Austerity Coming to Ontario 2

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infracaninophile infracaninophile's picture
Austerity Coming to Ontario 2

 

Continuing from:

http://rabble.ca/babble/ontario/austerity-coming-ontario

 

What do babblers make of this information:

http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/article/1142062--ontario...

 

It seems to explain a lot about the current situation, but doesn't seem to figure (ha ha, pun) largely in the current discussion, whether here or elsewhere AFAIK.

Is there a synergistic effect of the corporate tax policies et al in Ontario and federal strictures that specifically target Ontario?

 

ygtbk

The Ontario government is planning to expand gambling (sorry, gaming) to bring in more revenue:

http://toronto.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20120312/olg-gambling-mod...

I guess that's one way to do it.

Freedom 55

[url=http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ontarios-budget-will-includ... budget will include welfare freeze: McGuinty[/url]

Quote:

Ontario's [...] Liberals are freezing welfare and delaying planned increases to the Ontario Child Benefit in Tuesday's budget to help slay a $16-billion deficit.

Social assistance, which includes Ontario Works and the Ontario Disability Support Program, will be frozen for a year, Premier Dalton McGuinty announced Sunday.

The child benefit was supposed to rise from the current $1,100 a year per child to $1,310 a year in July 2013. Instead, it will be increased more gradually [...] to $1,210 in 2013 and $1,310 in 2014, Mr. McGuinty said.

Fidel

Even more reasons to turf these bought and paid-for Bay Street stooges in Toronto.

ygtbk

The budget is not the Drummond apocalypse some expected, and is set to eliminate the deficit s-l-o-w-l-y, with Ontario's debt reaching almost $300 billion by 2017-2018. See:

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1152626--ontario-bud...

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

So, is the NDP going to prop up the McGuinty government by voting in favour of a legislated wage freeze for public servants?

It certainly looks as if they are giving it serious consideration.

Is there no limit to their treachery?

Freedom 55

Tough shit. I can't afford a freeze to my disability pension at this time

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

It was suggested on P&P that the ONDP can not afford another election at this time.

ETA: Horwath was interviewed on P&P and said she is negotiating on some changes in return for the ONDP's support.

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

Wealthy Ontario people will have to pay for their medications above a certain inclome level??? Holy crap, I didn't know Ontario had Pharmacare. Here in Quebec I pay around $1600.00 a year for Blue Cross Pharmacy coverage, and I'm living on a disability pension.

Michelle

I think the Cons are bluffing, frankly - they have lots of cuts in this budget to satisfy them.  The ONDP should vote against it and call their bluff.  If the ONDP say they're going to vote against, you'll see the Cons finding an excuse to climb down pretty quickly.

I think the Conservatives are saying they're going to vote against it just to scare the ONDP into voting for it, and that way they can tell their base they tried to defeat the Liberals but the ONDP propped them up.  But the Cons don't want another election any more than the ONDP does.  The ONDP shouldn't be fooled by it.  They should stand on principle - or at least get some concessions on the welfare and wage freeze if they're going to support it.

People on welfare get something like $565 per month.  Surely the ONDP couldn't possibly support such a budget.

infracaninophile infracaninophile's picture

With the steady rise in popularity of the NDP, it might be that the ONDP is the *only* party that can afford to go to the polls. 

I think Michelle nailed it. Hudak would lose seats in all probability. He came out of the last election looking like a loser -- and a stupid loser to boot -- and nothing has happened since to burnish his emage.  The Libs don't want an election -- they would be facing an army of canvassers and election helpers (likely working for the NDP) from the ranks of teachers, nurses, and other public sector employees. How would going from a "major minority" to a rump minority suit them?

Yes, by all means call their bluff. BOTH their bluffs.

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

That makes sense Michelle - yeah, let the Cons wear the stigma of topping up this budget.

 

ETA: Welfare in Ontario is just $565.00 a month? Wow, that's a disgrace.

Life, the unive...

I wonder if the members of the Working Family Coalition would like their money back?

