The new Russophobia

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swallow swallow's picture

ikosmos, can someone be critical of the Russian government's human rights record without being "Russophobic"? 

This thread reminds me of those who call all criticism of Israel "the new anti-semitism." 

I hope this is on-topic enough to avoid a hail of insults from you? 

NS NS's picture

Observant and funny.

Is that serious question tho swallow?

 

 

MegB

So I guess we should just sweep Putin's homophobia and other human rights violations under the carpet and spin criticism as the oppression of Russia. The thread title alone is an insult to those who suffer under the weight of others' very real phobias - Islamophobia, homophobia, etc.

Poor Russia, always the underdog.Undecided

NS NS's picture

I am not sure if its the same as an insult to those suffering racism anti semistm or homophobia.

The Red or communist scare was real. Fear of Russia is real and has been in American/Western culture, politics and society for a very long time before even before 1917.

Muslims and Arabs are the enemy and fear of them reached peak in the 1990s and 2000s culminating with First Gulf War but it was present long before that in Western culture. We have acknowledged Islamophobia for last 13 years or so.

"Russophobia" and Islamophobia can be present at the same time. The point is fear or fear mongering will be the same especially at times of war or regional and geopolitical conflicts.

One can be critical of Saudia Arabia without being Islamophobic just like one can be critical of Israel or Zionism , settler colonialism without being anti-semitic.

Why not add "Sinophobia" or fear of the Chinese as a threat to the Western hegemony? 

Supplemental: I am very critical at both Russia and China policy towards their Muslim minority regions.

swallow swallow's picture

NS wrote:

Observant and funny.

Is that serious question tho swallow?

yes. 

NS NS's picture

CNN is home to plaigarist Zakaria and morons Blitzer and Lemon. Christanne Amanpour used to at least pretend that she was a real reporter but even she has not be a serious journalist for a long time. 

Watch RT journalist confront Amanpour about her history of towing US State Dept line and calling it journalism. Amanpour gets upset that Anissa brings up her husband's role as former State Dept official and not disclosing to her audience. CNN didnt see the need to air the brazen questions.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Some noteworthy remarks...

Joshua Tartakovsky wrote:
Furthermore, the demonization of Russia had been coupled by an even stronger demonization of Putin. That accusations without any basis, such as that Russia invaded Eastern Ukraine, are frequently being made indicates that the goal is indeed demonization, not true journalism. The future is not too promising as the past indicates that a process of demonization of an individual leader by the US media, is followed by an attempt of the US to topple him undemocratically, using various means. We have seen this in the cases of Iraq, Libya, Venezuela and others.

Tatarkovsky notes: For Western reporters, the more irrational Russia appears, the better. There is a real frenzy with which Russia is depicted, while trivializing or ignoring altogether the brutal atrocities and war crimes of the Ukrainian junta.

William Dunkerley notes that incompetence plays an important role. The example of Litvinenko, in which it is claimed that “Former KGB Spy Murdered on Orders of Putin," is instructive. Dunkerley has written a whole book about the falsehoods and fabrications around Litvinenko's death - many of which have undoubtedly been lapped up like mother's milk by plenty of Canadians from the entire political spectrum (including the left). Dunkerley also makes the noteworthy comment that good international coverage has been in decline in the US, with bureaus closing; Americans have, it is said, little interest in international affairs. Much of it is for domestic political consumption around the electoral cycle.

Following up from Tartakovsky, Gilbert Doctorow outlines how Russia is being prepared for a colour revolution. The Yanqui strategy, so far, has backfired with Putin showing absolutely stratospheric levels of support.

Gilbert Doctorow wrote:
... mainstream Western media coverage of Russia, whether in the USA or in Europe, is heavily negative. It largely disseminates disinformation generated in Washington which is intended to denigrate the country and its leadership, preparing the general public for a color revolution in Moscow or for armed conflict between NATO and Russia in Ukraine, if it comes to that.

