Dion era
Sun, 2006-12-03 19:07
#1
Dion era
Sun, 2006-12-03 19:07
#2
Dion's election as leader is a defining moment for rabble.ca. He's the closest to a rabble-rouser ever to get this close to being prime minister. Rabble.ca should promote and support him. Unlikely that CanWest-Global will.
Sun, 2006-12-03 19:14
#3
Dion is a member of Rabble?
Sun, 2006-12-03 19:34
#4
Boom Boom
rab·ble-rous·er (răb'əl-rou'zər)
n. A leader or speaker who stirs up the passions of the masses; a demagogue.
rabblerousing rab'ble-rous'ing adj. & n.
Sun, 2006-12-03 19:37
#5
I don't know that Dion fits Boom Boom's definition either. Does he have a forgotten history as a rabble rouser from his university days?
Mon, 2006-12-04 00:16
#6
quote:
Originally posted by sandpiper:
[b]Does he have a forgotten history as a rabble rouser from his university days?[/b]
[url=http://stephanedion.ca/?q=en/Stephane-About]A professor of public administration:[/url]
quote:
Dion graduated from Universitй Laval with a B.A. in 1977 and an M.A. in 1979, both in political science. In 1986 he received his doctorate in sociology from the Institut d'йtudes politiques in Paris.Before entering politics, Dion taught public administration and political science at the Universitй de Montrйal from 1984 to 1996 and authored numerous books and scientific articles. He lectured at the Universitй de Moncton in 1984, was a visiting professor at the Brookings Institution in Washington, at the Laboratoire d'йconomie politique in Paris and at the Canadian Centre for Management Development in Ottawa.
[url=http://stephanedion.ca/?q=en/Stephane-Media-061125Comprimise]Dion actually became involved in the national unity issue as an afterthought:[/url]
quote:
"My academic expertise was actually in public administration, — people forget that," he says.As the Meech Lake accord foundered on the shoals of provincial opposition, Dion was watching from a safe distance in Washington, where he was a visiting scholar at the Brookings Institution.
One of the staple anecdotes told by current and former Dion collaborators concerns a meeting soon after he arrived in Ottawa.
At that meeting, his advisers broached the subject of a makeover — seemingly an inevitable discussion for every policy wonk who wins election to the Commons — and suggested he learn to loosen up in public.
"This is as loose as it gets," ramrod straight Dion told them. "Deal with it."
[url=http://www.forces.gc.ca/admpol/content.asp?id=%7BC4B8910E-65BE-4386-9665... Security and Defence Forum funds twelve centres of expertise and one Chair of Defence Management Studies at universities across Canada:[/url]
quote:
Professors affiliated to the International Peace and Security Program, from other universitiesJanine Krieber
Professor, Collиge militaire royal, Campus Fort Saint-Jean
- Politics and sociology
Some rabble-rousers. [img]wink.gif" border="0[/img]
Mon, 2006-12-04 01:03
#7
Cueball
Your just scared that Dion as a Liberal is likely to crush the NDP. You should be scared. Making Dion their leader indicates that the primary target of the Liberals is not the CPC, but the Green Party and the NDP. 6% off the NDP tally will be enough.
Mon, 2006-12-04 07:22
#8
Lard Tunderin Jeezus
According to Chantal Hebert in today's Star, the Liberals would have chosen Bob Rae if the NDP was their primary target. I'm not Chantal's biggest fan, but I'm not in agreement with your analysis either.
I find the most interesting thing about Mr. Dion is his past with the Institut d'Etudes Politiques in France. This Grand Ecole is the elite training ground for European politicos. Its graduates include both the current prime minister and president of France. I came to understand its importance reading [url=http://www.nadeaubarlow.com/books/view/1]Sixty Million Frenchmen Can't Be Wrong[/url] during my summer holiday.
I doubt Mr. Dion sees many limits on what government can capably accomplish. In this, he is the anti-Harper.