Life, the unive...

infracaninophile wrote:

With the steady rise in popularity of the NDP, it might be that the ONDP is the *only* party that can afford to go to the polls. 

I think Michelle nailed it. Hudak would lose seats in all probability. He came out of the last election looking like a loser -- and a stupid loser to boot -- and nothing has happened since to burnish his emage.  The Libs don't want an election -- they would be facing an army of canvassers and election helpers (likely working for the NDP) from the ranks of teachers, nurses, and other public sector employees. How would going from a "major minority" to a rump minority suit them?

Yes, by all means call their bluff. BOTH their bluffs.

I doubt it that the NDP could 'afford' to go to the polls so soon after the last election and a federal leadership campaign sucking up a lot of the available cash.  Elections are cheap, so if you want one you better make a donation asap.

I also don't think people would support an election and we might just end up with a Hudak government.   Would that be any better?  

I think what the NDP needs to do is to work with civil society groups and unions to put pressure on the government that has been pretending to be their friend all this time- until it came down to a decision between their corporate friends and those they fooled into believing thier rhetoric to become government.  McGuinty, despite specifically being voted into government to go down a different road is blaring down the Mike Harris Way.

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

Really astonishing how much debt Ontario and Quebec have gotten themselves into. Since it's been proven corporate tax breaks don't do fuck all in the way of job creation, why not reverse them and tax the shit of those greedy bastards and gain some revenue for the province?

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

It's pretty obvious from the following item on the NDP website that the NDP desperately wants to vote for this piece of shit neoliberal budget.

Quote:
Budget falls short on challenges facing families: Horwath

TORONTO – New Democrat Leader Andrea Horwath says that the budget falls short on the challenges facing families but says New Democrats will be talking to Ontario families about the McGuinty Liberal Budget tabled today.

“For families worried about their jobs, their health and the growing cost of living this Budget falls short. [b]We’re going to be listening to the everyday people who will be affected by the Budget[/b] and we’ll be putting their interests first in the days ahead,” said Horwath. [b]“We’re committed to making this minority government work as long as it provides results for people.”[/b]

For families focused on jobs, healthcare and the growing cost of everyday life, this Budget fails on key fronts. It lacks a plan to target tax relief to real job creators and will lead to the direct layoff of thousands of people in communities across Ontario. The budget does not make investments in home care, or outline a plan to control the growing costs of everyday essentials like electricity.

Horwath noted that the Budget has acknowledged New Democrat concerns about continuing with corporate tax giveaways.

“The government seems to be finally admitting that no-strings-attached corporate tax giveaways aren’t creating jobs,” said Horwath. “Unfortunately, the province has already blown billions on these handouts and plans to do more as soon as we have the money.”

The NDP Leader said she and her caucus would be [b]consulting families[/b] affected by the Budget.

“Ultimately, it’s up to Dalton McGuinty to decide whether he wants to make a minority government work or force an election. Our plan is to put people first,” said Horwath.

Posted on March 27, 2012.

Consulting families? Whom the fuck do they think they're kidding?

Horwath obviously has no intention of standing up for public service workers.

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

FFS. If the NDP votes for a budget that freezes the poorest people in the province, while NOT freezing others, I'm just about done.

This is disgaceful to even be talked about and not worthy of debate. Our society is full of wild animals.

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

M. Spector wrote:

Consulting families? Whom the fuck do they think they're kidding?

Horwath obviously has no intention of standing up for public service workers.

Fuck the workers. Appeal to the lowest common denominator. Won't you think of the children?

janfromthebruce

You know I'm hoping that the ONDP can work out a compromise with the libs here - seriously. The cons are so stupid that they would pull the plug on the Libs and go to election because they want to defeat the govt. And looking around, I think they would have a easier time of defeating the Libs than many on here think.

People would not give the NDP govt. With cons, they would slash and burn and people who are poor, on disability, low wage and so on would get the Harris type govt - really  is that what you want? I know you don't.

