NDP Leadership #94

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oldgoat

[quote=janfromthebruce]

Gregbythepond, I'm an oldgoatite and I've always respected his opinion on babble.

[/quote]

 

Holy cow!  I have an oldgoatite.  This is really kinda humbling. 

writer writer's picture

Wilf, could you explain why you think it's a game changer, and how you imagine it could change the "game"?

KenS

DSloth wrote:

Chris Borst wrote:

If Topp really does have numbers putting him around 28%, he should release his whole poll (including second choices) for comparison!

He doesn't, that was explicitly the "results" of a phone bank. 

Now Brian Topp certainly has his own scientific polls but they chose not to release any of those, which is of course his prerogative.  Really don't know why he insists on trying to run as the frontrunner though.  As a Mulcair supporter I'm fraught with concern about how coming out as the frontrunner today might put a big(ger) target on us.

Most campaigners make only teaser comments about what they know. Elizabeth May's campaigns are the only I know of to have a habit of releasing poll numbers. Most people just dont go there- whether the numbers are good for spin or not. Its a double edged sword for a lot of reasons. If nothing else- the benefit side is usually dubious whether it can work. That happens in a zillion ways, but this polll release of Dewar's is probably just another case. It unlikely will annoy as much as the intitial reaction here that will not last, but it also is not going to achieve its goal. Its a very blunt tool.

That said, I can see why the Mulcair campaign released the poll that shows pretty much the same dynamic as Dewar's poll. Doing that fits into the strategy of portraying him as the winner. He's already a target, so no added risk there.

It is a LONG time ago since Topp either set in motion or contributed to the narrative that he was THE front runner. He needed that to get noticed quick out of the gate.

The media of its own accord until recently referred to Topp and Mulcair as the apparent fron trunners. Thats how they work: since Topp was the front runner, and now Mulcair has probably taken over, that makes two front runners. Thats as sophisticated as most of the 'political reporters' get- drinking each others bath water.

Idealistic Prag... Idealistic Pragmatist's picture

Wilf Day wrote:

Odd that there has been little discussion here of Jack Layton's mother endorsing Topp so fulsomely. I think it's a potential game-changer. Are some here too close to the fine details to see the big picture?

Honestly, I don't think there are any endorsements that really have the potential to "change the game" at this point. They grab much-needed media attention, sure, but I don't think there are any endorsements that will actually change people's minds. It's good to know that Jack's mother thinks highly of Brian Topp, but that isn't going to make me more likely to vote for him (the way, say, Dewar's poll did).

Caissa

Didn't Jack Layton's mother once support a Tory cabinet minister?

Gaian

Has anyone else been hoping to see some greater concern for climate change among the candidates? Of course it is not a "starter" among the Great Misled, looking at poll esults, but it is a good point when talking about taming tar sands production and pipelines.

We can assume that NO candidate is going to turn the heads of Albertans and Saskewanians. But this thread contains muttering about the Conservatives using Cap and Trade as a bludgeon against the party in 2015.

Has there been anything beyond the usual "growing a green economy" offered by most candidates, any observations about exactly what employs people in that economy? How defeatist - for all species - is that?

TheArchitect

Wilf Day wrote:

Odd that there has been little discussion here of Jack Layton's mother endorsing Topp so fulsomely. I think it's a potential game-changer. Are some here too close to the fine details to see the big picture?

Quote:
"I support Brian Topp because he is very much on Jack's wave length. Jack and Brian worked closely together through the years. They can almost finish each other sentences. I feel secure with Brian's leadership that the NDP will definitely follow Jack's path -- a path that will lead the NDP to form government in 2015. And Jack's spirit will live on."

http://www.briantopp.ca/news/jack-laytons-mother-endorsing-brian-topp

I agree, Wilf; I think Doris Layton's endorsement is a very big deal—and not just the fact of the endorsement itself but the extremely complementary comments she made about Brian Topp.  While I continue to have a lot of doubts, I can say that I know I've been thinking much more favorably about Topp since seeing Doris's endorsement.

marciam

Babblers may be interested in a report being circulated by the Catch-22 people, entitled "The Logistics of Cooperation: A Study of Nathan Cullen's Progressive Primaries Proposal." It's written by Stuart Parker, so some will discount it immediately, but I still think it has some useful analysis.

http://bit.ly/xpqnyw

 

 

dacckon dacckon's picture

Doris's endorsement is more of a trust in values as opposed to an endorsement of economic value or one of the ability to attract people to the NDP in the next election.

janfromthebruce

ha ha ha - I just thought it was too funny in how it was framed - toppites vs Machaurites (or whatever) so I thought I'd just play. All kidding aside, I will be supporting your dog in the leadership race on first ballot - Surprised

 

oldgoat wrote:

janfromthebruce wrote:

Gregbythepond, I'm an oldgoatite and I've always respected his opinion on babble.

