Saskatchewan election Nov 2 2020

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Ken Burch

It appears that Meili chose to cave in to the "Stay The Course" crowd.  For the life of me, I can't imagine why he didn't say to them, "staying the course is why we lost by thirty points last time.  In what universe would it ever make sense to I stay THAT course?"

Aristotleded24

Strategy and ideology are 2 different things Ken. We all agree that Mulcair's instincts during the 2015 election were horrible, but his strategy in opposition is essentially what paved the way for Harper's defeat. Sure Meili had ideas, but as Misfit said, where was he on the big scandals and big issues? He should be front and centre speaking on that, instead of leaving it to one of his Regina-area MLAs. I don't know if Trent Worthespoon is more on the establishment wing of the party, but under his watch as interim leader, the NDP was in first place in Saskatchewan. Would he have won the election if he ran? I don't know, but obviously something happened under his watch to make that a realistic possibility.

Ken Burch

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Strategy and ideology are 2 different things Ken. We all agree that Mulcair's instincts during the 2015 election were horrible, but his strategy in opposition is essentially what paved the way for Harper's defeat. Sure Meili had ideas, but as Misfit said, where was he on the big scandals and big issues? He should be front and centre speaking on that, instead of leaving it to one of his Regina-area MLAs. I don't know if Trent Worthespoon is more on the establishment wing of the party, but under his watch as interim leader, the NDP was in first place in Saskatchewan. Would he have won the election if he ran? I don't know, but obviously something happened under his watch to make that a realistic possibility.

All valid points.  And of course strategy and ideology are two separate things.

It strikes me, though, that Meili seems to have listened to whoever it was in the party braintrust who argued that no changes in ideology OR strategy should be made- and this makes it look, to my eyes from a distance, as if Meili is running the same campaign his predecessor ran.

DO you feel I'm being unfair in that assertion?

Misfit Misfit's picture

Day 15: The Brightenview/GTH Land Scam

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5756542

"Today, I’m bringing attention to the GTH disaster. The story came out today, and confirmed what many have known for a long time: The GTH deal w/Brightenview was sketchy at best.

Millions of our money has been wasted on all of this, and the GTH is a huge failure, mostly because of incompetence and shady Sask. Party deals that, once again, were made to reward their friends. What a mess!

Basically, the Sask. Party was busted using taxpayer money to reward wealthy donors by paying them way more for land than what it was worth. Desperate to prove that the land was worth the exorbitant amount they paid, govt threw together a deal with Brightenview, a shady company, to also buy some land for an insane amount. It looks like in exchange, the Sask Party made some crazy promises to Brightenview which it seems they didn’t fulfil. Brad Wall even made a trip to China for these people.

The story is complicated, and really that’s what the Sask. Party is betting on. Just know that the whole thing has been a scam and a giant waste of money. You can also read four years worth of @gleocbc reporting on the whole fiasco, if you are so inclined.

Anyway, it’s kind of validating to read this article and now see that a lot of what many of us assumed, but had no proof of prior to the 2016 election was true."

------------------------------------------

GTH - the province bought up hundreds of acres of land for a global transportation hub on the CP rail line west of Regina for the wholesale warehouse and distribution of goods.

In one segment, the government bought up 204 acres of land from a wealthy Regina businessman with ties to the Sask Party, for $103,000 per acre that was appraised to be worth $30,000 per acre. 

Also, an Alberta businessman bought 103 acres from an Order of Nuns for $55,000.00 an acre and then sold the land to the Saskatchewan government for millions more. The nuns were not impressed.

The government then attracted a Chinese company, Brightenview, to buy up 30 acres of this land at $256,000.00 per acre to set up a Chinese mega mall. Chinese investors were allegedly promised immigration for investment by the Saskatchewan government.

Brightenview bought 10 acres and built the 40,000 sq.foot mega mall. Some Chinese investors set up stores in this mega mall. Brightenview leased another 10 acres from the government to build its office headquarters. 

Chinese investors were denied immigration by the Federal government and the Saskatchewan government allegedly flip-flopped on their immigration promises to the Chinese investors so they all pulled out.

Brightenview now refuses to pay their lease because without immigration tied to the investment like they claim the Saskatchewan government promised them, Chinese investors no longer want to invest in Saskatchewan, so Brightenview does not intend to pay their debt that they owe the government because their money all went back to China. 

