NDP leadership 81

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Wilf Day
NDP leadership 81

Now?

Wilf Day

Last night was a leadership debate at Concordia in Montreal. Was anyone here at it?

I see on Facebook that "it will be filmed and we will try to put the video online by tomorow afternoon," that is, this afternoon.

Gaian

A Globe story this morning says Mulcair "was at a Mike's Restaurant at the other end of the city for a meet and greet organized by local MP Eve Peclet. The event was set beforethe debate and Mr. Mulcair has already attented events with West Island MPs, said Raoul Gebert, his campaign manager."

The NDP-friendly Globe and Mail was clearly looking for another explanation in a story under the headline: "Mulcair skips NDP leadership debate in Montreal." No doubt a lacuna will be found and filled here by NDP friendly speculation among babblers.

Gaian

Transferred from nicky's posting on the "81" thread destined to disappear:

I can now answer my own question.

The Mulcair campaign has booked the Waterfalls, 303 Augusta Ave, Toronto for a debate party staring at 12:30 on Sunday.

It is in Kensington Market not far south of College St.

I understand that everyone is welcome regardless of leadership preference.

Unionist

Wilf Day wrote:

Last night was a leadership debate at Concordia in Montreal. Was anyone here at it?

I picked a bad week to be out of town - missing a few events. But I was curious to see that among the riding associations organizing this event (at the Loyola campus in the west end), NPD Outremont was not listed.

 

Unionist

Not much yet:

[url=http://www.cjad.com/CJADLocalNews/entry.aspx?BlogEntryID=10341260]NDP candidates debate the issues[/url]

Quote:

With the deadline passed to enter the race for the NDP leadership, five of the eight candidates squared off at a debate at Loyola campus Wednesday night. [...]

Outremont MP Thomas Mulcair was at another event in Pointe-aux-Trembles.

Paul Dewar was out of province at another event.

Romeo Saganash had to bow out for personal reasons.

 

nicky

 "Youngest MP in House of Commons Pierre-Luc Dusseault on why he supports Thomas Mulcair for NDP leader."

http://www.fatcatvideo.net/VideoDetail.aspx?assetId=Nycole-Turmel-on-MPs-Pensions-517254730&pv=FiveMin

TheArchitect

Paul Dewar has received the endorsement of Ginny Devine.

http://pauldewar.ca/content/ginny-devine-endorses-dewar-ndp-leader

Dewar's press release refers to Devine as a "respected New Democrat, pollster and former Chief of Staff to Manitoba Premier Howard Pawley."

Devine is also the wife of Gary Doer—which will undoubtedly lead many to see this endosement as an implicit endorsement of Dewar by Doer, who may feel that he should not personally endorse due to his diplomatic post.

Stockholm

Here is a video featuring Brian Topp's wife Rebecca and his two sons about what kind of a guy he is. I think its nice to see some glimpse of what these people are like behind the scenes etc...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmSDGKu5hzc

Howard

Stockholm wrote:

Here is a video featuring Brian Topp's wife Rebecca and his two sons about what kind of a guy he is. I think its nice to see some glimpse of what these people are like behind the scenes etc...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmSDGKu5hzc

Topp also posted a feel good video (French required) a few days ago about what it was like to work on the NDP's first electoral wins in Quebec (i.e. Phil Edmonston).

For anyone at the debate in Montreal, how were Topp's presentation skills that night? His performance at the Toronto forum was, IMO, his strongest stage performance to date.

Hunky_Monkey

Seems the Topp campaign have now focused on a few feel good videos. I just got one where he talks about making the decision to run with his family. Interesting. I wonder if they're getting feedback about his level of likability.

Stockholm

It might be a good idea for Mulcair to do something similar given some of the stories about him being a bit of a "hard-ass".

I honestly think that in the NDP - to a greater extent that in other parties - a lot of members want to feel that they are voting for a good person. Beyond who is "electable" or who is the smartest or the shrewdest etc...I think many of us also want to feel reassured that the person we have leading up us is a "mensch".

KenS

Hunky_Monkey wrote:
Seems the Topp campaign have now focused on a few feel good videos. I just got one where he talks about making the decision to run with his family. Interesting. I wonder if they're getting feedback about his level of likability.

Agree with Stock, that its just common sense pro-active. Of course the candidates supporters see them as human beings and 'likeable'. And some, maybe most, of the candidates have an existing image where that is not going to be a 'resistance' with the members they are courting. But not Topp and Mulcair. There is a huge territory between 'I think he's great' and 'he eats babies' that needs to be attended to.

Unionist

Hunky_Monkey wrote:
Seems the Topp campaign have now focused on a few feel good videos. I just got one where he talks about making the decision to run with his family. Interesting. I wonder if they're getting feedback about his level of likability.

