The Donetsk National Republic lives!

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ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Truly, glorious victory.

Just as Russian and Soviet era soldiers turned the Nazi tide all those years ago, defying predictions of defeat against the hitherto undefeated Nazi war machine, so too today the fighters of the Donbass their modest international brigades, and their sheer indomitable will and determination to defend their much-loved land, has resulted in a richly deserved crushing rout of the pro-US troops, private thuggish armies, and foreign mercenaries of the Ukrainian junta.

Glory to the fighters of the Donbass! But don't take my word for it.

The Saker wrote:
The Novorussians are in control of most of Debaltsevo (officially 100% as of midnight GMT).  More relevantly, there is no more organized resistance.  Russian sources say that about 1000 junta soldiers have refused to surrender and are hiding in the outskirts or have fled to the south end of the cauldron.  The Novorussians are not even bothering to hunt them down or return their sporadic (and inaccurate) fire: they are waiting for hunger and cold to force them to give up.  A spokesman for the Novorussians has reported that all communications between the junta forces in the cauldron and their commanders have been suppressed.  Russian TV stations are showing footage of Novorussian soliders raising their flag over the center of the city.

And the information war is a crushing victory as well.

Quote:
The most amazing event of the day though is Petro Poroshenko's continual denial that there is any Debaltsevo cauldron at all.  Apparently the junta is in such a shock from the recent events that the freaks in Kiev has decided to simply completely deny the reality of it all.  This is an extremely misguided strategy because even though the Russian media has now been banned on Ukrainian cable and radio stations, and the entire Russian press corps has had its accreditation in the Ukraine canceled, it is still accessible on the Internet and information about the current events is easily transmitted simply by phone (including phone calls from junta forces inside the cauldron).  So while the freaks in the Rada and the government can go into the "deep denial" mode, the population is informed about the reality and rumors will, if anything, only amplify the magnitude of the disaster. 

Even the NY Times doesn't buy the nonsense from President Chocolateshenko. He may now also be in the crosshairs by the fascist freaks and the West generally. Yesterday's man, like Saakashvili in Georgia, gets jettisoned sooner or later. This time, it may be sooner rather than later.

Quote:
I think that what we are witnessing these days is truly a historical event.  While the defeat in Debaltsevo is tactical in its dimension, it will most definitely have serious operational consequences and possibly even strategic ones.

For starters, all those crack troops tied up bringing the cauldron to a boil are now free to go elsewhere. By the spring, the Novorossiyans will be well prepared for any pro-US Ukrainian attack, however well armed they are. "This might well be the beginning of the end for the Nazi experiment in Kiev." And more.

Quote:
The implications for the AngloZionist empire are rather clear: if the 1%ers have any kind of sense of reality left, they should toss out Poroshenko and the rest of the crazies and foster some kind of government of technocrats in charge of drafting a new constitution and organizing a referendum on federalization simply because the folks in Kiev better negotiate while there still is something left to negotiate then to way to be hiding in a surrounded bunker like their hero Hitler did.  Alas, I don't think Uncle Sam or the Eurocretins have any common sense left in them.

Whatever may be the case, by the ballot or by the bullet, but we *are* winning.

Prolonged, stormy, tumultuous applause!!!!!!!!!!

ikosmos ikosmos's picture
ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Golden Stars of the Heroes of the Donetsk People's Republic

Contrast this, if you please, with the junta ... which saves money to be paid out to widows by leaving the dead on the battlefield, and/or pretending they are MIA, or betraying the ordinary soldiers by leaving them in an impossible position in the Debaltsevo cauldron so as to avoid the anger of their extreme-rightist/fascist domestic political allies...

NDPP

Genesis of Ukraine and Ukrainians: Maidan as a Bifurcation Point of 'Nation Building  -  by Pavel Gubarev

http://novorossia.today/russian-spring-the-struggle-for-democratic-right...

"Ukraine is a vast - in European terms - multiethnic country, situated on the civilizational joint line of Western and Russian civilization."

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

DPR leader Zakharchenko in a press conference, noting how the junt conducts itself, withdrawing armaments as reported, yes, but continuing the shelling of civilian areas anyway.

The other thing of note that Zakharcheno points out is that while, in the main, the military hostilities have been reduced, or mostly ceased, the regime is now carrying out war against the people in the east of the country with the blockade, cutting of fuel lines, preventing food and medical supplies from getting in. The only exception is water. It seems that the water supply for Mariupol is connected to the water for the areas controlled by the resistance; the result of cutting the water supply to the areas controlled by the DPR and LPR would mean cutting the water supply to areas controlled by the junta. Nevertheless, the resistance expects this sort of spiteful action from the junta, and is preparing for that eventuality as well ...