Misfit Misfit's picture

Saskatchewan election leaders debate

Wednesday 6:00 PM on CTV Regina.
60 minute debate.

Buddy Kat

Wife and I just got our mail in ballots .....funny we both live in the same house for 25 years and she now votes for a candidate in a differant riding than me. Wonder if this some kind of election gimmick that conservatives are noted for. On a side note ...months ago the courts ruled that Harper DID CHEAT in the last election he won. Funny how the media didn't pick up on that news.

Aristotleded24

Hi Buddy, welcome back! So nice to have more Prairie voices here! How have you been? :)

Misfit Misfit's picture

NDP could win 20-23 seats in Monday's election with a battle for the cities.

https://panow.com/2020/10/23/ndp-to-make-big-gains-u-of-s-professor/

There are 61 ridings. This means that the legislature could see:

41-20

40-21

39-22

38-23

Aristotleded24

That would be huge, and it's obscured by the fact that the seat standings are currently as lopsided as they are.

I'm particularly hoping for a huge NDP surge in Saskatoon. That would help the re-election odds of current incumbent mayor Charlie Clark.

NorthReport

The NDP should go hard after the Saskatchewan right-wing government for their Covid-19 screwups, just the same way the right-wing Greens and Liberals tried to do to the Social Democratic NDP in BC. It backfired in BC but it could succeed in Saskatchewan.

Misfit Misfit's picture

The NDP did heavily criticize the Saskatchewan government for funding cutbacks to schools and for having no plan of action for children to safely return to school. I don't think that it registered that much with people.

NorthReport

Tks Misfit

Aristotleded24

Misfit wrote:
The NDP did heavily criticize the Saskatchewan government for funding cutbacks to schools and for having no plan of action for children to safely return to school. I don't think that it registered that much with people.

I think regardless of how people feel about the pandemic or how it is run, there is a bit of cynicism among the public and a perception that the discussion about covid on the campaign trail is more about grandstanding and scoring political points than actually solving problems.

Aristotleded24

So if the polls are to be believed, there is now less than a 20 point gap between the Saskatchewan Party and the NDP.

The lopsided seat count for the Saskatchewan Party obscures the fact that (assuming these polls hold) this is a remarkable success for the NDP. They were facing off against one of the most popular Premiers in the country, disadvantages in terms of ability to fundraise and media coverage, and other things. Yet, they managed a remarkable turn-around throughout the time. They have not only consolidated the base they have (and are likely to re-elect their leader to the Legislature, something that hasn't happened since 2007), but they are gaining ground. They look poised to make major gains in Regina and Saskatoon, and may even pick up a few seats outside. Also look at the way the Leader Post framed the polling numbers: the race is tightening. That will be a huge morale boost to NDP voters who may feel their vote won't matter. I suspect that the gap may even end up being more narrow than that. Had the NDP not been so far behind the starting line when the writs were dropped, they could very well have contended for government right now.

That said, anything can happen.

Misfit Misfit's picture

338 is predicting 17 seats for the NDP. I woke up to news that my own riding in Moose Jaw is a very close race. The NDP has a 1% lead in the 338 poll in my riding. Yet 338 has it slated as a SP win.

People are very worried about the economy and the government debt. In July, Moe announced the 4 billion dollar irrigation project and when news of the debt leaked out (and not by the NDP) they quickly shut up about it.

Too many people associate the NDP with out of control spending, increased taxes, and massive debts. They are afraid of the economy but are afraid to vote NDP. Ryan Meili should have addressed the government's debts and irresponsible spending and scandals much sooner.
 

The NDP had the idea to sell themselves as being warm and caring and lovey-dovey people. I said from the beginning that people need an angry Tom kind of approach to shake people up. I'm not being arrogant but I was right. 

The Premier's driving accident history also played a minor part in deflating the SP numbers.

Ryan Meili did very well during the debate. He was very effective but should not have let some issues slide that Moe said that night. He did very well.

I hope that he stays on as the leader. 

Aristotleded24

Misfit wrote:
The NDP had the idea to sell themselves as being warm and caring and lovey-dovey people. I said from the beginning that people need an angry Tom kind of approach to shake people up. I'm not being arrogant but I was right.

