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Toronto council races part 4
Thu, 2010-10-21 14:05
#1
Toronto council races part 4
Thu, 2010-10-21 14:07
#2
[url=http://www.nowtoronto.com/guides/voteto/2010/story.cfm?content=177401]NOW endorses nepotism in Ward 19[/url]
Sun boasts a great resumé of lefty causes on women’s and environmental issues and enjoys the backing of noted NDPers like Judy Rebick, Tam Goossen and Winnie Ng. Ditto for environmentalist Layton, whose roster of backers includes the outgoing local councillor and wannabe mayor Joe Pantalone. Pants’s nod tips the scales slightly in Layton’s favour, all the other variables (like Layton being the son of the federal NDP leader Jack) aside. Thirty years of service in the area has to count for something.
Some great stuff in the comments section.
Thu, 2010-10-21 18:07
#3
Most of the negative comments about Mike Layton in the comment section are from people who also take the opportunity to dump on Joe Pantalone and go on about what a terrible city councillor he is and attack him for being a major figure in the Miller administration. Makes me suspect many of those comments are from Sean McCormick's people who know that the best way for him to win is to try to engineer a split in the progressive vote and cokme up the middle.
Thu, 2010-10-21 20:17
#4
Cueball
Fine by me if Layton loses. Good to spank the NDP for nepotism. The NDP has to understand that it may have to lose a few to build a more inclusive movement. Talk is cheap. The NDP needs to walk the walk.
There is nothing progressive about dividing the movement, and undermining the campaigns of non-white community activists.
Thu, 2010-10-21 20:24
#5
Yes, let's "teach the NDP a lesson" for daring to run a candidate in Ward 19 - can't let that happen can we? Just like how we "taught Bob Rae a lesson" by electing Mike Harris (one of these days maybe Bob can tell us what exactly was the lesson he learned).
Thu, 2010-10-21 20:38
#6
Cueball
The lesson we learned is that the NDP is not very good at learning lessons.
There is a reason that 99% of all people who show up to NDP meetings are aging white people, whereas Liberal meetings are full of young enthusisatic non-white people. Even the Ford camp has a number of non-white candidates in the running.
Thu, 2010-10-21 21:09
#7
There is a reason that 99% of all people who show up to NDP meetings are aging white people, whereas Liberal meetings are full of young enthusisatic non-white people. Even the Ford camp has a number of non-white candidates in the running.
Speaking as an NDP supporter, I find it quite problematic that the NDP caucus has less ethnic diversity than even the federal Conservatives.
Thu, 2010-10-21 21:17
#8
It's important to keep in mind that Karen Sun is an independent. However the NDP has backed progressive candidates who weren't party members before. Lots of NDPers backing Jonah Schein in Davenport - but as far as I know he's not a party member.
Stockholm may be right that the anti-Pantalone comments may be coming from McCormick's people. But so what? The question is who is a better candidate - Karen Sun or Mike Layton?
Thu, 2010-10-21 21:19
#9
That's going to change very soon. In a few weeks the NDP is almost certain to add Kevin Chief who is FN when the byelection happens in Wpg-North and there the NDP has an all star cast of FN candidates lined up for the next election several of whom are in highly winnable ridings. We also have an Afro-Canadian - Gordon Earle running in highly winnable South Shore St. Margarets and we have an Indo-Canadian candidate in Surrey North who will be heavily favoured to win back that seat - just to name a few.
I'm not aware of there being a "Ford Party" running. Where do I get the list of his candidates?? I know that the NDP has endorsed a Chinese-Canadian lesbian in Toronto Centre and is running nothing but women in all the east end wards...but let's not let the facts get in the way of rhetoric.
Thu, 2010-10-21 21:20
#10
The question is who is a better candidate - Karen Sun or Mike Layton?
We'll know the answer to that on Monday when we see which of them gets more votes.
Thu, 2010-10-21 21:30
#11
writer
Wow. Stockholm. Does that mean left candidates who have lost the horserace in any given election were lesser candidates compared to the winners?
Or is it more likely that they didn't have an equivalent machine backing them?
Seriously, there are many days when I wonder if you are a plant set up to drive people out of the party.
Thu, 2010-10-21 21:35
#12
I'm not aware of there being a "Ford Party" running. Where do I get the list of his candidates??
Well, here's the most notorious of all Ford endorsees, and he happens to be non-white to boot
http://www.wendellbrereton.com/
Oh, speaking of Ward 6, I'm truly puzzled that Now "endorsed" Mark Grimes, as if Michael Laxer or even Jem Cain meant nothing...
