Is Anti-Racist Liberal Hatchet-Man Warren Kinsella Racist?

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NorthReport
Is Anti-Racist Liberal Hatchet-Man Warren Kinsella Racist?

 

WTF?

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20090131.NOTEBOOK31/TPStory/Comment

 

HOT, NOT AND AN APOLOGY An Apology: Ignatieff senior strategist Warren Kinsella apologized this week for offending "friends in the Chinese community" for suggesting a Chinese restaurant in Ottawa served "cat meat." The reference appeared on Mr. Kinsella's blog, and it wasn't long before it was picked up by the Chinese press. The Toronto Chapter of the Chinese Canadian National Council demanded an apology and the Harper Conservatives made sure the national media was aware of it as well. Mr. Kinsella has written books opposing racism. He removed the remark: "I sincerely and unreservedly apologize," he said.

NorthReport
aka Mycroft

Obviously Kinsella has some issues he hasn't quite worked through. Any "anti-racist" who would brazenly tell Buddy Hackett-era Chinese waiter jokes cannot have ever seriously thought through the race issue and is desperately in need of sensitivity training. Hell, most racists these days won't tell Chinese waiter gags because they know better.

NorthReport

 Never mind two solitudes, how about three or four.

 

  Hello kitty: Grit aide grilled for BBQ cat comment

http://www.canada.com/Life/story.html?id=1236554

The comment and the controversy it created in Canada’s Chinese community received extensive coverage in the country’s Chinese language press earlier this week, even pushing news of the federal budget off the front page of some Chinese-language daily newspapers in Vancouver and in Toronto.

-=+=-

It's incidents like this that lead me to believe Kinsella's anti-racism doesn't procede from "first principles".  What does it come from then?

 

My guesses are a kind of "noblesse oblige", maybe a narcissistic superhero complex, or even fetishization of the targets of racism.

 

It's obvious this is what prevents a supposed "anti-racist" from seeing the apartheid setup in the West Bank and Gaza.

Michelle

I totally get what you're saying about Kinsella's action. It was a fucked up and racist thing to say. However, one thing you have to give him - he recognized it and apologized when called on it, with no excuses. That's at least a little bit better than a lot of people - me included - have done in the past.

I remember way back at the beginning of babble in 2001, I had my own personal web site, just a little place for family pictures and such. I had a joke section on it where I posted e-mail forwards that I found funny. One of them was a joke that used a pun based on a Chinese accent. I thought it was hilarious because in this case, it was not the person with the Chinese accent who was the butt of the joke, but the person the Chinese guy was talking to.

Someone posted it on babble and linked to my jokes page, and at the time, I didn't get what was wrong with it, since my family is full of accents and we all have funny "misunderstanding" stories about them. Honestly, I just didn't get it.

Another time, I made what I thought was a funny joke about an East Asian hurricane name. Maysie called me out on it way back when, and I was extremely defensive about it, and a lot of babblers came to my defence. A few other babblers agreed with Maysie. I just didn't get it.

I get it now. It took time for it to sink in, but I get it. Does that mean I was a horrible person or a terrible racist who didn't believe any of the anti-racist stuff I had been taught in university and by friends up to that point? No, I don't think so. It just means that even though I was trying to live my life as racism-free as possible, I still had a lot to learn. And I was still saying and doing racist things without realizing it. And I'm sure I still do without realizing it, but I like to think I'm a little more open to being called on it these days.

Does that make me "racist"? Yeah. I guess it does. I guess we all are, really. But people who are open to admitting it and learning from it, and apologizing when they fuck up are at least doing something that the majority of white people don't do when they say or do something racist.

aka Mycroft

It took several days (and possibly intervention from Iggy's office) before Kinsella apologized so I'm not sure I'd give him any credit. His initial response was to attack his critics.

Michelle

It took several MONTHS for me to apologize to Maysie. My initial defensive response was to attack her, too.

I guess what I'm saying is, this isn't unique behaviour among white people. We see it all the time on babble, among people that we wouldn't normally label "racists".

I realize that people are loving this because Kinsella is such an attack dog himself when he thinks he sees any weakness in his political rivals, and he's the king of pulling "gotcha" stuff like this on them. So I totally get the glee here. But I don't know, as a white person who has done just as stupid things myself, I find it hard to participate in the feeding frenzy. It feels kind of hypocritical, you know?

Stockholm

I agree with Michelle, I don't think that just because someone tells a joke that they ought to know better than to tell - it makes them "racist". There is a difference (to say the least) between kidding about cat meat being served in Chinese restaurants and wearing white hoods and taking part in lynchings.