I also see him as less Trudeau, and more Pearsonian in his approach. He is thoroughly a professional of political administration; someone with an understanding of exactly what it will take to successfully implement policy. I'm guardedly optimistic about the future for the first time in a long time.
The real key, to my mind, is to maintain some pressure on the left to keep the Liberals on track.
Mon, 2006-12-04 08:29
#9
Catchfire
I'm inclined to agree with Cueball here. Dion stole whole hog the NDPs biggest issue—the environment. In fact, he didn't really even steal it, since he's been touting it all along. Almost all of the NDP's other policies are simply trying to get the Liberals to enact their own promises: Kelowna, child care, housing projects etc. This does not bode well for the Dippers. Olivia Chow was on The Current this morning and the best dig she could get was that Dion was in the cabinets responsible for the Sponsorship Scandal. Even the Bloc candidate agreed that Dion is known for his integrity and such an accusation would never stick.
Why vote for the Green Party (well, why anyway) when a party with a chance at governing has almost as strong an environmental platform?
Mon, 2006-12-04 09:10
#10
Dion is largely unknown outside Quebec.
When Canadians hear about his ideas on:
Private health care ("I will allow any private practices that made sense to Canadians to have better access to the service")
Nukes in the tar sands ("I wouldn't close the door to it")
Federation ("'Are we too decentralized?' I do not think so.")
... they will be not too impressed.
Mon, 2006-12-04 09:23
#11
as for Dion "stealing" the environment issue from the NDP, well the Cons and the NDP have pointed out at any opportunity since Dion's victory that he was the Liberal Environment Minister during the time Kyoto targets were to be met and they went up 30%. not a very defensible record is it? And it isn't the Liberal, with Dion as an MP, who forced the Cons "Clean Air Act" into committe for a full rewrite was it? no.
I am happy neither Ignatieff or Rae won. I think the jury is still out on Dion, but i don't think he will have a hard time beating Harper for a minority. He isn't attached to the sponsorship scandal directly, so it will likely be a stretch to try and hammer him on that in the minds of voters, but he has a weak spot on the environment which he considers a strength. And he is after all a neo-liberal economic policy guy, so he has a chance to win back the fiscal conservative liberal swing voters (the 6% over the Cons 30% base) that gave Harper his minority.
I'm not sure how a Dion victory will play out for the NDP but it certainly doesn't "scare" me or likely anyone else in the party. He is Liberal establishment through and through, and i expect he will campaign strongly on the environment and reversal of the cuts to social policy and programming that the Cons have done, but will still be to the right in actual practice and do nothing to IMPROVE these files. The NDP just has to keep plugging away as an opppostition party should, pointing out good and bad legislation and offering intelligent ammendments to the bad, adn proposing solid alternatives to things we don't like, as was done with the Clean Air act. not too sexy. but that is not the goal here, effective policy for the public good is.
Mon, 2006-12-04 10:42
#12
Boom Boom
Dion was appointed environment minister in July 2004 - for a year and a half. He released the Green Paper, and chaired the Montreal Protocol. Not a bad start. Governments also face making environmental policy given the reality that
something like 20% of our GDP in Canada is in the hands of the big polluters, versus about 10% in the USA, so our two situations are not identical, and there probably are no short-term solutions. I think Dion, [i]if[/i] the Libs win the next election, will have a mandate to put into action his three pillars: strong economy, social justice, and sustainable environmental policy. I hope he becomes PM, and he is able to work towards his goals.
Mon, 2006-12-04 12:06
#13
remind
quote:
Originally posted by farnival:
[b]I'm not sure how a Dion victory will play out for the NDP...He is Liberal establishment through and through, and i expect he will campaign strongly on the environment and reversal of the cuts to social policy and programming that the Cons have done, but will still be to the right in actual practice and do nothing to IMPROVE these files.[/b]
After his caucus meeting he immediately took aim at his target:
quote:
he pulled no punches when comparing the party now under his lead and the minority government he will face in the House of Commons on Monday afternoon.“Canadians will have to choose two clear visions of the path that our country must take at the beginning of this century,” Mr. Dion said.
