U.S. embassy in Kabul under attack

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Unionist
U.S. embassy in Kabul under attack

Go get 'em!!!

Unionist
epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..whither the crumbling empire.

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

  

Thanks for the link. Judging from the live updates tweets from you post above the Taliban were shooting RPGs from a tall building they occupied trying to hit the US embassy. They mostly missed (if they even hit it at all)  and hit all over the place around it including hitting a school bus, a mosque, private shops and homes. But don't take my word, read from the people who are there right now from Unionist's link.

And yes you can (and will) argue the USA and the embassy shouldn't be there but then the Taliban should be responsible enough to learn to shoot before they go on a mission to shoot something in the city. That is if they give a shit about the people around them.

NDPP

Let them do Canada's too...

oldgoat

Sorta deja vu all over again, eh?

 

Northern Shoveler Northern Shoveler's picture

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

And yes you can (and will) argue the USA and the embassy shouldn't be there but then the Taliban should be responsible enough to learn to shoot before they go on a mission to shoot something in the city. That is if they give a shit about the people around them.

You know that is an excellent point.  I also note it is not one I have ever read you comment on about either the Libyan rebels or the IDF.  

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

Northern Shoveler wrote:

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

And yes you can (and will) argue the USA and the embassy shouldn't be there but then the Taliban should be responsible enough to learn to shoot before they go on a mission to shoot something in the city. That is if they give a shit about the people around them.

You know that is an excellent point.  I also note it is not one I have ever read you comment on about either the Libyan rebels or the IDF.  

 

Marksmanship never really came up as a subject matter before here, but now that you bringing it up I'm quite sure the Libyan rebels are worse shots than the Taliban and the IDF is hitting what they are aiming at (which is fucked up).

6079_Smith_W

Well if we're going through old photo albums, here's a quaint one:

Reagan with Mujahideen 1985

These gentlemen are the moral equivalents of America’s founding fathers.” — Ronald Reagan while introducing Mujahideen leaders to media on the White house lawns (1985). 

Hoodeet

I thought Reagan said that about the Nicaraguan "contras".   He was starting to repeat himself already, then...  Thanks for the information.

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

6079_Smith_W wrote:

Well if we're going through old photo albums, here's a quaint one:

Reagan with Mujahideen 1985

These gentlemen are the moral equivalents of America’s founding fathers.” — Ronald Reagan while introducing Mujahideen leaders to media on the White house lawns (1985). 

 

Yes and interesting enough they are all right winged religious white people (Caucasian) in that photo.

Frmrsldr

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

Marksmanship never really came up as a subject matter before here, but now that you bringing it up I'm quite sure the Libyan rebels are worse shots than the Taliban and the IDF is hitting what they are aiming at (which is fucked up).

I recall that the IAF intentionally bombed a clearly marked U.N. observation tower killing a Canadian officer in the 2006 war on Beirut, Lebanon.

I also recall Israel forces destroying a clearly marked ambulance in the 2009-10 war on Gaza with a tank.

In that same war, Israel forces intentionally bombed (from the air), shelled, shot, attacked and damaged or destroyed hospitals, ambulances, humanitarian relief centers that had collected food and drinking water for Gazans, desalination, water treatment plants, water pipelines and people's homes.

Gaza is a built-up urban area but Israel forces used white phosphorus - for "obscuration and illumination purposes only," of course.

A popular item at the time were T-shirts sold in Israel that had the image of a pregnant woman with the crosshairs of a scope superimposed and a caption that read "How to kill two Palestinian terrorists with one shot."

In Libya, newly captured territory by the rebels revealed the bodies of injured black persons in ambulances, MASH tents and hospitals with IV tubes still embedded, and the positions of the bodies of others suggested they attempted to crawl away from the hostile fire. There were also incidents of black persons in civilian clothing who appear to have been captured as pro-Gadhafi forces by the rebels and then were executed/murdered. The hands of the bodies still bound.

Fidel

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

Northern Shoveler wrote:

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

And yes you can (and will) argue the USA and the embassy shouldn't be there but then the Taliban should be responsible enough to learn to shoot before they go on a mission to shoot something in the city. That is if they give a shit about the people around them.

You know that is an excellent point.  I also note it is not one I have ever read you comment on about either the Libyan rebels or the IDF.  