I don't like what is in this budget and when I look at the ed cuts part, I am dismayed. So they will again (for instance) amalgamate school boards in declining population and decling boards and create huge geographic boards. But they will not force catholic and public boards who share the same geo areas and compete for the same student population to come together. Why do what is in the best interest of all students when you can "play politics". Crap

 

Freedom 55

And it goes beyond just a freeze on shelter and basic needs allowances for OW and ODSP recipients.

Quote:

Norman was also shocked at the budget’s plan next January to eliminate two benefits that help people on welfare with urgent housing-related expenses once every 24 months. The community start-up and maintenance benefit covers expenses such as the cost of replacing a bed-bug-infested mattress or moving. The home repair benefit pays for emergency plumbing, roof patching and damage due to fire or flooding.

Quote:

In addition, the budget is also capping health-related discretionary benefits for adults on Ontario Works, which pays for things like funerals, glasses and emergency dental care.

[url=http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/politics/article/1152810--ontario-bud... rate freeze really a cut, activists say[/url]

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

Here we go again..fuck...that's how we balance budgets now..on the backs of those least fortunate. I'll never go back to religion but Jesus said it best,

“I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.” Matthew 19:23-24"

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

I don't care about politics right now. If the ONDP doesn't fight this, they've lost my respect. They CAN'T vote for this. But then Jan's right, it would likely lead to a Hudak Horror. Did I say FUCK? Progress isn't as fast as we want but we need solidarity and more organizing. To all the sisters and brothers working hard, I salute you, we're getting there.

:)

Trying to regain positivity.

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..no one should be relying on the ndp to pull our asses out of this global fire. our children are showing us the way.
Students occupy Premier's Ottawa office

On the eve of the provincial budget, students occupied Premier Dalton McGuinty's Ottawa South Constituency office for about an hour to protest rising tuition.

"They basically just walked in as anybody is able to do and decided they were going to take over the space as an act of occupation against the rise in tuition fees," said a spokesperson for the protesters, Taiva Tegler.

The students held a banner that says "drop fees" and remained in the office for about an hour before police ushered them outside.

When eight more people went back into the office, they were promptly arrested and charged, said Tegler.

The students released a list of demands they want in the Ontario budget:

•    An immediate implementation of a 30 per cent tuition fee reduction for all students
•    The creation of a provincial aboriginal post secondary education access strategy, produced jointly with aboriginal student representatives
•    A re-establishment of graduate post-residency fees and all cut research funding  
•    The extending of OSAP eligibility to part-time students
•    An improvement to Ontario’s last-place student-faculty ratio by hiring more tenure-track professors  

http://www.metronews.ca/ottawa/local/article/1134892--students-occupy-pr...

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

Thanks epaulo13. You're good at finding good news. I wish more of it came in the daily fishwrap we pass around at the office. :(

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..txs rp. i love the internet! Laughing

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

OFL:ONTARIO BUDGET DELIVERS BILLIONS TO BANKERS BUT JOB LOSS AND DEEP CUTS FOR ONTARIO FAMILIES

(TORONTO, ON.) -- Today, the McGuinty government delivered two budgets to the province: a lucrative one for corporations and the financial sector and another full of deep cuts to core services for everyone else. McGuinty’s stubborn refusal to increase provincial revenue through the fair taxation of banks and corporations will cost many their jobs and many more their livelihoods.

“McGuinty hasn’t given us a balanced budget, he’s given us a banker’s budget. It was drafted by a banker, for bankers, so it is no surprise that this budget shields the financial and private sector from sharing the burden of a deficit they helped to create,” said OFL President Sid Ryan. “Simply rolling corporate tax cuts back by 1.5 percent would generate enough revenue to cancel cuts to social assistance and increase the income of recipients by 25 percent. Instead of looking for fair measures to generate revenue, McGuinty is asking the most vulnerable to make greater sacrifices.”...

http://ofl.ca/index.php/news/index_in/oflontario_budget_delivers_billion...

quote:

Since McGuinty is ignoring the electorate, we will take our demands directly to Queen’s Park. Over 60 labour unions and community groups have already pledged to challenge McGuinty’s agenda of cuts in a mass rally at Queen’s Park on April 21.”

