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NDPP wrote:

Loud & Clear (and podcast)

"New cracks emerge in 'Russiagate': beneath the headlines. 'Like a clown-car of lawyers,' and in the meantime the country is falling apart."

And in the meantime Trump's onetime national security adviser, campaign manager, deputy campaign manager, personal attorney, and foreign policy adviser — have all either pleaded guilty or been found guilty of federal crimes.


None of which had anything to do with Russia.


Papadopoulos pleaded guilty in October to lying to the FBI about his contacts during the campaign with a professor who, prosecutors alleged in court filings, had “substantial connections to Russian government officials.”

Not to mention the 12 indicted members of the GRU who will only get away with it because they're not in the country.


Nothingburger. And the Prof was Maltese not Russian.  The only PROVEN 2016 election interference and collusion  with a foreign government, my Yanqui friend, is that between the DNC Clinton team and Ukraine. 

Ukrainian Efforts to Sabotage Trump Backfire - Politico (2017)

New Material on the REAL 2016 Election Interference



Doesn't matter if he was Pomeranian.  It's his connection to Russian government officials that was relevant.

That's "proven", but the indicitment of 12 GRU officials is not proof?  LOL.


It is indeed proven. And is every bit as relevant. To conspire with a foreign government to alter or interfere with an election is as illegal for Dems as it is for Repugs, irregardless of your particular American ideological possession.


Proven?  How is it proven?  Were they convicted in a court of law?  Fake news.  And McCarthyism to boot.


Your denial of Ukrainian collusion as your denial of Israeli collusion c0mes as no surprise.  American denial of  the fundamental, inherently evil nature of your duopoly politics is well known to the rest of the world as is your country's proclivity to interfere in the affairs of others. 


I know full well Israeli interference in U.S. elections and politics.  That doesn’t excuse Russia cyber break in.


Michael Moriarity wrote:

1. Binney says that the U.S. military/industrial/intelligence/media complex is not to be trusted because they have always lied about anything they didn't want people to know. I agree with this fully.

2. Binney says that the indictment of the 12 Russian GRU agents is phony because what they did is just what spies do, on all sides. While this is just what spies do, it doesn't mean that it isn't illegal. However, the most important point is all the technical allegations in the indictment, which Binney didn't even deign to comment on. To me, the picture the indictment paints is very convincing, even though it is unlikely that any of those charged will ever be tried.

I agree with Binney's points 1 and 2.

The civil war in the US oligarchy is a great show to watch. I never watched The Apprentice because I found the Orange Herring to be an obnoxious asshole. He ran for President because as a conman he realized he'd either get elected or increase his brand name. Look around a conman and one is sure to find crooked cronies.

If this story is to be believed the whole thing is amateur hour and shows that Russian spys are really not up to the modern world. I mean if the Dutch can hack the Russians then who can't? I don't think the Dutch have more capability than the Five Eyes so it seems that we are being told that all of the Russian secret service agencies are an open book.

The US also regularily trys to interfere in other people's elections and are often effective. Frankly everytime I see a pro-American Venezualan politician stand in front of Congress asking for sanctions against their elected government I think of treason. Congress apparently believes it has the right to interfer anywhere in the world on behalf its syncophants so I frankly think the hue and cry over this level of interference in the US election is a joke.

voice of the damned

josh wrote:

I know full well Israeli interference in U.S. elections and politics.  That doesn’t excuse Russia cyber break in.

Basically, the question is not interference, but whether or not laws were broken.

If Justin Trudeau gets caught on tape paying neighbourhood kids five-bucks-a-pop to rip down opposition lawn signs in his riding, he's probably gonna end up with a criminal record and have to resign. And the Liberals could scream "What about all the corporations who influence the electoral process to the tune of millions of dollars a year?!" all they want, but it's not gonna make a dime's worth of difference, if what the corporations are doing is allowed under the law.  


What the Brennan Affair Really Reveals (and vid)

"John Brennan, CIA director under President Obama, characterized Trump's press conference with Putin as 'nothing short of treasonous'. In the political media furor that followed, Brennan was mostly heroized as an avatar of civil liberties and free speech, and Trump traduced as the enemy. Brennan's allegation was unprecedented. No such high-level official had ever before  accused a sitting president of treason, still more his collusion with the Kremlin.

Why did Brennan, a calculating man, risk leveling such a charge, which might reasonably be characterized as sedition? The most plausible explanation is that he sought to deflect growing attention to his role as the 'Godfather' of the entire Russiagate narrative. If so, we need to know Brennan's unvarnished views on Russia. They are set out with astounding candor in a NYT op-ed of August 17. They are those of Joseph McCarthy and J Edgar Hoover in their prime.