Doctorow notes that Noam Chomsky and Edward Herman, long ago in "Manufacturing Consent", pointed out the incestuous relationship between the press and official sources in the USA, and provided plenty of such examples to substantiate their claims.

The point of the degradation of journalism is also noted; Doctorow points out that even cultural matters like operas or museum openings are often covered by lightly edited versions of the press releases from the very same institutions. Democracy is being truncated in the USA, and perhaps it is time to call that country what it really is - an oligarchy just as much as Ukraine is an oligarchy.

Vladimir Golstein points out that the looming economic and financial crisis needs scapegoats. Russia is that scapegoat. Interestingly, he notes

Vladimir Golstein wrote:
... the Soviet Union was a rival, Russia has become a scapegoat.

Thus, brutal Soviet invasions of Hungary or Czechoslovakia produced much less hysteria, than the current Ukrainian crisis.

Why is Western Media so Stridently Anti-Russia?

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

swallow wrote:
ikosmos, can someone be critical of the Russian government's human rights record without being "Russophobic"? 

This thread reminds me of those who call all criticism of Israel "the new anti-semitism." 

I hope this is on-topic enough to avoid a hail of insults from you? 

 

OK, so you're not actually acknowledging what any honest person (Gorbachev, former Canadian diplomat Patrick Armstrong, etc, etc. ) feels compelled to acknowledge; that there IS a new Russophobia, that it is also aimed personally at the current Russian President who is vilified to the point of being compared to Hitler and/or Stalin, and that the aim seems to be regime change in which all options, including thermonuclear war, are "on the table".

It's hard to take seriously rhetorical questions that seem more like attempts at thread derailment than anything else.

There is a Russia thread in which well-deserved criticism of homophobia, electoral irregularities (like the Conservative Robo calls sort of thing), and so on ... can and should go. However, the fact that there is an organized campaign to scapegoat Russia and its President, to brainwash Canadians into a Russophobia that far exceeds anything from the first Cold War, ought to concern Canadians on the political left who know very well that the right wing in this country, as they are in any country, are only to happy to blame Jews, Communists, Muslims, Russians or any other group to distract attention from the brutal austerity regimes they are implementing. Russophobia should concern the left because it is part of the whole range of ideological weapons to disarm and neutralize the left.

What exactly is the link between real or alleged human rights violations in Russia and the current Russophobia? Does the underdeveloped state of GLBT friendly laws in Russia give our media the right to villify an entire country? How is that helping gays and lesbians in Russia?

Russia thread.

Hell, if I have the time I'd be happy to join in the debate about domestic politics in Russia. This thread, however, is about the media campaign in our own country which merits its own thread about subservient corporate media in Canada and elsewhere. I can't think of a more suitable subject for an independent website like rabble. ca.

 

 

nicky
swallow swallow's picture

As I said well upthread, ikosmos, the "new Russophobia" sounds much like the old Russophobia. Probably less intense than the days of the "red scare" though. 

I'm sorry you don't think I am an honest person, but I suppose I will have to live with that. 

Criticism of Putin is not evidence of hating Russians, any more than criticism of Netanyahu is evidence of anti-semitism. 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

swallow wrote:
As I said well upthread, ikosmos, the "new Russophobia" sounds much like the old Russophobia. Probably less intense than the days of the "red scare" though.

Plenty of commentators are noting that it is actually worse now. Hitler and the Nazis referred to Russian untermensch or sub-humans, as does the present-day Ukrainian regime and Ukrainian politicians, an odious misanthropy which Western countries support enthusiastically. Human being are compared to insects, as the Israelis compare Palestinians to insects, that need to be "exterminated". They're not trying very hard to hide this stuff.

Quote:
I'm sorry you don't think I am an honest person, but I suppose I will have to live with that.

The evidence of the entire thread is apparently not enough. So, you must agree that MORE evidence is needed? Or that any such evidence is already "too much" and should be silenced? I'm confused.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

bekayne wrote:

ikosmos wrote:
lol. RT publishes the left AND the right.