China there are regions of the country where civet cat is actually considered a delicacy and where live cats are kept in cages before being cooked to order. In Korea and Vietnam, dog is a delicacy. There is a town in Cambodia where a local specialty is grilled tarantula (eek!). Apparently a lot of people in China think that we in the west are revolting because take milk and let it rot and ferment to such an extent that it solidifies and smells like dirty socks and then we consider it a delicacy called "cheese"

aka Mycroft

I don't think Kinsella is a racist. I do think he's insensitive and a hypocrite though.

synthome

Completely unscrupulous, middling intelligence, dubiously relevant, and worst of all desperate for "cool" cred. Most of his cock ups come from trying too hard to impress his sophomoric friends. Kinsella is nothing but a poseur who has made a career out of disingenuously manufacturing controversy for petty partisan purposes. Canadian Observer beautifully punked the punk poseur. Still one of my favourite blog posts of all time. Click!

This said, if this were an isolated incident of stupidity, I'd be inclined to let it slide, but as part of pattern that includes a sexist attack on women in politics, charges of blood libel against an NDP staffer for signing the above mentioned petition, scurrilous charges against politicians whose grave error was to not be running for the Liberals, with the stench of the sponsorship scandal on him, I don't think so. 

aka Mycroft

I see your point. The thing with Kinsella is he's more than eager to do the exact same thing to people who disagree with him. Remember his attack on a babbler (I can't remember his screen name and don't want to give out his real name in case that wasn't it:) who pointed out that in the context of the early 1970s student movement Andrew Telegdi referring favourably to the book "The Student as N----r"  may not have been racist because at the time the n word was being used by radicals as a metaphor which, in retrospect, was a really bad and insensitive idea but at the time was seen as identification with the oppressed. Or also remember Kinsella's attack on an NDP staffer accusing him of anti-Semitism for signing a petition (also signed by Judy Rebick among others) that accused Israel of "systematic violations" of human rights, "military coercion and violence," "daily humiliation of an entire population," and "killings."

Kinsella has been quite quick to use his "anti-racist" credentials (ie writing Web of Hate a decade and a half ago) to engage in partisan smears. You just know if a Tory, NDPer or even a pro-Martin Liberal had made the same joke he'd be all over it. So while there is a lot of hypocricy here by Tories who are calling out Kinsella there is also a degree of hypocricy from Kinsella himself.

Michelle

Stockholm, you don't really agree with me.  Just for the record.  I don't agree with most of your post.

theboxman

Discussing the consumption of civet cats in China, and the deployment of cat meat jokes in North America -- wherein such a discourse has been historically used to discriminate and exclude Chinese people from social life through immigration and other policies, is not the same thing.

Stockholm

Jokes about cat meat are mean-spirited and insensitive, but don't you think you're overstating things a bit to say that "excludes Chinese people from social life"???

Anyways, my point is that people inadvertently say things that are racist - but that doesn't make that person "a racist". On the other hand, there are probably plenty of people who actually are racist to the core - who are also smart enough not to say things that get them into trouble - but they are still totaly racist.

A friend of mine who is just about the most hyper-politically correct person i know and who doesn't have a racist bone in his body got accused of racism because he gave a lecture where he described some issue about farm subsidies in the EU as being "not a black and white issue" and someone claimed that by saying this he had to be racist against Blacks!

 

NorthReport

Michelle,

Most of us, if not all here, have probably made some politically incorrect comments at some point during our lives.

But the comparison between you and M Kinsella is not the best one in the sense that Kinsella is a public figure and you are not quite there yet. Laughing

Kinsella has made it a mission in life to publically and agressively attack people who are politically incorrect, and it is for that reason he is being hoist on his own petard.

Maysie Maysie's picture

If we understand racism to be the internalizing, externalizing and institutionalizing of racist thoughts, ideas practices and actions, and that racism is the acting out of such thoughts, ideas practices and actions through institutions, systems and individuals, then anyone raised in such a society is racist.

My hope as an educator, and as a human, is that more and more of us can get on the project of spending some time, much of our lives, actually, unlearning racism (and other oppressions that are also imbedded in Canadian culture) and learning to become allies across various sites of oppression.

If we understand racism to be the extreme acts of a wacky white minority (KKK for eg.), then we will never attack the roots of racism, which is, in the Canadian context, Canadian culture itself. We will always view racism as "in the other, not in me".

remind remind's picture

Nor has michelle written anti-racism books, definitely not the same thing, michelle as your examples. This looks good on kinsella and he should wear it!

___________________________________________________________

"watching the tide roll away"

Stockholm

Kinsella is a total asshole and so it gives me some satisfaction to see him hoisted on his own petard - but in response to the OP's question. Is he a racist? I don't think so...not unless you think that EVERYONE is a racist to at least some extent.

remind remind's picture

Yep!

___________________________________________________________

"watching the tide roll away"

Sunday Hat

A few important points

1) His initial "apology" wasn't even remotely sincere and he only apologized again after a week of bad press. This looks a lot more like saving your career than genuine regret.