That choice, he said, was between “the very right-wing party who thinks that the United States is not only an ally for us, but also a model, or the party that want to preserve always the independent voice of Canada in the world.”
[url=http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20061204.wdioncaucus1...'s First Comments as Opposition Leader[/url]
Mon, 2006-12-04 13:20
#14
The Gandalf group had this to say about Dion in Quebec:
"Stephane Dion’scampaign looks completely different in Quebec than in the rest of Canada
In Quebec, where there has been speculation that his negatives are unacceptably high, only 38% of voters are certain not to vote Liberal if he is leader –a number in line
with or better than any of the other candidates
31% of Quebecers say that they are certain or likely to vote Liberal if he is leader, an eye popping number for a Party currently at 20% in Quebec
On the other hand, the “certain nots”are high elsewhere in the country and his profile is low
He appears to have strong potential to erode the BQ vote, but little potential to cut into NDP or Conservative support"
Could this be David Herle working to elect Dion?
Mon, 2006-12-04 13:42
#15
Boom Boom
Regardless, I hope Dion wins big in the next election, and he is able to implement the three pillars of what he sees as imperative for the 21st century: a strong economy, social justice, and sustainable environmental policies. And I hope Dion is elected PM without any backroom shenanigans - we've had enough of that, and, imo, Dion's election as LPC leader is evidence that the Libs will be heading in a new direction. Rose-coloured glasses, maybe, but I'm willing to give the guy a chance.
Mon, 2006-12-04 13:45
#16
Catchfire
quote:
[b]Originally posted by Boom Boom:[/b]
I hope Dion wins big in the next election, and he is able to implement the three pillars of what he sees as imperative for the 21st century: a strong economy, social justice, and sustainable environmental policies.
See, this is why they should have elected Ignatieff. While Dion only had three pillars for a policy foundation, Iggy had [i]four corners.[/i] I don't remember what they were, but four is [i]definitely[/i] better than three.
Mon, 2006-12-04 13:48
#17
remind
quote:
Originally posted by Boom Boom:
[b]And I hope Dion is elected PM without any backroom shenanigans - we've had enough of that,.[/b]
Hmph, i would say that that is an impossibility as most likely it has already happened!
quote:
[b] and, imo, Dion's election as LPC leader is evidence that the Libs will be heading in a new direction..[/b]
How can they be, he is an appointee originally, and he is part of the old Liberal government?
quote:
[b] Rose-coloured glasses, maybe, but I'm willing to give the guy a chance.[/b]
Not me! And I think not only are ya wearing rose coloured glasses they need cleaning too!
Mon, 2006-12-04 13:51
#18
Boom Boom
Dion won with Kennedy's support. The back room guys were trying to get Rae and Iggy elected. Dion is the new face of the Liberals, and he'll re-invent the party. Clean the muck of your glasses, remind. [img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img]
Mon, 2006-12-04 15:57
#19
Cueball
quote:
Originally posted by Lard Tunderin' Jeezus:
[b]According to Chantal Hebert in today's Star, the Liberals would have chosen Bob Rae if the NDP was their primary target. I'm not Chantal's biggest fan, but I'm not in agreement with your analysis either.[/b]
Yes, I considered this but this time the perspicacious Hebert is wrong. She is a Liberal after all, so she has no sense of the stigma Rae has among the left. He might be able to "talk" "leftishly," but I think it would be hard for him to deliver. And one thing about Rae, however bad he may look in the eyes of centerfield and right wing voters, it isn't [i]personal[/i] for them. But on the left it is personal and people are extremely turned off by him. The labour movement hates him, NDP stalwarts consider him a traitor, so it would be an uphill climb grabbing the left vote, but with Dion, he is at least as "leftish" as Rae, and has none of that baggage with the left.
And we can be sure that with Dion they are not going to be targetting the right. He certainly isn't going to sell with the right. Mo. they want to grab some Green votes and some NDP votes, based on the principle that the Tory vote will not move.
