USA finally gets a President who wants to put people to work

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NorthReport
USA finally gets a President who wants to put people to work

!!!

NorthReport

Union leaders meet with Trump; Construction on their mind
https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/01/23/business/economy/labor-leaders-tru...

NorthReport

If Trump keeps this up workers of America will give him a second term

lagatta4

No jobs on a dead planet.

Ward

Work aint all it's cracked up to be.

6079_Smith_W

Can't work if they cancel your insurance because of a pre-existing condition and you wind up dying.

If this is what you call a honeymoon, just wait and see how long it lasts.

 

 

6079_Smith_W

About this long:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2017/1/24/1624651/-FEMA-Under-Trump-Fails-...

Hard to work if you have no place to live.

 

NorthReport

It's all smoke and mirrors but Trump knows how to play the game And to someone who has been out of meaningful work for a long time like millions of Americans are, who gives a shit if the President rapes and pillars his way around Washington if as a result of The President's efforts you have a decent paying job once again

Sorry but the right wing are way too smart for us dumb lefties

https://www.google.ca/amp/insider.foxnews.com/amp/article/53829?client=s...

NorthReport
josh

What an idiotic thread.

NorthReport

Jobs Trump brings back will be high skilled manufacturing chief says

https://www.google.ca/amp/www.cnbc.com/amp/2017/01/23/jobs-trump-brings-...

Left Turn Left Turn's picture

I've flagged this thread as offensive. I now believe that North Report is violating the spirit of the babble policy statement, if not the letter of it, by consistently arguing that voters will only care about Jobs. I found it reprehensible enough when it was done in relation to issues such as BC amd Canadian politics, and pipelines.

Now that North Report is making this line of argument with respect to Trump, I believe he is excusing Trump's bigotry (racism, sexism, homophobia, ableism ect.). I find it hard to believe, given North Report's consitent expounding of these views, that North Report does not hold this position himself, and I don't believe that the babble policy was intended to excuse this type of behaviour.

I do want to be clear that I don't have problem with advocating in favour of jobs, as long as it does not ammount to excusing any and all behaviour by those who are deemed as favouring job creation. For instance, I am happy that Trump has killed the TPP, but I certainly don't think this excuses any of the other things that Trump has done.

I do believe that North Report could redeem himself if he wants to, though this would require some evidence of commitment to the values expounded in the babble policy -- "basic and fundamental values of human rights, feminism, anti-racism and labour rights". At present, with the exception of perhaps the labour rights issue (though even this is iffy), I see no evidence that North Report supports these things.

6079_Smith_W

I agree with you about this part Left Turn:

NorthReport wrote:

who gives a shit if the President rapes and pillars his way around Washington if as a result of The President's efforts you have a decent paying job once again

Three times as many people showed up on Saturday as showed up to his inauguration to demonstrate that we care about Cheetoface's misogyny.

As for this thread, it is not going to be long before those who voted for him realize what it is going to mean for them. If he even lasts that long. The latest word is that he spends half the day watching television.

 

 

NorthReport
NorthReport

People's number one priority is a decent job and that is why the right wing win again and again and again

99% of the NDP in Canada runs against jobs and so they lose again and again and again How dumb can the left be!

https://www.google.ca/amp/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1581CA?c...

6079_Smith_W

From that article at #13

Quote:

Estimates for construction jobs are ultimately misleading because historically they are rarely accurate and the jobs are short-term.

The very first point.

NorthReport

Tell that to a pipeline worker!

6079_Smith_W

I know a few, actually. Frankly I care more about what their work resulted in in the North Saskatchewan this summer.

And right now in Stoughton:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/stoughton-oil-spill-cleanup-1...

Idiots didn't even know they had a leak until they had lost 200,000 litres. THey still don't know whose pipe it is.

You think everyone is going back to work? Just wait until he starts clamping down on the border and everyone starts freaking out, because he doesn't actually have a clue what he is doing.

