Wife of former leader Stephane Dion lambastes Liberal party on Facebook

owlyph wrote:

Well people have called up notions of the NDP or even the Greens. Perhaps there'd be an idea for a brand new party. When you consider how Dion won his place leading the Liberals in the first place, and then that he managed to put together the whole coalition option, one thing is pretty clear, he's good at negotiating a certain sort of collaboration.

What if he were to negotiate not a combination of the NDP and Greens but rather convinced both of those parties to become part of an entirely new party? That would ease certain conflicts each might have if they were just to come together on their own, since it would be in service of a new third option. It would also create space for a new leader that didn't have to be a choice between Layton, May, or Dion (and we've seen both Layton and May publicly praise Dion). Finally, it would enable both the NDP and the Greens to leave behind some of the baggage they've been stereotyped as carrying, which seems to prevent them from garnering more votes. This scenario could however, still allow the new party to gain the combined support each would bring (which would altogether be greater than the current Liberal level of support--according to recent polls).

I couldn't resist - and the name of the new party will be called the "new Liberal Party". Considering it is the liberal brand that is damaged, through all dense associations with corporate Canada and making empty promises to get elected. And considering that the Greens haven't got one elected MP, and considering that in the last election Layton was way more popular a leader than either May or Dion why would the NDP party joined this trojan horse???

Sure sounds desperate, for sure. finally the NDP is getting the respect and media coverage it disserves - thanks NDP - you make this social democrat proud!

I'm not trying to put words in her mouth and only Mme. Krieber knows exactly what she meant to say. But the way i read her words, it sounded like she was referring to seeing something around NOW, not something that she wistfully would like to see in the future.

Debater wrote:

peterjcassidy wrote:

JeffWells wrote:

It makes me wonder as well whether there's been some discussion re Dion himself crossing the floor.

I remember Jack praising Dion during the Liberal leadership race as a decent guy, therefore unlikely to win the Liberal race. If Dion did cross, that would be MAJOR part of a MAJOR transformation of the party system, such as the NDP topping  the Liberals  in seat standings and votes after the next election.  WOW

I posted this story because I think Janine makes some good points and it's time for the Liberals to start having some important discussions about their identity and their future and hear some tough talk about their behavior.

But it's also important to be realistic about certain things as sometimes on this board realism tends to get lost.  Janine is unlikely to run for any other party for 2 reasons:  1)  She is married to Dion and he is likely to stay Liberal and I don't think she would want to run for a different party than her husband, and 2) I don't think she is interested in seeking elected office anyway.

As for Dion, it is unlikely he will switch to the NDP either as he considers himself a committed Liberal.  He also occupies a safe seat that is unlikely to go NDP even if he did want to switch.

As often. Debater you make good points. But I think the discussion of Dion or other Liberals crossing the floor to the NDP is significant, just as when there was some talk of Sheila possibly crossing. It indicates a possible realingment of the parties. I'm sure you noted the reference to Martin dissing Chretien and we know what that and stabbing  Sheila meant for the Liberals. I think we may be seeing Act two of that shift with Dion getting dumped t and the internal conflict raging on

Fruit of the poisoned tree should all hang together, anyway.

La femme de Stéphane Dion critique Ignatieff sur Facebook

Janine Krieber, dans un statut Facebook rapidement supprimé, s'interroge sur la capacité de Michael Ignatieff à sortir le Parti libéral de la crise profonde qu'il traverse.

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actualites/elections-federales-2009/partis/par...

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

she may be speaking about new leadership for the Liberals-- everyone else is -- why not her?

That is not any more hypothetical than anything else

I don't think that is a reasonable interpretation - she clearly says in her blog post that the Liberal party is falling apart and won't recover from the current crisis. That means she is talking about a different party and hints strongly that that party already exists.  Could be the NDP, could be the Greens, knowing that May and Dion had the infamous "deal" in the 2008 election.  Given the Greens are non-existent in Quebec, I'm thinking the NDP is the more likely reference from JK's post, but only she knows for sure.

