Arrest Israel's New Defence Attache Eden Attias as a Gaza War Criminal

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NDPP
Arrest Israel's New Defence Attache Eden Attias as a Gaza War Criminal

 

New Defence Attache Eager to Build Bridges

http://www.cjnews.com/news/new-defence-attache-eager-build-bridges

"Another layer has been added to the ever-deepening bilateral relationship between Canada and Israel. Last December, Israel quietly named Brig-Gen (Res) Eden Attias as its first Ministry of Defence attache to Ottawa. Prior to that, Israel's only defence attache in North America was stationed in Washington DC.

Given the deepening ties and friendship between Canada and Israel, the moment was right for his new post to be created, Attias said. 'Due to the flourishing relationship between Canada and Israel, one of the recent discussions between our defence ministries involved looking for ways to get more people on the ground in each country.

'We have a lot of things we're sharing,' he said. Attias said he's paving the way for his successors and hopes to open many doors for Israel with Canada's miltary industries and to connect Canadian firms to opportunities in Israel.

From a community standpoint, he said as an Israeli Jew, he's slowly learning just how much the Canadian Jewish community supports Israel."

(yeah me too.)

 

 

'Cast-Lead 'Dirty 200 List': Colonel Eden Atias ID: 22665954, Commander Nevatin Air Force Base; War Criminal No. #45'

http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2010/11/25/idf-officers-bel...

"The people listed here held positions of command at the time of the Gaza attack. Therefore not only did they perform on behalf of a murderous state mechanism but actively encouraged other people to do the same.

The bear a distinctive personal responsibilty. All took and active role in the offensive...'

With every new revelation like the Dirty 200 list, the moral noose is tightened that much more around those who engaged in misdeeds during Cast Lead. The shroud of impunity is lifting ever so gradually. The notion of accountability is affirmed in an ever-stronger fashion.

This is a battle of inches on behalf of international law and Israeli responsibility. Gradually and eventually every Israeli soldier will realize the price they are paying for their nation's futile, failed, folly in pursuing all out war against Palestinian civilians in Gaza during Cast Lead and the inevitable next war was well..."

"Israel has no better friend than Canada" - Prime Mininster of Canada

"I am an ardent supporter of Israel in all situations and in all circumstances" - Opposition

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9mkRiGbgZg&feature=related

Canada Must Arrest Israel's Defence Attache Brig-Gen Eden Attias For Gaza War Crimes!

Hoodeet

NDPP wrote:

 

New Defence Attache Eager to Build Bridges

http://www.cjnews.com/news/new-defence-attache-eager-build-bridges

"Another layer has been added to the ever-deepening bilateral relationship between Canada and Israel. Last December, Israel quietly named Brig-Gen (Res) Eden Attias as its first Ministry of Defence attache to Ottawa. Prior to that, Israel's only defence attache in North America was stationed in Washington DC.

 

Canada Must Arrest Israel's Defence Attache Brig-Gen Eden Attias For Gaza War Crimes!

Hoodeet (JW)

 

Yeah, as soon as the Citizens arrest bill becomes law, go for it.  No government official will.

 

Ken Burch

If you want to arrest the guy, fine. He undoubtedly has it coming.  And say what you will about the Israeli government.  That government has it coming.  But..."Dirty Zionist"? It's only a tiny step from "Zion__i" or "Dirty J_w".

 

That headline has GOT to be changed, mods.  It looks like something from Stormfront or something.

NDPP

Except he IS a 'Dirty Zionist Gaza War Criminal' Ken...and is even on a 'dirty' list leaked by a non-Zionist Jew that proves it. If history had gone differently and Canada was receiving and honouring an equivalent butcher of Jews instead of Palestinians, would the title 'Dirty Nazi War Criminal' similarly offend you?

Ken Burch

He's a war criminal in the Israeli government.  That's all you needed to say.

Bad as it has been, Zionism is NOT morally equivalent to Naziism...they aren't turning Palestinians into lampshades, for God's sake...and you can't assume that everyone who self-identifies as a Zionist supports what this bastard did or are complicit in it.