 

NorthReport
NorthReport

All I'm saying is most people just want a decent paying job and they don't really care what goes on elsewhere. And most Americans can relate to Trump when he talks about all the high paying jobs around Washington while the rest of the nation see their factories closing up one by one
And that is the key to the usual right-wing election successes

Mr. Magoo

Umm, OK.  But didn't you spend pretty much the whole late summer and early fall calling him "Birther Trump" and "Trump the Chump" and such?  And now you'll remind us that the trains running on time is no small feat?

SeekingAPolitic...

My critism of north report is that those pipeline jobs and natural gas projects in bc are just propangda.  I had a look at table 282-0008 in the stats can.  30,000 people work in "Mining, quarrying, and oil and gas extraction" in BC even if these jobs increase by 50% over the next 3 years your are looking 15,000 jobs on a base of 2,300,000 employed.  Not extactly jobs bonaza.

But I agree with nr that any party that lets itself be labelled anti job they are finished.  Let the ndp/left talk about green jobs all day long, thats makes sense. 

Personally I believe the ndp indenity politics should be not the prominent idea you run on.  It can be in the platform but not the basis for the platform.  The democrats ran on the idea and they lost. 

If you taken a course in HR or socialogy or one its branches you should have heard of Maslow. He propossed that their a pyramid of needs, at the base is survival needs, then safety, belonging and love, esteem need, and the top self actualization.  I believe that indentity politics is level 4 will trump was talking 1 and 2 level. 

One must satisfy lower level deficit needs before progressing on to meet higher level growth needs. When a deficit need has been satisfied it will go away. Our activities become habitually directed towards meeting the next set of needs that we have yet to satisfy. These then become our salient needs. However, growth needs continue to be felt and may even become stronger once they have been engaged. Once these growth needs have been reasonably satisfied, one may be able to reach the highest level called self-actualization.

Every person is capable and has the desire to move up the hierarchy toward a level of self-actualization. Unfortunately, progress is often disrupted by failure to meet lower level needs. Life experiences, including divorce and loss of job may cause an individual to fluctuate between levels of the hierarchy. Therefore, not everyone will move through the hierarchy in a uni-directional manner but may move back and forth between the different types of needs.

 

http://www.simplypsychology.org/maslow.html

Anyways Maslow ideas stayed with me and I found relevent in politics to today.  Canada is different for the US the canadian housing bubble is still going strong.  So maybe appealing to higher levels will work but I doubt it.  After the bubble goes I would be thinking very hard off Maslow.

 

Ken Burch

It's one thing to say that left-of-center parties need to make full employment a more important part of their program(none of us disagree with that, nor does anyone on the left from what I can see)

But it's a demagogic lie to say that the NDP, the BCNDP, or the Democrats or Greens in the US have EVER "run against jobs".

And it's not only bullshit but weapons-grade bullshit for anyone to argue that the ONLY way to be "for jobs" is to be for dangerous, extractive megaprojects like Kinder Morgan.

Pipeline construction is simply one possible way of employing people...and it's not even clear that any significant number of the people who are out of work IN areas of high unemployment will actually be given the jobs or paid decently if they get them.  As has been pointed out, you can create MORE jobs by expanding the railroad systems in Canada than you can by building pipelines.  And environmentalists aren't the enemy here.  They're not guilty of anything but trying to keep us all alive.

North, we are ALL in support of "jobs".  And you have always known it.  Kindly stop smearing people as "anti-jobs" just because they disagree with you about what is needed to get jobs.  And stop acting as if you are the only person on Babble(or possible the entire North Ameican left...assuming you still identify with the left...who cares about whether people are employed or not.  You have no personal monopoly on that concern and you never have.

So I asking you, please, to stop.  Just stop.  What you're doing is inappropriate, polarizing, borderline abusive, and has no chance of winning anyone here or anywhere else over to the point of view you want us to agree with.

If you have any respect for the board or the rest of us who post on it, give these tactics of yours a rest.

None of us deserve this from you.