That's absolutely correct. When the NDP was putting out press conferences on things like this, the polls were much more competitive. There are also other branding strategies tried in other provinces that the NDP could apply to Saskatchewan.

Misfit wrote:
Ryan Meili did very well during the debate. He was very effective but should not have let some issues slide that Moe said that night. He did very well.

I hope that he stays on as the leader.

Unlike the previous 2 leaders, he looks very likely to retain his own seat.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Actually, I don't know if it is SP propoganda but I have heard that his own riding might not be a safe seat. I don't know! I am thinking propoganda.

Aristotleded24

Maybe it is propaganda, although I think in general it's fair to ask if there is such a thing as a safe NDP seat anywhere in Saskatchewan these days. Its history suggests it's a "strong" NDP seat. Furthermore, with polls moving in the NDP's favour, along with the recent strong performance of NDP candidates in urban by-elections, I think things are looking pretty good.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Regina Elphinstone is a pretty safe seat always for the NDP.

I just found this on Twitter so it's not just me raising my eyebrows.

"It’s not invalid point, but I don’t know _ even as a capital plan _ you can characterize it as $4B prov. expense/4 yrs.
That said, you hit on a critical point as per today’s col.
The SP Govt capital spending is $7B.
They are complaining about NDP’s $4B?"Meili/NDP is missing this."

https://twitter.com/mmandryk/status/1317518887525601285?s=21

Misfit Misfit's picture

Disastrous outcome in Saskatchewan!!!

Aristotleded24

I wonder if Meili is now second-guessing the decision to throw Sandra Monin under the bus? It looks like she took enough votes from the NDP candidate to make a difference in that riding.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Yes she did. And she knew that she would.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Ryan Mieli might lose his own seat. It is flipping back and forth.  Yen's Peterson is losing his seat as well. 
 

I agree with Ryan Meili's platform. However, when you are polling at less than 30% before an election call, obviously the population does not agree with your ideology. It's not rocket science. Don't force a campaign platform on people that they don't want to hear.

So if they are worried about the debt then talk about the debt and about how the debt got to be what it is and who is at fault and why.
 

He didn't do any of that!!!

He even had the scandals handed to him on a silver platter and he said nothing. Other people had to address them.

I don't think that any NDP leader would have won this election. However, I do believe that a different strategy from someone else could have pulled out a far better result than this, perhaps about 24 seats.

there needs to be a third party to create a viable three way split and there just isn't one.

bekayne

When did Saskatchewan become more Albertan than Alberta?

Misfit Misfit's picture

bekayne wrote:

When did Saskatchewan become more Albertan than Alberta?

Oh Geez!!'

Aristotleded24

Misfit, I didn't want to say this when it happened, but I was amazed that it was the Regina area MPs who took the lead on some of the local scandals of the Saskatchewan Party and not the leader. I thought at the time that indicated a lack of confidence in Meili, and it was a subtle way of throwing him under the bus and grooming who they thought would be a potential successor. It's worth noting that one of those MLAs, Nicole Saurer, had actually led the NDP to first place in the polls for the first time in nearly a decade.

I agree that it's no-more-Mr-Nice-Guy time for the NDP. I wouldn't even worry about ideology or platforms or anything like that. There's no way to spin this, the vision offered by the NDP was resoundingly rejected, and repeating it won't change that fact. They need to instead, for the next little bit, really go after the Saskatchewan Party with all their failings, and tell the world. I'm talking about ads in social media, newspapers, television, and radio. Find a way to focus the spotlinght on those scandals, and make them stick. The biggest problem the NDP had was they were up against a popular Premier. They need to expose the truth and let that impact Moe's popularity before anything will change for them.

bekayne

The Buffalo Party coming 2nd in four ridings.

Misfit Misfit's picture

I grew up in rural Saskatchewan and cooperatives and socialist values were embodied deep within our culture. Our small town had a chartered bank and a credit union. It had a Saskatchewan Wheat Pool, a UGG, and two private elevators. There were two grocery stores: a Coop and a private one. The bakery was coop. Your gas came from a coop refinery. You could buy Coop machinery. Our insurance and utilities were crown owned. The people in rural Saskatchewan FOUGHT HARD for this lifestyle. 
 

Rudyard Kipling wrote:

"If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools, Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken, And stoop and build 'em up with worn-out tools; "

They are wrecking our crowns. They are wrecking our province beyond recognition."