2) This isn't the first time he's made a stupid comment and only apologized after being ordered to by the people who hold his leash. Remember this?

3) He hasn't hesitated to jump down the throats of other people for making similar gaffes.

4) His "anti-racist" work is largely self-promotional as far as I can tell. It's Geraldo Rivera-style sensationalism about how powerful the neo-Nazi movement is and their links to Libya. He took public potshots at ARA to boot (because they're too violent).

5) He's an uncritical supporter of Israel and he's written extensively about how the Palestinian children who dies brought it on themselves. This, to me, is way more offensive.

He's not a "racist" in the way that say, Wolfgang Droege's a racist - but he's definitely a Powerful Arrogant Asshole kind of racist, IMHO.

theboxman

Jokes about cat meat are mean-spirited and insensitive, but don't you think you're overstating things a bit to say that "excludes Chinese people from social life"???

 I said historically used as a discourse. See the history of anti-Asian racism in BC, for instance.

Peter3

I'm with Michelle (although in my wholly objective and dispassionate assessment Kinsella is a raving arsehole).

I lived in an African village for two years and a bit.  I was the only white person ever to live in that village or any village that neighboured it. It was hard at first, and one of the hardest aspects was being on the receiving end of some brutal stereotypes that people just assumed I would be fine with. In Michelle's terms, they just didn't get it. 

I couldn't imagine how that was possible at first, but eventually I recognized some of it mirrored in my own responses to unfamiliar situations. I was shocked when I realized it. I learned a few things about the limits of my own sensitivity. I learned a lot about how uncomfortable and excluded that kind of thing can make a person feel without anybody ever intending to be unkind.

Sunday Hat

So, a week later, Warren Kinsella is back to vaguely implying that people who oppose Israel's killing in Gaza are resorting to "hatred, bigotry and intimidation".

Not quite as offensive as:

"Being militarily weak does not make the Palestinians right."

"Israel has allowed goods into Gaza regularly throughout the “siege”. Palestinians have been able to complement these deliveries with supplies smuggled through hundreds of tunnels..."

Now he's making more of an effort to distinguish between "Palestinians" and "Hamas".

Last time I checked assuming that everyone was a terrorist because of their nationality was racist. Not to mention cheering as their children are killed.

-=+=-

I've been thinking about Kinsella's outburst some more.

 

I wonder if it has something to do with his uncritical support of the Gaza massacre (which happened just before he made this statement). 

 

At some level, maybe not even consciously, Kinsella has accepted apartheid in the occupied territories, the second class status of Arabs in Israel, the genocidal attacks on the Palestinians.  Once he has done that, it seems but a short step to start cracking ethnic jokes about Canadians.

 

Not only is the occupation corrupting Israel, but it corrupts men like Kinsella:  from anti-racist to racist.

Makwa Makwa's picture

Stockholm wrote:

Jokes about cat meat are mean-spirited and insensitive, but don't you think you're overstating things a bit to say that "excludes Chinese people from social life"???

Anyways, my point is that people inadvertently say things that are racist - but that doesn't make that person "a racist". On the other hand, there are probably plenty of people who actually are racist to the core - who are also smart enough not to say things that get them into trouble - but they are still totaly racist.

A friend of mine who is just about the most hyper-politically correct person i know and who doesn't have a racist bone in his body got accused of racism because he gave a lecture where he described some issue about farm subsidies in the EU as being "not a black and white issue" and someone claimed that by saying this he had to be racist against Blacks!

 

People make racist jokes because they know they are being racist, and enjoy that feeling of cultural superiority for the moment. It's not in the least inadvertent.  They may come to regret it later in hindsight, but that merely means that they are ashamed to be called out on their racism.  This does not mean that they may be engaged in racism full time, however for those who pretend to be anti-racist, this merely highlights their hypocrisy.  

As for your anecdotal lecturer, if she/he is unwilling to take a minute to reflect upon the social issues around language and colour dichotomies, then I am not particularly impressed with them either. Would it hurt to say, "whoops, sorry if that sounded bad, let's discuss it a bit later?" At the very least, they might at least admit that unimaginative and cliche metaphors like these can be problematic in some contexts and are generally well avoided by good speakers.

PS: Speaking of cliches, now that we've carefully analyzed the "bone structure," of the aforementioned archetypical speaker, what if we were to drill down to the capillaries and cellular membrane structures, hm?  Perhaps a wee bit of residual racism may be yet excised?  I am immediately skeptical of anyone who claims to have no racist cultural concepts whatsoever.  I do, regularly, and constantly query myself. Those who claim no such reflections must come from another plane of existence which has had no contact with western history within the past four hundred years or so. 