And you must be aware of the old "Dirty J_w" slur, and how close this sounds to that.  Why use such phraseology when it gives those on the Zionist hard right and their enablers in the U.S. and Canadian governments rhetorical ammunition to fire at YOUR position.

"Dirty Zionist" is not acceptable.

Unionist

NDPP, what exactly is wrong with showing some sensitivity to distinctions that others think are important?

Let me try to explain. If someone opened a thread saying, "Condemn the dirty zionist filthy pseudo-social democrat Mulcair, collaborator in the genocide of the Libyan and Palestinian people!", I would expect people here to say, "naw, that ain't right". I'd certainly say so myself. Would that make me an apologist for Tom Mulcair?

"Zionist" doesn't mean the same to everyone. There are people who consider themselves zionists who are our allies, whether you want to believe it or not. Otherwise, you will be opening threads saying, "Arrest that dirty zionist bootlicker of war criminals Uri Avnery!" We can agree or disagree with his view of the Israel-Palestine issue, but we can't call him a "dirty zionist" and expect everyone to back away in fear of being associated with zionism if they don't like that phrase.

Personally, I think the main difference between Hitler and Netanyahu is that Netanyahu is still alive, and that makes him a clear and present danger. That doesn't mean I'm going to put up thread titles saying, "Israeli regime worse than Hitler!". That kind of foolishness leads to ... well... people being afraid of Iran, for example. It leaves the Netanyahus rubbing their criminal hands with glee. You know what I mean?

Hope I'm being clear. If not, well, it won't be the first time.

 

NDPP

Ken Burch wrote:

 you can't assume that everyone who self-identifies as a Zionist supports what this bastard did or are complicit in it.

And you must be aware of the old "Dirty J_w" slur, and how close this sounds to that.  Why use such phraseology when it gives those on the Zionist hard right and their enablers in the U.S. and Canadian governments rhetorical ammunition to fire at YOUR position.

"Dirty Zionist" is not acceptable.

NDPP

Ah, so you seek to defend, exonerate and make the case for 'Clean' Zionists. Well, if such exists, this one isn't one of those. And I am not the only one who disagrees with you either:

www.israelversusjudaism.org/comparison/index.cfm

Ken Burch

As a practical matter, you are not going to get anything to change in the Israel/Palestine situation if you insist that everyone who supports change repudiate Zionism in ANY form.  You will need to get the support of those who still identify as Zionists but oppose what Israel is doing to Palestinians(and there are a LOT of such people, especially in the Diaspora).  This is especially true for winning support for change within Israel itself...you simply CAN'T demand that every person of conscience there publicly declare themselves to be anti-Zionist.  To ask them to do that is to ask them to permanently marginalize themselves within the Israeli political spectrum...and what use are allies if they are marginalized and powerless?

It's like insisting that  oyu can only be pro-FN if you call for the complete dissolution of Canada(or the U.S., for that matter).

And of course Zionism isn't synonymous with Judaism, but not all Zionists are reactionary Arab-hating maximalist maniacs either. 

Why do you insist on using rhetoric on this issue that costs you a LOT of potential support?

Do you really believe that all Zionists are personally evil? That being a Zionist is actually the same thing as being a Nazi?  Even if you are a progressive Israeli who speaks out against what is being done to Palesitnians?

That there's no difference between Uri Avnery and Avigdor Lieberman?  or(to use an American example)between Michael Lerner and Alan Dershowitz?

If you believe that, you are holding people there to a standard you would never hold people to here when discussing anything pertaining to North America.

As for myself, I'm neither Zionist nor anti-Zionist...you could call me an agnostic on the issue.  But(like a lot of other people)I'm always going to call someone out for using rhetoric("Dirty Zionist")that sounds like it could have been used at a Nuremberg Rally.  It's the sort of thing a right-wing Likudnik provacateur might use here if she or he wanted to give other right-wingers something to attack Babble for.

 

NDPP

Unionist wrote:

NDPP, what exactly is wrong with showing some sensitivity to distinctions that others think are important?