Tonight I feel violated!!! It is a curse to really care!!!

The government took away hearing aids for poor deaf people! Think about that!

Misfit Misfit's picture

Ari, I told you privately why I hated Ryan Mieli right from the start. However, he is articulate. He is presentable. He is very intelligent.

He let Scott Moe portray the NDP as being fiscally irresponsible during the debate and he didn't challenge it.

its over, and I can't think of anybody now who is in a good position to replace him.

Cathy Sproule decided not to run again, and she was excellent in opposition. 
 

you have to have a solid opposition base to work with and they didn't achieve that. There are too few people having to do too much research with scarce resources.

 

 

Aristotleded24

Am I correct in understanding that this election essentially returned the same seat count for each party as it had going in? Why was this election even held in the first place?

bekayne

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Am I correct in understanding that this election essentially returned the same seat count for each party as it had going in? Why was this election even held in the first place?

Fixed election law.

Aristotleded24

bekayne wrote:
Aristotleded24 wrote:

Am I correct in understanding that this election essentially returned the same seat count for each party as it had going in? Why was this election even held in the first place?

Fixed election law.

Could you not tell that this was more of a rhetorical than a serious question?

Debater

Misfit wrote:

I grew up in rural Saskatchewan and cooperatives and socialist values were embodied deep within our culture. Our small town had a chartered bank and a credit union. It had a Saskatchewan Wheat Pool, a UGG, and two private elevators. There were two grocery stores: a Coop and a private one. The bakery was coop. Your gas came from a coop refinery. You could buy Coop machinery. Our insurance and utilities were crown owned. The people in rural Saskatchewan FOUGHT HARD for this lifestyle. 
 

Rudyard Kipling wrote:

"If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools, Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken, And stoop and build 'em up with worn-out tools; "

They are wrecking our crowns. They are wrecking our province beyond recognition."

Tonight I feel violated!!! It is a curse to really care!!!

The government took away hearing aids for poor deaf people! Think about that!

Is what is happening in Saskatchewan a reflection of a wider pattern across Canada and other countries in rural areas?  Are social-democratic policies becoming further and further a part of the past in rural communities?

That also seems to be the case in the U.S. where the Democrats are becoming largely extinct in rural America and with rural America becoming more & more right-wing Trump country as Democrats become more the party of the cities.

That also seems to be the case in Saskatchewan and across Canada.  And we saw it in Saskatchewan in the last Federal election in 2019 with the Conservatives sweeping all 14 Federal seats -- wiping out the NDP and even taking Ralph Goodale down, too.  So the Conservative dominance seems to be occuring at both the Federal and Provincial level in SK and both in rural areas and in the cities of Regina and Saskatoon.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Provincially, there is viable no third party. The Liberal party has never been able to reorganize since the SP was formed.  
 

Also, the older generation that survived the 30s is now gone.

Many people moved to Saskatchewan 20 years ago from Alberta and B.C. to retire because they could sell their homes for top dollar and buy homes very cheaply in Saskatchewan then. They brought their right wing ideology with them.

The oil industry is important to Saskatchewan and they have adopted Alberta's oil psychology.

The NDP had the school tax which inflamed rural Saskatchewan. The NDP from Blakeney on has never been an agriculture party. They cater to the urban unions. Agriculture has changed from small family farms to big enterprise outfits which identifies with right wing free market capitalistic ideology.

The NDP cut back on hospital beds in rural Saskatchewan.

And there is just too much common and pervasive ignorance circulating about the NDP.and Ryan Mieli did absolutely nothing to try to dispel those myths.

The media is anti NDP.

 

 

Ken Burch

There's nothing else for it- the SNDP needs to dissolve and be replaced by a new party on the Left(or even the "center-left", whatever that ever meant).

The SNDP is beyond repair.  

josh

Debater wrote:

Misfit wrote:

I grew up in rural Saskatchewan and cooperatives and socialist values were embodied deep within our culture. Our small town had a chartered bank and a credit union. It had a Saskatchewan Wheat Pool, a UGG, and two private elevators. There were two grocery stores: a Coop and a private one. The bakery was coop. Your gas came from a coop refinery. You could buy Coop machinery. Our insurance and utilities were crown owned. The people in rural Saskatchewan FOUGHT HARD for this lifestyle. 
 

