I think this is an example of where Layton NOT publicly endorsing Pantalone would be more of a story than him doing it. Also, Jack Layton's son Mike is running for city council in Pantalone's old ward against some rightwing sportswriter backed by the Ianno crowd - you can be sure than Pantalone will return the favour by endorsing Mike Layton as well.
Rob Ford: Toronto should be a refugee-free zone
Tue, 2010-08-24 16:02
#52
Tue, 2010-08-24 16:18
#53
Who is this Ianno-backed candidate in Ward 19?
I'm supporting Karen Sun in that ward.
Tue, 2010-08-24 16:42
#54
RevolutionPlease
Sean McCormack from Rogers Sportsnet Connected broadcasts.
Tue, 2010-08-24 22:35
#55
Who is this Ianno-backed candidate in Ward 19?
I'm supporting Karen Sun in that ward.
She is not a serious contender - a vote for her will just make it more likely that Smitherman's puppet will win.
Wed, 2010-08-25 01:21
#56
What's the matter with Toronto? 
http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/article/851914--mallick-...
Wed, 2010-08-25 07:01
#57
I like Cueball's original take on the Ford-Smitherman split. And unless Ford admits to something really heinous at this point, it appears he's going to win. I've yet to read or see anything on Smitherman that makes him sound like he's actively engaged in politics beyond "I have the credentials and pedigree to be Mayor."
What is the average voter turn out for a Toronto mayoral race? And if there's an anti-Ford backlash, where will it come from?
To TP's point re Ford and some of his legal issues, PR, and media. I imagine someone from Smitherman's camp, or an opposition camp, leaked the info. Or it was always known and it became convienient to publish the story at the time. The influence of modern PR in news media is less about digging up dirt than it is in simply supressing information or managing it, gatekeeper style. It's a rare large business or organization, including the NDP, which does not employ PR or communications people, who's job it is to try and influence the media in various ways. There are definitely more people employed in PR and communications than in news gathering, and I know for a fact which camp gets paid significantly more. Arrive at your own conclusions.
Wed, 2010-08-25 08:23
#58
http://www.torontosun.com/comment/columnists/sueann_levy/2010/08/24/15129106.html
Whats wrong with the integrity commissioner?
Thu, 2010-08-26 12:34
#59
Toronto mayoral candidate Rob Ford has been ordered to repay thousands of dollars in charitable donations.
City council ordered the move on Wednesday - less than a week after the city's integrity commissioner found the outspoken councilor had breached the rules of conduct by using his office letterhead to seek contributions for the Rob Ford Football Foundation.
It's believed Ford will have to repay about $3,000.
Fri, 2010-08-27 09:54
#60
writer
[url=http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/torontomayoralrace/article/853234--yours... vaguely, Rob Ford[/url]
I am so tempted to quote from this piece, but I don't want to spoil the fun.
Fri, 2010-08-27 10:19
#61
Heather Mallick on Rob Ford
http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/article/851914--mallick-...
Fri, 2010-08-27 10:34
#62
writer
(The same piece was linked to @ post #55.)
Fri, 2010-08-27 12:12
#63
Rob Ford is Mr. Popular at city hall
Fri, 2010-08-27 12:49
#64
remind
[url=http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/torontomayoralrace/article/853234--yours... vaguely, Rob Ford[/url]I am so tempted to quote from this piece, but I don't want to spoil the fun.
Oh now that is funny......
Looking for...Rob Ford? Try emailing him.
...Cathie Besso...sending the mayoral frontrunner an email asking him what he plans to do about bike lanes in the city.
She received a form letter, first thanking the Beach resident for passing along her concerns.
But what struck her as odd was the second paragraph, written in bold.
"Insert vague response on policy," it read.
Huh?
In what was presumably an error, there was no actual response to her question. Only the word "vague" staring her in the face, and then a request to fill out a questionnaire.
Sun, 2010-08-29 05:48
#65
dandmb50
I do believe Rob Ford has a populist appeal, the fact that he was charged with DUI actually made him more human or imperfect. Archie Bunker had a populist appeal, while he said a lot of disasteful things people might not say or disagree with, many people liked him, even some non white people and women. There are alot of people who will vote for someone who ``tell it like it is.`` Think Howard Stern.
Alot of immigrants and non white people support Rob Ford, i think it is a dead end and only serves to increase his popularity by pulling the immigrant card. George Smitherman is an idiot for putting words in Ford`s mouth, he didnt actually say anything racist, even though his implications might be racist.
I actually think the statement about "non-white people" is racisit, because it is suggesting that white people are somehow the "supreme beings" or something.