The result is, of course - and no less ominous - to criminalize any advocacy of 'cooperating with Russia', or detente, as Trump sought to do in Helsinki with Putin. Still more, a full-fledged Russophobic hysteria is sweeping through the American political-media establishment, from Brennan and - pending actual evidence against her - those who engineered the arrest of Maria Butina - to the senators now preparing new 'crippling sanctions' against Moscow.

As the dangers grow of actual war with Russia, from Ukraine and the Baltic region to Syria - the capacity of US policy-makers, above all the president are invariably diminished.  Finally, there was a time when Democrats, certainly liberal Democrats, could be counted on to resist this kind of hysteria and, yes, spreading neo-McCarthyism. (Brennan's defenders accuse Trump of McCarthyism, but Brennan's charge of treason without presenting any actual evidence was quintessential McCarthy.)

After all, civil liberties, including freedom of speech are directly involved - and not only Brennan's and Trump's. But Democratic members of Congress and pro-Democratic media outlets are in the forefront of the new anti-Russia hysteria, with only a few exceptions..."

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

NDPP needs to rush out and buy a copy of Ann Coulter's new book, which proves conclusively that Killary was behind the whole Russia hacking story right from the start.


Was your ridiculous and pathetic smear directed at Prof Stephen Cohen's considered analysis above, me, or both, Michael? Having obviously been played as a fool by 'Russiagate', are you now so determined to play the part as well?

Besides, the story has already been told in 'Shattered: Inside Hillary Clinton's Doomed Campaign,' by Jonathan Allen, Amie Parnes:

"Within 24 hours of her concession speech, [campaign chair John Podesta and manager Robby Mook], assembled her communications team at the Brooklyn headquarters to engineer the case that the election wasn't entirely on the up-and-up. For a couple of hours with Shake Shack containers littering the room, they went over the script they would pitch to the press and the public. Already Russian hacking was the centerpiece of the argument.

The plan, according to the book was to push journalists to cover how 'Russian hacking was the major unreported story of the campaign,' and it succeeded to a fare-thee-well. After the election, coverage of the Russian 'collusion' story was relentless, and it helped pressure investigations and hearings on Capitol Hill and even the naming of a special counsel, which in turn has triggered virtually nonstop coverage..."

Yikes! New Behind The Scenes Cook Brutalizes the Clinton Campaign  -  by Matt Taibbi

'Shattered' is what happens when political parties become too disconnected from their voters. Trump or no Trump, the Democrats need therapy - and soon."


The Jimmy Dore Show

"Cohen and Manafort guilt not related to Russia."


Why not wait until Mueller presents all the results of his investigation before determining the ethics, morality, and, legality of Trump's actions? I think it's important to remember that Mueller is investigating Trump, not Russia.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

NDPP wrote:

Was your ridiculous and pathetic smear directed at Prof Stephen Cohen's considered analysis above, me, or both, Michael?

Just you, NDPP. And I don't think it's a ridiculous smear. After all, you quoted National Review, America's longest running white supremacist magazine, just a few posts back, so why not Ann Coulter?

Regarding Prof. Cohen, I have watched him on television and read his articles for several decades, and I have always considered him a genuine expert and honest commentator on Russia and the U.S. relationship with Russia. I still respect his opinion about his area of expertise, and I completely agree with him that more cooperation with Russia is necessary, and confrontation with Russia should be avoided if at all possible. I also agree that there is a very dangerous mood of Russia hatred in the U.S. especially in the media and political elites.

As to the specific Nation article you posted, I agree with Cohen that John Brennan is a horrible person with no honour at all, and I have felt this way since I first learned of his existence, back in the W years. I also agree that Brennan's calling Trump a traitor is over the line, although it doesn't even come close to being sedition, as Cohen suggests. If calling the president a traitor were a crime, there would be hundreds of Republican office holders in prison because of their statements during the Obama administration.

But the point of the post you called a smear was the question of whether the Russians really did hack the DNC as I hypothesize, or the Dems just made that up, as you and Ann Coulter contend. Now, I really don't give a shit whether the Russians did it or not. I don't care politically, and it wouldn't change any of my other positions if I turned out to be wrong, so I approach the question as just another technical puzzle.

I've been an application developer since before the internet was invented, and as such I've had to pay a moderate amount of attention to the issue of security. I read several information technology web sites daily, including a couple specifically dedicated to network security, so I think I have enough competence to have an informed opinion. My best informed guess, based on technical considerations only, is that the Russians did the DNC hack.