Even, if not intentional it is the only election strategy now.
[ 04 December 2006: Message edited by: Cueball ]
Mon, 2006-12-04 16:17
#20
remind
quote:
Originally posted by Boom Boom:
[b]Dion is the new face of the Liberals, and he'll re-invent the party.[/b]
New face same as the old face, there's nothing new in having Dion leader of the Liberals!
Everytime I watched Dion at the leadership convention, after he won, Chretien was at his side!
Mon, 2006-12-04 16:58
#21
Boom Boom
They're friends. Something wrong wit dat? [img]tongue.gif" border="0[/img]
Mon, 2006-12-04 18:57
#22
remind
quote:
Originally posted by Boom Boom:
[b]They're friends. Something wrong wit dat? [/b]
The optics say much and so does the fact of it say new face = old face.
Nope nothing wrong with it, just pointing out new=old.
Mon, 2006-12-04 19:05
#23
I dunno. I like the way Dion went right after Harper today during Question Period.
[url=http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2006/12/04/dion-react.html]CBC[/url]
quote:
But then Dion questioned Harper, saying "why on Earth" is he closing 12 of the 16 status of women offices across Canada "if it is not to cripple those who dare challenge his government's neo-conservative ideology."snip
Dion also pressed Harper about the coming vote on same-sex marriage, asking why he wants to be the "first prime minister in Canadian history to override the Charter?"
Harper instead zeroed in on whether Dion would force all of his MPs to vote against reconsidering same-sex marriage.
"I hope that proves not to be the case because I think the rights of members of Parliament are some of the most important rights we have in this country," Harper said.
Dion also challenged Harper over proposed changes to the process of appointing judges. The prime minister defended the changes, saying they will let crime victims and police have a say.
Mon, 2006-12-04 19:20
#24
remind
quote:
Originally posted by Amйricain Йgalitaire:
I dunno. I like the way Dion went right after Harper today during Question Period.[b]..Dion questioned Harper, saying "why on Earth" is he closing 12 of the 16 status of women offices across Canada "if it is not to cripple those who dare challenge his government's neo-conservative ideology."
[/b]
Oh ya, I heard that today, why wasn't it said last week, when it happened, by the Liberals?
Mon, 2006-12-04 19:31
#25
Maybe they wanted a leader to respond? That might seem weak but that's all I can think of.
Mon, 2006-12-04 19:32
#26
Boom Boom
[url=http://liberal.ca/news_e.aspx?type=pressrelease&id=12080]Conservative Closure of Status of Women Canada Offices A Step Backward[/url]
[b]November 29, 2006[/b]
OTTAWA - The minority Conservative government's decision to close twelve regional offices of Status of Women Canada, leaving only four to serve Canadian women, is reprehensible, Liberal Status of Women Critic Maria Minna said today.
Mon, 2006-12-04 21:50
#27
quote:
The labour movement hates him, NDP stalwarts consider him a traitor, so it would be an uphill climb grabbing the left vote, but with Dion, he is at least as "leftish" as Rae, and has none of that baggage with the left.
On bread and butter issues, I think Rae has more credibility than Dion with your average left leaning Canadian. One of the defining moments in the Liberal leadership race I believe was Dion's thumping of Rae for being too leftwing in his time as Premier and his defence of the Martin cuts in the 90s.
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSUjGm5QQC4&mode=related&search=]"They Had Compassion, Bob, They Had Compassion"[/url]
He also voted against anti-scab legislation, something I doubt Rae would do. I didn't live in Ontario during Rae but as a unionized worker I don't have a problem with "Rae Days" as I understand them, they certainly seem preferable to me over what Harris and Gordon Cambell(who Dion has praised and recruited a key organizer from) did. I'd rather spread the pain around then just cut a third of the workforce. If I was voting purely on my interest as a unionized worker I'd take Rae over Dion any day.