As long as it agrees with the position of the Russian government.

I see that RT has a a piece on protests against cutbacks in health care in the city of Moscow. We have the same sort of protests here.

Unlike our own media, which often omits or botches the view of the protestors, the views of both sides are included. What do these Russkies think they are? Journalists???

RT reports: ‘Fair healthcare’: Hundreds protest medical reform in Moscow

Mind you, if it isn't vetted by the limousine liberals, those darlings of Western intelligence agencies and the confederacy of useful idiots, does it count? lol.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

file: Putinphobia.

How Irresponsible Is Putin? Let's Ask This Russian Guy Who Embezzled a Billion Dollars

Quote:
Like all karate black belts, Putin is incapable of anticipating anything.

He's “not someone who sets strategic plans; he lives today.” He's as unpredictable as a menopausal woman [no offense, Mom – Riley]. Sometimes he even barricades himself in his Kremlin nuclear fallout shelter for hours on end, snacking on buckets of tasty popcorn shrimps as he watches Bridget Jones's Diary over and over again.

We know all of this thanks to Russia's bravest political dissident-in-exile, Sergei Pugachev, who describes Putin as a comatose Ritalin-induced vegetable: “With [Putin] it was just quiet, no one there, no meetings, everything quiet. He’d sit there, or watch TV. He really likes watching TV.”

Russia's bloodthirsty dictator-for-life is...Chauncey Gardener? Fancy that. “I can't write. I can't read. I like to watch TV. As long as the roots are not severed, all is well in Russia.” Finally, the mystery of Vladimir Putin has been solved forever.

Wheeeee!

 

swallow swallow's picture

Yeah, I'm all about silencing others. Sure thing, that must be it. 

In my opinion, voiced here, the evidence in this thread does not prove that there is a hatred of Russians stronger than there was under the Nazis or during the Cold War, again in my view. It all reminds me very strongly of the threads we had here some years back saying "the left is anti-semitic" beacuse there was rising support for Palestine. Babblers rightly rejected that accusation. 

The demonization of Russia in the West, it seems to me, is nowhere near the vilification of Muslims. The "russophobia" seems directed mostly at a right-wing government that is increasingly nationalistic, led by a man who is increasingly autocratic, and not at the Russian people. Meg has said this better than me. My main concern here is a general one, that criticisms of governments are conflated with x-phobia. But if you think I'm somehow trolling your thread by disagreeing wth your premise, I'll vacate it. 

6079_Smith_W

@ swallow

I'd think twice about that offer to vacate. If someone wants an unchallenged soapbox one can rent web space.

Considering the number of threads there are on this single theme, and the ways it has been used as a tangent in others, you might soon find yourself with no place to post at all.

I think fair comment is fine, and your input is nothing if not that.

 

 

 

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..wasn't quite sure which thread to post this in.

Pipeline Geopolitics: From Syria To Russia via Ukraine

Prior to landing in Ukraine or before I start glossing the western sanction on Russia, it is important to take the readers through the memory lane into Syria to expound the Pipeline-Geopolitics in the Middle-East. Moreover, without understanding Putin's love and Obama's abhorrence for Assad, the whole story of Ukrainian crises and the latest sanction on Russia is incomplete. In the entire Pipelinistan region, Syria plays a pivotal role in connecting Asia with Europe. The same geographical ascendancy in the region has made it an easy victim in the hydrocarbon tussle of domination between Russia & US led Western Allies. This could be elucidated from the fact that the US led NATO forces has already spent close to 50 billion dollars to support the rebels in Syria while Russia keeps pouring arms into Damascus to support Assad's regime by justifying his alleged war crime against the civilians.

http://www.countercurrents.org/eapen301114.htm

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

swallow wrote:
My main concern here is a general one, that criticisms of governments are conflated with x-phobia. But if you think I'm somehow trolling your thread by disagreeing wth your premise, I'll vacate it. 

