"Mother 'trapped' in Saudi Arabia"

15 posts / 0 new

Thu, 2009-04-16 12:44

toddsschneider

"Canada accused of refusing to help woman, three children escape abusive home"

http://tinyurl.com/cl48pf

MONTREAL–A woman's fear for her daughter, evident in the strained urgency of her voice, is magnified by three – three grandchildren, all of them trapped, she says, in a desolate apartment in Saudi Arabia, "hostage" to an abusive husband and father who barely cares for them.

Johanne Durocher is at her wit's end. Allegations by the Longueuil, Que., woman are in dispute by Canada's own government. It has been four years since her daughter Nathalie Morin went to live in Saudi Arabia with her husband, Said Ramthi Al Bishi, and became enmeshed in what seems like an impossible plight.

"Who am I worried about the most? My grandchildren," Durocher says. "Because they are young. What your father does to you when you're so young, all your life you'll be a mess ...

Thu, 2009-04-16 15:31

Golbez

It makes you wonder why the women went over there in the first place. I guess they hadn't watched the movie "Not Without My Daughter".

Obviously, the woman involved is not the brightest lightbulb in the ceiling

1. Dropped out of high school and got pregnant? Check.

2. Had not 1, but 2 chances to escape and didn't take them? Check

3. Went over there in the first place, with all of the risks involved? Check.

I do feel for the kids, but I'm not so sure the Canadian gov't should be spending any more time on this when they already helped the woman in the past and SHE WENT BACK!

"All we know is that when she came to us, we made sure to help her come back. Both times, she returned" to Saudi Arabia.

Thu, 2009-04-16 16:09

Ghislaine

I think she is going to learn the hard way that the father has sole control and custody of children in Saudi Arabia. She may be able to get home, but there is no way the Saudi gov't is going to let the children leave. I hope for her kids' sake that they are all boys.

Thu, 2009-04-16 17:37

martin dufresne

Hey I resent that quip, Ghislaine... It's not easy growing up either gender under fundamentalist rule, esp. when Washington needs your oil so much they have the Saudi State suppress any dissidence.

Fri, 2009-04-17 00:23

sanizadeh

Golbez wrote:

"All we know is that when she came to us, we made sure to help her come back. Both times, she returned" to Saudi Arabia.

That fact may also raise the possibility that the grandma is making up this whole story just because she disapproves her daughter marrying an Arab.

Fri, 2009-04-17 00:26

Unionist

Yeah, this has all the makings of a serious non-story. Another episode in, "Our Superior Way Of Life".

Fri, 2009-04-17 00:33

sanizadeh

Golbez wrote:

It makes you wonder why the women went over there in the first place. I guess they hadn't watched the movie "Not Without My Daughter".

I am sure most of you have seen that movie, but I doubt many have seen the rebuttal documentary that was shown in Iran. Not that the events in the movie was impossible to happen, but that at least in the specific case of Betty Mahmoudi (the heroine of the movie), there was another side where the American audience never got to hear, and which contradicted many of the stuff she had claimed.

Fri, 2009-04-17 08:14

Ghislaine

martin dufresne wrote:

Hey I resent that quip, Ghislaine... It's not easy growing up either gender under fundamentalist rule, esp. when Washington needs your oil so much they have the Saudi State suppress any dissidence.

You are correct - it is not easy being either gender in a repressive place like Saudi Arabia. And Obama looks like he is just as in bed with them as Bush was.

However, I don't think you can deny that it is much easier being a boy there than a girl. And, yes unionist, our way of life in Canada is superior to Saudi Arabia. Perhaps not if you are a man, but as a woman there is a massive, undeniable difference.

Fri, 2009-04-17 08:41

Cueball

Unionist wrote:

Yeah, this has all the makings of a serious non-story. Another episode in, "Our Superior Way Of Life".

I remember when all and sundry were convinced that Michelle Palmer was going to do 6 years hard time for frolicking on the beach in Dubai. The truth? Three months and then deported.

Hey but what is jingoism without a little misinformation.