 

Marksmanship never really came up as a subject matter before here, but now that you bringing it up I'm quite sure the Libyan rebels are worse shots than the Taliban and the IDF is hitting what they are aiming at (which is fucked up).

 

Mujahideen, Qaeda and Taliban all trained by Pakistan's army intelligence agency ISI. The CIA shovelled billions of dollars, weapons and technical assistance to them for years. It was the CIA's biggest covert operation in history. They may not have the highest tech weaponry, but I would not want to be surrounded by a dozen or a hundred of them. Many of them do not necessarily fight for Taliban ideology so much as they fight for freedom. It's a formidable enemy who fights for that cause.

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

Fidel, not that I really care but there will be very little freedom under the Taliban. But we've been over this already numerous times and I'm not going to drag this thread down that road. Anyways the attack is pretty much over... the MSM is toting this attack as a bold success that proves the Afghans can't defend themselves.  I guess I have my bar set too high, oh well.

Perhaps this is an evil plot to justify the US staying Afghanistan longer by cooperate controlled MSM... holy crap did I just hatch a conspiracy?

Frmrsldr

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

Perhaps this is an evil plot to justify the US staying Afghanistan longer by cooperate controlled MSM... holy crap did I just hatch a conspiracy?

Naw, after each such incident the antiwar/anti-intervention doves will sing "Disengage" and the prowar banshees will shriek "Escalate."

Fidel

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

Fidel, not that I really care but there will be very little freedom under the Taliban. But we've been over this already numerous times and I'm not going to drag this thread down that road. Anyways the attack is pretty much over... the MSM is toting this attack as a bold success that proves the Afghans can't defend themselves.  I guess I have my bar set too high, oh well.

Bec, your school boy naivety was cute last year. But this is babble, and you've had plenty of time to swallow the red pill. Let's exchange ideas like adults sometimes do from now on, shall we?

The Taliban were taken off the terrorist list briefly when the U.S. Government negotiated with them for political recognition, economic aid, and something else forget what it was. Ah yes! They were negotiating the handover of Usama bin Laden to U.S. authorities apparently. Bush's government balked. Apparently they weren't interested in taking custody of Usama bin Laden approximately three different times.

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:
Perhaps this is an evil plot to justify the US staying Afghanistan longer by cooperate controlled MSM... holy crap did I just hatch a conspiracy?

The warmongers are getting rich, and the elite among the Taliban are getting rich. Why rock the boat? The select few Afghans benefitting from it all don't mind the circular flow of "stimulus" money from the U.S. to the warlord government with their "brothers in creed" and greed, the Taliban in for a cut. Everyone and their dog in Afghanistan knows the U.S. and western countries are propping up both sides of the phony war in Afghanistan. And everyone knows the CIA are the biggest dope dealers since British Tea Company pirates ran China.

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

  

I wasn't saying I didn't care about you; I really don't care if the Taliban retake Afghanistan; if they can take it then they deserve it and so do the people under them.

Fidel

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

 

I wasn't saying I didn't care about you; I really don't care if the Taliban retake Afghanistan; if they can take it then they deserve it and so do the people under them.

The U.S. and NATO will eventually want to recognize a Taliban government in Kabul like last time. And like they are slowly working toward doing today. As I've been saying for months, this is a phony war on terror. 

Next thing we know Washington and London will be lobbying other countries to accept Taliban officials at the UN, like they did with Democratic Kampuchea under the Khmer Rouge not so long ago.

NDPP

Taliban 'Controlling War Narrative' in Afghanistan (and vid)

http://rt.com/news/taliban-war-tax-usa-499/

"how the US war against terror has actually affected the Taliban."

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

"Battle for Kabul" you got to love RT dot com.Wink

NDPP

Mighty oaks from tiny acorns grow...

"It means that half a trillion dollars spent by the US in the course of the Afghan war has been a waste of American taxpayers' money.."

After ten years of occupation and war, the Afghan resistance continues to demonstrate it is alive and well. The west has clearly lost in Afghanistan.

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

 

Yeah but then if you think about it 11 guys can go into any city on the planet and shoot it up till they are all hunted down and killed.

 

Like I said before; perhaps I'm setting the bar too high for these guys.