I do think Dion would be better than Rae at maintaining a somewhat independent stance for Canada internationally and potentially better at taking on industrial polluters. But for your average soft NDP voter, I think Rae had more appeal.
Mon, 2006-12-04 23:53
#28
Cueball
quote:
Originally posted by melovesproles:
[b]On bread and butter issues, I think Rae has more credibility than Dion with your average left leaning Canadian. One of the defining moments in the Liberal leadership race I believe was Dion's thumping of Rae for being too leftwing in his time as Premier and his defence of the Martin cuts in the 90s.[/b]
I know you guys are out with your hatchets, and yes I agree that Rae would probably play with your average a-politcal Liberal type. Buy I'm not talking about them. Dion doesn't even have to worry about that. He plays to the soft shoe Liberal crowd and might appeal to more dyed in the wool lefties, in particular in ridings where the NDP is soft, and people are thinking of voting strategically.
And the reason that the Public Service union got pissed off, was not so much because of hte Rae Days, but because of how he handled the negotiations, essentially shoving it down the unions throat. There were some biter internal politics between some kay players.
[ 04 December 2006: Message edited by: Cueball ]
Tue, 2006-12-05 01:03
#29
I'd like to see Dion as Prime Minister, I just think we would see a very different agenda depending on whether the NDP are in a position of strength or not.
What you say about Rae pissing off the unions makes sense, the guy's resume really isn't very good, goes on and on about how "pragmatic" he is and has a record of destroying the political party he led and alienating everyone. I think the Liberals chose well in avoiding him.
Still, I think he is economically to the left of Dion, and I think voters for whom that is the primary concern would have been more attracted to him. Certainly here in BC, Rae would have been well poised to scoop the soft-NDP vote. Dion might be able to as well but I think it will be more dificult.
Anyways I just think Dion is not as leftwing as some here seem to think but time will tell. Taken from their online prescence the impression I received of the general breakdown of Liberal delegates was:
Rae = Old School Liberal Left/soft NDP
Kennedy = next generation Liberal Left
Dion = Progressive Centrist, Economically conservative but environmentally progressive.
Ignatief = Liberal Right, Quebec soft nationalists
Tue, 2006-12-05 05:34
#30
quote:
Dion = Progressive Centrist, Economically conservative but environmentally progressive.
In what sense is he economically conservative, beyond apparently opposing the anti-scab legislation? I'm not saying that to pick a fight; I'm just curious.
Tue, 2006-12-05 10:04
#31
quote:
Yes, I considered this but this time the perspicacious Hebert is wrong. She is a Liberal after all, so she has no sense of the stigma Rae has among the left. He might be able to "talk" "leftishly," but I think it would be hard for him to deliver. And one thing about Rae, however bad he may look in the eyes of centerfield and right wing voters, it isn't personal for them. But on the left it is personal and people are extremely turned off by him.
I think you are confusing the view of hard-core leftwing/NDP activists (ie: about one half of one percent of the Canadian populaition if that) and NDP voters (2.5 million people in the last election.
Yes, Rae gets a lot of backs up among hardcore NDP activists etc... - but who cares? Those people were never going to vote Liberal in the first place. No matter how angry or content you are - you still only get one vote.
But, i think that Rae could have been quite appealing to a lot of NDP voters who just see him as someone with an NDP pedigree with a chance to become PM. Fortunetly this won't happen.
Dion is a very dry stuffed shirt who doesn't have a populist bone in his body and is not a particularly good communicator. I think the NDP can easily run a populist issues based campaign that focuses on economic insecurities etc...and scoop up plenty of votes in BC and Ontario and Nova Scotia etc...
Contrary to popular belief, the typical NDP voter in Canada is NOT a member of an environmental NGO who lives in the Annex and is part of the so-called Think Twice Coalition. The typical NDP voter is someone of English descent with a low income who lives in places like Halifax, Hamilton, Windsor, Winnipeg, Nanaimo etc...
Tue, 2006-12-05 10:46
#32
quote:
In what sense is he economically conservative, beyond apparently opposing the anti-scab legislation?
