Living in the SARS-CoV-2 era (distancing, wash hands, wear mask to protect others, but OK to go outside)

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Sean in Ottawa

Ok we are playing conspiracy theories:

Let's consider this one:

The US  has covid 19 already and has community transmission. The US administration puts the most incompetent person they can find in charge -- Pence --  a man with a track record of screwing up a health crisis. 

The US sends the message to the undocumented -- do not seek medical care -- you may be deported for doing so. They send the message to people who do not have citizenship that you cannot use medicaid or you lose the opportunity.

This is a big conspiracy -- you will see soon.

Mexico is going to finally offer to pay for that F$%#ing Wall.

(oh, please do not think I am serious -- okay?)

NorthReport

So, if you do not have the virus, would you wear a mask when traveling?

101,490

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

Sean in Ottawa

NorthReport wrote:

So, if you do not have the virus, would you wear a mask when traveling?

101,490

https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

No. Better to postpone travel. A mask is ineffective largely on protecting the wearer and using them in this way takes away from supplies for healthcare workers. I would wear gloves. The reason for the gloves is to remind myself to not touch my face and to be more crareful about surfaces. I would use hand sanitizer to clean the gloves frequently and wash hands at all opportunity. Better yet, postpone travel if possible.

No on the mask -- without goggles they are largely pointless

NorthReport
NorthReport

 

Trump aides pound on China. Health experts say: Please stop.

The coronavirus is deepening the rift between Beijing and Washington, at a time when cooperation is needed most.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/03/13/trump-china-coronavirus-127919

NorthReport

COVID-19, Brought to You by Globalization

How the virus exploits traits of our economy extolled as modern triumphs.

https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2020/03/13/COVID-19-Brought-By-Globalization/

NorthReport

Five Lessons from Past Pandemics

‘Disaster planning does not go as planned’ and more of history’s teachings for the era of COVID-19.

https://thetyee.ca/Analysis/2020/03/12/Five-Lessons-Past-Pandemics-History-Disaster-Planning-COVID-19/

NorthReport

So what has China done to put a stop to the live animal markets?

Sean in Ottawa

NorthReport wrote:
So what has China done to put a stop to the live animal markets?

They banned them

NorthReport

Pay attention, Trump: Trudeau’s coronavirus response is a lesson in leadership

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-pay-attention-trump-trudeaus-coronavirus-response-is-a-lesson-in/

NorthReport
NorthReport

Former CDC director: Covid-19 is different from flu and we must respond differently

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/14/health/coronavirus-covid-19-flu-comparison-frieden-analysis/index.html

NorthReport

Who’s ‘flattening the curve’ on the coronavirus, and who isn’t? A global graphic comparison

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-whos-flattening-the-curve-on-the-coronavirus-and-who-isnt-a/

NorthReport
NorthReport

What Trump’s Twitter Feed Tells Him About the Coronavirus

The president follows 47 accounts on Twitter. Here are the five main things they’re saying about the pandemic.

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2020/03/14/trump-coronavirus-twitter-feed-covid-19-129170

Paladin1

We're about 3 weeks behind Italy in terms of an explosion of infected people.

Food and household items are going to start disapearing quick as people panic-buy and feed off each others fears. Suggest you look at at leasts 3-4 months of provisions if you can afford it. Ration food and supplies.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

Paladin1 wrote:

We're about 3 weeks behind Italy in terms of an explosion of infected people.

Food and household items are going to start disapearing quick as people panic-buy and feed off each others fears. Suggest you look at at leasts 3-4 months of provisions if you can afford it. Ration food and supplies.

It seems to me that unless the supply lines for these consumer goods are shut off (of which there is no hint as yet), the stores will be full again next week, and all the idiots who were out panic buying this week will be left wondering what to do with 100 kilos of rice and 640 rolls of toilet paper.

NorthReport

Earth 156,000

Canada 198

USA 2,726

Paladin1

Michael Moriarity wrote:

Paladin1 wrote:

We're about 3 weeks behind Italy in terms of an explosion of infected people.

Food and household items are going to start disapearing quick as people panic-buy and feed off each others fears. Suggest you look at at leasts 3-4 months of provisions if you can afford it. Ration food and supplies.

It seems to me that unless the supply lines for these consumer goods are shut off (of which there is no hint as yet), the stores will be full again next week, and all the idiots who were out panic buying this week will be left wondering what to do with 100 kilos of rice and 640 rolls of toilet paper.

Last week the WHO was saying the virus wasn't a threat.  I don't suspect this will be over in a month or two. Estimates are 12-18 months.

 

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

Paladin1 wrote:

Last week the WHO was saying the virus wasn't a threat.  I don't suspect this will be over in a month or two. Estimates are 12-18 months.

Let's say you're right about duration. First, do you have any reason to believe that shortages of these goods will happen during that period? And second, if that is the case, what good would 3-4 months of supplies do?

Paladin1

Shortages of goods would happen for a few reasons I believe.

1. Companies and/or their workers decide they're not putting their own lives at risk to make/manufacture/package/deliever/sell products. Workers call in sick or just say they're not coming in.