NDPP

In general nothing. But this particular 'sensitivity to distinctions' is really about  Zionists defending Zionism. I will not consent or participate in that. This is merely another manifestation of why the influence of dirty Zionist war criminals continues to grow here and how it is that not a word of protest has appeared against this particular dirty Zionist Gaza war criminal, but those against me naming him as such, are mounting.

 

Ken Burch

Nobody denies he's a war criminal.  And nobody here was defending Zionism.

It's about your rhetoric here-your pointlessly offensive and inflammatory phrasing.

I WANT the guy arrested, ok?

NDPP

Yeah well I found Gaza pointlessly offensive and inflammatory too. As for your various Zionists, clean, dirty, carnivorous or vegetarian and their various internal messes - sorry not interested .  He's 'Dirty', he's 'Zionist', he's a 'War-Criminal'. Title is accurate and stays.

Want him charged?  You'll have to persuade the AG Canada because no war-crimes charges can proceed without his consent. Handy eh?  I would suggest you try the NDP Opposition, but then the leader's an 'ardent supporter of Israel in all situations and in all circumstances' so looks like  Zionist impunity wins again as it always does, probably because it has so many defenders ' in all situations and circumstances', as becomes more and more obvious to all.

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

NDPP wrote:

He's 'Dirty', he's 'Zionist', he's a 'War-Criminal'. Title is accurate and stays.

He's Jewish too, right?

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Unionist wrote:

If someone opened a thread saying, "Condemn the dirty zionist filthy pseudo-social democrat Mulcair, collaborator in the genocide of the Libyan and Palestinian people!", I would expect people here to say, "naw, that ain't right". I'd certainly say so myself. Would that make me an apologist for Tom Mulcair?

By definition of the word [url=http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/apologist]"apologist"[/url], yes, it would.

Unionist

M. Spector wrote:

Unionist wrote:

If someone opened a thread saying, "Condemn the dirty zionist filthy pseudo-social democrat Mulcair, collaborator in the genocide of the Libyan and Palestinian people!", I would expect people here to say, "naw, that ain't right". I'd certainly say so myself. Would that make me an apologist for Tom Mulcair?

By definition of the word [url=http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/apologist]"apologist"[/url], yes, it would.

I hope that inspired intervention made you feel better. It certainly had a calming effect on me. Next time you weigh in, consider the possibility that one might oppose the use of baiting inflammatory divisive language even when it is absolutely accurate in your lexicographical purist's sense. To be very blunt, one could object to the phrase "that dirty warmongering genocidal crooked Jew Netanyahu" without being painted, by either Merriam or Webster, as an "apologist" for Netanyahu.

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Ken Burch wrote:

As a practical matter, you are not going to get anything to change in the Israel/Palestine situation if you insist that everyone who supports change repudiate Zionism in ANY form.  You will need to get the support of those who still identify as Zionists but oppose what Israel is doing to Palestinians(and there are a LOT of such people, especially in the Diaspora).  This is especially true for winning support for change within Israel itself...you simply CAN'T demand that every person of conscience there publicly declare themselves to be anti-Zionist.  To ask them to do that is to ask them to permanently marginalize themselves within the Israeli political spectrum...and what use are allies if they are marginalized and powerless?

It's like insisting that  oyu can only be pro-FN if you call for the complete dissolution of Canada(or the U.S., for that matter).

And of course Zionism isn't synonymous with Judaism, but not all Zionists are reactionary Arab-hating maximalist maniacs either. 

Why do you insist on using rhetoric on this issue that costs you a LOT of potential support?

Do you really believe that all Zionists are personally evil? That being a Zionist is actually the same thing as being a Nazi?  Even if you are a progressive Israeli who speaks out against what is being done to Palesitnians?

That there's no difference between Uri Avnery and Avigdor Lieberman?  or(to use an American example)between Michael Lerner and Alan Dershowitz?

If you believe that, you are holding people there to a standard you would never hold people to here when discussing anything pertaining to North America.