I agree Dion won't cross the floor to the NDP but I think his position in caucus will be untenable unless he publicly disavows JK's statement, which is something he's very unlikely to do.  It's unimaginable that she would post something of this nature unless she felt that Dion shared her opinion.

NorthReport wrote:

Fuck you Debator.

You post the most unrealistic crap of anybody here here, bar none.

This is so unnecessary.  If you find yourself attacking someone like this regularly, then either step back from the keyboard, or ignore their posts.

Personally,  think it was all Liberal smoke and mirrors to give the pretense there is a nice, and a left, side to the Liberal Party that needs to be gotten back to.

And to increase their public political media presence, while also taking the heat off of Ignatieff and refocusing te knives elsewhere...

A couple of days from now the Liberals will have a press conference, or a photo op, assuring everyone they have gotten their act together now and are moving in the right direction.

According to most of the Liberal reports you mean. 

Debater wrote:

West Coast Lefty wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

she may be speaking about new leadership for the Liberals-- everyone else is -- why not her?

That is not any more hypothetical than anything else

I don't think that is a reasonable interpretation - she clearly says in her blog post that the Liberal party is falling apart and won't recover from the current crisis. That means she is talking about a different party and hints strongly that that party already exists.  Could be the NDP, could be the Greens, knowing that May and Dion had the infamous "deal" in the 2008 election.  Given the Greens are non-existent in Quebec, I'm thinking the NDP is the more likely reference from JK's post, but only she knows for sure.

I agree Dion won't cross the floor to the NDP but I think his position in caucus will be untenable unless he publicly disavows JK's statement, which is something he's very unlikely to do.  It's unimaginable that she would post something of this nature unless she felt that Dion shared her opinion.

According to most of the reports that came out today, Dion did not want her to post it and did not agree with it.

This is big news and sure to do lasting damage to the Liberals. The reason being is Krieber is saying what a sizeable portion of the voting public have been observing and thinking ever since Chretien was ousted in a coup by Martin, years ago.

As long as you have the Martinites such as Reid, Zed, Ignatieff etc. in control the Liberals might as well join the Conservatives because they are as right-wing as Harper and it's painfully obvious to see.

Les indiscrétions de Mme Dion

Changement d'allégeance?Janine Krieber, dit amorcer une «réflexion sérieuse» et songe ouvertement à changer de parti.

«Je ne veux pas donner ma voix à un parti qui risque de finir dans les poubelles de l'histoire», affirme-t-elle.

Elle souhaite plutôt appuyer une formation qui ne conteste pas son chef à chaque soubresaut dans les sondages, et au sein duquel l'éthique de travail et la compétence sont respectées. Elle conclut en ajoutant: «Je ne rêve peut-être pas.»

Selon Françoise Boivin, ex-députée libérale passée au NPD, cet épisode témoigne du «vent de panique» qui s'est installé au PLC avec la succession de sondages défavorables depuis le mois de septembre. Mais elle assure que sa formation accueillera à bras ouverts les libéraux qui auront déchanté.

«Quand elle a dit qu'elle cherche un parti où l'on ne mange pas les chefs de l'intérieur, on s'est sentis agréablement visés», a indiqué Mme Boivin.

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/actualites/quebec-canada/politique-canadienne/...

Please provide a link

Chajusong wrote:

Chantal Hébert just posted on her blog that the Greens are announcing a new Deputy Leader for Québec in Montréal tomorrow, and she hinted that it'll be Dion. That's disappointing...

If this is true it will confirm that Dion is prone to make bad choices. Why would someone want to go from leader of a political party into complete political oblivion

Dion does not bring benefits. He is a locomotive looking for a place to derail. This likeable guy is a political  trainwreck. No matter what party he goes to that party will inheret a person that has no political instincts.  He will create some discomfort for the LPC by leaving, but Dion adds nothing to any parties portfolio.  Dion has the unique ability to cause damage to a party he is leaving and damage to the party he arrives at.