Rudyard Kipling wrote:

"If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools, Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken, And stoop and build 'em up with worn-out tools; "

They are wrecking our crowns. They are wrecking our province beyond recognition."

Tonight I feel violated!!! It is a curse to really care!!!

The government took away hearing aids for poor deaf people! Think about that!

Is what is happening in Saskatchewan a reflection of a wider pattern across Canada and other countries in rural areas?  Are social-democratic policies becoming further and further a part of the past in rural communities?

That also seems to be the case in the U.S. where the Democrats are becoming largely extinct in rural America and with rural America becoming more & more right-wing Trump country as Democrats become more the party of the cities.

That also seems to be the case in Saskatchewan and across Canada.  And we saw it in Saskatchewan in the last Federal election in 2019 with the Conservatives sweeping all 14 Federal seats -- wiping out the NDP and even taking Ralph Goodale down, too.  So the Conservative dominance seems to be occuring at both the Federal and Provincial level in SK and both in rural areas and in the cities of Regina and Saskatoon.

Yes, this is true.  Unfortunately.  

Left Turn Left Turn's picture

I have family who live in Saskatoon who lean to the left politically. They tell me that in the 2000s a lot of young men from Saskatchewan started going to work in the tar sands, and then came back after a few years with large ammounts of money saved up, pushing up housing prices. That these men have a very pro-oil ideology because what the tar sands has done for them financially. And that pickup trucks are up massively as a percentage of all vehicles.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Yes. The riggers and retired people from BC and Alberta bought up cheap real estate and drove the values up.

 

kropotkin1951

People from the BC coast do not retire to Saskatchewan, maybe from Fort Saint John. Trust me the migration pattern for seniors on VI is very much the other way around. No body here dreams of retiring to a Regina winter.

Misfit Misfit's picture

When they could sell their house for one million and buy the equivalent in Saskatchewan for $120/250,000.00. Of course they did. The population in Saskatoon was 200,000 thirty years ago. Now it's 260,000. Regina has had a boom too but not quite like Saskatoon. Retired people selling high in BC and moving to Saskatchewan where it's cheaper to live. When real estate collapsed in the States, you could buy a cheap condo in Arizona and a house in Saskatchewan and winter in the States. Many did.

Aristotleded24

Now that the results are in, what does this mean for Charlie Clark in Saskatoon? Will the fortunes of the mayoral candidates rise and fall with the tides of support of their respective porvincial parties, or are there more local issues at play that would influence the outcome?

Misfit Misfit's picture

I have no idea. We have a really bad mayor that I would love to vote out but would only replace him with worse than what we have now. I'm not voting municipally this time.

jerrym

kropotkin1951 wrote:

People from the BC coast do not retire to Saskatchewan, maybe from Fort Saint John. Trust me the migration pattern for seniors on VI is very much the other way around. No body here dreams of retiring to a Regina winter.

Krop is right. I used to tease my wife that we would move to Regina for the weather. The response was "That's when we get a divorce". People joke that there are more Roughrider flags and gear than Lions fans in the stands when BC plays Saskatchewan at home, from all the ex-Saskatchewan  residents. 

Misfit Misfit's picture

Both of you NO!!! Leave me alone but please do not spew out your opinions about this anymore.
 

You are not correct on this.

I fully understand where you are coming from but you don't know anything about what I have discussed. 

I have explained this as much as I intend to and the conversation is over. You are entitled to your opinions.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Saskatchewan is known to have exported more than 1 million people over the course of my lifetime. The big joke, ha ha ha, is that our greatest export has been our own people. That is why the Saskatchewan Roughriders have home field advantage everywhere they go including eastern Canada.

Many hundreds of thousands of people relocated from Saskatchewan to BC. The climate is nicer on the BC coast and the let's say 700+ thousand people most wearing green and white would be highly visible to people who live on BC's lower mainland and VI.

Now, there is the concept called "economies of scale". If say 20 or 30 thousand people who once lived in BC decided to move back to Saskatchewan for whatever reason over a twenty year period, nobody in BC would really notice.
 