Zakharchenko in press conference...

6079_Smith_W

Gubarev?

Kind of funny that he is trying to justify his own rebel movement by claiming the country he is trying to break away from is just an invention of the Soviet Union. Remind me about those genocide claims again?

Quote:

Before 1939 Ukrainians existed as ethnic minorities of the adjoining states and were often subjected to repressions on religious, ethnic and cultural grounds, and the ultimate unification of the Ukrainian lands took place only in composition of the Ukrainian SSR. At that time the self-appellation “Ukrainians” was not widely known. This ethnonyme became well-known only in the Soviet period of the history of Ukraine.

They have Russia to thank for even existing at all. Right.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

6079_Smith_W wrote:
They have Russia to thank for even existing at all. Right.

This has been written about more than once. Some commentators have noted the irony of tearing down statues of Lenin (or Stalin if they are still around) by Uke nationalists when those political figures played such a key role in the establishment of a separate Ukrainian state. Historically, in domestic Russian politics, it was the Communist left that fought hardest for the concept of the right of nations to self-determination.

There are still plenty on the English Canadian left, I would add, that have not, even in the 21st century, risen to this level of understanding and, for example, continue to hold Quebec-phobic attitudes in this country.

6079_Smith_W

So that's why Gubarev, like other pro Russian propagandists also claim that Ukraine isn't a realnation at all, and only exists because of Russia. If you want an actual Canadian comparison that is the same as claiming that Native people should thank Ottawa for creating their nations. It is a ridiculous lie, and one which makes it clear who gubarev really represents. Though I wonder, did he write that before or after his comrades ousted him and tried to kill him? If after, then he is an even bigger fool.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

The return of Crimea to Russia and the establishment of the independent DPR and LPR certainly shows that "the state formerly known as Ukraine" no longer exists. What is left is rapidly falling into chaos, complete with fascist para-militaries, brutal IMF-imposed austerity, xenophobic repression of minorities, and all the other blessings of a US-sponsored failed state.

Just call it what it is now. Banderistan.

NDPP

Why Novorossiya?

Novorossian Herald December 2014

http://novorossia.today/wp-content/uploads/nh/nh2.pdf

"...Novorossiya will never be Ukraine anymore. We are too different and what is the most important - blood has been spilled. We will not live in the same country with people who profess the Bandera ideology and killed our friends and family. Although it was external forces that were controlling this process, leaning on the Nazi and Bandera ideological component, Banderovites have established their authority and have support on the West Ukrainian territory.

Bandera ideas became the ideological component of modern Ukraine almost from the very first days of its existence and Bandera followers were the driving force..."

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Battle for Donetsk video game

 

This is a war game with a difference. There is no good or bad, only casualties.

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

ikosmos wrote:

6079_Smith_W wrote:
They have Russia to thank for even existing at all. Right.

This has been written about more than once. Some commentators have noted the irony of tearing down statues of Lenin (or Stalin if they are still around) by Uke nationalists when those political figures played such a key role in the establishment of a separate Ukrainian state. Historically, in domestic Russian politics, it was the Communist left that fought hardest for the concept of the right of nations to self-determination.

There are still plenty on the English Canadian left, I would add, that have not, even in the 21st century, risen to this level of understanding and, for example, continue to hold Quebec-phobic attitudes in this country.

Indeed. We even see it here.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Beyond Left and Right, Beyond Red and White: Framing the Liberation War in Donbass

The video is based on an article by Nina Kouprianova with the above title.

Framing the Liberation War in Donbass

Noteworthy concepts of "Russian civilization" and other ideas expressed here.

NDPP

Zina From Donetsk

https://youtu.be/jgnj_UcXiF4

Cleaning up from war

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Pepe Escobar has been in Donetsk reporting for his Hong Kong publication (and others). Links to follow.

"I saw the best minds of my generation destroyed by madness"

P Escobar wrote:
Thus what I saw were the ghastly side effects of the worst minds of my – and a subsequent – generation corroded by (war) madness.

I saw refugees on the Russian side of the border, mostly your average middle-class European family whose kids, when they first came to the shelter,  would duck under tables when they heard a plane in the sky.