As for myself, I'm neither Zionist nor anti-Zionist...you could call me an agnostic on the issue.  But(like a lot of other people)I'm always going to call someone out for using rhetoric("Dirty Zionist")that sounds like it could have been used at a Nuremberg Rally.  It's the sort of thing a right-wing Likudnik provacateur might use here if she or he wanted to give other right-wingers something to attack Babble for.

This post is as close as one can get to equating anti-Zionism with anti-semitism without using an equals sign.

Ken Burch

No it isn't.  I don't make any such equation. Anti-Zionism has nothing in common with anti-semtism.

Left anti-Zionism is a respectable position and I admire the convictions of those tho take it.

What I reject is the idea that absolute anti-Zionism(which I'm defining as settling for nothing short of calling for a unitary state)is the ONLY progressive position.

To make that equation is to say that people like Uri Avnery, Michael Lerner, and most of the Israeli human rights community are reactionaries.

It doesn't have to be absolute anti-Zionism or nothing.

Why insist on a position that will ALWAYS be opposed by the majority of the Israeli population and that will always permanently marginalize any Israeli that embraces it?  You do realize that it will be necessary to get the acquiescence of such people in resolution to the crisis for that resolution to work(just as it will be necessary to get the acquiescence of the majority of the Palestinians), right?

And no, I don't absolve the Israeli government of anything it's done to Palestinians.

NDPP

Ken Burch wrote:

Why insist on a position that will ALWAYS be opposed by the majority of the Israeli population

NDPP

You mean the same majority that were so overwhelmingly supportive of Zionist barbarism in Gaza?

Ken Burch

OK...so you think all Israelis are evil.  I wonder whether you still make a distinction between Israelis and Diaspora Jews, then.

Why is it that you can't accept that it is impossible to get an agreement that ends the war here that is not accepted by the majority of the Israeli population?

One option that might work would be the Belgian model...which creates a unitary administration yet recognizes the national characteristics of each polity here. 

While the majority of Israelis will always be against an absolutely unitary state, a Belgian-type model could work.

That's what most of the left in Canada now seems to back regarding Canada's relationship with Quebec.

 

NDPP

Actually I know some Diaspora Jews that are working hard against both colonizations, Israel's and Canada's. Settler states are surprisingly similar - the rednecks against Indigenous land rights of Six Nations (who have allied with Zionists of JDL, incidentally) are probably much the same in both places, except Israeli settlers are armed and supported by the regime. The majority of the Israeli population's heads are full of hateful Zionism and 'chosen' nonsense and are led by their noses by Lieberman, Netanyahu and that ilk. Honourable negotations will never happen with such hateful snakes.  As for the Belgian model who knows? Certain outstanding issues of history, colonization and ongoing genocide are fundamentals that have to be addressed by negotiators with honour and credibility. Neither are present as far as I can see.

Ken Burch

Agreed that they aren't present among the current leaders(and that probably goes for both sides).

But, seriously, how do you propose to get the people of Israel, whose cooperation with any arrangements will be required, whatever those arrangements will be, with ANY proposals for ending the war, if you collectively demonize them, and if you insist that the only acceptable resolution is one that you know that they can never be persuaded to accept?  You do realize that the world can't just ORDER the State of Israel, as currently constituted to simply disappear, right?  How many countries, anywhere, would WILLINGLY agree to do that?

This isn't about me...it's about the question of how do you get everybody whose acceptance will be needed to get on board with ending the war?  You can't seriously insist that a pure unitary state is the ONLY accceptable solution(just as it is equally UNacceotable to say "they should just move to Jordan" to Palestinians).  There is a case for it as the ultimate solution, but, at least in the interim, there needs to be a reconciliation process in which the wounds are healed on both sides and grievances are redressed on both sides.

This is something that a Belgian-type approach could achieve...since it would involve, at the outset, ending all the privations and restrictions currently imposed on West Bank and Gaza Palestinians.

