Olivia Chow marches in support of Apartheid

Fidel wrote:

Why not play rough with the bigger kids, like the US and Israeli corporations and US government aiding and abetting the fascism in Israel? What about socially responsible investing ? You know, those banks and credit card companies investing our pension funds in the US and abroad and nickel and diming Canadians on ATM fees and usurous cc rates?

I think that would be fine, although I'm not sure it has anything to do with Olivia.

Peter3 wrote:

Fidel wrote:

Why not play rough with the bigger kids, like the US and Israeli corporations and US government aiding and abetting the fascism in Israel? What about socially responsible investing ? You know, those banks and credit card companies investing our pension funds in the US and abroad and nickel and diming Canadians on ATM fees and usurous cc rates?

I think that would be fine, although I'm not sure it has anything to do with Olivia.

That's because it doesnt! Bingo. And it has nothing to do with leaning on kiddies either.

 

Absolutely right Fidel. Why not just send money to Israel direct, rather than have the US government and its allied corporations do it for us? Where do I sign up? Can I just send bullets, rather than cash donations, since every dollar saved on social costs, is yet another available for the occupation.

Cueball wrote:

Exactly. There is no reason for Olivia to get on side with US corporations and its government that already donates handsomely to the cause, by raising even more money for it. All this does is let Israel defer social costs of militarization and pay for the costs of enforcing the its Apartheid occupation of the West Bank and Gaza

I dont think Olivia is going to listen to your suggestion that she prop up corporate America in any way.

So who's subsidizing the Harpers' estimated half-trillion dollar spending on US military buildup in Canada over the next ten years? Is it the Liberals with their abstaining from house votes and 71 votes of confidence for harper and his exaggerated minority government? Personally I think it wouldnt matter to Canada's near bottom of the barrel rates for child poverty. They wouldnt deal with child poverty in this country regardless of the situation. And they especially dont care about Canadian apartheid existing under various Liberal and Tory governments for decades and decades, And I really hope no one present has ever voted Liberal or Tory and are now dissing Olivia in this thread. Because that would make them the biggest hypocrites theyve ever met.

 

Unionist wrote:

As I said - harmless, humourless, hopeless. Think of the children! When convenient.

It's convenient for you to blather on about children in the neo-Nazi parents thread while simultaneously ignoring the fact that the feds have been violating children's rights in Canada for years and years.

And in THIS thread, you think along the same lines in that it's the children of fascists who want punishing for their fascism. And, in fact, there's no evidence at all that Bat Yam children are connected in any way to Israeli elites never mind Arab thugs also benefitting handsomely from the conflict. 

You guys need to find someone your own size or bigger to pick on. Im sure we can point you misguided progressives in the right direction if you really care about it.

Cowards!

You want to target short people.

I want to target the right people.

Cowards!

Cueball wrote:

Firstly, the UJA aid is not aid directed at children.

Well that's what it says in the linked-to articles above, that the money goes toward integrating Ethopian children into Bat Yam society.

You want to pick on not just any short people, you want to rob short kids who've come to Israel from AFRICA of their rights defined clearly by a UN convention on children's rights!  That's low. Really low. Youre lower'n snake's belly in a wagon rut durin'a downpour.

Cowards!

Well Fidel, most of the UJA money goes through the Jewish Agency for Israel. The proudly talk about their infrastructure support for Operation Cast Lead where you can find their reports on their good works, such as:

Quote:

Peripheral Repairs of Bomb Shelters - Since the war broke out, the Jewish Agency has repaired 315 bomb shelters in Sderot, Netivot, Ofakim, Ashkelon and Ashdod, rendering the shelters livable. Another 200 bomb shelters are currently being repaired.
Equipment for Bomb Shelters - In collaboration with Israeli companies, the Jewish Agency has received donations of basic supplies, books, toys and computers, which are being distributed in 250 shelters in the south. Thanks to support of the UJC, hundreds of bomb shelters in the south are being provided with equipment such mattresses, first aid kits, emergency lighting, heaters etc.
Multi-Day Respites - The Jewish Agency sent more than 450 children and youth from the south on 2 -7 day retreats in Eilat, Rosh Ha'ain, Moshav Nordia, Jerusalem, Nitzana and Hakfar Hayarok, away from of the range of missiles. The children visited the Dolphin Reef, Timna Park and Yotvata Nature Reserve and enjoyed bonfires, outdoor activities, cycling and swimming.
SOS Emergency Fund - Within 24 hours, the Jewish Agency responds with a financial grant of up to $1,000. Since the start of Operation Cast Lead, the fund has provided more than $90,000, offering an immediate response to 95 victims.

