Chow for Mayor?

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Stockholm

socialdemocraticmiddle wrote:

I suspect that Liberals would also be thrilled to push out a high-profile NDP MP who won a riding that the Liberals previously dominated.

There is that...but from a Liberal perspective that would be far outweighed by their being less than thrilled at the notion of an NDP icon being mayor of Canada's largest city.

Aristotleded24

Stockholm wrote:
socialdemocraticmiddle wrote:

I suspect that Liberals would also be thrilled to push out a high-profile NDP MP who won a riding that the Liberals previously dominated.

There is that...but from a Liberal perspective that would be far outweighed by their being less than thrilled at the notion of an NDP icon being mayor of Canada's largest city.

She'd aslo be in a much stronger position than David Miller was, because Miller's coalition included Liberals and this is why he was not very critical of their mis-steps in the region. Olivia can run and win on her own, which means she's not beholden to the Liberals that way.

Stockholm

In fact, I suspect that when and if Olivia Chow announces she is running for mayor - she may have more high profile "red Tories" supporting her than big "L" Liberals - because so many Liberals hate the NDP more than they hate Ford.

Polunatic2

I meant to say that Vaughan is a centrist, a "left-Liberal". Thanks for the clarification around Miller's party membership. 

As for the Red Tories, won't they initially line up with someone like Karen Stintz who appears to have her big toe in the water according to today's media reports?

janfromthebruce

Unifor sets out long-term strategy at their convention By H.G. Watson | September 1, 2013

Lastly, MP Olivia Chow made a short surprise appearance in the afternoon. Although she has yet to announce if she plans on running for the mayoral seat in Toronto, Dias made it abundantly clear that he supports her if she does.

snip

Jerry Dias - "a world class city needs a world class mayor." @oliviachow may not yet be campaigning for mayor but Dias is doing it for her.

2:46 PM - 1 Sep 2013

MP @oliviachow addressing the crowd at #unifor pic.twitter.com/ED9f10GrYn

 

NorthReport

Do you really need to even ask?

Uh, don't think so.

Olivia Chow Can Rob Ford catch her?

Toronto mayoral race is NDP politician’s to lose, with polls consistently putting her far ahead of incumbent mayor.

http://www.thestar.com/opinion/columnists/2013/09/18/olivia_chow_can_rob...

NorthReport

 - from Olivia's facebook page and her campaign for sideboards.

Another killed cyclist – rolled over by a truck. Tragedies like this one can and should be avoided. Mandatory side guards on heavy trucks will save lives. That is why I’m renewing my call to the federal government to adopt my private member’s bill and make sideguards mandatory. The EU took this step more than 20 years ago. It’s time that Canada catches up. Read the story here:http://bit.ly/1ahFxw1Cyclist dies of injuries after being struck last week in downtown Torontobit.lyPolice say a female cyclist has died of her injuries after being struck and dragged by a truck in downtown Toronto.

NorthReport

Interesting support.

 

Olivia Chow picks up steam for possible Toronto mayoral run

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/blogs/dailybrew/olivia-chow-picks-steam-possibl...

mark_alfred

Interesting that Smitherman seems to be supporting her.  He's at her booklaunch and just tweeted:

Smitherman wrote:

Excited to be at @oliviachow's book launch! She's a pragmatic progressive who can work with all #topoli #voteto pic.twitter.com/F3IuG4ouiZ


mark_alfred

No official announcement yet, but I'm sure Olivia Chow will run and will be Toronto's next mayor.

lagatta

Obviously Chow is much more progressive than Smitherman, but can you see how much more attractive she would be as a symbol of a modern, creative metropolis than the walking disaster in office there now?

Though she has also been pushing important dossiers such as transport and "urban workers" in Parliament...

scott16

How would John Tory's entrance into the race affect Olivia's chances? Helping or Hurting?

There's a link to the Toronto Star that says John Tory is running in the 2014 Toronto Mayoral election thread.

theleftyinvestor

I'm not sure how much I actually would want Smitherman as an endorser, but he does encompass a certain strategic "Liberals who would be nervous about picking an NDP mayor" vote.