 

Holy cow!  I have an oldgoatite.  This is really kinda humbling. 

______________________________________________________________________________________ Our kids live together and play together in their communities, let's have them learn together too!

Bookish Agrarian

TheArchitect wrote:

Wilf Day wrote:

Odd that there has been little discussion here of Jack Layton's mother endorsing Topp so fulsomely. I think it's a potential game-changer. Are some here too close to the fine details to see the big picture?

Quote:
"I support Brian Topp because he is very much on Jack's wave length. Jack and Brian worked closely together through the years. They can almost finish each other sentences. I feel secure with Brian's leadership that the NDP will definitely follow Jack's path -- a path that will lead the NDP to form government in 2015. And Jack's spirit will live on."

http://www.briantopp.ca/news/jack-laytons-mother-endorsing-brian-topp

I agree, Wilf; I think Doris Layton's endorsement is a very big deal—and not just the fact of the endorsement itself but the extremely complementary comments she made about Brian Topp.  While I continue to have a lot of doubts, I can say that I know I've been thinking much more favorably about Topp since seeing Doris's endorsement.

Actually I found it more than a wee bit icky.

It also makes me wonder about the desperation level of the Topp campaign and what ever happened to his supposed strategic brilliance.

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

Caissa wrote:

Didn't Jack Layton's mother once support a Tory cabinet minister?

From here:

Doris Layton comes from the formidable Steeves family, descended from William Steeves, a reformist Father of Confederation from New Brunswick, who was appointed as a Liberal to the new federal Senate in 1867, and used the post commendably to lobby for better care for the mentally ill.

It was she who nudged Jack's father, Robert Layton, toward the provincial Liberals in the Quiet Revolution days of the early 1960s. Nancy recalls her mother attending a tea in support of the local Liberal member of Quebec's national assembly, Paul Gérin-Lajoie, and was impressed enough to encourage her husband to meet him. It was a consequential bit of wifely advice: Bob went on to be a stalwart Liberal organizer, before switching to the federal Conservatives and becoming a Tory MP under Brian Mulroney in the 1980s.

janfromthebruce

Actually that is why I supported Topp as leader since day 1 - I want to con't on the same path and I know Brian will con't on the path both Jack & Brian traveled together.

 

TheArchitect wrote:

Wilf Day wrote:

Odd that there has been little discussion here of Jack Layton's mother endorsing Topp so fulsomely. I think it's a potential game-changer. Are some here too close to the fine details to see the big picture?

Quote:
"I support Brian Topp because he is very much on Jack's wave length. Jack and Brian worked closely together through the years. They can almost finish each other sentences. I feel secure with Brian's leadership that the NDP will definitely follow Jack's path -- a path that will lead the NDP to form government in 2015. And Jack's spirit will live on."

http://www.briantopp.ca/news/jack-laytons-mother-endorsing-brian-topp

I agree, Wilf; I think Doris Layton's endorsement is a very big deal—and not just the fact of the endorsement itself but the extremely complementary comments she made about Brian Topp.  While I continue to have a lot of doubts, I can say that I know I've been thinking much more favorably about Topp since seeing Doris's endorsement.

______________________________________________________________________________________ Our kids live together and play together in their communities, let's have them learn together too!

Grandpa_Bill

Architect reported the following caucus endorsements:

05 - Ashton

04 - Cullen

05 - Dewar

41 - Mulcair

09 - Nash

00 - Singh

12 - Topp

45 - Unaligned

It is too bad that the party opted for a So-You-Think-You-Can-Lead celebrity contest rather than allowing the caucus to choose their House Leader.

 

oldgoat

Closing for length

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