I saw the Dylan of Donetsk holed up in his lonely room in a veterans’ home turned refugee shelter fighting the blues and the hopelessness by singing songs of love and heroism.

I saw whole families holed up in fully decorated Soviet-era bomb shelters too afraid to go out even by daylight, traumatized by the bombings orchestrated by Kiev’s “anti-terrorist operations”.

....

I did not see, as Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe international observers also didn’t, the rows and rows of Russian tanks and soldiers that the current Dr. Strangelove in charge of NATO, General Breedhate, sees everyday in his exalted dreams invading Ukraine over and over again.

And I did not see the arrogance, the ignorance, the shamelessness and the lies distorting those manicured faces in Kiev, Washington and Brussels while they insist, over and over again, that the entire population of Donbass, traumatized babushkas and children of all ages included, are nothing but “terra-rists”.

After all, they are Western “civilization”-enabled cowards who would never dare to show their manicured faces to the people of Donbass.

So this is my gift to them.

Just a howl of anger and unbounded contempt.

Ginsberg would be proud of such truth-telling.

NDPP

While Canada itself becomes a kind of Kiev...

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Ukrainian saboteurs preparing provocations — Donetsk PR Defense Ministry spokesman

TASS wrote:
The self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic (DPR) has data on subversive groups who, under the guise of militiamen, will stage provocations and open fire on Ukrainian positions, DPR Defense Ministry spokesman Eduard Basurin said Wednesday.

Who are the terrorists again?

nicky

I'm wondering if this explains some of the posts on this thread:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/apr/02/putin-kremlin-inside-russia... 

"Just after 9pm each day, a long line of workers files out of 55 Savushkina Street, a modern four-storey office complex with a small sign outside that reads “Business centre”. Having spent 12 hours in the building, the workers are replaced by another large group, who will work through the night. The nondescript building has been identified as the headquarters of Russia’s “troll army”, where hundreds of paid bloggers work round the clock to flood Russian internet forums, social networks and the comments sections of western publications with remarks praising the president, Vladimir Putin, and raging at the depravity and injustice of the west......

The trolls were firmly instructed that there should never be anything bad written about the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic (DNR) or the Luhansk People’s Republic (LNR), and never anything good about the Ukrainian government."

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

nicky wrote:
The trolls were firmly instructed that there should never be anything bad written about the self-proclaimed Donetsk People’s Republic (DNR) or the Luhansk People’s Republic (LNR), and never anything good about the Ukrainian government."

aw, gee. If I mention that the DPR - like the Ukrainian junta - banned the Communist Party from participating in the elections there, does that mean I get your seal of approval that I'm NOT one of the afore-mentioned trolls?

It would mean a lot to me. Not.

 

sherpa-finn

C'mon ikosmos, - what does the Communist Party have to do with anything anymore in this region?  Is this the moment we link to Barbra Streisand singing "The Way We Were"?" 

The sad truth is its just your favourite plutocrat's militia fighting someone else's favourite plutocrat's militia.

And most of us just don't have a dog in this unhappy race. 

NDPP

It's A Waiting Game in Donbas. What Comes Next?

http://newcoldwar.org/its-a-waiting-game-in-donbas-what-comes-next/

"Reflecting on my visit to Donetsk last week, what strikes me the most is the total absence of Russia, in every respect.

Once again, Russia has chosen the legalistic approach by adhering to agreements.

Many are baffled by this approach, knowing that the other party, that is the West and its puppet government in Kiev, could not care less.

Certainly, Russia must know that it cannot impress the West in any way with such respect for agreements. Whatever it does, it will continuously be accused of breaching agreements and incursions into Ukraine..."

NDPP

For Their Smiles...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d49_1428772269

"The last time we visited Donbass, we accidentally ended up at the Krasnodan orphanage/boarding school for disabled children. Evacuating such children to the basement during each bombardment is almost impossible - many of the children are quite grown, some cannot walk.

Only women work in the school. In the summer, shells fell 150 meters from the orphanage. But none of the staff stopped working or left the children. These women are heroes..."

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

RE: it's a waiting game, etc.

Donetsk and Lugansk Republics will probably have to combine into one Novorossiya. And how long can they live, side by side, with a state drenched in fascist and Neo-Nazi influence in key positions of authority? This, assumes, even, that failures on the battlefield will not lead to more "determined" elements grabbing complete power in rump Ukraine or Banderistan, whatever the "official" electoral results are. As in Right Sector, Yarosh, and other jackbooters.