In coming to my opinion, I don't rely on clever journalists like Max Blumenthal, or ex-spooks like Bill Binney, but rather actual network security experts like Bruce Schneier and Thomas Rid, both of whom think the Russians probably did it. I will also say that Crowdstrike, the firm that did the original forensic analysis, is generally respected in the business, despite many claims to the contrary by those who don't want to believe Russia did it.

Schneier has written a couple of pieces about this question.

Bruce Schneier wrote:

The constellation of evidence attributing the attacks against the DNC, and subsequent release of information, is comprehensive. It's possible that there was more than one attack. It's possible that someone not associated with Russia leaked the information to WikiLeaks, although we have no idea where that someone else would have obtained the information. We know that the Russian actors who hacked the DNC­ -- both the FSB, Russia's principal security agency, and the GRU, Russia's military intelligence unit -- ­are also attacking other political networks around the world.

Rid also has more than one article on the subject.

Thomas Rid wrote:

The forensic evidence linking the DNC breach to known Russian operations is very strong. On June 20, two competing cybersecurity companies, Mandiant (part of FireEye) and Fidelis, confirmed CrowdStrike's initial findings that Russian intelligence indeed hacked the DNC. The forensic evidence that links network breaches to known groups is solid: used and reused tools, methods, infrastructure, even unique encryption keys. For example: in late March the attackers registered a domain with a typo—misdepatrment[.]com—to look suspiciously like the company hired by the DNC to manage its network, MIS Department. They then linked this deceptive domain to a long-known APT 28 so-called X-Tunnel command-and-control IP address, 45.32.129[.]185.

One of the strongest pieces of evidence linking GRU to the DNC hack is the equivalent of identical fingerprints found in two burglarized buildings: a reused command-and-control address—176.31.112[.]10—that was hard coded in a piece of malware found both in the German parliament as well as on the DNC's servers. Russian military intelligence was identified by the German domestic security agency BfV as the actor responsible for the Bundestag breach. The infrastructure behind the fake MIS Department domain was also linked to the Berlin intrusion through at least one other element, a shared SSL certificate.




Washington is a poisonous duopoly - an odious nest of military, secret police, corporate media, lawyers, politicians and other crooked liars and hustlers. 

"Aside from Carolyn, my four children and my immediate family, I consider you to be the best friend and the best person I have met in my long life!' - Michael Cohen lawer Lanny J Davis to Crooked Hillary (2010)

"My recommendation to Americans who want to be free: end all emotional attachment to either of the two major political parties." - Joe Lauria -



"In the topsy turvy aftermath of the Trump presidency and Russiagate hoax, even Rudolph Giuliani can be truthful and yet be pilloried for saying what is obvious...The Russiagate investigation is proof that this country is run by liars, race-baiters, warmongers, torturers and their enablers.

The Brennans of the world work for both Republican and Democrat administrations. The Giulianis and Trumps thrive politically by publicly declaring and then acting upon racist intent. All of these evil-doers are upheld by the corporate media if they curry favor well enough.

They shouldn't be able to influence those who purport to be on the left.

Anyone who is really paying attention can see that the criminal gangs at the top are exposing themselves. They are all enemies of the people and the people should loudly say that none of these emperors are wearing any clothes."

Giuliani and Brennan: Truth or Dare


The Jimmy Dore Show

"CNN push dumbest & funniest Russiagate article yet."


Trump says it was China. Is that the party line now?


How the Department of Homeland Security Created a Deceptive Tale of Russian Hacking US Voter Sites    -    by Gareth Porter

"... The Mueller indictments of GRU officers released on July 13 appeared at first reading to offer new evidence of Russian government responsibility for the hacking of Illinois and other state voter related websites. A close analysis of the relevant paragraphs however, confirms the lack of any real intelligence supporting that claim..."


The Jimmy Dore Show

"CNN caught lying about Russiagate & won't retract."


'Vital' US Moles in the Kremlin Go Missing! (and vid)

"According to NYT intel leakers, 'informants close to' Putin have 'gone silent'. What can it all mean?"

voice of the damned

NDPP wrote:


"Aside from Carolyn, my four children and my immediate family, I consider you to be the best friend and the best person I have met in my long life!' - Michael Cohen lawer Lanny J Davis to Crooked Hillary (2010)


If you're gonna claim to be taking a "pox on both their houses" stance with regards to the major American parties, I recomnend not using uniquely Republican slogans like "Crooked Hillary".   


I use it not because it's Republican but because it's empirically true. Sorry if you're CH supporter but 2+2=4 after all. 

The Jimmy Dore Show

"Democrats CAVE AGAIN & fast-track Trump's judges


Continued here.


Topic locked