And mine was to explore the theme, collect evidence of Russophobia, try to make sense of it, in an independent media environment (like rabble.ca) in which like-minded individuals could explore the issue.

The Canadian government supports a regime that bombs schools, day care centers, hospitals, cuts funding to seniors pensions, uses incendiary and phosphorus weapons on residential neighbourhoods, as well as ballistic missiles, burns protestors to death in the trade union building, or opens fire on them as they leap from a burning building, shoots down civilian airliners and blames those who resist them, calls those who resist sub-humans and uses a Nazi narrative, raises the Nazis up like vampires to prey upon the living .... and your response is to parse the replies as "unfair".

Let's wait until they physically exterminate the ethnic Russians in eastern Ukraine and then we can wring our hands and say, "How awful! What a shame we didn't know! If only we had actually read what they were saying!" blah blah

6079_Smith_W

Actually it seems like the theme is how many falsehoods you can pack into the tighest space. I caught six in that middle paragraph, and I am being generous. Though I have corrected you a number of times on some of them (like the nonexistent phosphorous bombs).

And "exterminate the ethnic Russians"? Again, the problem isn't that either side has bombs that are so smart they can sniff out someone's ethnicity. The problem is they BOTH have been using highly inaccurate ones. And you seem to forget that the Azov Battalion you talk about so much is actually Russian speaking, formed and based in Donbass.

 

 

NDPP

Western Attacks on Russian Media Merely Prove That It Is Telling The Truth  -  by Alexander Mercouris

http://sputniknews.com/columnists/20141130/1015316066.html

"The primary target is the Russian media's coverage of the Ukraine crisis. US Secretary of State John Kerry has even called RT a 'propaganda bullhorn' because of it..."

swallow swallow's picture

ikosmos wrote:

The Canadian government supports a regime that bombs schools....

And has supported regimes that do this sort of thing for decades around the world. 

NDPP

Yes, it has. Which is why we shouldn't...

Vancouver Peace Activist Offers Alternative View on Ukraine, Claiming Government Commits War Crimes (and vid)  -  by Charlie Smith

http://newcoldwar.org/vancouver-peace-activist-offers-alternative-view-u...

"This year, all three major Canadian political parties have expressed strong support for the elected government of Ukraine and have been harshly critical of Russian-speaking rebels in the eastern part of the country. That's also been the tenor of the vast majority of Canadian media coverage, which has largely vilified Russian president Vladimir Putin's role in destabilizing the country.

In the face of this broad consensus, a retired Vancouver aerospace worker and peace activist, Roger Annis, has worked tirelessly to offer a different perspective..."

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

That article by Alexander Mercouris shows that independent media, at least in the UK, is winning the battle.

Extraordinary. It is a pity and a shame that more supporters of rabble.ca  don't recognize it as such.

Quote:
...for the first time in its long history, the Western media finds itself in a position where it is not only giving an account of a conflict which is false (that has happened many times), but also finds itself effectively challenged by a powerful alternative media, which is giving an account of the conflict which is true. Since in any conflict between truth and falsehood, it is truth that always has the advantage, the western media for the first time in its experience finds itself on the defensive, sensing that its own credibility is now on the line. It doesn’t like this situation at all, which is why it is lashing out in the way it is doing.

Hooray for alternative media. Parse that, Russophobes!

NDPP

New York Times Shows How Propaganda Works  -  by Robert Parry

http://newcoldwar.org/new-york-times-shows-propaganda-works/

"...Take for example international law, especially prohibition against aggression. When the topic is Ukraine and the alleged violator is Russia, no extreme is too extreme in denouncing Russia's President Vladimir Putin.

But the concern about international law simply disappears when discussing Syria and the desirability of US President Barack Obama overthrowing the government there.

While ignoring the issue of US aggression in a war on Syria, the Times presents the Ukraine crisis as a simple matter of Russia's aggression..."

swallow swallow's picture

ikosmos wrote:

Hooray for alternative media. Parse that, Russophobes!