NDPP

Yes, but this is Kabul, and if, after ten years of occupation and counter-insurgency, the mujihideen can shoot up NATO headquarters and the US embassy, well, even if it's just the Taliban equivalent of a Greenpeace banner hanging, I think you have to agree that it's a pretty strong message that I suspect resonates pretty strongly both inside and outside Afghanistan. How much longer do you think the average US taxpayer is going to be willing to pay for what appears to be clearly a losing proposition - and OBL, the ostensible reason for the war is duly dispatched anyway, or so we are told, so these kinds of actions can only intensify the momentum to GTFOOT (get the f**k out of there!) A very effective action for the resistance.

If I was Karzai or President Bam-bam this is definitely not something good for future political possibiities...

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

I agree with the fact that a "strong message" was delivered, but I think it's being exagerated by the MSM, the Taliban and other news media for a bunch of reasons. But your right, in the end a propaganda victory is a propaganda victory and that's all the Taliban needs in the end.  

I also agree its mission over as well (Osama is deadWink), the withdrawel starts around August 2012... (after 10 years) most tax payers here seem happy with that.

wage zombie

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

I also agree its mission over as well (Osama is deadWink), the withdrawel starts around August 2012... (after 10 years) most tax payers here seem happy with that.

They should be enraged.

How do they feel about the economy?  It's not like they're related or anything...

Frmrsldr

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

Yeah but then if you think about it 11 guys can go into any city on the planet and shoot it up till they are all hunted down and killed.

Like I said before; perhaps I'm setting the bar too high for these guys.

Take an American city. Provided there are no hostages, police and at worst a SWAT team, could take care of these guys in at most two hours.

It took ANA and ANP what, 18 hours. And that probably included assistance from U.S. and/or NATO helicopters, etc.

So yeah, I would say you've set the bar too high.

Herr Harper better hope that until the end of 2014 there are no or very few casualties among Canadian troops and that overall Canadian ignorance and apathy remain at the current level or get worse.

Otherwise this situation in Afghanistan could be (let's hope) political dynamite for him.

Frmrsldr

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

I agree with the fact that a "strong message" was delivered, but I think it's being exagerated by the MSM, the Taliban and other news media for a bunch of reasons. But your right, in the end a propaganda victory is a propaganda victory and that's all the Taliban needs in the end.  

The American, Canadian, European, Australian and New Zealand public are like an incredibly large and dumb elephant. They need something akin to a shot from a .70 caliber hi-power rifle before they wake up and start to realize and care about what's really going on in Afghanistan and start to demand we GET OUT NOW!

As for propaganda value, I think "The Great Escape 2" from the Sarposa prison in Kandahar City was and should have been of greater propaganda impact. Especially among Canadians as looking after Kandahar province and City was Canada's job.

Fidel

Frmrsldr wrote:
Herr Harper better hope that until the end of 2014 there are no or very few casualties among Canadian troops and that overall Canadian ignorance and apathy remain at the current level or get worse.

Otherwise this situation in Afghanistan could be (let's hope) political dynamite for him.

 

He'll only start to make a few sounds like a real leader in control of sovereign decision making come 2015 or so. Until then he's just a hand puppet for Washington and NATO. They are all ths same corrupt stooge heading up either of the the two old line parties in our northern colony. I think the CIA must be drugging our stooges to be as docile and obedient to their bosses in Washington as they are. Our colonial administrators in Ottawa can't be that good at acting. It's inconceivable.

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

wage zombie wrote:

They should be enraged.

How do they feel about the economy?  It's not like they're related or anything...

 

That they are mad about.

Northern Shoveler Northern Shoveler's picture

Frmrsldr wrote:

As for propaganda value, I think "The Great Escape 2" from the Sarposa prison in Kandahar City was and should have been of greater propaganda impact. Especially among Canadians as looking after Kandahar province and City was Canada's job.

It also showed that unlike Bec's view the insurgents are well organized and have deeply penetrated into the collaborators organizations.  When the troops start to leave that will be what makes the sycophants and the garrison left behind vulnerable to a repetition of 1842.  The NATO people left behind will be very exposed because the Afghan army and police appear to riddled with patriots only pretending to be sycophants.