NDPP

"Even as NDP and union officials were gathering in Toronto for the leadership convention that accompanied the cross-Canada electronic vote, the Ontario NDP was involved in secret discussions with the Ontario Liberal government on a deal to secure passage of a provincial budget that will slash billions in social spending and impose real wage cuts on public sector workers..."

NDP Picks Ex-Liberal Minister As Federal Party Leader

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/mar2012/ndpc-m27.shtml

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

You are needed more than ever NDPP. Thank you for the real NewZ!

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

If the NDP is going to form the next federal government in three years' time, it will need to win big in Ontario.

The provincial NDP has a big role to play in preparing for that eventuality, by boosting its support in the provincial Legislature. This is no time for the party to be shying away from elections! It has to take every opportunity to put itself out there as an alternative and to get its message out.

If the provincial NDP gives up on being able to win Ontario away from Tim Hudak and his Mike Harris/Stephen Harper/Preston Manning co-thinkers, the federal party can kiss the 2015 federal election goodbye right now.

janfromthebruce

RevolutionPlease wrote:
I don't care about politics right now. If the ONDP doesn't fight this, they've lost my respect. They CAN'T vote for this. But then Jan's right, it would likely lead to a Hudak Horror. Did I say FUCK? Progress isn't as fast as we want but we need solidarity and more organizing. To all the sisters and brothers working hard, I salute you, we're getting there. :) Trying to regain positivity.
______________________________________________________________________________________ Our kids live together and play together in their communities, let's have them learn together too!

 

humming solidarity forever and drinking my early morning coffee. Not happy and know it's going to be hard on those who are vulnerable. I'm actually disgusted because this is all caused by lack of revenue coming into the treasury - oh, perhaps corporate taxcuts doesn't mean we all are better off, oh, when corporations leave town for cheap labour it doesn't help us, and corporations and financial sector screw up and screw with the fake money economy, the people on the streets always are the ones who pay for it.

janfromthebruce

M. Spector, I try to live by the "Art of Warfare" - which is don't go to war unless you have to. Think of the election as war. Money wasted where the outcome would not be pretty. Hudak would have a simple message easy for the press to write about and people to understand. The comfortable would vote, the uncomfortable are busy keeping their heads above water, and not vote.

I'm sorry but Andrea needs to show her negotiation skills here - let's see what she can get first.

 

If you think that we are ready for an election you are so wrong.

Fidel

We could all wear corsets and button our coats to the neck and hold our breaths.  

Doug

It's pretty unlikely that the ONDP is ready for an election at this point. With so much going on federally, provincial fundraising has to have taken a hit and there's still any money borrowed for the last election to worry about. 

There's a wider context involved as well. Let's say the NDP does trigger a new election and amazingly enough, wins. Next year's NDP budget will contain...much the same. Different in details, perhaps, maybe with an attempt to negotiate rather than impose a wage freeze but the big picture will be the same, because the big picture is driven by the economy of Ontario which is not doing very well. 

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

Why would the provincial NDP, if they won a next election, keep corporate tax cuts, Doug? Horwath has spoken out against these for a while.

Fidel

M. Spector wrote:
If the provincial NDP gives up on being able to win Ontario away from Tim Hudak and his Mike Harris/Stephen Harper/Preston Manning co-thinkers, the federal party can kiss the 2015 federal election goodbye right now.

Since when it is a rule that Ontario voters elect the exact same wing of the Bay Street property party federally as provincially? It's rarely if ever the case. 

The general wisdom for Ontario voters is that they typically vote Liberal(or Conservative) federally and the complete opposite when it comes to provincial government in hopes of playing one against the other and receiving more as a result. 

And today instead of receiving more from either of the austerity parties, Ontarians are receiving a lot less hence the shitty voter turnouts and 22% of eligible voters handing them 126% of political power at Queen's Perk up to the last election. Now instead of Pinocchio's Bay Street boys wielding all of the power, they have to share it with the other wing of the exact same austerity party. As a result, things are completely different in Ontario. 