In the Youtube excerpt I posted above Dion attacked Rae's record as Premier from the right and defended the Martin/Chretien cuts in the 90s as "compassionate." Please, someone explain to me how this is not economically conservative. This is starting to feel like the "nation" debate where "left" is the new word which can mean whatever one wants it to.
I don't know how economically conservative Dion is, the broad spectrum of support he has suggests he might not be that ideological one way or another but his connections with Christie Clark and her husband are worth noting. I just found his supporters on line were not that left wing at all and enjoyed seeing Dion champion the Martin approach to balancing budgets over Rae, who he portrayed as too reluctant to enact "compassionate" cuts to government programs.
I suppose one clue as to how he thinks economically might be found in the work he did for the Brookings Institution in Washington although I did a very quick search and couldn't find anything by him.
Tue, 2006-12-05 12:44
#33
Cueball
quote:
Originally posted by melovesproles:
[b]This is starting to feel like the "nation" debate where "left" is the new word which can mean whatever one wants it to. [/b]
!
Tue, 2006-12-05 13:08
#34
quote:
!
?
Tue, 2006-12-05 14:32
#35
Dion was a good choice, from an NDP point of view and for the country. I consider myself progressive and usually vote NDP even though I'm not a member. But I also like and respect Bob very much. I thought he did a good job as Premier and he would have been effective in taking on Harper. I also prefer Rae's stance on Israel to that of the NDP. I would have been an undecided voter in that scenario.
Tue, 2006-12-05 15:37
#36
quote:
I also prefer Rae's stance on Israel to that of the NDP. I would have been an undecided voter in that scenario. -Sheldon Gordon
I stopped paying attention to what Mr. Flipflop says or stands for or against.
I am not a fan of Zionist Israel, but I have deep respect for politicians who take a stand and hold to it, such as Marlene Jennings, who is the Vice-Chair of the Canada-Israel Committee.
Now, what makes you sure that Bob Rae will not flipflop ? I have talked with Rae and I have talked to Jennings. I do not trust Rae. I trust Jennings in spite of her support of Israeli. Because I know where she stands and that she sticks to her position.
Tue, 2006-12-05 15:50
#37
Rae's position on Israel has always been consistent.
Tue, 2006-12-05 16:28
#38
Cueball
"... consitently bad."
Tue, 2006-12-05 16:28
#39
Cueball
quote:
Originally posted by melovesproles:
[b]?[/b]
Its chess notation.
Tue, 2006-12-05 16:30
#40
"Contrary to popular belief, the typical NDP voter in Canada is NOT a member of an environmental NGO who lives in the Annex and is part of the so-called Think Twice Coalition. The typical NDP voter is someone of English descent with a low income who lives in places like Halifax, Hamilton, Windsor, Winnipeg, Nanaimo etc..."
A very good point Stockholm. I was having a discussion today about something similar to this today but from a Montreal perspective. Substitute Annex with Plateau/Mile End granola hipster. Point aside: NDP voting in Montreal has been strong in non-hipster areas.
As for your point about Dion not being a good communicator are you talking about his english language skills or his woodenness? I saw Air Farce doing a skit last night complete with the stilted Harper character. I think that this is a stale critique, for whatever reason he is in 24 Sussex.
Tue, 2006-12-05 17:52
#41
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
[b]"... consitently bad."[/b]
Indeed just listen/read Bob Rae here. A total apologist for Israeli apartheid.
[url=http://www.cjpac.ca/liberals.php]http://www.cjpac.ca/liberals.php[/url]
Tue, 2006-12-05 21:15
#42
quote:
I also prefer Rae's stance on Israel to that of the NDP.
How is that possible when they are essentially identical. They both deplore violence and recognize everyone's right to exist.
Tue, 2006-12-05 21:57
#43
quote:
Originally posted by Cueball:
[b]And we can be sure that with Dion they are not going to be targetting the right. He certainly isn't going to sell with the right. Mo. they want to grab some Green votes and some NDP votes, based on the principle that the Tory vote will not move.[/b]
And that would be down to a fundamental truth that the two old line parties are one and the same mirror image of the other.