Perhaps he is leaving electoral politics.  I cannot see him having the strength to be in a party like the NDP. It would require stepping down and running under the banner.  I cannot see him stepping down and helping the NDP with policy.

However I can see him stepping down leaving electoral politics and attempting to work as a policy advisor to the Green Party.

Not that anything will come of it in the short or long run.

I view this as the 2nd least amount of damage Dion can do.

The least amount of damage would be to resign and leave politics in its entirety. This wouldn't hurt the LPC or anyone else.

I also wonder how Dion is going to pay off his leadership debt?  

I can see a scenario where Dion packs it in and Ms Krieber decides to seek a nominaton or move to support another party.  I don't know about anyone else, but I have never found my spouse to simply be an echo chamber for my views, so I think it is totally sexist to think that Ms Krieber might not have a few thoughts of her own on political matters.

That is a fair point, but Dion has indicated that she was his most trusted political advisor which suggests that their views were somewhat aligned (at one time).

Tommy_Paine wrote:

I'm laughing because what Liberal left is he talking about.

 

Well, one advantage the left caucus of the Liberal Party has is that they can all still meet if martial law is declared.

you mean they can all meet under the same culvert?

Boom Boom good one LOL. Good for the goose, good for the gander.

Wouldn't you love to be listening to the dinner conversation at the Dion-Krieber residence tonite.  

JeffWells wrote:

Dion's pledging loyalty to Ignatieff. Or more accurately, Iggy is vouching for Dion's pledge. ("I just spoke to Stephane," yadda yadda.)

 

NDP Leader Jack Layton, meanwhile, dodged questions about whether Krieber has made any overtures about joining his party.

"Well, of course we're watching the conflicts that are going on in the Liberal party. It's kind of hard to avoid. But I'm paying attention to our own party," he said.

"So far, our members and their spouses too, I guess ... seem to be working as a team and we're going to pay attention to that objective."

 

http://www.am1150.ca/news/14/1027024

Why do the Dion spokesperson-Iggy comments remind me so much of a General Manager of a sports team the day before they trade their player they have so much faith in?

you mean they can all meet under the same culvert?

Phone booth.   The new kind.

They don't even call it the "left"  caucus, they call it the nano-caucus.

NorthReport wrote:

Yea, it's so much better when you screw over the people that you're polite about it.

Hatred towards people you disagree with is also a political decision.

Basic human decency is still important in politics, even in our age of cynical wedge issues and hyper-partisanship. One of the things that differentiates the NDP from the Conservatives is the higher level of civility in the NDP. You can tell a lot about a party by its level of civility.  The Conservatives have perfected the art of personal destruction. It's hard to believe there was once a time when Broadbent, Trudeau, and Clark would publicly show respect for each other. This mutual respect helped people believe in the political process and the possibilities of collective action. But the advent of the Reform Party changed all that. The neo-CONS have brought a much greater level of meaness to our political landscape.

But most Canadians have continued to shun the politics of personal destruction. If there's one thing that's kept Harper from a majority, it's been his crude partisanship. In contrast to the neo-CONS, the NDP should show Canadians that the NDP acts in the interests of all Canadians.

This requires treating all Canadians with civility, be they NDP, BQ, Liberal, or Conservative.

JKR, I think you are right.  Extreme partisanship is never attractive, even if it is in the service of righting old wrongs.

I think a constant campaign in the House of civility would dovetail nicely with Jack's "lets get back to work" campaign.  It conveys a certain maturity and confidence that has the added benefit of infuriating ones opponents.

bekayne wrote:

Actually, the lowest the Liberals polled with Dion as leader was 21% when they were tied with the NDP.

I wasn't aware of that! Still, Iggy's 23% is pretty close to Dion's low water mark.

She sounds to me like the person that should be leading the LPC, not Iggy.