 

Life, the unive...

NDPP wrote:

"Even as NDP and union officials were gathering in Toronto for the leadership convention that accompanied the cross-Canada electronic vote, the Ontario NDP was involved in secret discussions with the Ontario Liberal government on a deal to secure passage of a provincial budget that will slash billions in social spending and impose real wage cuts on public sector workers..."

NDP Picks Ex-Liberal Minister As Federal Party Leader

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/mar2012/ndpc-m27.shtml

If these were secret discussions as the World Socialist Website claims, how did they find out about it.  Doesn't that immediately suggest they weren't secret, or that someone is just making shit up.  Parties talk all the time about all things behind the scene- you can put the grand conspiracies in the shit recepticle I suspect.

Life, the unive...

Doug wrote:

It's pretty unlikely that the ONDP is ready for an election at this point. With so much going on federally, provincial fundraising has to have taken a hit and there's still any money borrowed for the last election to worry about. 

There's a wider context involved as well. Let's say the NDP does trigger a new election and amazingly enough, wins. Next year's NDP budget will contain...much the same. Different in details, perhaps, maybe with an attempt to negotiate rather than impose a wage freeze but the big picture will be the same, because the big picture is driven by the economy of Ontario which is not doing very well. 

I think you doses of economic reality are usually right on the mark.  I don't think this one is dead centre though.  The ONDP could create some room for itself through even a minor rollback of the corporate tax rate.  It would still mean that there would have to be some belt tightening in some areas- oh say like quasi-private sector sweetheart deals like ORNGE and E-Health, but the depth and kind of cuts and more importantly their impact could be significantly different.  That's assuming a Horwath NDP wouldn't pull a Rae.

IF, and it is a big IF for me at this point, Horwath supports this budget as is, one has to wonder why even have an Ontario NDP in the first place.  Say why you can't support it and let the chips fall where they may.  Sometimes you have to have the courage of your convictions.  But we too will have to and really get behind a fundraising effort to ensure the ONDP can actually mount a campaign.

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Fidel wrote:

Since when it is a rule that Ontario voters elect the exact same wing of the Bay Street property party federally as provincially? It's rarely if ever the case.

OK, what's your plan for winning Ontario voters away from the Conservatives and the Liberals in the next 3 years? Do you seriously imagine that masses of Ontario voters are suddenly going to vote NDP in 2015 federally while supporting Tim Hudak and Dalton McGuilty provincially? If they like the Ontario Conservatives (which seems to be what's terrorizing Andra Horwath these days) what's not to like about S. Harper?

When do we actually get to explain to Ontario voters that "playing off" provincial Liberals against federal Conservatives is a recipe for disaster?

Brachina

Even if Andrea decides to go to an election, negiotating in good faith is good optics.

Look Andrea is in an akward position, go to an election and risk a Hudak or Dalton Majority where she can't blunt thier actions or support some stuff she doesn't like in exchange for some concessions.

Right now Dalton appears to be willing to make concessions on executive salaries and maybe an raise for the little guys could be made from this along with cutting tax credits and loop holes.

Lets wait and see how this plays out before deciding.

Life, the unive...

Just saw this posted on facebook by our local NDP guru -  he is encouraging people to be blunt with the party.  Goddess I respect him-    http://www.ondpcaucus.com/yoursay/  

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Brachina wrote:
Right now Dalton appears to be willing to make concessions on executive salaries and maybe an raise for the little guys could be made from this along with cutting tax credits and loop holes.

Don't be fooled by McGuilty's offer to let the NDP buy into the austerity agenda by tinkering with minor details. At best he is prepared to make small concessions to secure NDP support. The NDP is going to end up wearing this austerity budget like a cheap suit with minor alterations to the cuffs.

Then there will be no voice in the Legislature to speak up for the rights of labour or to demand that ordinary Ontarians not be made to pay for Bay Street's plunder of the economy.

This is where Koalition politics, driven by fear of the Conservatives, logically takes you.