Skinny Dipper

First rule of Fight Club...I mean polls...is that things will likely change over the next eight to nine months.  That means that we should not gauge a winner or loser based upon the current polls.  Based on what I read from the Toronto Star, I don't think John Tory is going to be a clone of Rob Ford, but without the crack and alcohol.  Those who are supporting Olivia Chow should not assume that Tory will be a secondary candidate behind Rob Ford.

Stockholm

You would be surprised how many Ford voters would choose Chow over Tory if they were the only candidates on offer. There is a big chunk of the "Ford vote" that are low income people who respond to populism and many are visible minority people in places like Scarborough. Those people who would not be at all attracted to a blue blood WASP patrician from Rosedale like John Tory and would probably prefer Olivia Chow. That being said, one way or the other Ford will be on the ballot unless he is dead.

DaveW

that is largely true, i think;

one of the great failings of a place like Babble is that people here often think categories like Right and Left have a big following among regular (i.e. non-politicized) people

political affiliation/support is more like a Rorschach projection of things I like  onto  people running for office;

populists right and left are often not that different from each other -- and occasionally even cross over, hence Ford and the lower middle class

Skinny Dipper

It would be interesting if someone could do a cost-benefit analysis on lower income families from all the potential major mayoral candidates.  While it may seem great it Rob Ford can promise low taxes.  If one is poor, the amount of municipal taxes paid directly or indirectly through rent will likely be small anyway.  Low taxes means poor support for transit.  It means paying the full fare for each trip.  It also means that there could be less buses on routes that don't make money which, in turn, hurts lower income families' access to transportation.  Moderate taxes overall would not affect lower income families that much.  They could receive better services from the public.

mark_alfred

I think it would depend upon whether Ford is in the race or not.  If Ford is in, then Chow wins.  If Ford is out, then Tory wins.  Ford's support is right-leaning, and without Ford, some of it would go to Tory, giving him the victory (many of "Ford nation" simply wouldn't vote).  I believe in all scenarios Ford cannot win (IE, if either Chow or Tory or both run, Ford would lose).  He could simply be a spoiler for Tory.

I get that just from past polls I've seen.  However, one really never knows until after the election.

mark_alfred

I speculated that Ford running could split the right-wing vote with Tory, giving Chow the win.  But, some votes could be lost due to "strategic voting" -- IE, those who fear a Ford win turning to Tory rather than Chow.  Hard to say.  Her campaign so far seems to focus on being cooperative and decent.  Someone who can work with others and will be a good role model (unlike Ford).  Seems a good strategy.

adma

I do still think Soknacki's worth monitoring, though.

theleftyinvestor

http://www.thestar.com/opinion/commentary/2014/01/26/olivia_chow_and_the...

Sensing that the core of the Christian message was to “love one’s neighbour as one’s self,” Chow began to ask why her church spent so much time saving souls when saving lives was just as central to the Gospel message.

Chow recalls that if she were to be true to her creed and faithful to Jesus’ promise to bring “good news to the poor,” the vulnerable and marginalized had to be at the foreground, rather than in the background, of her life’s landscape.

In the wake of conservative politicians in North America embracing the “new Christian right” and allying with fundamentalist Christian groups in their campaigns, it might seem odd to some to witness a mainstream, progressive politician talk about her faith in Jesus as a wellspring of her political life.

And yet, given the provenance of the NDP, whose first leader, Tommy Douglas, was a Baptist minister, Chow’s religious convictions are not surprising.

A very interesting article. Many on the left are apprehensive about bringing religion into the public sphere. But perhaps if you're a religious voter in Toronto, you might find Chow more appealing than a foul-mouthed man-child.

Aristotleded24

theleftyinvestor wrote:
http://www.thestar.com/opinion/commentary/2014/01/26/olivia_chow_and_the...