Not that there is anything particularly bad about this kind of thing, but the fact is that all this and more, are the kinds of things that your UJA money goes to so that the Israeli government doesn't have to, and so rather than building bomb shelters or bringing them up to grade (with computers and everything) and taking the kids for bike rides Yotava Nature Reserve, the Israeli government is free to spend as much as it like flattening Gaza, without taking any of the direct financial consequences that resulted from its Gaza policy.
Sending money to the UJA is just a convenient way of letting the accountants in the government budget office shuffle the books, and pay for the occupation.
Also this is a far cry from supporting the needs of down and out Ethipoian Jews.

Hardly any of the money donated to the UJA ends up there Fidel.

Here is a good one, from a section about building the economy of the north:

Physical Infrastructure Aid to Northern Businesses

This part says it all about how your money goes defraying the cost to the government for the invasion of Lebanon:

Quote:

A certain amount of funding will be dedicated to renovating and upgrading industrial buildings that have been damaged during the war.  These funds will compensate for the difference in actual rebuilding expenses and government allocations (that take into account depreciated value of properties and a deductible when allocating reconstruction funds).

I think few countries do a better job of cooking their own books than the USSA - a premier nuclear-powered empire shovelling more aid money to Israel every year than any other country in the world. Rummy said just before 9/11 that DoD had lost track of ~$2 trillion taxpayer dollars. And they still refuse to talk about a federal audit for DoD until sometime after 2015 or so.

Quote:

Because of the uncertainties and ambiguities associated with U.S. aid to Israel, arriving at a precise figure for total direct U.S. aid to Israel probably is not possible. Parts of it are buried in the budgets of other government agencies-mostly the Defense Department (DOD)-or in a form not easily quantifiable-such as the early disbursement of aid, allowing Israel a direct gain and the U.S. Treasury a direct loss of interest on the unspent money. Given these caveats, the Washington Report on Middle East Affairs (WRMEA) conservatively estimates cumulative total direct U.S. aid to Israel at $107.961 billion

It's only a conservative estimate by a bunch of people using dozens and dozens of different kinds of accounting s/w for years and years, and accidentally on purpose, too. The different computerized accounting programs dont talk the same language to one another. It's foobar. It's likely a lot more than the whopping $108B figure mentioned by US feds.

 

And youre worried about a few piddling thousand going toward integrating a few African kids into Bat Yam society? A few toys and school books?

 

Cowards!

 

http://www.nationalpost.com/todays-paper/story.html?id=1626816

 

That was a stupid move on her part, but it doesn't necessarily follow that Olivia Chow was supporting Israeli policies Re their Palestinian neighbours but the existence of the state itself, nor does it follow that unblinking support for Aparthied is now official NDP policy.  I know some here find it hard to make these distinctions.   Tell ya what, someone write her and her hubby a polite but inquiring letter then post it here when they get back to you.  If its mindless flag waving puff, like this event looks to be, then that too should show through.

Erik Redburn wrote:

http://www.nationalpost.com/todays-paper/story.html?id=1626816

 

That was a stupid move on her part, but it doesn't necessarily follow that Olivia Chow was supporting Israeli policies Re their Palestinian neighbours but the existence of the state itself, nor does it follow that unblinking support for Aparthied is now official NDP policy.  I know some here find it hard to make these distinctions.   Tell ya what, someone write her and her hubby a polite but inquiring letter then post it here when they get back to you.  If its mindless flag waving puff, like this event looks to be, then that too should show through.

Why would I send her a letter? I will tell her what I think the next time I see her. She is more likely to read this web site than any letter I write. It will just go into the "yay/nay" file. Last time I didn't vote for her, but my wife did. This might be enough to put an end to that. I think I will spoil my ballot by voting Tory this time.

But I thought you didn't believe in the popular voting mechanism either.   You change your mind as often as the average politican.  lol.   

Erik Redburn wrote:

But I thought you didn't believe in the popular voting mechanism either.   You change your mind as often as the average politican.  lol.   

What on earth are you talking about? Other than "lol" nothing there make sense in context. Go to the fridge get another beer and polish off the night and pass out.

And your mistake is that you actually think politics takes place in parliment and during elections. In fact the greatest amount of human politics have absolutely nothting to do with elected officials of their bodies. It is you who are sitting on the sidelines by relegating your social responsibilty to the act of hiding behind a screen and making and X in a little box, just above the writing that says New Democratic Party, which the state electoral office put there just to make sure you don't have a "political accident" and vote for one the other parties or persons whose election campaigns are not financed by the state.

And then you rant about Chinese dictators or Communist state control in the Soviet Union. Lol.

What "inconsistency". Be specific. What I said, and why it is inconsistent, with something else I said.

All you did was say that I was inconsistent. Now you have repeated the statement. Two statements in a row does not an arguement make. Its not even a fart.

Two people here have already steted that they are tired of writing nice letters to the NDP and not getting responses. I don't see why you are insisting such a process should be followed again. If you are so hot on the idea why don't you write a letter asking her why she is raising money so that the UJA can fund organizations which publish Israeli government "talking points" supporting "Operation Cast Lead" and strongly object to Jews immigrating to the USA?