As to the exiles, while it isn't realistic to do total the total physical return of all of them, there can be official acknowledgment by Israel that the expulsions of 1948 and 1967 were never acceptable and that the exiles, even if they can't physically return home, have the right to identify as Palestinian and to have that idenfitication accepted by all(this would also involve real apologies and real, immediate financial compensation for all they've been put through).

Those are the kinds of things that can be tried, I think, and that could get the support of rank-and-file Israelis, many of whom are not unquestioning supporters of what the various Israeli governments have done to Palestinians, yet who, like anybody else, have a hard time getting their heads around the idea of something like the formal dissolution of the country they currently live in.  There has to be a way of including at least the non-hawkish wing of the Israeli population in any solution, and this is the problem with insisting that the immediate creation of a unitary state is the ONLY acceptable outcome.

 

Caissa

Are the moderators going to change the thread title or are we going to continue to have this discussion about the phrase "dirty Zionist" every time it appears?

allah

Change the title. Maybe a suspesion is in order. If instead of Zionist NDPP used another term (I will not give examples) a banning would occur

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Caissa wrote:

Are the moderators going to change the thread title or are we going to continue to have this discussion about the phrase "dirty Zionist" every time it appears?

Are you going to shut the fuck up and stop creating problems where none exist?

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Let the pro-Zionist witch-hunt continue!

NDPP

Not only is this Zionist attache on a 'dirty' list, he also commanded an airbase from which pilots flew to drop fire and death on the little children of Gaza.  By any definition he's dirty and befouled by his crimes.

And since, as it appears, there are Zionists here, let them declare themselves and defend their thing.

Zionism and Judaism - Let Us Define Our Terms

http://www.nkusa.org/aboutus/zionism/index.cfm

Caissa

No, I'm going to flag your post as offensive.

Catchfire Catchfire's picture

It was established in the other thread that many babblers consider the phrase "dirty Zionist" to be offensive. That's enough for me to change the thread title. For the record, NDPP started this thread before the other discussion came to that deduction. I would also like to ask that babblers show respect and sensitivity to those who have reached a similar conclusion.

Dostoyevsky

M. Spector wrote:

Let the pro-Zionist witch-hunt continue!

Yes people who object to the phrase "dirty zionist" must be pro-zionist warmongers.  Why not just say zionist vermin?  Using these words to try and make Israeli Zionists seem less than human is juvenille and stupid and has absolutely nothing to do with justice for the people of Gaza.  It's trolling by NDPP - plain and simple.

NDPP

the dirty, shameful crimes of Zionism and its adherents enjoy impunity almost everywhere. *POOF*: Babble's little contribution to NAKBA day..

kropotkin1951

allah wrote:

Change the title. Maybe a suspesion is in order. If instead of Zionist NDPP used another term (I will not give examples) a banning would occur

Welcome to our community.  Nice to see that on your first day you are demanding that punishment be meted out to a poster who has been a part of babble for 4 years.

Lets start punishing people not for anything they post but rather what we can imagine they might have posted instead. What a truly totalitarian statement.

Again welcome to babble I just hope you don't try to get me banned on day two.

ETA: hi Catchfire crossposted with you this morning.

Thx NDPP for pointing out that this promoter of punishment posted for the first timne on Nakba Day.

kropotkin1951

Dostoyevsky wrote:

M. Spector wrote:

Let the pro-Zionist witch-hunt continue!

Yes people who object to the phrase "dirty zionist" must be pro-zionist warmongers.  Why not just say zionist vermin?  Using these words to try and make Israeli Zionists seem less than human is juvenille and stupid and has absolutely nothing to do with justice for the people of Gaza.  It's trolling by NDPP - plain and simple.

Happy Nakba Day

But don't say that anywhere in Israel or a police officer of IDF personnel will clean your clock. Nothing dirty about that.

 

Quote:

Zaheya Madi, a Palestinian woman who was born in 1947, said she was one year old when her family was forced to leave their village, Beit Jerja, during the war in 1948 when Israel closed to the borders with the Gaza Strip. "I can't remember anything, but I still miss my home," she said.