************* 

Even now / We are not lost: If you look out at the night / You'll see the colours and the lights seem to say / People are not far away, at least in distance, / And it's only our own dumb resistance / That's making us stay.

mybabble

Michelle wrote:

Does that make me "racist"? Yeah. I guess it does. I guess we all are, really. But people who are open to admitting it and learning from it, and apologizing when they fuck up are at least doing something that the majority of white people don't do when they say or do something racist.

the majority of "white people" don't do when they say or do something rascist sounds a whole lot rascist to me. 

aka Mycroft

I think the problem with Kinsella is he assumes he's anti-racist and so he sees no need to think about what he says.

Also, if he's pal-ing around with the JDL then he's definitely lost whatever anti-racist cred he once had.

Eliezer Zusken

 I recall during the 80s and 90s  that the JDL and the ARA use to make common cause against neo-Nazis both here and in the United States.

 Here is an interesting take as found in Ken McVay's FTP Shofar:

"White Separatists Drive Zionists and Communists from Bandshell    
                           The Hoffman Wire
                               3 Jul 99

COEUR d-ALENE, Idaho -- Approximately 100 white separatists who are
here to attend the Aryan Nations World Congress in Hayden Lake,
escorted their leader, 82 year old Richard Butler to the Coeur d¹Alene
Lakeside Park today, and rushed the stage of the municipal bandshell,
which had been occupied by approximately 200 members of the United
Front Against Fascism, ARA and Jewish Defense League (JDL), who were
intent on denying the Aryans a forum.

Before the white separatists had arrived, the day had begun about noon
with a confrontation between JDL leader Irv Rubin and a half-dozen of
his followers from Los Angeles, and Michael A. Hoffman II, a
revisionist author and local resident."

 http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/ftp.py?people//b/bjurling.vera/VB.990706

What is interesting is that this report also notes that the subject of the attack by the JDL and ARA, Holocaust denier and neo-Nazi, Michael Hofmann 111, defended himself by confronting JDL leader Irv Rubin with the JDL's anti-Arab protests. Nonetheless the ARA worked in common cause with the JDL. We saw similar examples of ARA and JDL working together here in Toronto against the Heritage Front at around the same time.

Would it also be fair to say that anyone pal-ing around with the JDL during these times had lost any anti-racist cred they once had?

Stargazer

Yes.

Cueball Cueball's picture

I seem to remember that Weinstein was in Alberta during the 80's and that the anti-Heritage Front campaign was led by the ARA, Rodney Bobiwash's Klan Busters with support from Bernie Farber and the CJC. Front line action was all almost all ARA, and Klan Buster's while Bernie and the CJC did background legal stuff.

Were you there? Kiss

aka Mycroft

Back in the 1980s when the KKK tried to set up an HQ in the Riverdale area of Toronto a group was formed, I believe it was called Riverdale Against the Klan. The JDL tried to join and were refused.

I would not be surprised if JDL people showed up at a few ARA rallies and I know from press accounts that Meir Weinstein (then going by the name Halevi) observed the fight between ARA, police and fascists outside the courthouse where I think Zundel was being tried at one point. However,  anyone who has actually attended a large rally knows that the organizers have very little control over who attends. Just because 3 or 4 JDL members might have been in attendence at a mass rally organized by ARA in the early 1990s does not mean the two groups were working together. I'm unaware of any instances in which a JDL member was a speaker at an ARA rally or event or vice versa or of the two groups sitting together on any rally or even organizing committees. Frankly, Eliezer's argument is specious.

Eliezer Zusken

AKA Mycroft,I'm not sure I made an argument. Seems I more asked a question. Calling it specious is a bit too precious.

Cueball, I wasn't there at the time I only read about it in Kinsella's book "Web of Hate" and a few articles I found online.

 

 

aka Mycroft

Fine, your suggestion that "during the 80s and 90s  that the JDL and the ARA use to make common cause against neo-Nazis both here and in the United States" is specious or, at best, highly misleading.

Cueball Cueball's picture

The only reason I would be concerned about having the JDL at an anti-Nazi event would be the fact that I have observed that they go off discipline and sometimes instigate, or participate in shouting matches and shoving matches with the opposite side. That is bad for business. In principle I (personally) would not have a problem with them in an anti-Nazi protest, since they would not likely cause problems like that within the demonstration.

On the other side of the fence, it is hard to tell if they are going "off" discipline when trying to start stuff with pro-Palestinian demonstrators, or if that is policy. Fortunately, the Palestine House people usually run the security at those events and they have rock solid discipline and usually are able to keep their people in check.

Fidel

Theyre all just visitors to Kinsella's and Iggy's Canada.  

Lard Tunderin Jeezus Lard Tunderin Jeezus's picture

Eliezer Zusken wrote:

AKA Mycroft,I'm not sure I made an argument. Seems I more asked a question. Calling it specious is a bit too precious.

"Precious"? 

Really?

Wow.

You're quite the arsehole, aren't you, Eliezer?