Makin' Sci-Fi Work

11 posts / 0 new

Fri, 2009-08-14 15:30

Papal Bull

Makin' Sci-Fi Work

There was a very interesting thread in the feminism forum which was getting slightly derailed from it's original purpose, but evolved its own little discussion regarding 'hard sci-fi' vs. 'soft sci-fi' and all the technomagic in between. So, I raised the point regarding the system of governance for the human fleet in BSG, R_F mentioned the importance of the vacuum of space in making certain Trek gadgets work.

So, let's work out other sci-fi kurfuffles with our sci-fi solar powered fan person brains.

Fri, 2009-08-14 15:39

Snert

In noting that the main character in The Time Traveller's Wife wakes up naked after each jump through time, it got me wondering why, when Dr. Bruce Banner becomes the Incredible Hulk, his new size rips his shirt off like nothing, yet somehow his pants are always intact. Ripped some at the bottom, but otherwise capable of covering thighs that are, like, five times bigger. Are they just afraid of having to draw a green penis the size of a loaf of wonderbread, or did the gamma rays muck with his trousers too?

My other bugbear is superheroes who lift, say, a Sherman tank while standing on the ground. How many pounds per square inch do you suppose their feet are bringing to bear on the earth? Or, more to the point, why does their strength lift the massive object, instead of just pushing them into the ground like a golf tee?

Fri, 2009-08-14 15:52

Fidel

I think part of the reason people write sci-fi is to deal with social issues and how they might be dealt with in the future. Fear of the future or plain old curiosity compels some of us to watch sci-fi. According to Michio Kaku, Star Trek tech would represent technical capabilities of a type II civilization as generally categorized by Kardashev, Dyson and others. And I think some of their timeline predictions for humans attaining that level of technological and scientific development might be several hundred to a thousand years from now. I think BSG might be type III and Star Wars for sure. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 5,000 years from now at a minimum according to Kaku's physics of the impossible.

In the 1950's as a cold war raged on, people couldnt accept the plot in a sci-fi movie Day the Earth Stood Still. Apparently it was because the idea of friendly aliens was implausible considering that everyone was under the impression a red menace on our own planet wanted to takeover the world and steal everyone's freedom. The idea for friendly aliens wasnt popular until the 1980's era of sci-fi with early signs that a cold war might end. 1990's sci-fi themes seemed to centre around corporations run amok with Bladerunner etc and even time travelling robot terminators. Wild and wooley and very imaginative.

Fri, 2009-08-14 17:30

oldgoat

Well there's just nothing that can't be fixed by sweeping it with tachyon particles. The duct tape of the 25th century

Fri, 2009-08-14 21:14

bagkitty

Can I put a plug in for the old Babylon 5 series? They took their physics just a wee bit more seriously... witness centrifigual force being necessary to allow the characters to stand "upright" on the station, and that all various space vehicles in the series conformed to Newton's Laws of Motion. I think part of what made it (B5) such a good series was that there was only one major violation of the laws of physics (the jump gates) -- quite unlike Star Trek where following a law (any law) is never allowed to get in the way of whatever storyline they are flogging.

But rather than get hung up on who most flagrantly ignores physics, I think the overwhelming majority of Science (speculative) Fiction can be called to task for its complete lack of imagination of how societies are organized. The choices seem to be feudal or neofeudal, mercantile capitalist, quai-fascist military models and/or rugged individualists bucking the corrupt politicans who manipulate an ovine electorate. I can list a lot of very honourable exceptions to this, but when compared to the mountain of published SF material, these exceptions are few and far between. What is most notable, to me (an avid consumer of the stuff) is how truly limited the imagination of most SF writers is... they can conceive of wonderful toys and gadgets to propel their stories, but really limit themselves to a very narrow range of societal models.

Fri, 2009-08-14 21:19

500_Apples

bagkitty,

Conjuring up a truly alien society seems like an intrinsically difficult task.

Fri, 2009-08-14 21:26

bagkitty

500_Apples.... I was referring to human societies but in the speculative future. It seems the overwhelming majority of future societies imagined are feudal (or in cyberpunk, neofeudal with the corporations taking the place of an aristocracy) or military (would include Star Trek in this model, rigid hierarchical command structures) -- while I will accept exceptions exist, they are very few... SF writers seem almost incapable of envisioning a future society that is egalitarian - as a genre, SF seems very hostile to the idea of democracy, much less socialism.