A sudden de-capitation of the Kievan junta's leadership and a long period of peaceful economic development would be the best scenario. Much more likely is another horrific attack on Novorossiya by the junta, richly funded by the US and its vassal states, accompanied by dead silence on the uncountable civilian casualties and noisy exaggeration of the "heroic" losses, etc, etc., etc.. followed by the disarray of another failed state and all the blessings that the US and its vassals have bestowed on Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Yemen, Yugoslavia, drenched in the horror of millions displaced, tens and hundreds of thousands dead, infrastructure destroyed, apalling and horrificly uncountable human losses...

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Western MSM interview with Donetsk leader Zahkarchenko.

This is significant as much of Western MSM accepts the junta's narrative and has treated all resistance leaders, elected or not, as "terrorists" or sub-humans and whose casualties are not even worth reporting other than in the most vague and mis-leading way (e.g., "as a result of conflict" some civilians died but the numbers "can't be confirmed" etc. etc. )Even Bloomberg Business can't resist calling Zakharchenko the leader of the "self proclaimed" DPR, etc.

Russia Insider wrote:
Zakharchenko said Mariupol will eventually be part of his people’s republic.

“We will liberate all our compatriots,” he said, adding that he had about 23,000 troops under his control and 30,000 reserves. “It’s easy to outflank it and they will surrender. Don’t forget, our mothers and our sisters live there, so don’t make us out to be bloodthirsty beasts.”

Bloomberg Business interview with Alexander Zakharchenko

NDPP

E Ukraine Forces Close-Up: Meet Margarita Seidler..

http://rt.com/op-edge/254649-margarita-seidler-volunteer-strelkov-battal...

"The defense of Donbass became the first major volunteer war in Europe since the Spanish Civil War."

NDPP

In Horlovka, Eastern Ukraine, a Donetsk Republic Rises

http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/05/07/in-horlovka-eastern-ukraine-a-don...

"...The fact is, and this may seem a paradox, when Kyiv authorities decided to starve elderly people already suffering from shelling and cold by cutting off their pensions, they expected this would bring the Donetsk People's Republic to its knees.

However, Kyiv officials, who hate the coal dust tainted proletarians of the Donetsk region, have achieved quite the opposite effect. Their inhumane initiatives, have served to further legitimize the new Republic in the eyes of the local residents.

We use the abbreviation 'DPR' more and more often as the name of the community to which we belong. You can dissemble it and call it 'unrecognized' or 'self-declared'. You can even call it a 'terrorist organization'.

But the fact remains, there are hundreds of thousands of us who are getting used to the fact that we do not live in Ukraine, anymore."

NDPP

What Does Donetsk Want?

https://youtu.be/h4PQeaG6hMo

"The main point is we don't want their fascism.."

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Resistance nationalizes bank ... of oligarch and supporter of fascist militias Igor Kolomoisky!

Quote:
Having been nationalized, these banks are now apparently going to be used for investment in infrastructure for the people of the DPR. This infrastructure is expected to be used for roads, sanitation, and other public services but also for the purposes of industrial infrastructure and transportation.

...which is a breath of fresh air compared to what private banking or privatized central banks (such as the US Federal Reserve) do.

Ukraine Rebels Nationalize Banks, Drawing the Ire of the US & World Bankers

NDPP

Happy Victory Day From Donetsk Republic!

http://fortruss.blogspot.ca/2015/05/big-victory-day-in-donetsk-zakharche...

Video and photos

 

'It is Our Time, Their Time Has Already Passed.'

http://novorossia.today/it-is-our-time-their-time-has-been-already-passe...

"It will be one year on 11th of May, since the moment citizens of Donbass voted for the formation of the DPR and LPR.

We have to offer our active agenda for this 'Ukraine'. It will be demilitarization, denazification, de-tycoonization..."

6079_Smith_W

Pavel Gubarev? Last time we heard weren't they deposing and arresting him, then trying to push his car into a tree?

Perhaps when he says the time is passed, he means the time when he used to wear a fascist uniform.

NDPP

Yes, the last time his name came up and probably the time before as well, you alluded to his 1999-2000 membership in a nationalist youth group, but never bother to mention his membership after in the Progressive Socialist Party of Ukraine, his University degrees etc. "I am red to the bone", is his own description of himself.

For further confusion, here's a relatively recent and badly translated interview with him..

http://23on.com/exclusive-interview-with-the-leader-of-new-russia-pavel-...