Boom Boom Boom Boom's picture

If an election is forced over the budget, there's a chance Ontario voters will punish severely those who forced the election - namely the ONDP and the PCs.

Life, the unive...

Most likely it will be the Liberals, for the budget and the NDP for 'causing' the election.  Sadly the PCs will likely get a pass.  This is the sad state of politics in Ontario right now.   

Fidel

M. Spector wrote:

Fidel wrote:

Since when it is a rule that Ontario voters elect the exact same wing of the Bay Street property party federally as provincially? It's rarely if ever the case.

OK, what's your plan for winning Ontario voters away from the Conservatives and the Liberals in the next 3 years? Do you seriously imagine that masses of Ontario voters are suddenly going to vote NDP in 2015 federally while supporting Tim Hudak and Dalton McGuilty provincially? If they like the Ontario Conservatives (which seems to be what's terrorizing Andra Horwath these days) what's not to like about S. Harper?

When do we actually get to explain to Ontario voters that "playing off" provincial Liberals against federal Conservatives is a recipe for disaster?

I'm not so concerned about the NDP winning in Ontario. It's scorched earth for the next government.

My hopes are that with provincial attacks on public service workers, teachers and unions, and the poor and the newly-made poor, a phony majority of them in Ontario will do what they did in 1990 elections and vote NDP federally. And the federal NDP will help them over the edge with electioneering between now and 2015. 

The Harpers are not invincible and are quite beatable actually. They currently have 24% of the eligible vote under them and are hoping that Ontario voters won't be waking up by 2015. And it's the federal NDP's job to wake them from their long slumber. Mulcair says he will focus on what's important to Canadians, the economy.

I think this is Harper's soft underbelly, and Mulcair is just the kind of vicious attack dog that we need to exploit this weakness. NAFTA will not save the Harpers. A non-existent U.S. economic recovery will not save the Harpers. Tax cuts for profitable corporations already sitting on piles of cash will not save the Harpers.

In fact, the Harpers will not be saved.

epaulo13 epaulo13's picture

..this is a political struggle not an economic one. for years it was fine to accumulate debt so said the politicals and all of a sudden across canada it's a crisis? if anything we can take from the struggles in greece is that debt and austerity are vehicles to transfer wealthe to the 1%. the priority is coming together and organizing to defeating these measures. this is not about electing the ndp.

Mask comes off with Greece crisis — Naomi Klein

video

As happened in South Korea, speculators use disaster to lock in security for themselves.

February 13, 2012: Naomi Klein, the Canadian international best-selling journalist, book author and privatization critic, is interviewed about the Greek crisis in a clip from the forthcoming documentary Catastroika: Privatization goes public, featured on the website Greek Left Review.

Klein charges that "this whole neo-liberal project has been all about hollowing out democracy."

She says the Greek crisis reminds her "of what South Korea went through during the economic crisis" there. "You had a very explicit war with democracy," she says. With Greece, "This has been one of the moments when the mask completely comes off... Greece is portrayed as a nation of children that needs to have the keys to the car taken away."

http://www.publicvalues.ca/ViewArticle.cfm?Ref=001170

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Fidel wrote:

I'm not so concerned about the NDP winning in Ontario. It's scorched earth for the next government.

My hopes are that with provincial attacks on public service workers, teachers and unions, and the poor and the newly-made poor, a phony majority of them in Ontario will do what they did in 1990 elections and vote NDP federally.

Good luck with that, if the provincial NDP gives its blessing to the "provincial attacks on public service workers, teachers and unions, and the poor and the newly-made poor". The voters aren't that stupid.

The only "phony majority" in Ontario will be the Liberal-NDP Koalition government.

Quote:
The Harpers are not invincible and are quite beatable actually.

Right. It's the Hudaks we have to be terrified of... [img]http://i32.tinypic.com/oi5aw2.jpg[/img]

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

epaulo13 wrote:

if anything we can take from the struggles in greece is that debt and austerity are vehicles to transfer wealthe to the 1%. the priority is coming together and organizing to defeating these measures.