I never really paid much attention to politics before but no matter what anyone says with this mayoral race, a lot more people are interested. I'm not convinced that Ford is the best, because a lot can happen in two months, and with Ford's track record, anything is possible, but he's looking pretty good so far. Every time the Star dumps on him he gains popularity. But what's the alternative, Smitherman - $1 Billion? I don't think so.
I have always thought that is what has always been so great about Toronto, the fact that we are made up from people all around the world and we all seem to get along. We went to visit my sister in Michigan a few years back and couldn't figure out what was different and then it finally hit me, it was all white people, no multi-culture. That is our strength, and I for one, never want to lose that. And by the way, I am white. Make sure you go out and vote this year, no matter who you vote for. I'm still undecided.
Daniel .. Toronto
Sun, 2010-08-29 09:07
#66
Maysie
If Rob Ford wins I don't know what I'm gonna do. Ditto Smitherman.
But here's a question that I'd like to hear Cueball's thoughts on specifically, and of course anyone else's. This is driving me slightly kooky trying to figure it out.
While I get the "regular guy" schtick of Ford's alleged appeal, Toronto is 50% people of colour and close to 50% immigrants (first and second generations). Some of these folks are in that (sob!) 32% quoted in post #42. The Canadian "hoser" white guy, the equivalent of the "good ol boy" USian trope, somehow has traction????
If someone has any theories I really would like to hear them.
Sun, 2010-08-29 09:25
#67
Cueball
I actually think the statement about "non-white people" is racisit because, it is suggesting that white people are somehow the "supreme beings" or something.
No. It just indicates that white people have inherited a superior political and economic position that is inherited from the days of the great European empires, and has now been transformed into the new world order, which is for the most part, still run by white people of European origin.
It reflects the fact that there is a real historical political and economic divide that has real implications and meaning for relations between white people and non-white people.
Sun, 2010-08-29 09:30
#68
Cueball
Sun, 2010-08-29 09:43
#69
Cueball
Good point.
Sun, 2010-08-29 10:16
#70
Maysie
Yeah Cueball. I think I knew that and didn't want to face it. Damn.
Um Daniel, when you say "people who buy cottages" do you mean white people?
And by "all kinds of people from Toronto" do you mean people of colour?
And if you meant your piece to be a high-level critique of how the colonists and their lackeys feel about who was here first (which is wrong by the way), then well done. Otherwise, you might want to look at a few of the assumptions you've got going on.
Sun, 2010-08-29 11:00
#71
Yeah, I know. Muskoka on Simcoe Day as a way of getting away from those Caribana gang-bangers. That schtick.
But seriously, I'd be cautious about over-framing Rob Ford's "white trash" appeal--in fact, I'm wondering if there's also a non-white/Anglo pro-Ford critical mass, small business owners and the like who came to Canada for "freedom" and who also like the tough-on-crime message, and who--let's face it--themselves don't have very much in common with the inner-city left-liberal (and, I regret to say, heavily "white", albeit in the Christian Lander/Stuff White People Like sense) cabal.
Paradoxically, Rob Ford's become the Stuff White People Hate candidate. He ain't got a whiff of Trinity-Bellwoods about him (except, maybe, when the annual Portuguese festival takes place there, cheesy carny rides and all)
Sun, 2010-08-29 14:41
#72
He ain't got a whiff of Alexandra Park about him either.
Sun, 2010-08-29 15:01
#73
Like it or not, there's a strong perception that the Toronto suburbs have been ignored by the current mayor and council in favour of projects downtown. From the perspective of Mr and Mrs Middle-Class-Homeowner in Scarborough, North York or Etobicoke more has been done to them than for them. It doesn't hurt Rob Ford that these are people who bother to vote in local elections.
Sun, 2010-08-29 15:12
#74
dandmb50
This reminds me of people who buy cottages up north in Muskoka and they love it, because it is away from the city and in "God's Counrty" and very peacefull. But the problem arises when they get the cottage and then all of a sudden there are all kinds of people from the Toronto moving into their nice quiet area and they want to cut off people from moving in.
"We found this quiet spot and we don't want anyone else moving in, we found it first" but we must allow others to benifit from our way of life and whether it's a cottage up north or just moving to Toronto as a refugee, we must show compassion and help those who need help which makes our city a better place. Will this include dead beats, yes, but we must help those that will be an asset to our city and will return the opportunity 10 fold. We all had a chance, don't deny others the same opportunity even if they are from other countries.
Daniel .. Toronto
Sun, 2010-08-29 15:15
#75
Of course this is also a total myth. By any objective standard tax revenue gets raised in downtown Toronto and tends to get spent in the 'burbs. If the old City of Toronto seceded from Toronto and created a doughnut hole - the first thing that would happen would be the suburban shell declaring bankruptcy because they would lose all the massive revenue from downtown businesses and condos etc...