Frmrsldr

Northern Shoveler wrote:

It also showed that unlike Bec's view the insurgents are well organized and have deeply penetrated into the collaborators organizations.  When the troops start to leave that will be what makes the sycophants and the garrison left behind vulnerable to a repetition of 1842.  The NATO people left behind will be very exposed because the Afghan army and police appear to riddled with patriots only pretending to be sycophants.

Yes.

When the war first started the Fawning Corporate Media used to refer to any Afghan insurgent group as the "Taliban."

Starting in about 2009 the FCM started to identify the groups.

Such as the Quetta Shura Taliban (the original Taliban led by Mullah Mohammad Omar stationed in Quetta, Pakistan.)

The Hekmetayar network.

The Haqqani network.

Of the different insurgent groups, the Haqqani network is the most sophisticated and professional.

It was the group mentioned by name by the FCM for this latest operation in Kabul.

Such operations by the Haqqani network are marked by meticulous planning in advance. They are often carried out by only between 6 - 12 individuals but are able to tie down large numbers of ANA and ANP for often between 12 - 24 hours. They have been responsible for a number of such operations in Kabul and Kandahar City since about 2009 that have caught the West's FCM attention.

They were responsible for the well-planned and nearly successful assassination attempt (in 2007, I believe) on President Hamid Karzai. They were responsible for "Great Escape 1" and "Great Escape 2."

I guess they figured since "The Great Escape" was such a success they ought to try it again and see if they could outdo themselves(!) ;D

 

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

Northern Shoveler wrote:

It also showed that unlike Bec's view the insurgents are well organized

 

Never said they were not organized, I said they seem to be lacking in marksmanship training as documented by Filmmaker Paul Refsdal.

 

Northern Shoveler Northern Shoveler's picture

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

 

Yeah but then if you think about it 11 guys can go into any city on the planet and shoot it up till they are all hunted down and killed.

 

Like I said before; perhaps I'm setting the bar too high for these guys.

Sorry I thought this post implied clearly that you were saying there was no organization or real planning.  You have low expectations and you think even at that the bar you set might be too high.  I took that post as a dismissive sneer at the competence of the insurgents.

 

Frmrsldr

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

Like I said before; perhaps I'm setting the bar too high for these guys.

I think the bar our friend Bec.De.Corbin is referring to is that of the Karzai government, the ANA, ANP, etc.

Roscoe

Frmrsldr wrote:

Bec.De.Corbin wrote:

I agree with the fact that a "strong message" was delivered, but I think it's being exagerated by the MSM, the Taliban and other news media for a bunch of reasons. But your right, in the end a propaganda victory is a propaganda victory and that's all the Taliban needs in the end.  

The American, Canadian, European, Australian and New Zealand public are like an incredibly large and dumb elephant. They need something akin to a shot from a .70 caliber hi-power rifle before they wake up and start to realize and care about what's really going on in Afghanistan and start to demand we GET OUT NOW!

As for propaganda value, I think "The Great Escape 2" from the Sarposa prison in Kandahar City was and should have been of greater propaganda impact. Especially among Canadians as looking after Kandahar province and City was Canada's job.

A ".70 caliber hi-power rifle"?

Frmrsldr

Roscoe wrote:

A ".70 caliber hi-power rifle"?

Yeah.

Starting in the 1880s and through the early 1900s, British ammo companies - most notably Holland & Holland - made large caliber hi-power rounds along with rifles to shoot them. The rounds ranged from about .50 to .75 cal.

They were used for hunting big game in Africa like elephants and rhinos.

They were single-loaders as opposed to repeaters (the chamber only held one round, the next round entered the chamber by the shooter manually placing it there as opposed to it being mechanically placed there by a feed or loading mechanism that's part of the rifle.) They were break-open arms, some had one others had two barrels like shotguns - but they were not shotguns; they were hi-power rifles.

Roscoe

Nope.  Up to .500/465 H&H but no .70 caliber, much less .75. You better search a little deeper than wiki, lol. Try Nitro Express. What kind of soldier were you - public affairs maybe?

Frmrsldr

Yes, the recent violence in Kabul and the attack on the U.S. embassy was just another transitory outburst of violence. No big deal.