Fri, 2009-04-17 08:43

#10

Ghislaine

Yeah Cueball, it's amazing how rich white Westerners often get special treatment.

Fri, 2009-04-17 10:09

#11

Unionist

Ghislaine wrote:
And, yes unionist, our way of life in Canada is superior to Saudi Arabia. Perhaps not if you are a man, but as a woman there is a massive, undeniable difference.

Does Saudi Arabia send troops abroad to impose their notion of democracy and murder a few civilians along the way? Or does that not count in "way of life" measurement?

I never thought I'd be defending Saudi Arabia. Strange the kinds of feelings that self-righteous White Christian Western elitism engenders in me. I'll have to report this to my analyst. Hell, I'll have to hire an analyst.

Fri, 2009-04-17 10:18

#12

Ghislaine

How is saying that Canada's human rights record and way of life for iwomen is superior to Saudi Arabia's "White Christian Western elitism"? It is a fact.

Saudi Arabia funds and supports terrorism all over the globe and arguably some of its citizens commited suicide while murdering thousands in NY.

Have I ever supported the sending of our troops to impose "democracy" and kill civilians? I wouldn't support it for Saudi Arabia. I do support an end to using their oil which pollutes and funds a repressive regime concurrently.

I consider it part of our "way of life" that our democracy results in outcomes I find disagreeable - such as a refusal by any party to call for our troops to come home. However, mechanisms exist to protest these actions, speak out against them and work to get others elected (or our fptp system changed). I never said we were perfect, just that our way of life is superior. I am not saying that Canadians are superior to Saudis. I am certain that most (while women at least) in Saudi Arabia would greatly prefer our system to the one the men in charge call "theirs".

Fri, 2009-04-17 10:25

#13

Unionist

Ghislaine wrote:
I never said we were perfect, just that our way of life is superior.

How does Saudi Arabia treat its indigenous population?

Quote:
I am certain that most (while women at least) in Saudi Arabia would greatly prefer our system to the one the men in charge call "theirs".

Do you think they would prefer Ontario's system of public funding of Catholic schools but not Muslim ones?

Do you think they would prefer our advertisers' habits of using women's bodies to sell commodities?

Do you think they would like our climate? (Ok, that's a cheap shot.)

This thread is about someone "trapped" in Saudi Arabia. I'll believe it when I see the evidence. I'd also like to see the precise legal arrangements that Canada has internationally and with Saudi Arabia when it comes to Canadian citizens abroad alleging distress and seeking assistance. Until then, I repeat, this is an episode in, "Why the hell would any normal person want to live anywhere in the world except CANADA?"

Fri, 2009-04-17 10:27

#14

remind

Like shit considering women are indigenous.

Fri, 2009-04-17 10:33

#15

Ghislaine

Unionist wrote:

Do you think they would prefer Ontario's system of public funding of Catholic schools but not Muslim ones?

What a ridiculous policy (representing 1/13th of this country's jurisdictions) to point out. I think most would prefer the right to speak about

the issue and pressure politicians to have the courage to change the policy.

Unionist wrote:

Do you think they would prefer our advertisers' habits of using women's bodies to sell commodities?

I think perhaps they would prefer our age of consent laws and the right of an [url=http://www.alarabiya.net/articles/2009/04/12/70482.html] an 8 year old girl

not to be forced to marry a 47 year old [/url]

Unionist wrote:

This thread is about someone "trapped" in Saudi Arabia. I'll believe it when I see the evidence. I'd also like to see the precise legal arrangements that Canada has internationally and with Saudi Arabia when it comes to Canadian citizens abroad alleging distress and seeking assistance. Until then, I repeat, this is an episode in, "Why the hell would any normal person want to live anywhere in the world except CANADA?"

I agree with you there. I would like to see those agreements as well. This woman is not "trapped". She went there willingly as an adult and obviously wanted to live there.

Who are we to judge here decision to move there? Why should we believe her mother's claims and "rescue" her from her own decision and desire to move there?