The Palestinian Central Statistics Bureau said in a report to mark Nekba Day that Israel controlled 774 Palestinian towns and villages, and 531 of these towns were ruined. It also said Israeli soldiers killed 15,000 Palestinians before, during or after the war in 1948.

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/world/2012-05/15/c_131589919.htm

kropotkin1951

Haaretz wrote:

In 2009, Miller introduced a Knesset bill which would have made taking part in a Nakba Day event punishable by arrest and up to three years in prison. The prison sentence was later struck from the bill in order to pave way for its becoming law in 2011.

But Miller's Nakba Law still casts a shadow over events marking the day. Legal experts have noted that if schools or other state-supported institutions merely read the names of Palestinians killed or forced to leave their homes in 1948, they could be fined at the discretion of the Finance Minister.

Is it relevant that Miller, a resident of the settlement city of Ariel and a senior member of Avigdor Lieberman's Yisrael Beiteinu party, was born and raised in Leonid Brezhnev's Moscow?

It is relevant because for decades, the Jews of Soviet Russia were forbidden to commemorate their heritage. They were barred - with artfully worded and intensively enforced official repression - from gathering to study their true history, reconstruct their shattered culture, and mark the memories of their people.

It is relevant because the Soviet system tried for decades to legislate feelings and creeds and beliefs and the sense of peoplehood, and because the Soviet system, partially as a result, failed.

In the end, though, I have to thank Alex Miller. Had he not sought to make a name for himself with a law to help obliterate the names of others, I might not have spent time this week studying the history of the place I first lived in Israel, and studying about the people who had lived there before.

http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/a-special-place-in-hell/thank-you-russian-i...

So what does anyone think of the fact that Canada has allowed a diplomat who is a suspected war criminal to enter the country?

Personally I don't give a flying fuck about his personal hygiene I think he should be banned for being a murderer of innocent people.

NDPP
Caissa

As far as I am concerned condemn Zionism all you wish. All I'm opposing is the coupling of the words dirty and zionist.

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Catchfire wrote:

It was established in the other thread that many babblers consider the phrase "dirty Zionist" to be offensive. That's enough for me to change the thread title.

It's been established in this thread and elsewhere that many babblers don't consider it offensive. What's offensive is the implication that Col. Attias doesn't belong on the [url=http://rabble.ca/babble/international-news-and-politics/arrest-israels-n... Cast Lead Dirty 200 list[/url] — that he is in fact a clean Zionist.

Babble has always been at best ambivalent towards anti-Zionism. Now it seems it just takes two or three self-appointed language police to get the moderators to censor condemnations of Zionism. And who benefits, objectively, from such censorship? We all know.

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Richard Silverstein makes a blog post entitled [url=http://www.richardsilverstein.com/tikun_olam/2010/11/17/idf-cast-lead-di..."IDF Cast Lead Dirty 200"[/url], about the list of IDF members allegedly involved in war crimes against Gaza in Operation Cast Lead.

Colonel Attias is on that list. He is one of the "Dirty 200".

There are 50 responses posted on the blog; not one of them objects to the use of the word "dirty" as a descriptor of those alleged war criminals.

Only when it gets to babble does the phony politesse raise its head; on babble we can criticize war criminals but we have to be polite about it, and not hurt the feelings of anyone who might have some sympathy for them. God forbid we should say anything inflammatory or divisive.

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

You're fetishizing and decontextualizing words as an excuse to blunt anti-Zionist discourse.

kropotkin1951

I think that the people that come on this board only to complain about things like using dirty in front of zionist have an agenda that has little to do with any progressive vision of the ongoing tragedy that is the Israeli occupation of Palestine.

Caissa you post here a lot so I can accept your voice even if I think your wrong on this one.  The adjective dirty gets applied to everyone we don't like.