Has he done one yet wearing a sweater? Or holding a pussycat? Might be saving those for the final push...

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

He look like he's about to stangle it. If any of my cats got near him I'd have to give them a bath!

doofy

Personally, I found Topp's video a bit cringe-worthy.  Maybe because it reminded me a bit of this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vBDtDvXu0M&feature=related

Pulling out the family is an American campaign tactic that I am not comfrtoable with. We are not electing the best Dad or the best husband, but " the next Prime Minister". 

I hope Mulcair won't run something like this, but we seem to imitate America so much these days, that it might be unavoidable.

 

Howard

Unionist wrote:

Hunky_Monkey wrote:
Seems the Topp campaign have now focused on a few feel good videos. I just got one where he talks about making the decision to run with his family. Interesting. I wonder if they're getting feedback about his level of likability.

Has he done one yet wearing a sweater? Or holding a pussycat? Might be saving those for the final push...

Turtlenecks. It's all about the turtlenecks. Wink

Howard

Arthur Cramer wrote:

He look like he's about to stangle it. If any of my cats got near him I'd have to give them a bath!

I think he's about to ask it if it likes handcuffs.

dacckon dacckon's picture
Hunky_Monkey

KenS wrote:

Hunky_Monkey wrote:
Seems the Topp campaign have now focused on a few feel good videos. I just got one where he talks about making the decision to run with his family. Interesting. I wonder if they're getting feedback about his level of likability.

Agree with Stock, that its just common sense pro-active. Of course the candidates supporters see them as human beings and 'likeable'. And some, maybe most, of the candidates have an existing image where that is not going to be a 'resistance' with the members they are courting. But not Topp and Mulcair. There is a huge territory between 'I think he's great' and 'he eats babies' that needs to be attended to.

Not knocking it, Ken and Stock. I actually liked the one with his wife and kids. Found the family one a little bit cheesy (my son went to his room...) but thought it well done. Made me like him a little more ;)

socialdemocrati...

The dumb reality is that Steven Harper went from an American-style Conservative-fetishist to Prime Minister -- in part -- because he toned down the rhetoric and positioned himself as a "regular guy". A few sweaters. A few Beatles songs on the piano. A book about hockey that always comes up around election time but never seems to come out.

Most Canadians didn't buy it. But it was enough to score him a couple extra percentage points, and creep up the middle in Ontario.

Likeability is a qualification to be Prime Minister, whether we like it or not.

But it doesn't have to be that kind of shameless "hire an acting coach and a personal stylist, and hide how you really feel" that Harper uses.

Jack Layton became more charismatic over the span of nearly 10 years as leader. He also had a lot of inherently likeable qualities: he's principled, he's honest and consistent, and he has a sense of humor.

Our candidates have some of those qualities. Saganash just exudes earnestness. Cullen has a sense of humor. Mulcair is passionate. Nash has had enough of a career in politics to establish herself as incredibly principled and consistent.

I personally would not fault them if they had to hire someone to teach them how to be better in front of the camera. God knows they're hiring people to improve their French. And what Layton naturally learned over a decade (or multiple decades) can be accelerated with some good advice. Not that any of the candidates can just hire a coach and become Jack Layton, but they can hire a coach and become a better version of themselves.

Hunky_Monkey

Mulcair will be in St. John's tomorrow to announce an endorsement. I assume it will be either Harris or Cleary.

Unionist

Danny Williams?

Pass it on.

 

theleftyinvestor

doofy wrote:

Pulling out the family is an American campaign tactic that I am not comfrtoable with. We are not electing the best Dad or the best husband, but " the next Prime Minister". 

Andrea Horwath went in that direction when she gave a speech at the fed convention in Vancouver. She basically said that she is a good leader because she is a good mother, and Ontario needs a woman in charge. If McGuinty is Premier Dad, she was running to be Premier Mom :P

NorthReport

Things appear to be looking better and better for Mulcair with each passing day.

 

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1121993

 

Lord Palmerston

Tim Harper wrote:
He’s anti-union.

It appears that Tim Harper reads babble.  That's the only place I could find online where that phrase was used, and just about every use of that phrase has been from Mulcair's supporters here who accuse others of saying "Mulcair is anti-union."

ETA: Plus this one article, and he goes on to imply that union leaders "call the shots."

But I agree with most of his supporters here that he is quite "electable."

socialdemocrati...

I'd definitely be comfortable with Mulcair as leader. He has enough contrasts with the Liberal party to make me trust him. He's a good speaker and debater. Worst case with Mulcair, he'd be able to hold most what we earned in Quebec, plus most of the big cities that have voted NDP consistently the past few elections. He wouldn't sink much lower than 90 setas, and his upside is potentially much higher.