You forgot to say "boo rah" that time.

NDPP

'Green Light' to War on Russia, Legislation in Congress: Say No To War With Russia - - H. Res. 758, 'Russian Aggression'   -  by Dennis Kucinich

http://www.opednews.com/articles/Green-Light-to-War-on-Ru-by-Dennis-Kuci...

"...distortion of reality is artificially creating a hsteria about Russian aggressiveness, another distortion which could pose an exceptionally dangerous situation for the world, if acted upon by other nations. The US Congress is responding to the distortions, not to reality.

Similar distortions are developing now in the coverage of events in the eastern part of Ukraine, in Donetsk and Luhansk.

Tensions between Russia and the US are being fueled each day by players who would benefit financially from a resumption of the Cold War, which, from 1948 to 1991 cost US taxpayers $20 TRILLION dollars (in 2014 dollars!), an amount exceeding our $18 trillion National Debt.

Tomorrow the US House will debate and vote on H. Res. 758 which is tantamount to a 'Declaration of Cold War' against Russia, reciting a host of grievances, old and new, against Russia which represent complaints that Russia could well make against the US..."

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Quote:
The head of Russia's Central Bank resigned in disgrace this morning after arctic hookers announced that they intend to peg the cost of their lady-love to the dollar.

Putin's Russia has finally been brought to its knees, and by hookers, no less. The Moscow Times reports: ...

Yellow journalism, much?

Quote:
Bank runs are being reported across Russia as frantic citizens desperate for one final hooker-fix rush to exchange their miserable rubles for delicious, sex-buying dollars. The situation is extremely dire. Just ask the BBC.

Many years from now, western scholars will attribute the collapse of Russia not to sanctions, nor oil prices, nor Putin invading Finland, but rather to arctic hooker hyperinflation.

You had a good run, Russia. But no country can survive without affordable hookers.

This is what appears in Western-sponsored newspapers in Moscow.

Russians Must Choose Between Food or Hookers, Collapse Inevitable

 

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Not only is there the new Russophobia but there are also real attempts to silence Russian media.

'They’ll try to shut you down': Meeting Assange & the non-stop 'War on RT'

The article includes a good story as well about how the jackboot NATO leaders managed to silence Kurdish media.

In regard to RT, there are techniques such as ...

1. Pressuring and threatening employees;

2. Many Western media outlets attempting to discredit the work of RT, etc.;

3. Explicit threats to revoke broadcasting licenses;

4. Pressuring independent experts who appear on RT; e.g. attempts to pressure Russia expert Stephen Cohen;

And so on.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

'Eye of Sauron' on Moscow skyscraper to end up badly for city, Orthodox Church says

 

In a stunt related to the upcoming release of the latest LOTR film (Hobbit Part 3), attempts to erect a real-life "Eye of Sauron" in Moscow is being harshly criticized by the Orthodox Church.

Quote:

'Eye of Sauron' is “in any case, a demonic symbol,” Archpriest Vsevolod Chaplin, a senior church official in charge of relations with the society, stressed.

“Such a symbol of triumphant evil rising above Moscow and becoming one of the tallest objects in the city…is it good or bad? I am afraid it’s mostly bad. One shouldn’t be surprised if something goes wrong with the city after that,” Chaplin told Govorit Moskva radio station.

Russian art-group ‘Svechenie’ plan to create the scary installation which will be in place for some 9 hours is a tribute to British novelist J. R. R. Tolkien and film adaptations of his most famous works “The Lord of the Rings” and “The Hobbit.”

A giant orb, with the projection of the fiery 'Eye of Sauron' on it, will be lit on the roof of one of the towers of the Moscow-City International Business Center on Wednesday, a day ahead of the Russian premiere of “The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies.”

Now Washington. That's a different story.

Edited to add: the idea has been dropped after local opposition drew attention to the planned stunt.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Ukraine Today wrote:
We have undeniable proof that Putin's invaders used illegal secretly developed chemical weapons that could turn entire populations into disfunctional retards.