Exactly. Unfortunately, it appears the Ontario NDP will be following in the footsteps of their social-democratic colleagues in Greece.

Instead of hailing McGuilty's corporate tax "freeze" at a measly 11.5%, they should be calling for - at the very least - a return to the paltry 14% corporate tax rate that applied less than two years ago. Sid Ryan says such a modest step "could balance the books without job loss or cuts to services". 

 

Brachina

Andrea's.giving you a chance to have your say, so if you want her to go to war over this, then that is what you tell her.

I think this is a cleaver move on her part. It will put huge pressure on Dalton and if she does vote against the budget it will be because she has the mandate to do so. The next election could have the question as do you want austerity or higher corporate taxes.

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Boom Boom wrote:

If an election is forced over the budget, there's a chance Ontario voters will punish severely those who forced the election - namely the ONDP and the PCs.

If an election is forced over the budget the voters will have a chance to vote either for or against austerity. Should we be deprived of that chance to actually make a democratic choice, or should we capitulate to the agenda of the One Percent? Should we fear the voters and our ability to present an alternative vision, and arrange things so that we have as little democracy as possible?

 

Maysie Maysie's picture

I got an email from the ONDP asking for my thoughts on the budget, and asking me to answer a few questions. I did, and posted them in a note on Facebook, and wanted to share it here. 

Quote:

I just received a disturbing email from the Ontario NDP asking for my input into the budget just proposed by the Liberals.

The texts reads as full of fear, and the leading questions are absolute bullshit.

The following is my response, verbatim, and the questions.

If you get this email asking for input, please complete it and let the Ontario NDP know that you want them to show leadership, not cowardice, in the face of this horrific budget.

............
Question 1:
Do you like the budget introduced by the McGuinty government last Tuesday? What do you like about the budget?

No, and nothing

Question 2:What do you dislike about the budget introduced by the McGuinty government?


Corporate income taxes should be increased. Low and middle income earners should not support corporate tax cuts. Any cuts to health care are unacceptable, since more services are needed, not less. Freezing the wages of public sector employees is a very bad idea. How about freeze or cut the wages of executive compensation at all government agencies? This budget is a conservative budget, it doesn't matter that the Liberals delivered it. Ontario NDP, please reject the budget, force them to re-do it, with the most vulnerable at the centre. Please be a true leader.

Question 3:


Voting against the budget may force Ontario into an election. Would you support an election at this time?

[ ] No, I wouldn't support going to an election
[x] I don't know either way
[ ]Yes, I support calling an election

The idea that voting against the budget may force an election is bull, sorry.

Shame on you.

Your poll is flawed and it's a false choice meant to scare people. It's as if you believe the hype that the mainstream says about passing a budget. Don't fall for it.

Put a better spin on it: How about the NDP says something like "This budget is unacceptable to people and families who are struggling in Ontario. Put people's needs at the centre, not the needs of the privileged. Go back and fix this. Do community consultations, don't let corporations run the province."

Ontario NDP, we already have a Liberal party, who acts just like the Tories. Please stand up for social justice. I've voted NDP my entire adult life which is close to 30 years. This poll sounds like a Liberal party hack wrote it. Remember the grassroots, remember your base.

Maysie, March 28, 2012

Have Your Say

Fidel

M. Spector wrote:
Good luck with that, if the provincial NDP gives its blessing to the "provincial attacks on public service workers, teachers and unions, and the poor and the newly-made poor". The voters aren't that stupid.

The only "phony majority" in Ontario will be the Liberal-NDP Koalition government.

As much as Pinocchio would surely like to lay blame on the third party NDP for his excellent record in power for bankrupting Ontario with Hudak promising even more of the same strangulation of provincial economy and social spending, I don't think it's on.

Quote:

Right. It's the Hudaks we have to be terrified of... [img]http://i32.tinypic.com/oi5aw2.jpg[/img]

Neither Hudak nor Pinocchio will have their names on federal ballots in 2015. They will be Steve and his Harpers running on their economic record while in dictatorial power, which by 2015 will likely be a Mexican pinata for Mulcair and the NDP.

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