6079_Smith_W

I am curious, since obviously there were some among the rebels who wanted him dead. So it is odd to have him turn up again as a spokesperson.

And if I continue to mention it, it is because the rebels seem to be in denial of the fact they have just as many far right elements among their ranks as Ukraine does - more, probably.

That is because the only card they have to play is this "Nazi" lie. So it is kind of hard to square their own fascist roots, and current association with fascist organizations and ideas.

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

6079_Smith_W wrote:
And if I continue to mention it, it is because the rebels seem to be in denial of the fact they have just as many far right elements among their ranks as Ukraine does - more, probably.

That is because the only card they have to play is this "Nazi" lie. So it is kind of hard to square their own fascist roots, and current association with fascist organizations and ideas.

 

SOP of UkrNazis is to identify Hitlerite Germany and the former Soviet Union as "equally responsible" for WW2 and all the 55 million or so deaths.

I see Smith is using the same technique. Well done.

6079_Smith_W

ikosmos wrote:

SOP of UkrNazis is to identify Hitlerite Germany and the former Soviet Union as "equally responsible" for WW2 and all the 55 million or so deaths.

I see Smith is using the same technique. Well done.

I have said nothing of the sort. As for Stalin, no one has said he is equally responsible for that specific war, but he was working overtime on slaughtering people long before Hitler came to power.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Smith, paraphrased: 

"I completely reject your claim but, while we're on about it, clearly the Soviets bear the brunt of the responsibility for World War II."

kropotkin1951

Seems to me the only question is do people have the right to determine their own future? If Canada is supposedly supporting "democracy" then maybe they should get involved in trying for a peaceful settlement so that the people can use the ballot box to determine what nationality they want to be. It is apparent that the Donetski Republic has strong support amongst the people but no one knows how much support. Let them decide.

Apparently the American way of dealing with a civil war is what they are pushing on the Ukraine. Of course the est. 625,000-850,000 dead in the American civil war were just collateral damage. One estimate of the death toll is that ten percent of all Northern males 20–45 years old, and 30 percent of all Southern white males aged 18–40 died.[11] Of course the bonus for the winning North was they got to steal everything of value in the South. Something I am sure the Kiev government is hoping for.

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

kropotkin1951 wrote:
Seems to me the only question is do people have the right to determine their own future?

The NATO support of an independent Kosovo, against the wishes of those around it, undermines all the cheap talk by those same NATO regimes, Canada included, against Crimean or Novorossiyan independence. Quite simply, and this is hardly my original idea, the US regime is for "democracy" when it suits their own foreign policy. When it does not, as in the current case, or in the case of the 2006 Palestinian election, the US literally arranges for bombings to punish the incipient democracy. And Canada follows along, whether "Liberal" or "Conservative" like a good little doggy.

Quote:
Apparently the American way of dealing with a civil war is what they are pushing on the Ukraine. Of course the est. 625,000-850,000 dead in the American civil war were just collateral damage. One estimate of the death toll is that ten percent of all Northern males 20–45 years old, and 30 percent of all Southern white males aged 18–40 died.[11] Of course the bonus for the winning North was they got to steal everything of value in the South. Something I am sure the Kiev government is hoping for.

I'm glad that you mention the USA but perhaps not for the reason you may think. Yes, this is a civil war, but the role of outside players is key. No, I don't mean the mythical Russian invasion. Rather, I just don't see the Kiev regime as truly independent. They take orders from Washington. Hell, some US citizens even had rushed Ukrainian citizenship so they could play key Ministerial roles in the current government.

Now, whether you call it a puppet regime, or whatever you call it, I think it's important to acknowledge that irrational policy of attacking your own citizens and making a shambles of the country also makes sense from the US geostrategic point of view of making Ukraine a failed state, a mess, right on Russia's border. That which Uncle Sam cannot control he is happy to destroy. And I think that is a very possible scenario -  frozen conflict, like Korea, with armed camps facing each other, and the US military with their finger on the nuclear trigger.

 

6079_Smith_W

I agree the Old South is a good comparison. After all they perfected the romantic lie of turning a feudal slave state, which was actually the aggressor, into genteel, downtrodden Old Dixie.

NDPP

Ukraine Crisis News: 11-05-2015 (and vid)

http://thesaker.is/11-05-2015-ukraine-crisis-news-latest-news-of-ukraine...

Anniversary of DPR-LPR self-determination referendum:

'Do you support the act of state independence of the Donetsk-Lugansk Republic?'