One half of the political right racks up one of the most humungous national debts in the history of the solar system in the 1980's next to only their political conservative counterparts in the U.S. and maybe Brazil, and then the Libranos promised to "fix" the debt by starving social program spending to do it. Neither party believes in well-funded social programs, and the ideology is exactly the same. Campaigning on the left and ruling on the right goes way back, across the pond in the first half of the last century at least. The sucker job is as old as the hills. No daylight between'em. Might as well vote CPC as waste one second of our lives believing the right-wing Liberals have a left-wing bone in their cold blooded, invertebrate, Gucci-hooven bodies.
Look at Dion's vacant stare - it says, "Space for Rent!"
[ 05 December 2006: Message edited by: Fidel ]
Tue, 2006-12-05 22:44
#44
The neo-libs and neo-cons remind me of this Simpsons episode:
[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kang_and_Kodos]Citizen Kang[/url]
quote:
In the episode "Treehouse of Horror VII," they impersonate Bill Clinton and Bob Dole and compete for the presidency of the United States on crowd-pleasing platforms ("Abortion for some, miniature American flags for others!"). Even after Homer reveals them to be aliens, most people vote for one of them because they don't want to throw their vote away on a third-party candidate (Ross Perot). Kang wins and enslaves humanity. A toiling Homer says "Don't blame me. I Voted For Kodos".
Classic stuff
[img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img]
[ 05 December 2006: Message edited by: a lonely worker ]
Wed, 2006-12-06 02:01
#45
[img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img] I love the Simpson's. I was as disappointed as Bart & Lisa were time Itchy and Scratchy were pre-empted due to a strike at the station. The filler cartoon was a Soviet era standby with a cat chases mouse theme entitled, Worker vs Parasite. [img]biggrin.gif" border="0[/img]
Wed, 2006-12-06 07:08
#46
I think Dion has a hell of a lot of potential. He's certainly caught my interest. If he plays his cards right vis-a-vis equal marriage and the environment, he's got my vote next election.
Wed, 2006-12-06 07:14
#47
Boom Boom
I like Dion, too, but I have a fear that Dion is vulnerable to the machinations of whoever holds 'real' power in the Liberal Party - I don't have the link, but a few days ago I read that there was backlash against the possibility of Dion using a whipped vote on the SSM motion, and, Dion being forced to back down on this, over the prospect of losing some MPs in his first week on the job.
Wed, 2006-12-06 07:24
#48
I think Dion will prove to be the most left-wing leader the Liberal Party has had in a long time.
Wed, 2006-12-06 07:50
#49
Boom Boom
I think he's also the most leftist leader the Libs have had in a good while, and I hope he gets a chance to implement his 'three pillars' (strong economy, social justice, environmental sustainability).
Wed, 2006-12-06 12:46
#50
Boom Boom in another thread regarding homelessness put this in:
quote:
...we take away subsidies to an already filthy rich oil and gas industry.
...
We should be subsidizing housing, not rich oil and gas corporations.
I think this will be a defining issue of a 'Dion era'... I'm decently certain that given the chance, Dion will go in after the energy industry.
_____
Added... to Cueballs comment:
quote:
And we can be sure that with Dion they are not going to be targetting the right.
I agree with that on many levels... For the most case the right within Canada are 'flag wavers' that are voting for their team. You'll have as good as chance of trying to get a Leafs fan to convert to the Canadiens as you will to get a Conservative to change their vote ^^ There really is no part in targetting that segment.
[ 06 December 2006: Message edited by: Noise ]
Wed, 2006-12-06 15:43
#51
freedomfinder
If Dion wants nukes he is very smart...
As long as the US is acting the way it
does you would be smart to have nukes
lots of nukes!
TO KEEP THE USA AT BAY!!!
Don't you know we can't be trusted???