 

 

lagatta4

North Report is talking like the most backward sectors of the working class. No, historically workers have NOT cared only about their own employment. Look at the anti-slavery solidarity shown by workers in those dark satanic mills in the UK, who weren't materially any better off than the slaves (they were better off in other ways such as not having their families ripped apart, and while beatings and sexual assault were certainly not unknown, they weren't as systemic and essential to the system as in slavery). It is hard to think we will be commemorating the centenary of the Revolution in Russia; very soon of the women who sparked the February Revolution.

Absolutely agree that a great effort must be put on the issue of green jobs, which doesn't only mean workers in recycling centres, but restoring and modernising rail (long and medium-haul freight and passenger, and light rail) and upgrading both local, environmentally-friendly and non-lethal transport and urbanism, and a host of other things, including more local food production. Nobody wants workers to be unemployed, on miserable 'welfare' benefits or begging in the streets, and it is ludicrous to insinuate that they do.

Another negative aspect of extractivism as a jobs strategy - as if planetary destruction isn't bad enough - is that essentially creats jobs for men. There are some women training for those jobs, but their number remains small. There is a huge income and employment disparity between men and women in resource-centred regions with few other jobs (except a handful of decent jobs in public services and crappy jobs in retail and other private services) which translates into exacerbating the vulnerability of women to violence and other manifestations of patriarchy.

Women are going into non-traditional jobs, but they are more likely to opt for jobs such as bus or métro driver that provide long-term stability and benefits, not temporary work with high salaries but no job security whatsoever.

Yes, this latest series of posts does strike me as counter to rabble and babble policy.

josh

My problem is that the thread title is idiotic. Under Obama, the unemployment rate was cut in half. Does that not show a president who wanted to put people to work? If you wanted a debate on the quality of the jobs, or jobs and the environment, that's a different matter.

SeekingAPolitic...

But I agree with nr that any party that lets itself be labelled anti job they are finished.  Let the ndp/left talk about green jobs all day long, thats makes sense. 

Let me stress the "LABELLED", it does not matter what I think and frankly what you think or NR.  IF your opponent can convince the general public that your anti job its very hard to get elected.  Politics is a blood sport its not fair and people strecth the truth and try label each other in ways that will hurt their credibilty.  I no idea what was spent to label "angry tom" for mulcair, but "angry tom" just did not pop out of nowhere.  Is mulcair an angry man, it doesnt matter what truth is, what matters the voters believe.   Thats all I am I am saying.  The NDP gets beat up every election in the same way, the right and centre start talking that its environment vs jobs.  If care for the environment then you must not care for jobs.  I am saying to not change policy but change the messaging, I have no idea of how to break that idea in the meme expect to mention "green jobs" until the public gets the message.  Instead of getting angry with me I suggest you think how the NDP will deal wtih "demagogic lie" because its coming in BC. It will be there in 2018 ontario and 2019 federally until NDP can neutarlize this idea.  Then oppentent spinners doctors will try to come up with new ways to label the NDP that will hurt the NDP credibilty.  I would also suggest to learn from how leftist parties deal with this in Europe maybe they have the answer.  When the right starts messaging their usual idea of jobs vs evironment the NDP has to respond.  This not a change policy issue, this a messageing idea.

6079_Smith_W

Indeed. Ooops.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2017/01/23/kansas_city_southern_rail...

Quote:

Donald Trump’s election has threatened to erode both of the pillars underlying Kansas City Southern’s business. Trump has signaled his intention to tax outsourcers, to renegotiate NAFTA, and to build a massive, comprehensive wall between Mexico and the United States. Each of those policy initiatives would directly impede the current ease with which goods flow across the border.

In addition, Trump’s saber-rattling has shnitzeled the peso, whose value plummeted sharply against the dollar in November and December and is now near a record low.

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

We saw in the 1930s that protectionism such as that advocated by Trump leads only to retaliation. Then jobs are lost on both sides of the border in an unending spiral. This is how the Great Depression became a worldwide phenomenon.

josh

That's to a great extent an myth.  The worldwide depression was already baked in by then.  And opposiing agreements like TPP is not protectionism.  And retailiatory actions have been taken in the past without leading to an economic collapse.