2. Borders close or are severely restricted and a vaccum develops. When a shipment does arrive at a store people decend on it in a panic. Which leads to the next reason.

3. Because this situation is relatively new to/unseen by most Canadians they'll be prone to panic. We haven't dealth with this before on a parge scale or for such a projected amount of time. They might have a month or two supply of something but they see/hear their neighbour is stocking up on something so their survival instinct sorta kicks in and they theorize well they better buy X just like everyone else before it's gone. Herd behavior like 200 water buffalo running from 1 crocadile.

 

As for the supplies 3-4 months of supplie sis better than 1 month. 3-4 months can be rationed to last almost twice as long if someone is careful. Past a panic period of 2-3 months people may be likely to calm down and a plan and supply system might stabalize.  I have 3 an a half months worth and I'm looking at doubling it. If I don't need it right away then  I'll have have emergency supplies just in case, or I won't have to go shopping a while.

I'm reading that the body doesn't create an immunity to Covid19 at this time so if you get it once you can get it again. There's also talk about this being a yearly occurance.

Sean in Ottawa

Paladin1 wrote:

Shortages of goods would happen for a few reasons I believe.

1. Companies and/or their workers decide they're not putting their own lives at risk to make/manufacture/package/deliever/sell products. Workers call in sick or just say they're not coming in.

2. Borders close or are severely restricted and a vaccum develops. When a shipment does arrive at a store people decend on it in a panic. Which leads to the next reason.

3. Because this situation is relatively new to/unseen by most Canadians they'll be prone to panic. We haven't dealth with this before on a parge scale or for such a projected amount of time. They might have a month or two supply of something but they see/hear their neighbour is stocking up on something so their survival instinct sorta kicks in and they theorize well they better buy X just like everyone else before it's gone. Herd behavior like 200 water buffalo running from 1 crocadile.

 

As for the supplies 3-4 months of supplie sis better than 1 month. 3-4 months can be rationed to last almost twice as long if someone is careful. Past a panic period of 2-3 months people may be likely to calm down and a plan and supply system might stabalize.  I have 3 an a half months worth and I'm looking at doubling it. If I don't need it right away then  I'll have have emergency supplies just in case, or I won't have to go shopping a while.

I'm reading that the body doesn't create an immunity to Covid19 at this time so if you get it once you can get it again. There's also talk about this being a yearly occurance.

I agree that 3-4 months allows even in difficult circumstances for new plans to adjust and permit steps to be taken.

As well I have heard that the science is now saying that people cannot be infected for a second time. There are now many who believe that the poeple thoguht to have picked it up twice actually had not fully recovered.

Even if a vaccine is further down the road, I am guessing testing is likely to improve and if people who had it and fully recovered are found to be immune then you woudl ahve a workforce that would not be at risk.

Also there will be a surge soemwhere in infections. Follling that surge fewer people may become ill and the system may well be able to cope. The question surrounds surviving that surge and if you are vulnerable hoping to survive with minimal contact until there is enough herd immunity. I am guessing that somewhere between 4-6 months this will happen. While the virus will be present society will be able to cope. So stretching supplies to allow potential to subsist for this length of time is important.

These are not certain things but 

NorthReport

So Canada's airports seem to be the weak link in our so-called protective system as most of Canada's cases originated from outside the country, at least so far. They don't even have hand sanitizers nor are they even questioning passengers according to travellers interviewed on the news this morning. Disgraceful and they really need to up their game. Airports should never have been privatized

NorthReport

Planes are flying empty, so where are the airline discounts, eh!

NorthReport

How stupid can Canadians be?

The public lab that could have helped fight COVID-19 pandemic

https://rabble.ca/columnists/2020/03/public-lab-could-have-helped-fight-covid-19-pandemic

NorthReport
NorthReport

Canada needs to nationalize its airports, as the private sector airports are failing us

Coronavirus: The major breakdown at Canadian airports

Despite government policy, passengers landing over the weekend were not being adequately warned about the virus and the need to self isolate

https://www.macleans.ca/news/canada/coronavirus-the-major-breakdown-at-canadian-airports/

NorthReport

Trump claims coronavirus is under control -- contradicting reality and his own top expert

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/16/politics/coronavirus-us-president-donald-trump-fauci-politics/index.html

NorthReport

Canada has just shut down its borders to non-Canadians or non-permanent residents, except Americans, so airlines might as well shut down for a few months, eh!

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-canada-to-close-borders-to-most-foreign-nationals-except-americans/

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/canada-restricting-who-can-enter-the-country-due-to-covid-19-pm-trudeau-1.4854503

NorthReport

All apartment building owners need to be forced to provide hand sanitizers and wipes as everyone is pushings buttons for elevators and doors.

NorthReport
NorthReport

181,000 with more cases outside of China now than within.

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html 

NorthReport

Wash your hands!

Lessons on social distancing from the 1918 flu pandemic: St. Louis shut down public gatherings quickly. Philadelphia held a parade and saw death rates spike

https://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2020/03/14/lessons-on-social-distancing-from-the-1918-flu-pandemic-st-louis-shut-down-public-gatherings-quickly-philadelphia-held-a-parade-and-saw-death-rates-spike.html

NorthReport

Some BC grocery stores are now limiting customers to 4 of any kind of product and as well are starting to arrange special shopping hours for seniors. Maybe rationing is coming.

https://globalnews.ca/news/6686681/kelowna-meat-hoarders-coronavirus-pandemic/

 

NorthReport

BC Health Minister Adrian Dix is now asking Americans not to come to BC.