I guess those were the same chemical weapons used during the Cold War in the USA, huh?

... Personally, I prefer the term "Russophobic zombies" but perhaps I'm quibbling ...

6079_Smith_W

Is this the made up news and disability slur thread now, ikosmos? If there is a source for that quote, I can't find it.

 

Adam T

Just ignore FSB disinformation officer ikosmos.

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

That's quite a touching photo of the reporter, huh?  No swastika, mind you.

6079_Smith_W

You didn't answer my question, ikosmos. Is there a real story there, or is it just a discriminatory slur. And what do you mean "touching photo"?

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

6079_Smith_W wrote:
You didn't answer my question, ikosmos.

You don't answer mine. Try reading the name of the broadcaster and the show on the image. You may have to brush up on your Ukrainian.

Quote:
Is there a real story there, or is it just a discriminatory slur.

The slur is a quote from Executive Producer of Ukraine TV Today, Tetiana Pushnova. Take it up with the Ukrainian fascists.

6079_Smith_W

No it isn't actually.

Can you find a real source? I couldn't. Sorry ikosmos, it is a lie.

Maybe you should do your homework a bit better. It is kind of annoying cleaning up after this shit.

 

 

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Why ask questions if you don't like the answer?

In other Russophobia, at least 76 graves, mostly Serbian and Russian, have been desecrated in Australia ahead of Ukrainian junta leader Poroshenko's visit to that country.

Cultivated Russophobia = grave desecration thousands of kilometers away.

Desecration of Russian and Serbian graves in Australia

But some people are worried about Ukrainian fascists and neo-Nazis being treated "unfairly". uh huh.

NDPP

The Trigger-Happy West: Blaming Russia for Everything?  -  by Brian Cloughley

http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/12/12/blaming-russia-for-everything/

'Russian Bombers Threaten Guam'

It is apparent that these people don't only want to confront Russia - they want war.

But it is our lives and the future of our world they are playing with..."

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

RT, the very successful public broadcaster from Russia, has now reached 2 Billion views on their 5 YouTube channels. This is triple the numbers for CNN. This would make RT the biggest news channel... in the world.

The neo-cons must be foaming at the mouth. Oh well.

Over 2 Billion served. That's certainly a strong antidote to the fatty diet of Western Russophobia.

swallow swallow's picture

I like the Eye of Sauron in Moscow article. Though is it Russophobic? It does paint the people of Russia as being in thrall to right-wing Christians, that could be a slur....

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

That was amusing. The Orthodox Church, and some unnamed others, objected and it was cancelled at the last minute. Perhaps they went ahead anyway?

Washington, the center of the tentacles of the Five Eyes, surely deserves the title of the lidless eye more than any other city in the world. Edward Snowden, Julian Assange, and Wikileaks generally have demonstrated that.

Supplemental: You have to be careful with simple right-left categories in Russian political life. So-called liberals in Russia, including the Atlantic Integrationists, etc., are treated as traitorous 5th columnists in that country. Their electoral support has disappeared into single digits. Socially conservative Christians, like the ones we have here, is probably more precise terminology than simply "right wing" Christians. These social conservatives probably also support a strong public sector in Russia, good welfare state support, and so on. That is quite different from the market and religious fundamentalists that we get in Canada.

6079_Smith_W

And beating, murdering and blackmailing LGBT people. I think "right wing" is simple enough.

Someone was slinging this bullshit argument around the time of the Pussy Riot trial about the Russian Orthodox Church being a refuge for political dissidents back in teh bad old days (or good old days, depending on how you want to play the argument on any particular day). True or not, the argument is nothing but a shell game so far as the current administration is concerned.

 

 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

Let Pussy Riot members stuff a rubber chicken into their p*ssies in some major Canadian church and then televise the results like they did in Moscow. It won't only be socially conservative - oh, sorry, I mean right wing Christians in this country that would object.