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

Thanks for Trumpslaining that one.

Misfit Misfit's picture

First of all, I don't see pipeline construction as creating many long-term sustainable jobs. Also, if left wing governments were anti-job then Norway and Sweden would have massively high unemployment rates, which they don't. Thirdly, Saskatchewan under the CCF post war would have been in dire straights with massive unemployment, which wasn't the case. Saskatchewan had nearly 60 years of CCF and NDP governments with no major unemployment issues.

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smoot%E2%80%93Hawley_Tariff_Act

As then, Canada was the USA's most loyal trading partner.

josh

At first, the tariff seemed to be a success. According to historian Robert Sobel, "Factory payrolls, construction contracts, and industrial production all increased sharply." However, larger economic problems loomed in the guise of weak banks. 

 

 

Sean in Ottawa

All that Lagatta said.

I do think the thread is offensive.

Trump is a liar. So a thread about what he wants is a waste of time. I don't think he is interested in jobs or the working people and he is doing many things to show that.

Trump is interested in deriving every advatnage to large US businesses he can at the cost of gender equality, the environment, wages, healthcare, working standards, and on and on - and when it finally suits him jobs. In the name of jobs he will screw everyone and the planet but this is not about jobs this is about money. US money. The jobs are the excuse to bully. They will get thrown overboard when he is finished using them as the rallying cry.

We are in a post-truth world. As jobs are lost -- in the United States -- and workers become poorer -- the propaganda will roll on to say jobs have been created. This is why the key piece is to get the Trump supporters to not believe the news. Any employment news that disagrees with Trump will be supressed or called fake news. He has put together a religion of people who will not question the most obvious lies.

And 1984 is a best-seller again.

If you think Trump is about Jobs and has any real desire to create jobs then you really need to re-read that book. He is about US big money and that will conflict with jobs just as soon as it gets what it wants in the name of jobs.

Time for people here to at least understand what is going on. People here are buying into the propaganda becuase it is very, very good. It is the best propaganda money can buy. They polled people and know people want jobs. Every job killing initiative will be called job-creating.

We got a little taste of this during the Harris years in Ontario -- remember the Tenant Protection Act? That was the bill to strip tenants of many of their rights. And so on.

lagatta4

And Trump says he's going ahead with his absurd waste of money and energy in The WALL. He's so full bullshit - and of himself - that there is no reason to confuse his pronouncements with reality. It is important to dismantle the smoke and mirrors though.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

Sean in Ottawa wrote:
We are in a post-truth world. As jobs are lost -- in the United States -- and workers become poorer -- the propaganda will roll on to say jobs have been created. This is why the key piece is to get the Trump supporters to not believe the news. Any employment news that disagrees with Trump will be supressed or called fake news. He has put together a religion of people who will not question the most obvious lies.
And here is a Congressman from Texas who makes it explicit.
Matt Shuham wrote:
The chairman of the House Science, Space and Technology Committee said Monday that Donald Trump was a more credible news source than the entire press corps.

After praising the President on the House floor for things like his “stamina,” and “conviction,” Rep. Lamar Smith (R-TX) criticized the press for, in his view, skipping over the Trump's positive attributes.

“No, the national liberal media won’t print that or air it or post it,” Smith said. “Better to get your news directly from the President. In fact, it might be the only way to get the unvarnished truth.”

Smith is also chairman of the Media Fairness Caucus. A newsletter for the caucus published Tuesday proclaims, among other things, the headline “Breitbart News Surpasses 3 Million Likes.”

alan smithee alan smithee's picture

President Idiot threatens Chicago via Twitter. End the 'carnage' or I'm sending in the feds. Fucking twit.

MegB

Closing because this is indeed an idiotic thread, as one babbler so helpfully mentioned. You can't simply point to Trump's job promises (unlikely to bear significant fruit) and not mention his assault on everything we need to sustain and grow a healthy planet.

Topic locked