NorthReport

Get in the game Ottawa!

B.C. Health Minister Adrian Dix has a message for Americans: ‘Don’t come’

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2020/03/16/bc-health-minister-adrian-dix-has-a-message-for-americans-dont-come.html

NorthReport

Good!

Philippines Becomes First Country to Shut Financial Markets Thanks to Virus

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-16/philippines-shuts-financial-markets-after-virus-spurs-stock-rout

JKR

NorthReport wrote:

BC Health Minister Adrian Dix is now asking Americans not to come to BC.

The feds should ban Americans. Too bad BC can't.

NorthReport

What's with the freakout over toilet paper as there are no supplier shortages and haven't people heard of bidets?

kropotkin1951

NorthReport wrote:

What's with the freakout over toilet paper as there are no supplier shortages and haven't people heard of bidets?

A large part of the Canadian population gets its news and FB feeds from US sources. I am sure you understand it because you see them every day. My understanding is that a meme in the US went viral that claimed that 90% of the TP in the US was imported from China. So that started panic buying among people in Canada who consume a steady and almost insatiable stream of US based internet and MSM content.

Its like the Liberal view of our border with the US. Basically we have become the provinces of the US not a sovereign country with a different culture. Only if the US closes its borders to Canada will we take the same measure. After all its an internal thing, like in China, when the central government in Washington says close the provinces borders, they will be closed.

kropotkin1951

JKR wrote:

NorthReport wrote:

BC Health Minister Adrian Dix is now asking Americans not to come to BC.

The feds should ban Americans. Too bad BC can't.

The idea that ferries are unloading tourists for vacation purposes in Victoria, one of the oldest demographics of anywhere, just shows how out of touch our "national" decision makers are. Banning non-essential trips would seem to be the only sensible idea, with a broad definition of essential; wide enough to drive a truck through. It seems that more and more our national interest is being determined by Freeland's handlers in Washington and New York.

Sean in Ottawa

If the feds banned Americans likely the border would be shut down and Canada relies on it more than the Americans. At this moment supply lines cross it. The government is trying to preserve two things with the border being open for now:

1) supply lines that in many cases are critical for our response including medication

2) employment for those who can still work as the government needs the income to stop a financial disaster the will imperil what is a costly response.

A vindictive US president in this fragile time can severely damage the Canadians economy. Economic crisis damages emergency response- especially when it is likely to be a fairly long term emergency.

The government is balancing very difficult choices here.

Over simplifications should be avoided.

NorthReport

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kropotkin1951

Sean I advocated for stopping non-essential trips. Fuck your over simplifications of my posts. Who the fuck do you think you are?

Sean in Ottawa

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Sean I advocated for stopping non-essential trips. Fuck your over simplifications of my posts. Who the fuck do you think you are?

You are out of control and probably have no idea how boring this is. You are making a fool of yourself. I have no idea why you persist with this.

My comment was on the topic and a response. This site encourages conversation that includes explanations of what people are reporting. My post was not criticizing the objective of not having unessential trips.

This is what that company says on their website:

The borders between our two countries are very important, and we are following the direction of both countries in regard to the movement of people and goods. Our vital supply chains are interdependent, and we all share a commitment to one another and our communities. Whether it’s a Canadian returning from their winter home or an American in a similar situation, we are being mindful that people need to return to their loved ones and homes.  Our travelers today are our friends and family members returning home, not tourists. Discretionary travel is not recommended at this time.

Now please go and make long sweet love to yourself. You clearly need it.

 

ETA the link to https://www.cohoferry.com/ has been removed. My response was to that and the rest of the conversation. This is a problem when people can delete things after posting them and other people respond.

 

NorthReport

An expert guide to social distancing – and what to do if friends and family aren't onboard

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/16/how-to-social-distance-convince-friends-family

NorthReport

Trump tweeted about ‘the China Virus,’ but Asians like us were already facing abuse. Let’s talk about why

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/2020/03/16/trump-tweeted-about-the-china-virus-but-asians-like-us-were-already-facing-abuse-lets-talk-about-why.html

NorthReport

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Sean in Ottawa

NorthReport wrote:

An expert guide to social distancing – and what to do if friends and family aren't onboard

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/16/how-to-social-distance-convince-friends-family

I read commentary about partners who live together. If they spend all their time together and face the same risks and take the same precautions some experts argue that there is no point adding stress by distance between them. However if one goes to work and the other does not this changes.

Sean in Ottawa

NorthReport wrote:

Trump tweeted about ‘the China Virus,’ but Asians like us were already facing abuse. Let’s talk about why

https://www.thestar.com/opinion/2020/03/16/trump-tweeted-about-the-china-virus-but-asians-like-us-were-already-facing-abuse-lets-talk-about-why.html

Stupidity, hate, prejudice, misinformation are pandemic as well

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