Russophobia is helped along by the sort of intense ignorance of Russian political life that is shown here.

Why not post, as Adam T has already done on another thread, your keen desire to see the Russian President killed? Nobody in the babble moderators will punish you and it will give you a glorious opportunity to show how much you love "freedom of expression" and other core western values.

6079_Smith_W

ikosmos wrote:

Let Pussy Riot members stuff a rubber chicken into their p*ssies in some major Canadian church and then televise the results like they did in Moscow.

They didn't do anything like that in the Cathedral protest, ikosmos. Why are you making offensive claims like that?

They called on Mary to deliver them from Vladimir Putin.\

But I was talking about your characterization of the Russian Orthodox Church. Again, no offense to those who follow that faith, but as for the way it has been used as a political tool by the Russian government, I have heard that nonsense before.

Did you read the story I posted? It is a really funny one, and there is even a message there.

 

 

 

NDPP

The Secret History of Pussy Riot  -  by Israel Shamir

http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/08/23/the-secret-history-of-pussy-riot/

 

6079_Smith_W

Hey NDPP,

You can put away the mirrors and wave off the smoke. I was actually talking about the false characterization of the Russian Orthodox Church as a bastion of progressive thought.

Do I need to repeat that again, or have you got it this time?

 

swallow swallow's picture

ikosmos wrote:

That was amusing. The Orthodox Church, and some unnamed others, objected and it was cancelled at the last minute. Perhaps they went ahead anyway?

Washington, the center of the tentacles of the Five Eyes, surely deserves the title of the lidless eye more than any other city in the world. Edward Snowden, Julian Assange, and Wikileaks generally have demonstrated that.

Probably, yes, if the lidless eye is badly in need of contacts and cataract surgery as it advnaces into old age. 

Quote:
Supplemental: You have to be careful with simple right-left categories in Russian political life. So-called liberals in Russia, including the Atlantic Integrationists, etc., are treated as traitorous 5th columnists in that country. Their electoral support has disappeared into single digits. Socially conservative Christians, like the ones we have here, is probably more precise terminology than simply "right wing" Christians. These social conservatives probably also support a strong public sector in Russia, good welfare state support, and so on. That is quite different from the market and religious fundamentalists that we get in Canada.

To me, you're talking about traditional conservatism, rather than the neo-liberalism that has stolen its outfit. So I am fairly confortable calling them right-wing. 

Not sure what you're trying to say re Pussy Riot, which has not done anything approaching what you suggest they try in Canada. 

ikosmos ikosmos's picture

6079_Smith_W wrote:

ikosmos wrote:
Let Pussy Riot members stuff a rubber chicken into their p*ssies in some major Canadian church and then televise the results like they did in Moscow.

They didn't do anything like that ...

Yeah, they did actually. Or Nadezhda Tolokonnikova and Yekaterina Samutsevich when they were members of Voina participated "in having sex in the Timiryazev State Biology Museum in Moscow" and then called it satire, while other members, and possibly member of Pussy Riot as well, "participated in  a notorious performance by Voina in St. Petersburg, in which a woman stole a chicken from a supermarket by stuffing it in her vagina," etc., etc.

Real artists.

 

6079_Smith_W

Pussy Riot didn't do that at the church, ikosmos.

And in fact yes, Voina are real artists. Do you care what any of those actions were about, or are you more concerned about theis shock value?

But you seem to be avoiding my actual point, which is that the Russian Orthodox Church heirarchy as it is being used by the Russian government is not at all a progressive force. It is being used as a foil against LGBT people, against access to abortion, against free expression, against other faiths, and also as a propaganda tool for Putin's government and his war in Ukraine.

 

 

NDPP

6079_Smith_W wrote:

the Russian Orthodox Church heirarchy as it is being used by the Russian government is not at all a progressive force.

 

unlike the Ukrainian Orthodox Church....?

http://iouc.net/2014/05/19/svoboda-nazis-a-2013-funeral

 

 

 

6079_Smith_W

dp

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