That being said... I'd like to be more than just "comfortable" with the NDP leader. Inspired would be nice. Still hoping Nash or Saganash can catch fire.

socialdemocrati...

It didn't take very long. The Conservatives suggest it's time to scale back the pension system.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/opposition-fire-back-agains...

I'm happy to go into the next election with a big contrast on this one. Not only is it the right thing. It's also the way to peel off a hell of a lot of senior voters. Helps we've been singing the same song for a while.

northwestern_lad

For those interested, Romeo Saganash will feature big in tonights episode of CBC's documentary "8th Fire" - its on at 9 pm on CBC, in whatever region you live

 

http://www.cbc.ca/doczone/8thfire//2011/11/whose-land-is-it-anyway.html

 

Howard

Tim Harper doesn't need to follow rabble to catch the "anti-union" whispers.

Howard

This is Topp's lightest policy paper yet and it would be easy to criticise it except for the fact that he has already easily carried the field in terms of who has presented the best policy this campaign.

R.E.Wood

Howard wrote:

This is Topp's lightest policy paper yet ...

 

Really?? This is far more detailed than Topp's policy paper on the arts, and I thought this one had some substance to it. I actually think this is one of Topp's best so far...

I also noticed that Nathan Cullen has also just released his 6th policy paper - on security for Canada's food system and farming. It's up on his website. 

http://en.nathancullen.ca/security_for_food_and_farmers

 

 

Wilf Day

Unionist wrote:

Since when do leadership candidates get to make up policy and parade it around fashion-show style? What kind of party is this?

Brian Topp's 6th policy paper 

It ends

Quote:
I propose our party commit to co-­‐funding a national child nutrition program . . .

I propose that our party commit to supplementing a renewed health accord . . with a home and community care accord.

I propose that our party commit to supplementing a renewed health accord . . with a national pharmaceutical accord. . . .

I propose that our party commit to negotiating a renewed Medicare funding accord . . .

And a couple more such proposals.

Isn't that the way to do it?

Unionist

Thanks, Wilf. I needed a good laugh/cry before bed.

writer writer's picture

As a book-end to northwestern_lad's post above, here is the 3rd episode of 8e fue, which just went online: http://www.radio-canada.ca/television/8eFeu/serie.shtml#ep3

"Pour qu’une société puisse évoluer, elle doit pouvoir se développer et développer son territoire. Certaines communautés autochtones l’ont bien compris."

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

northwestern_lad wrote:

For those interested, Romeo Saganash will feature big in tonights episode of CBC's documentary "8th Fire" - its on at 9 pm on CBC, in whatever region you live

 

http://www.cbc.ca/doczone/8thfire//2011/11/whose-land-is-it-anyway.html

 

I watched it tonight. Seems to be a full consensus that the Indian Act has to go - but be careful what replaces it. And what a history of screwing First Nations. Saganash was good, as was Charlie Angus.

CanadaApple

Anyone watch the At Issue panel on The National tonight? Their biggest complaint seemed to be that the Leadership Race so far has been boring. Though someone (not sure who), mentioned something interesting, which was  along the lines of, "the race is so low key, you would almost think the NDP doesn't really think they can win the next election."

Which makes me wonder, do we really think we can win the next election or not?

writer writer's picture

I think mainstream media doesn't get the culture of the party, and has always been prone to downplay its potential. Still, the NDP managed to become the Official Opposition last May. I think trying to do things to placate mainstream media and its wonked, dull, empty and foolish horse-race sense of what matters in democracy is a mug's game. Or worse.

It's not what real people with real problems worry about.

Sorry, but we're not here as a form of entertainment for one Mr. Andrew Coyne and associates.

Hunky_Monkey

CanadaApple wrote:

Anyone watch the At Issue panel on The National tonight? Their biggest complaint seemed to be that the Leadership Race so far has been boring. Though someone (not sure who), mentioned something interesting, which was  along the lines of, "the race is so low key, you would almost think the NDP doesn't really think they can win the next election."

Which makes me wonder, do we really think we can win the next election or not?

Hard to say... my crystal ball isn't working :)

My worry is that we fall back as we did in Nova Scotia after the 1998 election breakthrough. We still maintained official opposition though. Big difference is that we've got almost four years for our incumbents to establish themselves. The next election in NS was the following year.

I'd be happy as a party if we maintained or slightly grew our seat count and maintained official opposition. My gut feeling is that we may lose at least 10 seats in Quebec... hopefully replacing them with some growth outside Quebec.

I'd be sad for the country though to have four more years of Conservative government.

Howard

People should not ignore how big of trouble the Liberals are in. Other than their fundraising numbers, they don't have much to smile about. It's a lot of smoke and mirrors these days.

socialdemocrati...

In all sincerity, I don't really see the math adding up to a majority.