So, You will make us suffer through 300 words of apologia, rather than sending her much shorter letter to the person in question..  You brought up the letter, so, basically you volunteered. You came up with the idea, so you own it. Or are you afraid you might not get a response.

As for me, i am quite content in the knowledge that not a few of their backroom critters pop in here once and a while to check on things, and their national Campaign Director creature makes a point of posting every time his name appears in the press, so I have no fear that the message is getting across.

I am pretty sure I could cop the texts from one of the posts here, and basically have the general idea of the content, if not something pretty close to the straight text of what we could expect in response. Cultural event yadda yadda, important minority and so on.

Then again, if you want to prove me wrong, you feel free to write the letter up and post it and the response, if you get one. Posting the letter is free btw.

Thanks for the civics lectures.

Cueball wrote:

And here we are, now with Olivia's UJA/JAFI money being put toward the cause of preventing Jewish immigration to the United States. How nice:

 

The connection is non-existent. Olivia Chow does not support any of the things you ppl are attempting to smear her with.

 

However, there is a strong relationship between [url=http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=11743]massive direct US military aid to Israel and its recent aggression in Gaza.[/url]

 

Quote:

History of US Weapons Shipments to Israel 

The stockpiling of US made bunker buster bombs by Israel has been ongoing since 2005:  

"The United States will sell Israel nearly 5,000 smart bombs in one of the largest weapons deals between the allies in years.

Among the bombs the [Israeli] air force will get are 500 one-ton bunker busters that can penetrate two-meter-thick cement walls; 2,500 regular one-ton bombs; 1,000 half-ton bombs; and 500 quarter-ton bombs. The bombs Israel is acquiring include airborne versions, guidance units, training bombs and detonators. They are guided by an existing Israeli satellite used by the military.

The sale will augment existing Israeli supplies of smart bombs. The Pentagon told Congress that the bombs are meant to maintain Israel's qualitative advantage [against Iran], and advance U.S. strategic and tactical interests." (Jewish Virtual Library: September 21-22, 2004, Haaretz / Jerusalem Post.)

The actual shipments of US made bunker buster bombs started in 2005. The US approved in April 2005, the delivery of:  

some 5,000  "smart air launched weapons" including some 500 BLU 109 'bunker-buster bombs.  The (uranium coated) munitions are said to be more than 'adequate to address the full range of Iranian targets, with the possible exception of the buried facility at Natanz, which may require the [more powerful] BLU-113 bunker buster [a variant of the GBU 28]'" (See Michel Chossudovsky, Planned US-Israeli Nuclear Attack on Iran, Global Research, May 1, 2005)

The BLU-109 is smaller than the GBU 28. "It  is a 2,000lbs warhead that can be used in combination with a GPS guidance kit [...], and can penetrate up to 15 feet of fortified concrete." (See F16.net)

In 2006 at the height of the Lebanon War in August 2006, a major shipment of the 2.2 ton GBU 28 bombs, according to the New York Times, was dispatched to Israel. 

The GBU 28 is produced by Raytheon. It was used against Iraq in the 1991 Gulf War, has the the capability of penetrating some 20 feet of reinforced concrete. (Haaretz, 9 Nov 2008)  In contrast to the GBU 39 smart bombs (130 kg) used against Gaza, each GBU-28 weighs a hefty 2.2 tons.  

"The Guided Bomb Unit-28 (GBU-28) is a special weapon developed for penetrating hardened Iraqi command centers located deep underground. The GBU-28 is a 5,000-pound laser-guided conventional munition that uses a 4,400-pound penetrating warhead." Federation of American Scientists,

This is on top of the $3 billion+ USD the long-time frontline state of Israel receives every year from the USA.

So youre entirely wrong - and couldnt be more wrong - about who is supplying Israel with military aid for carrying out repressive policies in Gaza and West Bank, and representing the largest threat to peace in the region by menacing other countries with nuclear weapons and general all around aggression.

 

I'm sorry, but no one in their right minds is going to believe you when you say that Olivia Chow and the walk for Israel is maintaining the Israeli military with their walkathon money. You must be completely out of your mind to even consider it to be the case. Tell shill school you want a refund, or something.

The money goes to an organization that opposes Jewish immigration to the USA. They are proud of it. They posted an article about it on their own website. Some of the Chasidic Rabbis are trying to bring some Yemeni Jews to the USA, and JAFI (which is funded by the UJA) is trying to stop it.

Zionist group opposes Yemenite rescue to N.Y.

Quote:

"We vehemently oppose the emigration of Jews in distress anywhere in the world to the USA ,including the group of Jews from Yemen, who will not be coming to Israel," a spokesman for the agency said in March. "The  destination for the Jews of the world -- among them the Jews of Yemen -- is in their ancestral homeland in Israel."

Well, nice to see everyone had such fun overnight!  Closing for length.