On top of that under Miller, the city has actually spent a fortune on "neighbourhoods at risk" almost all of which are in downtroden parts of Scarborough and Etobicoke etc...and Transit City is all about massively expanding TTC access in the suburbs!
Sun, 2010-08-29 15:29
#76
Like it or not, there's a strong perception that the Toronto suburbs have been ignored by the current mayor and council in favour of projects downtown. From the perspective of Mr and Mrs Middle-Class-Homeowner in Scarborough, North York or Etobicoke more has been done to them than for them. It doesn't hurt Rob Ford that these are people who bother to vote in local elections.
Similar perceptions exist in the peripheral zones of Queens and Staten Island in New York and the San Fernando Valley in Los Angeles.
Sun, 2010-08-29 18:23
#77
On top of that under Miller, the city has actually spent a fortune on "neighbourhoods at risk" almost all of which are in downtroden parts of Scarborough and Etobicoke etc...and Transit City is all about massively expanding TTC access in the suburbs!
And Transit City to Etobicoke and Scarborough will almost certainly be cancelled under a Ford mayoralty. How is denying residents access to rapid transit helping them?
Sun, 2010-08-29 18:24
#78
Smitherman said if Canada had turned down refugees in the past, it would never have absorbed the Irish during the potato famine or Jews during the Holocaust.
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/torontomayoralrace/article/849139--mayor...
Smitherman should be *very* careful about using history, especially in context of Jews fleeing Nazi oppression. A grand total of 5,000 Jews were taken in by Canada in the period 1933-1948. For comparison, Britain took 70,000 and the US 200,000 (source: Irving Abella and Harold Troper, None Is Too Many: Canada and the Jews of Europe, 1933-1948 (1982)). This was in no small part due the craven opportunism of Mackenzie King, who pandered to anti-semites for votes. He was the man who said that while he detested Nazism and its hatred of Jews, he remarked of Hitler, "[he] will rank some day with Joan of Arc among the deliverers of his people". He was the head of the cabinet who maintained an unofficial ban on all Jewish refugees from Nazi Germany. This led to Canadian authorities turning away the S.S. St. Louis, a ship packed with Jewish refugees fleeing the Nazis, from Halifax harbour in 1939. The ship then returned to mainland Europe, where it docked in Antwerp. Many refugees were unable to escape when the Nazis moved in a year later.
Canada *has* turned away refugees in the past, including Jews in the most desperate of circumstances. And this was all in order to pander to the racist tendencies of some sections of Canadian society at that time.
I refuse to accept, use or carry a $50 bill for this reason.
Sun, 2010-08-29 18:36
#79
Maysie
Charges dropped 2 months later. You'll never guess why. The wife had some "credibility issues".
Fucking hell fuck.
Sun, 2010-08-29 21:02
#80
Cueball, Ford wants me dead (as a cyclist and anti-car activist). Didn't you see the shithead's clip on how it was cyclists' own fault if we were killed by cars?
Not that I support Smitherman either. Pantalone also said some dreadful things (not that I spend my days following Toronto politics). But Ford is a fucking Nazi.
Sun, 2010-08-29 21:48
#81
I didn't read the poll originally, and I can't find it now. I have to really wonder how the poll was conducted, to give the numbers it does, for the reasons Maysie points out.
Maybe POC make up nearly 50% of Toronto's population, but what percentage do they make up of Toronto's "likely voters"? I tend to think that maybe they represent a low likely voter percentage, and the poll was of likely voters?
Ford's support does seem rather inexplicable. Even from a white guy populist perspective, he's got to be pushing a lot of looney buttons with people.
Or it could be that people, no matter who they are, are just not listening to negative stuff in the media. Maybe they just chaulk it up to slur or spin. Maybe, like me, they figure Ford just can't buy his way out of trouble, like Smitherman and that underneath it all, Smitherman's likely just as bad, only it's kept out of the press.
Maybe it's a case that when confronted with smarm, people will opt for the guy next door smarm flavour rather than the high powered flavour of smarm Smitherman represents and we're all so very tired of.
Ford. I swear he's the corporeal version of Eric Cartman.
Sun, 2010-08-29 21:58
#82
And Transit City to Etobicoke and Scarborough will almost certainly be cancelled under a Ford mayoralty. How is denying residents access to rapid transit helping them?
Because Ford's big supporters in the burbs tend not to be transit users?