I can see us holding most of our seats. Yes, even in Quebec, and not necessarily with a Quebec leader.

The problem is I can't see a path to 155 seats (or whatever the equivalent will be once Harper has piled a bunch more seats into Alberta).

There aren't enough seats outside Ontario for us to realistically form a government. We don't stand a chance at building a wave in Alberta: maybe a seat or two. Picking up every seat in BC, SK, and MB (unlikely) wouldn't even net us 50 seats. Picking up every seat in the Maritimes would net us around 25.

The path to victory runs has to involve Ontario. But the province had terrible experience with the Bob Rae NDP government. If we win the 55% of seats he won at the Provincial level (except at the federal level), that would be worth a solid increase of 40 seats from what we have now. Still not enough to do it by itself. We'd need gains all across the country.

I sometimes wonder if the only way to pull this off is an NDP-Liberal coalition. I'm receptive, but very skeptical, of Nathan Cullen's point.

CanadaApple

For those who were around back then (sorry if I'm making anyone feel old = P), how does this Leadership Race compare to the last one held in 2003?

socialdemocrati...

... actually, further to my last post, the NDP matching Bob Rae's success in Ontario in 1990 isn't impossible. But it counts on people being equally pissed at Dalton McGuinty as they are at Steven Harper, with the NDP being the main beneficiary.

duncan cameron

The At Issue panel was a travesty. The host Peter M. treats the NDP with scorn. He is the least professional journalist on CBC TV. They brought in John Ivison as a guest (Coyne was not there). He got his job because he could be counted on to reject everything NDP always. Even the Can Press reporter could not break out of the frame set by Peter. Has anyone heard anything about the leadership race, does anybody know there is a leadership race? Maybe he has trouble getting out.

I remember when CBS news turned against the Vietnam War. LBJ said if I have lost Cronkite (CBS news host Walter) I have lost America. He then declined to run for re-election in 1968.

Mansbridge lost Canada years ago. His show is a special production for the PMO. 

I hardly ever watch the show, its too painful, and irritating. It wil be awhile before I watch again.

NorthReport

Well said writer.

I'm looking forward to the last few weeks of the leadership race though where the media will have no choice but to provide media coverage, as it's a reasonable assumption that whoever we elect as NDP and Official Oppostion Leader may well end up being Canada's prime minister one day, and perhaps sooner than we all think is possible. 

 

writer wrote:

I think mainstream media doesn't get the culture of the party, and has always been prone to downplay its potential. Still, the NDP managed to become the Official Opposition last May. I think trying to do things to placate mainstream media and its wonked, dull, empty and foolish horse-race sense of what matters in democracy is a mug's game. Or worse.

It's not what real people with real problems worry about.

Sorry, but we're not here as a form of entertainment for one Mr. Andrew Coyne and associates.

NorthReport

Well Peter Mansbridge's show has always about Mansbridge and his right-wing BS. 

Listening to Don Newman usually made me want to puke.

Wouldn't it be nice to have some media types like Peter Gzowski which unfortunately is sorely lacking at the CBC these days. 

Rex Murphy - ugh!

 

duncan cameron wrote:

The At Issue panel was a travesty. The host Peter M. treats the NDP with scorn. He is the least professional journalist on CBC TV. They brought in John Ivison as a guest (Coyne was not there). He got his job because he could be counted on to reject everything NDP always. Even the Can Press reporter could not break out of the frame set by Peter. Has anyone heard anything about the leadership race, does anybody know there is a leadership race? Maybe he has trouble getting out.

I remember when CBS news turned against the Vietnam War. LBJ said if I have lost Cronkite (CBS news host Walter) I have lost America. He then declined to run for re-election in 1968.

Mansbridge lost Canada years ago. His show is a special production for the PMO. 

I hardly ever watch the show, its too painful, and irritating. It wil be awhile before I watch again.

NorthReport

Time to cut this minority supported (39.6%) prime minister down to size!!!

http://www2.macleans.ca/2012/01/27/major-harper-long-time-coming/

NorthReport
socialdemocrati...

Honestly, one of the reasons the orange wave took place is BECAUSE the media was treating it as a two-way race. We had trouble getting coverage, but we were in full control of our message when it got out.

First they ignore you. Then they fight you.

Not looking forward to greater media coverage.

Wilf Day

Double post

Wilf Day

CanadaApple wrote:

Anyone watch the At Issue panel on The National tonight? Their biggest complaint seemed to be that the Leadership Race so far has been boring.

Facebook update:

Peggy Nash 6,195 likes

Nathan Cullen 5,645 likes

Niki Ashton 4,932 friends

Paul Dewar 4,080 likes

Brian Topp 3,721 likes

Romeo Saganash 2,988 likes

Thomas Mulcair 2,494 likes

Martin Singh 744 likes

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