Rebecca Walker on Alice Walker

I have a number of responses.

First, if I didn't know who Rebecca Walker was, or if I hadn't read her book [i]Black, White and Jewish[/i] I would think some very different things, given that she can sound a bit like a neo con, esp at the end. !!! Anyone who hasn't read her work, please keep this in mind.

Second, we (the public) have no idea the issues that are between the two of them, and since they both are writers, we get access to their relationship via this public method, but who knows what's really transpired over the years? This article gives us a tip of the iceberg. Rebecca says she looked for, and found, other women during her life to be proto-mothers to her, that Alice was lacking as a mother. I don't doubt that, as writers are known to be not great as partners, and not hugely great as parents. But I do know that there are many many more issues, some of which are none of my business as a member of the public, some of which the two of them may not be able to name.

Third, I feel like blaming feminism is the way for Rebecca to normalize her feelings. It's feminism that took her mother away from her so it's feminism that Rebecca blames. My feminism includes the reality of choosing to be a parent and that feminists can be wonderful parents. I know many many women of the age Rebecca mentions (I'm slightly older than her) who've planned and had one child, or more, and this desire to parent was hand in hand with their feminism. And I say this as a child-free and happy-with-that feminist. [img]smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Fourth, and this is from my own (brief and 10-year old) experience meeting Alice Walker, as well as a report from a friend who saw her speak at a conference last year. Let's just say Alice's public behaviour has made her fall from her pedestal. It serves us right, I suppose, those who put her up there, since anyone who gets placed on one will fall eventually. And I think we all know that anyone in the public eye will often behave very differently in private.

What I glean from this article is that Rebecca and Alice have much healing to do. As a woman with a mother who I struggle with, and love, I hope they can do that someday.

As a person who did not want children, I can relate to Alice Walker's sentiments. In fact, I walked out of the Drs office in shock and crying in dispair when I found out I was pregnant. And at certain points in my daughter's life, I was pretty distant from being a hands on parent and it also negatively impacted her, as is the case apparently with Rebecca Walker.

Upon reflection, years later, as to why I was so full of dispair, as nowadays, after getting rid of the guilt for bringing her into a misogynist world, I quite like being a mother and grandmother.

I did not want to have a female child, as I did want another woman to have to suffer at the hands of men. Nor did I want to have a male child who could grow up and inflict patriarchy upon a woman.

In fact, it saddens me still that my daughter lives in a world that has so far to go equality wise, and not just gender equality, as she is impacted by racial inequality too.

In her own words (from that Daily Mail article):

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Then I meet women in their 40s who are devastated because they spent two decades working on a PhD or becoming a partner in a law firm, and they missed out on having a family. Thanks to the feminist movement, they discounted their biological clocks. They've missed the opportunity and they're bereft.

Feminism has betrayed an entire generation of women into childlessness. It is devastating.

But far from taking responsibility for any of this, the leaders of the women's movement close ranks against anyone who dares to question them - as I have learned to my cost. I don't want to hurt my mother, but I cannot stay silent. I believe feminism is an experiment, and all experiments need to be assessed on their results. Then, when you see huge mistakes have been paid, you need to make alterations.

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Sorry but you do not speak for me Rebecca. I chose not to have children and I am not at all devastated. I am very thankful for the feminists who made it possible for me to make my choices, including Alice Walker.

ETA: If she is so disappointed in her mother why did she change her surname from Leventhal to Walker? Could it be that she is an opportunist who wanted to ride on her mother's coat tail?

[ 24 May 2008: Message edited by: laine lowe ]

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Originally posted by lagatta:
[b]There aren't many things I'm happy about in life, but not having children certainly is one. Sure, I have many friends, female and male, who are happy parents. But the very thought alienates me profoundly.[/b]

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Yes, and you didn't have one. Alice Walker, on the other hand, did have one. And she's written about how she feels she's been treated by her.

It's too bad she's attributing her mother's treatment of her to feminism in general. We are all individuals and we all come at our lives differently, and we all incorporate our political and feminist beliefs into our lives in vastly different ways.

I agree with bigcitygal above, and would add that this piece sounds like a very personal reaction to a very difficult relationship she had with her mother. I wouldn't automatically assume that she is right-wing or even anti-feminist. I would assume from this that she has been deeply hurt and is writing out her pain and trying to make sense of her experiences, her feelings, and the philosophy she has learned from her mother.

There are lots of people out there who have progressive politics but are very difficult people to have relationships with, and the people closest to them sometimes get hurt. In this case, one of those people are writing about it.

Sorry, I don't understand your post.

Yeah, no surprise from the Daily Mail, which is not only a tabloid, but a right-wing, anti-woman, anti-immigrant tabloid (Daily Mirror is generally more progressive, though as a tabloid can of course still indulge in sensationalism.

It did remind me of the Manon Barbeau rant, but it is even worse as it is only attacking the mother, not the father who was just as negligent and self-absorbed (as writers often are, eh?) And especially the rightwing crap against feminism.

I stated earlier, in different words, that just because Rebecca is blaming feminism for her experience of her mother's parenting, doesn't mean we have to believe her. This article is personal, Rebecca isn't a sociology person, nor a theoretical / academic feminist. Now that I know the Daily Mail is right wing explains why this article was posted with them since it suits their agenda. But the reality of Rebecca's experience stands.