Sun, 2010-08-29 22:19
#83
Ford appeals to the (real and wannabe) ugly-McMansion-teardown class. And you can see these days in much of Toronto--they rule.
Oh, and the heritage-issues debate is on the 30th (tomorrow) at St Lawrence Hall.
Sun, 2010-08-29 22:59
#84
Maybe POC make up nearly 50% of Toronto's population, but what percentage do they make up of Toronto's "likely voters"? I tend to think that maybe they represent a low likely voter percentage, and the poll was of likely voters?
Ford's support does seem rather inexplicable. Even from a white guy populist perspective, he's got to be pushing a lot of looney buttons with people.
Keep in mind that Ford's own ward in Etobicoke North is very poor and has a very large Somali population and yet he keeps getting elected there by huge majorities - so someone is voting for him.
Sun, 2010-08-29 23:21
#85
It also has a large Italian and anglo working class homeowner population there...and turnout in municipal elections is very low. So who knows if lots of Somalis are turning out to vote for Ford?
Sun, 2010-08-29 23:59
#86
evidently they are not turning out to vote against him either!
Mon, 2010-08-30 00:47
#87
a clear "privatizing" union busting agenda. What Smitherman will be trying to do to the TTC (privitization) and the garbage workers (privitization anti-strike contracts), McGuinty will be doing to the provincial workers such as the teachers and various government support workers, when the contract comes up in a couple of years.
Do you have citations for these things?
By and large, I think Smitherman's Wait Times Strategy and Green Energy Act were effective? Is there something I'm unaware of? I can't see at all how he could be worse than Ford. (FWIW, when Harper won a minority the first time, I also thought he would be so ineffective as to be preferable to Martin. How wrong was I!)
(On the whole, I'm pro-McGuinty, which may place me in the minority on this board, I'm not sure. While remaining pro-business and reasonably fiscally responsible, the provincial Liberals have significantly raised the minimum wage -- my American friends only dream of a minimum wage above $10/h, doubled the number of community health centres [which are great ime], made real progress on green energy, continued supporting culture effectively, and brought much-needed infrastructure to Windsor. Their handling of G20 security was horrible and would be inexcusable if there were any credible progressive alternative in Ontario. Our universities are in crisis but they are beginning to deal with the issue. I have confidence that Glen Murray will be quite good and progressive in research and innovation. If Hudak wins next year, I think we'll start to see wistful pining for the McGuinty days.:P)
Mon, 2010-08-30 03:37
#88
Cueball
a clear "privatizing" union busting agenda. What Smitherman will be trying to do to the TTC (privitization) and the garbage workers (privitization anti-strike contracts), McGuinty will be doing to the provincial workers such as the teachers and various government support workers, when the contract comes up in a couple of years.
Do you have citations for these things?
George Smitherman Campaign Website:
Garbage Collection: Putting Service FirstWe all remember last year's unnecessary garbage strike-with George Smitherman as Toronto Mayor, that will not happen again. As part of his commitment to Service First, George Smitherman will consider the contracting out of solid waste and recycling collection services on an area-by-area basis, where service levels can be enhanced at similar or lower cost. It is up to Torontonians to say whether the service is good or needs improvement. Citizen panels would be involved in advising on service levels or evaluating bids. Any outside contractors bidding or hired would be subject to a new No Strike rule.
George Smitherman will contract with the private sector to partner on the construction of additional transit capacity in a design, build and finance model. This model is similar to the mortgage model used by many of us to achieve home ownership before we have the money to pay the full purchase price. Under the terms of the arrangement, the TTC - and by extension the people of Toronto - would be the customer. Once the lines are completed, the City will have an annual financial obligation that will be met through the establishment of the Transit Trust.
These are major pieces of Smitherman's campaign, I am not sure why you feel so enamoured of him, when you don't actually know what he is supporting.
Cueball, Ford wants me dead (as a cyclist and anti-car activist). Didn't you see the shithead's clip on how it was cyclists' own fault if we were killed by cars? Not that I support Smitherman either. Pantalone also said some dreadful things (not that I spend my days following Toronto politics). But Ford is a fucking Nazi.
A Safer Community for the self-confessed "tough on crime" candidate, more cops but also more Big Brother:
It is no secret that the federal government is spending approximately $1 billion on Toronto's G20 Summit, with much of this focused on security-things like closed circuit cameras placed strategically downtown. Toronto should benefit from this. George Smitherman will press the federal government to donate the G20 cameras to Toronto Police Service. They will be sited according to Torontonians' needs, after consultation with elected officials, citizens and advice from the police. They will be used not to spy on people, but to better protect ourcitizens and visitors and to deter criminal behaviour.ces of the Smitherman campaign.