I think Canadian (and U.S. and NATO/ISAF) efforts to train the ANA and ANP so that they can assume full responsibility for Afghanistan's security and defense by 2014 will be successful:

http://original.antiwar.com/hallinan/2011/09/21/light-at-end-of-afghan-t...

Frmrsldr

Correction.

Incorrect link.

Frmrsldr

Roscoe wrote:

Nope.  Up to .500/465 H&H but no .70 caliber, much less .75. You better search a little deeper than wiki, lol. Try Nitro Express. What kind of soldier were you - public affairs maybe?

I'm going by memory from what I read years ago in a book.

Don't be fooled that just because something (or some information) doesn't exist on the internet it therefore doesn't exist.

It seems the only information currently posted on the net is modern smokeless powder ammunition and older ammunition that is still commonly used today such as the Government .45-70.

The high caliber, hi-power rounds and the rifles that used them I was talking about were rare even in their day. Only very wealthy British "tourist" hunters would have used and owned them.

Talking about contemporary larger caliber hi-power rounds if that is your interest, there is the Smith and Wesson S&W ".500" Magnum which is more powerful than their S&W .44 Magnum. Magnum Research Institute (MRI) Desert Eagle and Beowulf have .50 cals that are almost as powerful.

Gunsmithing Industries (GI) has a .50 cal. that is not a Magnum. It's velocity is equivalent to the venerable Colt 1911 .45 ACP.

LOL, an antiwar/anti-interventionist public affairs military officer, how does that work?

There is really no connection between being a soldier and being a small caliber (as opposed to artillery rounds) expert unless one is a (small caliber) munitions/weapons tech or it's a case of personal interest.

Frmrsldr

Who are the Haqqanis?

In post #30 I claimed it was the Haqqani network that was responsible for the attack on the U.S. embassy in Kabul.

Here is another take on the Haqqanis:

Jason Ditz wrote:

The shift to "number one Afghan militant threat" is mostly a function of his presence in the Pakistani tribal areas. After much browbeating from the US, the Pakistani military invaded South Waziristan on the basis of the threat of the "Pakistani Taliban." The US has since been trying to push an invasion of North Waziristan, but with no Taliban there, a reason was needed - enter Haqqani.

There is very little officials can agree on publicly about the network, and reports have the group comprising as many as 10,000 tribal fighters to as few as 300 actual full-time fighters. Sirajuddin, Haqqani's son, insisted the real number is actually well over 10,000. Particularly noteworthy is that the US has killed well over 1,000 "suspects" in North Waziristan in drone strikes but that the group never seems to get any smaller.

Though the repeated drone strikes against North Waziristan surely give the group a reason to want to attack US targets now, their positioning as a major part of the war largely appears to be a matter of narrative convenience, as the administration looks for a new way to blame Pakistan for the failing occupation of Afghanistan and finds Haqqani's territory as the last uninvaded tribal area. A force of 10,000 fighters or more is not particularly unusual in areas where tribesmen are all armed and bound by family ties into fighting forces.

The real thing that is missing, however, is a declaration of guilt by the Haqqanis themselves. Usually major terrorist groups can't wait to declare themselves responsible for everything they did and many of the things other people did, and so far the major attacks that the US has tried to blame on the Haqqanis have all been claimed by Afghan Taliban factions, and not the Waziristan based Haqqanis.

http://news.antiwar.com/2011/09/23/ticket-to-pakistan-who-are-the-haqqan...

Frmrsldr

Update on U.S. embassy attack:

Jason Ditz wrote:

An Afghan employee at the US Embassy in Afghanistan attacked the CIA annex in the neighboring Ariana Hotel last night, killing an American citizen, and lightly wounded others.

Officials say they are still investigating the incident to try to figure out the motive of the attacker, who was killed by embassy troops. They also declined to say whether he was authorized to carry a weapon in the embassy.

Immediate speculation, of course, is that he was a Taliban "sleeper agent," but officials insist all employees undergo thorough background checks. While this wouldn't be the first time such checks failed, it is also possible he is simply a disgruntled employee with a grudge against somebody.

The attack comes just two weeks after the last attack on the embassy, which was claimed by the Afghan Taliban but which US officials now say was actually ordered by the Pakistani military[!]

http://news.antiwar.com/2011/09/26/afghan-employee-kills-us-citizen-in-k...