Is she not allowed her perspective?

How feminist is it that she's been called extremely nasty names here, in this thread, by feminists, in the feminist forum?

Now I will move into a murky area that I'm just guessing at that needs to be named: Rebecca is mixed race, and her mother is her parent of colour. As a mixed race person myself who's talked to many mixed race people, and read tons of stuff written by mixed race people themselves, I can say that our relationships with our parent of colour plays specific roles for us in our lives. In a profoundly racist world (talking about growing up in Canada or the US now), there are things to learn from, and to get support from, our parent of colour, that very likely our white parent can't provide. We can't even voice this need when we're younger, and this need may or may not be met depending on other issues in the family.

This breakage, this estrangement, from her mom, a black woman, for Rebecca, as a black woman herself, has levels that none of us, including myself, can imagine.

No, she didn't express this disconnect in a supportive way towards her mother. Why the hell should she, it's her pain. She will have to deal with the consequences of this public piece of writing.

You're "shocked" at lagatta, are you Ghislaine?

Just curious - what was your reason for posting this in the feminism forum on babble? What kind of reaction were you hoping to get? I mean, you post what sounds like an anti-feminist rant from a right-wing tabloid in the feminism forum, claim that you want feminists on babble to share their feelings about the piece - then some of them do, and you're shocked - shocked! - that the piece has triggered a strong or emotional reaction.

What do you want us to say?

I think this article is interesting because it shows that people with great politics don't necessarily have glowing relationships with everyone in their lives. And it's interesting to see the way a person can develop some pretty repugnant politics as an emotional reaction to a bad relationship with a parent who has opposing politics. Her mother is famous for being a feminist, and she has suffered because of some things her mother has said about her feelings towards motherhood, and now R. Walker blames feminism for it all.

So, okay, we get it. What's your point? What do you want us to say about it? "Wow, she's got a point, feminism really sucks"? "Boy, that Alice Walker, what a ball-busting bitch"? "Goes to show you, the more radical a feminist you are the worse mother you'll be"?

[ 25 May 2008: Message edited by: Michelle ]

I agree with that too. I think this is a sad case of an estranged mother-daughter relationship. I don't think it really has much significance beyond that, except, of course, that both are public figures and one of them is writing out her pain, as writers generally do.

I don't think this really has any bearing on feminism in general. This is a personal drama that is significant for the two of them. R. Walker is trying to make it about feminism in general - but as bigcitygal says, that doesn't mean we have to agree with her that it is.

anyway, I guess that point's already been made.

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
[b]Feminism for me means choice for women over and above anything else.[/b]

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One hears that a fair bit these days. In my day it meant equality - freedom - no more discrimination and commodification and dehumanization. But I guess if a woman "chooses" to be unequal and subordinate, that's part of some new definition of feminism?

I would never presume to define what feminism really is, but I question that for anyone to openly share a negative view of childbearing tasks in this still sexist world is 'awful' feminism. Many great twentieth-century women have done just that. I sincerely hope that Rebecca Walker remains enthusiastic about her motherhood experience - many women come to see it with different eyes - but her difference of views with her mother seems to have little bearing to her disappointment with her childhood experience or with feminism in general.

Thanks BCG for your insights about mixed-race women confronting a coloured mother.

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Originally posted by Ghislaine:
[b]So she should shut the hell up because if her mother would have had the choice to abort her she would have? [/i][/b]

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Did I say, anywhere in this thread, that she should "shut the hell up"? No, I didn't.

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Originally posted by bigcitygal:
[b]Is she not allowed her perspective? [/b]

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Having read the thread over several times, I have not found 1 person who tried to deny R Walker her voice.

What I saw was, other feminists taking back their voices and themselves from R Walker, as she has expropriated them/us, and has lumped together all feminists to suit her "poor me" musings.

Compounding that, she apparently has let others, with a right wing agenda, exploit her to suit their political agenda.

Thus, anyone allowing R Walker to expropriate their voice is also allowing those with a right wing agenda to exploite them. We have a right to react to being exploited by R Walker.

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[b]How feminist is it that she's been called extremely nasty names here, in this thread, by feminists, in the feminist forum?[/b]

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I think it is a very human response to the incredibly exploitive actions of R Walker.

Exploitive actions that have several layers as a matter of fact.

First of all, she exploits mother's name and public person to write about her personal issues with her. In my life, I have never ever met a woman, or in fact a male, who did not have some type of issue with their parents. Neglect, misinforming, indoctrinating, conditional love, physical abuse, you name it and we could all write a book about our parents. However, not so many of us would get instant publicity and book sales from our endeavors, as would R Walker, when she wrote and published hers.

Now, after this first exploitation, she goes on to exploit feminists, on several levels too. Our movement, our voices, our gains, gains that she herself is beniftting from, and OUR bodies.

Finally, she is exploiting the general public to make herself a bundle of money because she can exploit her mother's fame.

And frankly, I do not think it is correct to move this into a mixed racial issue, so I will not address the rest of your post other than to agree that;

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[b]She will have to deal with the consequences of this public piece of writing.[/b]

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[ 26 May 2008: Message edited by: remind ]