Where Ford is fascist up front and simple, and he wears it on his sleeve, there is nothing in Smitherman's attack on labour, privacy and civil rights that really distinguishes him from Ford on a policy level, and when it comes down to it, given his overt connections with Queens Park, Smitherman can succeed where Ford will fail.
As Howard Moscoe put it: "Ford wont be able to pass gas" at city council.
Mon, 2010-08-30 10:59
#89
"when Harper won a minority the first time, I also thought he would be so ineffective as to be preferable to Martin. How wrong was I!"
There is no comparison whatsoever between the powers of a Canadian PM who has tot dictatorial control of his own caucus, has MASSIVE executive powers etc... and a Toronto mayor who has no party behind him, very limited executive powers etc...also, Harper in Ottawa has thrived on the fact that if the opposition voted down one of his budgets we would be into an election. If Ford were mayor, city council could systematically vote down every single thing he ever proposed for the next four years and there would be nothing he could do about it. There is no way to force early municipal elections!
Mon, 2010-08-30 11:04
#90
Are we sure that a Ford administration would not have a lot of councillors on his side? The same people who would vote for Ford might also vote for similarly-minded councillors.
Mon, 2010-08-30 11:11
#91
We have no party system so he has no "slate" and in any case, Ford is so personally abrasive that most of the rightwingers on council hate his guts personally. You may have noticed that virtually no one on council has actually endorsed him for that reason.
Mon, 2010-08-30 11:16
#92
They threw smiles his way. They laughed at his jokes.
Rob Ford isn't typically the popular guy at city council meetings, but with the right-wing writing on the wall, the race to capture the possible mayor-in-waiting's affection has begun.
Publicly, his fellow councillors have softened their criticisms. Privately, they have begun lobbying for powerful roles in a Ford administration.
Mon, 2010-08-30 12:16
#93
Cueball: I didn't say or imply that I was enamoured of Smitherman. I was just asking for more information since I haven't lived in Toronto in five years and hadn't followed this race closely. (So thanks for that!) His provincial cabinet record had suggested to me that he would be much better (or at least less bad) than Ford and, while you've made some strong points, he still appears to me to be the lesser evil. Again, I haven't been following the situation closely.
Mon, 2010-08-30 12:34
#94
I think more has been made of Ford's comment than is justified, and portraying it as a racist comment is missing the target.* Just because many people (including myself) strongly disagree with Ford on many levels, name-calling is counterproductive at best. I believe Ford is a fiscal conservative at heart. He'll go along with social conservatives when it suits him, but he could take or leave their concerns. Where Ford did screw up was not following up his comments with a call for more funding from the province and the feds to help Toronto out, as Toronto is clearly going to be the destination of choice for many refugees. Sadly, Ford is never going to admit that the city needs to work out better funding with the province and the feds, because that would undercut his entire raison d'etre.
* As I pointed out earlier, he isn't the only one in that little exchange to come out with his reputation tarnished.
Mon, 2010-08-30 13:10
#95
Cueball
Cueball: I didn't say or imply that I was enamoured of Smitherman. I was just asking for more information since I haven't lived in Toronto in five years and hadn't followed this race closely. (So thanks for that!) His provincial cabinet record had suggested to me that he would be much better (or at least less bad) than Ford and, while you've made some strong points, he still appears to me to be the lesser evil. Again, I haven't been following the situation closely.
How so? Smitherman has a clearly articulated agenda, we can see it for what it is. Ford talking points are almost all rhetorical. When it comes down to action, the fact is that Ford would have to pursue an agenda simillar to Smitherman's in order to move from rhetoric to action. Yes, he says offensive things, but what more can he realistically do that Smitherman isn't already takling about doing?
Mon, 2010-08-30 14:30
#96
About the only "saving grace" for Smitherman MIGHT be that if he gets really desparate to get Pantalone supporters to back him etc... we could get him to go on record taking some progressive positions etc...as much as i detest Smitherman as a person, he was Barbara Hall's Chief of Staff and he is backed by a couple (literally a couple) of people who's opinion I respect like Pam McConnell.
Wed, 2010-09-01 11:02
#97
Rob Ford wins key scumbag endorsement
Dimitri the Lover. Creep, sure. Leaver of awful voicemail messages, that too. Film star, unfortunately. Villain, undoubtedly. But kingmaker?
Wed, 2010-09-01 11:07
#98
Dimitri who?
Wed, 2010-09-01 20:43
#99
Tue, 2010-09-07 12:27
#100
Yuck.
Tue, 2010-09-07 12:40
#101
Maysie
What an appropriate way to end this long thread.
I second the yuck.