Sensing that the core of the Christian message was to “love one’s neighbour as one’s self,” Chow began to ask why her church spent so much time saving souls when saving lives was just as central to the Gospel message.

Chow recalls that if she were to be true to her creed and faithful to Jesus’ promise to bring “good news to the poor,” the vulnerable and marginalized had to be at the foreground, rather than in the background, of her life’s landscape.

In the wake of conservative politicians in North America embracing the “new Christian right” and allying with fundamentalist Christian groups in their campaigns, it might seem odd to some to witness a mainstream, progressive politician talk about her faith in Jesus as a wellspring of her political life.

And yet, given the provenance of the NDP, whose first leader, Tommy Douglas, was a Baptist minister, Chow’s religious convictions are not surprising.

A very interesting article. Many on the left are apprehensive about bringing religion into the public sphere. But perhaps if you're a religious voter in Toronto, you might find Chow more appealing than a foul-mouthed man-child.

What George Bush and Jack Layton both had in common is that they were deeply motivated by their faith to get into politics. Guess which of these 2 examples is better known. I agree with what was said, and specifically that people like Jack Layton and Olivia Chow need to be more vocal about their faith, both to connect with voters and to dispel the misconceptions that are common about the faithful.

Brachina

 The religious left tends to have the manners and grace not to ru people's faces in there religion, while the religious right uses religion like a spiteful weapon. The religious left is what is best about religion and the religious right is what is worst in religion, all spite and corruption.

Unionist

Aristotleded24 wrote:
I agree with what was said, and specifically that people like Jack Layton and Olivia Chow need to be more vocal about their faith, ...

More vocal about their faith? Really??

PRAISE THE FORD!!!

Aristotleded24

Brachina wrote:
The religious left tends to have the manners and grace not to ru people's faces in there religion, while the religious right uses religion like a spiteful weapon. The religious left is what is best about religion and the religious right is what is worst in religion, all spite and corruption.

People like to hold up the Social Gospel or Martin Luther King as examples on the left end of the political spectrum. However, back then there was a near 100% allegiance to Christianity among the population (at least on some level) so the contemporary challenge is how to speak this language while being inclusive to those of other faiths or those who practice no faith.

NorthReport

WHAT IS STOPPING OLIVIA CHOW FROM RUNNING FOR MAYOR OF TORONTO?

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/video/3119533594001

Caissa

New Democrat MP Olivia Chow will resign her seat in Parliament on Wednesday, as she prepares to launch her formal campaign to become mayor of Toronto, ending months of speculation of whether she would run to replace Rob Ford.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/olivia-chow-to-resign-as-mp-launch-toronto-mayoral-bid-1.2569053

theleftyinvestor

Olivia's purple colour scheme for her campaign echoes the Peggy Nash leadership campaign.

The little jingle song at the end of all her videos sounds vaguely familiar. Was it used in some NDP campaign previously?

Brachina

http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/news/blog.html?b=fullcomment.nationalpo...

 

 Christy is a fucking joke, her criticizing anyone else on journalistic ethics is just insulting coming crom such a nasty rightwing hack. What really upsets her is Chow will be Toronto's next Mayor.

lagatta

I really get the idea that Chow has a very good chance indeed. Her immigrant background should help her in some of the more outlying but also deprived areas of amalgamated Toronto. She would provide such a radically different image of the city and I think she is able to tackle some difficult urban problems.

She'll be missed in Parliament. Both the work on "self-employed" urban workers and a lot of the rail and road safety material we work with here comes from her office.

Unionist

Ok, I understand that Olivia Chow is a [url=http://www.oliviachow.ca/2012/05/lucky-moose-modified-bill-passes-in-hou... supporter[/url] of the right of store-owners to arrest shoplifters after the fact, and I also understand that she has not been seen smoking crack or throwing fits in videos.

Besides that, any expectations for what she might do as mayor?

 

janfromthebruce

New Mayor. Better City.

So easy to access a candidate's website these day. I used google search.

mersh

janfromthebruce wrote:

New Mayor. Better City.