DPR- 89.6%     LPR - 96.2%

kropotkin1951

6079_Smith_W wrote:

I agree the Old South is a good comparison. After all they perfected the romantic lie of turning a feudal slave state, which was actually the aggressor, into genteel, downtrodden Old Dixie.

You are not agreeing with me you and you know it. I guess one still can't have a  discussion without you purposefully misreading what people write.  So show me the fucking slaves in the Ukraine that you are alluding too you disengenious twit.

6079_Smith_W

I was talking about the lie and the scam, kropotkin. ikosmos also took a different spin on it. Gonna call him names too?

The top-heavy nature of plantation economy wasn't just limited to slaves. It truly was oligarchical. And they weren't satisfied with keeping slavery within their borders, but started legal processes which would have opened the entire U.S. to that institution, and despite the shabby state their economy had fallen to by the time of the war, they were initially the most powerful bloc in the U.S.

Good analogy, and as ikosmos said, just not in the way you meant it.

 

 

kropotkin1951

So 6079 I gather you have absolutely no respect for the right of the people of the Ukraine to secede from a central government they find oppresive because it  openly claims to hate people of Russian descent. I guess given your anti-Russian hatred and the ethnicity of most of the area in revolt you would really like to see 30% of all males in the eastern Ukraine killed.

Why is it that Canada needs to train one side's troops?  Its not like there are not oligarchs with deep pockets supporting both sides. We have no reason to be involved full stop.

6079_Smith_W

What are you talking about? Who said anything about hating Russians or wanting anyone killed?

 

NDPP

Right Sector Nationalists' Exercise in Donbass May Escalate Conflict

http://tass.ru/en/world/794085

"An exercise launched by fighters of the Russia-banned nationalist Right Sector organization in Ukraine's eastern Donestk region, is at variance with the Minsk agreements and may escalate the conflict in the troubled Donbas, the official envoy of the self-proclaimed Donestk People's Republic for the Contact Group, Denis Pushilin, said on Monday.

'A punitive battalion of radically minded people launches an official exercise. This not only violates the Minsk 2 agreements, but actually worsens the situation,' the Donetsk News Agency quotes Pushilin as saying.

In November, 2014, the Supreme Court of the Russian Federation declared Right Sector an extremist organization."

 

Happy Birthday Donbass!

http://thesaker.is/happy-birthday-donbass/

"...But they did it. Right under the nose of the Ukronazis and their western allies. And having celebrated the defeat of Nazi Germany over the weekend, we can now all celebrate the birthday of the DNR and wish her many more!

kropotkin1951

6079_Smith_W wrote:

What are you talking about? Who said anything about hating Russians or wanting anyone killed?

I post about the horrors of civil war and you post a comparison to slavery. Your posts in this topic and others show contempt for all things Russian and sound like hatred. Your promotion of Canada training fighters for a civil war means you want people killed.

6079_Smith_W

Actually, better trained soldiers means fewer people killed:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/10/world/europe/ukraine-troops-receive-us...

And I have no idea where you are getting this nonsense from. I told you quite clearly what I was refering to - the great whopping lie built around this war. I haven't said anything hateful against Russians, nor have I said anything in favour of the mass slaughter of people in eastern Ukraine.

So are you back from vacation for good, or just driving by?

 

NDPP

That pathological and violent hatred of all things Russian has always been the essence of Bandera thought, and is the reason both the Nazis and Americans  found it such a useful creature to weaponize against Russia. The Ukrainian diasporic lobby organizations in Canada like UCC are badly afflicted with this tendency as well.

kropotkin1951

6079_Smith_W wrote:

So are you back from vacation for good, or just driving by?

Are you the new police? Still trying to stop any dissent from your biased opinions by using this kind of disengenious attack?  But I guess a tip of the hat must be given to you because you are the best at it.

6079_Smith_W

No k, and stay as long as you like; it was a simple question. But don't show up with a chip on your shoulder, calling names and making accusations about me hating people and wanting them dead and expect me to not say something.

You want honest conversation about the issues rather than grudges? I am more than happy to engage.

 

kropotkin1951

6079_Smith_W wrote:

You want honest conversation about the issues rather than grudges? I am more than happy to engage.

Bullshit. I post a neutral comment on this thread talking about the evils of civil war and you disengeniously spin it around to claim I am saying that the Donetsk Republic is akin to slave owners. You don't engage on any issue you just troll and bait. 

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