Fri, 2009-08-14 22:56

Fidel

I think some sci-fiction writers nowadays write to frighten their audience about the future and deliver important messages for society advocating progressive change. Waterworld, a movie with accompanying tie in novel reflect modern fears about global warming. The ending turns out to be hopeful for democracy and freedom from oppression. HG Wells' Time Machine was about realizing that we cant change the past, and so therfore we should embrace the present and future. The Postman is about keeping hope alive for something better in a post-apocalyptic America. Even that 1950's Day the Earth Stood Still is about hope for mankind and reinforced in the modern day remake. Apparently we evolve only when collectively standing at the edge of the precipice. We change when absolutely necessary. I think it's necessary.

Socialism in Sci-Fi? Someone commented that Star Trek writers eliminated poverty among the federation of planets. And since capitalism is about controlling governmental decion making so undemocratically with global money speculators, Bank for International Settlements, IMF, WTO etc - none of those institutions exist in Star Trek. And they dont use money with replicator technology. Hunger and poverty are pretty much eliminated in the future.

And with nanotechnology, it's said that self replicating robots will, for the first time outside of biology, create new matter for use in building manufacting plants, more nanomachines or whatever. It will reproduce its own means of production. Designs for products or food, water or whatever in future will be transmitted around the world by what Michio Kaku refers to as a type one civilization's telephone network, a truly global internet. Science and technology will make it possible for workers and communities to own the means of production in the not-so distant future. Material wealth and comparative wealth could become things of the past, theoretically and hopefully speaking.

Sat, 2009-08-15 09:52

Tommy_Paine

while I will accept exceptions exist, they are very few... SF writers seem almost incapable of envisioning a future society that is egalitarian - as a genre, SF seems very hostile to the idea of democracy, much less socialism.

Kim Stanely Robinson's Mars trilogy envisioned some pretty interesting political arrangements.

Conjuring up a truly alien society seems like an intrinsically difficult task.

I always thought the "Horta" episode from the original Star Trek episode, where the life form was silicon based instead of carbon based was a pretty decent attempt. However, something that secreats enough acid to make person sized holes through rocks in seconds took some liberties with the possible.

But yes, any life form we can imagine will be based on just what we know.

I've always thought that in terms of actually going out into space to live there, religion will play a central role.

Sat, 2009-08-15 11:13

#10

Tommy_Paine

I think some sci-fiction writers nowadays write to frighten their audience about the future and deliver important messages for society advocating progressive change.

Oh, I think looking at sci fi as a mirror of the times it was written or filmed in is well travelled ground. The monster/alien invasion movies were said to be stand ins for the Red Mennace. Instead of Commie infiltrators. And, the worries about nuclear oblivion, where our playing god with uranium created giant ants, mantisis, men, women, etc. tried to impart a lesson. Mostly with hillarious results.

Nice period pieces though.

I have to confess Kevin Costner drives me nuts. His sci fi social commentary is arranged like we be all dullards, so the message of the film has to be delivered with all the finesse of a 20lb sledge hammer.

Speaking of allagories, and being a mirror of the times, I was just having a summer read of a book called "Gargoyles", by Andrew Davidson, and an omage of Dante's Inferno seems to be serving as the climax to the story. Which put me in mind of "Blood Merridian" by Cormac McCarthy, which has it's Inferno moments. Similarly, there's the book by sci fi writers Larry Niven and Jerry Pournell, "Infreno" which seeks to update Dante's original.

If one sees Inferno as a measure of the percieved injustices of the author's time period, it would be interesting to know, at any given time, how many authors are utilizing the Inferno motife as alagory, commentary in thier works. It might be an interesting measure of the times.

Sat, 2009-08-15 12:25

#11

Maysie

oldgoat wrote:

Well there's just nothing that can't be fixed by sweeping it with tachyon particles. The duct tape of the 25th century

Polaron bursts come in very handy, as well as inverting the deflector dish.

But you're right, oldgoat. Soon there will be Tachyon Particles (TM) for sale at every corner store.