"Hey, baby, if you're feelin' down
I know what's good for you all day
Are you worried what your friends see
Will it ruin your reputation lovin' me "

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUDMy-GplkQ

 Dirty White Trash (with Gulls), 1998

Noble and Webster

kropotkin1951

allah wrote:

Change the title. Maybe a suspesion is in order. If instead of Zionist NDPP used another term (I will not give examples) a banning would occur

Sorry Allah I see you actually joined in 2011.  Tell me since this is all about respecting others, why do you use the Arabic word for god as your posting handle? Seems a bit strange for someone who makes your kind of leaps to antisemitism.

Ken Burch

M. Spector wrote:

Catchfire wrote:

It was established in the other thread that many babblers consider the phrase "dirty Zionist" to be offensive. That's enough for me to change the thread title.

It's been established in this thread and elsewhere that many babblers don't consider it offensive. What's offensive is the implication that Col. Attias doesn't belong on the [url=http://rabble.ca/babble/international-news-and-politics/arrest-israelsne... Cast Lead Dirty 200 list[/url] —

 

nobody on this thread or the other thread on which the "Dirty Zionist" usage was questioned was making THAT implication at all.  Attias clearly belongs on that list.  You don't have to accept the use of the term "Dirty Zionist" to accept the guilt of those on that list OR Attias' place on it.  Nor do you even have to be an apologist for Zionism.

You are reading something into peoples' responses that isn't there at all.

Ken Burch

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Haaretz wrote:

In 2009, Miller introduced a Knesset bill which would have made taking part in a Nakba Day event punishable by arrest and up to three years in prison. The prison sentence was later struck from the bill in order to pave way for its becoming law in 2011.

But Miller's Nakba Law still casts a shadow over events marking the day. Legal experts have noted that if schools or other state-supported institutions merely read the names of Palestinians killed or forced to leave their homes in 1948, they could be fined at the discretion of the Finance Minister.

Is it relevant that Miller, a resident of the settlement city of Ariel and a senior member of Avigdor Lieberman's Yisrael Beiteinu party, was born and raised in Leonid Brezhnev's Moscow?

It is relevant because for decades, the Jews of Soviet Russia were forbidden to commemorate their heritage. They were barred - with artfully worded and intensively enforced official repression - from gathering to study their true history, reconstruct their shattered culture, and mark the memories of their people.

It is relevant because the Soviet system tried for decades to legislate feelings and creeds and beliefs and the sense of peoplehood, and because the Soviet system, partially as a result, failed.

In the end, though, I have to thank Alex Miller. Had he not sought to make a name for himself with a law to help obliterate the names of others, I might not have spent time this week studying the history of the place I first lived in Israel, and studying about the people who had lived there before.

http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/a-special-place-in-hell/thank-you-russian-i...

So what does anyone think of the fact that Canada has allowed a diplomat who is a suspected war criminal to enter the country?

Personally I don't give a flying fuck about his personal hygiene I think he should be banned for being a murderer of innocent people.

You can assume that nobody here is defending either Zionism OR Canada's admission of Col. Attias.  Objecting to the phrase "dirty Zionist" doesn't make you a Likudnik.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

Watch what you say or they'll be calling you a radical,a liberal,a fanatical,criminal

Ken Burch

NDPP wrote:

This Is Why Zionism Has Become A Dirty Word

http://desertpeace.wordpress.com/2009/03/25/photo-essay-new-york-jews-te...

 

Those protesters are brave people...they are risking ostracism from, possibly, everybody else they know.

In their honor, I'd like to put this picture from the event directly into this thread:

NDPP

I notice that those who rush to protect dirty war criminals from their adjectives only do so when they are of the Zionist persuasion;

http://rabble.ca/comment/1346041

NDPP

and I honour them with you Ken.

kropotkin1951

Ken Burch wrote:

You can assume that nobody here is defending either Zionism OR Canada's admission of Col. Attias.  Objecting to the phrase "dirty Zionist" doesn't make you a Likudnik.

I would never presume to know the minds of other posters which is why I am open to the idea that some on this board are defending the state of Israel from justified criticism. Your post screams don't talk about the issue because we all agree. That is also a silencing technique especially when it is far from clear that we all agree.