So easy to access a candidate's website these day. I used google search.

 

Well, to be fair, there really isn't much policy there yet. I can infer from the transit blurbs that she opposes the Scarborough stubway (yay!) in favour of a more robust LRT system. So that's a good start. The other pillars of her campaign (jobs and kids) still need to be fleshed out. And yes, I support her.

 

ETA: And I think Unionist has already perused her site, given the reference to the v̶i̶g̶i̶l̶a̶n̶t̶e̶ ̶ Lucky Moose bill.

Unionist

mersh wrote:

Well, to be fair, there really isn't much policy there yet.

Understatement of the century.

Quote:

ETA: And I think Unionist has already perused her site, given the reference to the v̶i̶g̶i̶l̶a̶n̶t̶e̶ ̶ Lucky Moose bill.

Heh, no I hadn't seen it (thanks janfromthebruce for the link!). But we have extensively discussed Olivia Chow's pandering to the tough-on-crime crowd over the years:

For David Chen, the shoplifters keep on coming

Support David Chen

NDP will support Conservative bill allowing greater use of Citizen's Arrest

NDP will support Conservative bill allowing greater use of Citizen's Arrest, Part 2

David Chen unsure new citizen arrest powers will change police attitudes

... to name a few.

I did see Chow's laudatory reference to "small business" on her new site (though I was unable to find any actual statements as to where she stands on issues facing people, other than bragging about how she used to balance budgets with Mel Lastman and saving a billion on shovels or something). I have no doubt she will be reminding folks of her support for vigilante justice.

She was one of the first caucus members to stand up and say that Canadian troops should get out of Afghanistan (when her spouse was still saying, "get out of the combat mission in the south"). I remember that day and praise her for it still. Let's hope she has something positive to offer Toronto, though I'm just a humble observer.

 

 

 

mersh

"humble"? (ducks)Laughing

 

I honestly don't expect too much for leftish folks in this election. There's a race to speak to/for the so-called middle class (although that is arguably a rapidly shrinking target market). Transit will apparently take up a lot of oxygen, but with an emphasis on what won't be used to fund it. Employment might get some meaningful attention (and hopefully be tied to Andrew Cash's work on precarious jobs).But we need to talk a lot more about housing (affordability, not density) and building a city for all residents.

I do think Olivia Chow will offer much more than the other candidates, and will shift some of the debate away from who can occupy the most centre-rightish spot without being stoned. Touch wood.

theleftyinvestor

I think Chow is going to spend the majority of this election in the suburbs. Downtown already knows who she is. Show up for a few adoring crowds, keep her base happy, and then go win over Ford Nation.

If anything, she may be able to sway folks who voted for Ford last time but who are not avowedly right-wing.

jerrym

Unionist wrote:

 I'm just a humble observer. 

Humble? And all these years I thought you were a proud unionist!

CanadaOrangeCat

People with cars who live the suburban lifestyle will not vote for Chow.
They will stay FORD. Too solipsistic and schizoid a mentality to do anything else.

adma

CanadaOrangeCat wrote:

People with cars who live the suburban lifestyle will not vote for Chow.
They will stay FORD. Too solipsistic and schizoid a mentality to do anything else.

Not if Ford's no longer available as a ballot option.

CanadaOrangeCat

The non-conservatives who voted for Ford were Liberals. Ford actively courted Liberals. Liberals are who decide Toronto politics.

That is a fundamental notion in Toronto politics: Can you get Toronto Liberals to vote NDP? If so, Chow is also going to be doing dirty work for her provincial and federal cousins.

Justin wished John Tory good luck, so I don't see anything good coming out of his camp for Chow. The Liberals are going to want to keep the NDP down in Toronto, as it is their core.

theleftyinvestor

CanadaOrangeCat wrote:

People with cars who live the suburban lifestyle will not vote for Chow.
They will stay FORD. Too solipsistic and schizoid a mentality to do anything else.

That's a bit of a overly broad generalization. Not everyone in a suburb with a car is wealthy, and they're not all assholes.