These same people who you never missed did not settle in rural Saskatchewan. No, they moved to the urban centres which have traditionally been NDP strongholds. However, 20,000 people in a small city like Saskatoon which has we'll say 10 constituencies breaks down to about 2,000 votes per constituency. Those few votes are enough to destabilize the election results and change the outcome of an election.

I just spent days dealing with people who said things like, "I drive to Regina regularly and I haven't seen any evidence of hitchhikers due to the sell off of the provincial bus service." Because they haven't seen it they feel entitled to erase the lived experiences of people in the province who have had to suffer because of the government's decision to sell off the crown public bus service.

You need to see evidence and you need to see the scale that you have witnessed move to BC to reverse in order to believe or comprehend what I have been discussing. An annual influx of 2,500 per year over and above the natural birth/death rate into a city like Saskatoon can create havoc and major infrastructural decisions and adjustments. 

Most of the people came from the west which is both Alberta and BC. And yes, people did move from coastal BC back to Saskatchewan because of differences in property values.

But what do I know. I guess that I am stupid even though I live here and deal with numbers of them personally. But since they are from the BC coast that makes them somehow imaginary to some, and it makes me a fool.

In the 70s, many farmers retired and sold their farms to their sons and moved to the coast. Some of these people 20 or so years  later sold their property on the coast and moved back to be closer to their families. They capitalized on the high housing prices and bought retirement condos in Saskatoon, Regina, or other smaller cities close to where they originally farmed. This is not rocket science.

People move to the coast to retire. The husband dies. The widow moves back to be close to her children and grandchildren. 

Or nobody dies but a retired couple wants to be closer to their families. 
 

People move. That is what people do.

How hard is it to comprehend!!!  How many people have to move to Saskatchewan from the coast in order for you people to believe?

How many?

is this a numbers issue with you people?

what is it?

Oh, and people have moved from coastal BC to Saskatchewan all the time for as long as I can remember. This is not a new phenomenon. So there is the definite arrogance factor in your opinions that Saskatchewan is so horrible and detestable a place that no one would ever want to relocate to the province for any reason at any time, especially from coastal BC. All we have learned from your opinions is what you think of Saskatchewan and nothing more.

Aristotleded24

Misfit wrote:
Oh, and people have moved from coastal BC to Saskatchewan all the time for as long as I can remember. This is not a new phenomenon. So there is the definite arrogance factor in your opinions that Saskatchewan is so horrible and detestable a place that no one would ever want to relocate to the province for any reason at any time, especially from coastal BC. All we have learned from your opinions is what you think of Saskatchewan and nothing more.

One thing we hear from costal residents who move to the Prairies is that even though the winters are colder, the trade-off is worth it because at least they see the sun in the winter time.

Misfit Misfit's picture

And for the scoff remark that people who relocated from BC to Saskatchewan had to have moved from eastern BC and not the coast. Well, the farmers and most other people who retired to BC from Saskatchewan didn't retire to eastern BC. They moved to the Okanagen, Vancouver, and the Island, NOT to eastern BC. The migration back to Saskatchewan would have been from the Okanagen,  coastal mainland, and the island, not eastern BC although people do move from eastern BC to Saskatchewan as well. The majority of people returning from BC would have moved from the coast because that is where the went to in the first place.

I would rather bundle up and live in Saskatchewan in the winter than in Ontario. It is a dry cold and not a damp cold. Historically, without global warming, there are ususally two or three cold snaps each winter. The rest of the time, winter is actually not a big deal.

Misfit Misfit's picture

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Misfit wrote:
Oh, and people have moved from coastal BC to Saskatchewan all the time for as long as I can remember. This is not a new phenomenon. So there is the definite arrogance factor in your opinions that Saskatchewan is so horrible and detestable a place that no one would ever want to relocate to the province for any reason at any time, especially from coastal BC. All we have learned from your opinions is what you think of Saskatchewan and nothing more.

One thing we hear from costal residents who move to the Prairies is that even though the winters are colder, the trade-off is worth it because at least they see the sun in the winter time.

We don't worry about avalanches either.

Misfit Misfit's picture

And they find out that you can actually see things out on the Prairies. In BC, the mountains block the view!

Misfit Misfit's picture

My cousin's friend from Saskatoon went to Vancouver. Her observation was: "The nature in Stanley Park was too profuse. There were flowers everywhere. There was no place to rest your eyes. The nature was just too gaudy!!!"

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