It is similar to trying to destroy arguments by putting words in your opponent's mouths. For instance you have raised the term Likudnik and no one you are talking to has hurled that insult.  So the talk goes from the issue at hand i.e. letting suspected war criminals into Canada especially as diplomats to a stupid side track of we aren't all right wing assholes.  Allah (nice respectful name for an Israeli supporter) like you not only disagreed with the adjective chosen but also tried to put antisemitic words in NDPP's mouth. One of the preferred tactics of some people is too obfuscate the real issue.  This thread has had little discussion of Canada allowing this outrageous appointment because the title has become the topic of discussion not Israeli war crimes. 

You can presume all you want I prefer to keep an open mind on the subject of peoples intents.

Dostoyevsky

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Dostoyevsky wrote:

M. Spector wrote:

Let the pro-Zionist witch-hunt continue!

Yes people who object to the phrase "dirty zionist" must be pro-zionist warmongers.  Why not just say zionist vermin?  Using these words to try and make Israeli Zionists seem less than human is juvenille and stupid and has absolutely nothing to do with justice for the people of Gaza.  It's trolling by NDPP - plain and simple.

Happy Nakba Day

But don't say that anywhere in Israel or a police officer of IDF personnel will clean your clock. Nothing dirty about that.

 

Quote:

Zaheya Madi, a Palestinian woman who was born in 1947, said she was one year old when her family was forced to leave their village, Beit Jerja, during the war in 1948 when Israel closed to the borders with the Gaza Strip. "I can't remember anything, but I still miss my home," she said.

The Palestinian Central Statistics Bureau said in a report to mark Nekba Day that Israel controlled 774 Palestinian towns and villages, and 531 of these towns were ruined. It also said Israeli soldiers killed 15,000 Palestinians before, during or after the war in 1948.

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/world/2012-05/15/c_131589919.htm

Believe it or not I agree with you more than you think.  I believe the creation of the state of Israel was wrong and a tragedy for the Palestinian people.  Just because I dislike NDPP and Martin's smug attitudes and their trolling in this thread and felt like commenting on it doesn't mean you know anything about me or my political views.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

Zionism is not exclusively related with Judaism...Far from it.

I think those who believe the adding of the word 'Dirty' to the word 'Zionist' is somehow 'anti-semtitic'  are just trying to put words in other people's mouths and babble has a nasty habit of smearing those with libelous labels when they disagree with a comment.

The PC train has left the rails.

Dostoyevsky

alan smithee wrote:

Zionism is not exclusively related with Judaism...Far from it.

I think those who believe the adding of the word 'Dirty' to the word 'Zionist' are just trying to put words in other people's mouths and babble has a nasty habit of smearing those with libelous labels when they disagree with a comment.

The PC train has left the rails.

why not just end this thread drift by admitting that adding the adjective dirty doesn't add anything useful to the conversation except to remind people of the history of using that adjective to describe people.  It's not necessary and a total distraction from the real issues  - land theft, unlawful imprisonment, murder.    

kropotkin1951

Dostoyevsky wrote:

Believe it or not I agree with you more than you think.  I believe the creation of the state of Israel was wrong and a tragedy for the Palestinian people.  Just because I dislike NDPP and Martin's smug attitudes and their trolling in this thread and felt like commenting on it doesn't mean you know anything about me or my political views.

I never said I knew anything about you or your political views.  i guess you can't help trying to put words in other peoples mouths.  I know it seems like an easy way to win a debate but it doesn't work.

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

Dostoyevsky wrote:

alan smithee wrote:

Zionism is not exclusively related with Judaism...Far from it.

I think those who believe the adding of the word 'Dirty' to the word 'Zionist' are just trying to put words in other people's mouths and babble has a nasty habit of smearing those with libelous labels when they disagree with a comment.

The PC train has left the rails.

why not just end this thread drift by admitting that adding the adjective dirty doesn't add anything useful to the conversation except to remind people of the history of using that adjective to describe people.  It's not necessary and a total distraction from the real issues  - land theft, unlawful imprisonment, murder.    

 

Thank you for proving my point.

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