Skinny Dipper

Over in the DRL Facebook group, there are some potential supporters of Olivia Chow who are worried about her lukewarm support for a Downtown Relief (subway) Line.  She needs to clarify her transit priorities so that some progressive supporters won't switch to John Tory because he strongly supports it while Ms. Chow seems unsure.

CanadaOrangeCat

Ford still at 30%. Toronto should be ashamed of itself.

adma

CanadaOrangeCat wrote:

The non-conservatives who voted for Ford were Liberals. Ford actively courted Liberals. Liberals are who decide Toronto politics.

Well, depends which Liberals.  Certainly the Norm Kelly/Peter Milczyn "right-Liberals".  But one can also argue that a few months later, Layton actively courted "Ford populists", Liberals not excluded...

voice of the damned

theleftyinvestor wrote:

CanadaOrangeCat wrote:

People with cars who live the suburban lifestyle will not vote for Chow.
They will stay FORD. Too solipsistic and schizoid a mentality to do anything else.

That's a bit of a overly broad generalization. Not everyone in a suburb with a car is wealthy, and they're not all assholes.

Yes. And my understanding is that some of those Toronto suburbs have numerically strong immigrant communities.

Someone who voluntarily makes a permanent relocation to another country, in fact, a whole different culture in many cases, and learns the language with sufficient proficiency to become a voting citizen, can hardly be labelled solipsistic.

And I won't even begin to speculate about the intended meaning of "schizoid" in that statement.  

theleftyinvestor

voice of the damned wrote:

Yes. And my understanding is that some of those Toronto suburbs have numerically strong immigrant communities.

Someone who voluntarily makes a permanent relocation to another country, in fact, a whole different culture in many cases, and learns the language with sufficient proficiency to become a voting citizen, can hardly be labelled solipsistic.

And I won't even begin to speculate about the intended meaning of "schizoid" in that statement.  

Right, and those immigrant communities played a huge part in Ford's 2010 victory. Chow can relate to their experience even though she didn't grow up in the suburbs, but it will be interesting to see if that translates to any suburban votes for her.

CanadaOrangeCat

Schizoid simply means 'split'. Split from the natural world. Split from the rest of humanity. As Rollo May put it before 1958, "detached, unrelated, lacking in affect, tending toward depersonalization, and covering up their problems by means of intellectualization  and mechanical formulations (Existence 1958)". This is a new psychological profile for the modern individal which is a perfect breeding ground for the Dark Triad and Dark Tetrad, and psychosis of all kinds. 25-30% of the people are mentally ill, and is the mindlessness of the suburban lifestyle going to make them better?

It doesn't matter where in the world you come from. They buy into this solipsistic lifestyle where only they and their family matter to the expense of everyone and everything else in this world. Start spending 5 hours a day in your car, and see how long your mental health lasts.

mark_alfred

Skinny Dipper wrote:

Over in the DRL Facebook group, there are some potential supporters of Olivia Chow who are worried about her lukewarm support for a Downtown Relief (subway) Line.  She needs to clarify her transit priorities so that some progressive supporters won't switch to John Tory because he strongly supports it while Ms. Chow seems unsure.

I don't think the DRL was ever part of the original Transit City.  I think it was proposed due to the perceived shortcomings of the system arising from not building Transit City.  With adequate light rail I suspect it wouldn't be necessary (or at least it wouldn't be a priority).  It's just more subway silliness, in that it will be a very long time before it's built, and it will cost a lot.

mersh

I wouldn't recommend demonizing or pathologizing so-called suburbanites as a viable campaign strategy. I mean, the downtown ward next to mine voted for Ford, too. And I'd say that a good number of the folks in Rexdale who voted for him don't drive SUVs and are more likely to spend five hours on the TTC than in their cars. Ford was an effective populist who could at least appear to speak to people who have been by and large ignored by downtown interests (or at least feel that way). John Tory provides us with a more "rational" image, but it's still going to be all about austerity, not transit.

Brachina

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