Thu, 2010-10-21 21:39
#13
Oh, speaking of Ward 6, I'm truly puzzled that Now "endorsed" Mark Grimes, as if Michael Laxer or even Jem Cain meant nothing...
It's pretty outrageous.
Thu, 2010-10-21 22:04
#14
Well, here's the most notorious of all Ford endorsees, and he happens to be non-white to boot
FWIW three of the most odious homophobic extreme rightwingers running serious campaigns in this election are Afro-Canadians - such as the aforementioned Wendell Brereton, Rob David and Michael Thompson.
Thu, 2010-10-21 22:35
#15
Makes me suspect many of those comments are from Sean McCormick's people who know that the best way for him to win is to try to engineer a split in the progressive vote and cokme up the middle.
I loved NOW's comment re:McCormick: "More dud than dude." Made my day, and I don't even live in the ward or know the guy.
Thu, 2010-10-21 22:37
#16
While there is no official Ford party...but there is a distinct coalition of interests that have gathered around him. His followers have put out feelers to defeat his enemies without implicating the man himself (in the classic, it was not me but my advisor/friend who did it). Also, very early on he formed a like-minded caucus called the Toronto Party - www.thetorontoparty.com then check out our candidates which included the usual suspects - who had their hate-on for Miller & Miller allies.
Ford has been doing the classic Canadian tactic - one is not engaging in politics instead keep it abstract and unrealistic by promising a backwards utopia...where everything that Miller did was black and Ford will ride the White horse into victory by saying that he is not Miller.
Funny enough, that is how the different wantabee councilors have all behaved - which tells you something about the state of the Left or even the Liberal idea in Toronto. They never sought a broader base. They allowed bigotry and hatred cloud the imagination of the city - for all the talk of creativity & green ideas - they only captured the imagination because it was still better than the alternative in good times.
Now, that the times have turned to the bad again, we can expect a swing again to the Right. The only way to counter the politics of hate - is a politics of love.
Fri, 2010-10-22 01:26
#17
Cueball
Well, here's the most notorious of all Ford endorsees, and he happens to be non-white to boot
FWIW three of the most odious homophobic extreme rightwingers running serious campaigns in this election are Afro-Canadians - such as the aforementioned Wendell Brereton, Rob David and Michael Thompson.
Yes. Exactly. The right, in this case Ford, has managed to activate and develop many regressive leaders in immigrant communities. However, the NDP has been pretty much hapless at developing similar progressive contacts in those communities. Perhaps that has something to do with the fact that the NDP has no problem undermining the progressive leadership in those communities whenever it seems to best suit the interests of the white anglo clique that runs the NDP.
Of course, the defence of this suppression of non-white progressives by the NDP is usually justified by allusions to racist stereotypes about Afro-Canadians being homophobic and sexist like the right wing leadership in these communities as if they are representative of these communities in total. Far be it for the NDP to do anything proactive like reach out to those people in those communities who are progressive, and supporting them, as opposed to squashing them every time it is expedient politically for the "greater good".
I imagine by now many non-white progressive folks are wondering when the NDP will get around to supporting the "greater good" inside its own organization. The NDP's idea of "inclusion" seems to be getting non-white people help white people get elected, so that they can say nice things about how bad bigotry is.
Fri, 2010-10-22 01:52
#18
Lard Tunderin Jeezus
Well worth repeating, in view of the divisive nonsense being spewed here:
That's going to change very soon. In a few weeks the NDP is almost certain to add Kevin Chief who is FN when the byelection happens in Wpg-North and there the NDP has an all star cast of FN candidates lined up for the next election several of whom are in highly winnable ridings. We also have an Afro-Canadian - Gordon Earle running in highly winnable South Shore St. Margarets and we have an Indo-Canadian candidate in Surrey North who will be heavily favoured to win back that seat - just to name a few.
I'm not aware of there being a "Ford Party" running. Where do I get the list of his candidates?? I know that the NDP has endorsed a Chinese-Canadian lesbian in Toronto Centre and is running nothing but women in all the east end wards...but let's not let the facts get in the way of rhetoric.
Fri, 2010-10-22 02:01
#19
Lard Tunderin Jeezus
And Cueball?
On some topics, you're an ally, and have much to contribute here. On the topic of the NDP, or in this case the 'NDP-aligned', you are not.
And you are not, as you see yourself, engaged in constructive criticism. You are engaged in all-out attack. You are turning into a foaming-at-the-mouth hatemonger, to whom truth means nothing - so long as your target is damaged by the salvo.
Please consider not speaking on the topic of the NDP in the future.
Fri, 2010-10-22 02:12
#20
writer
Would Stockholm promise to do the same? Because, you know, ironically, it has been Stockholm who has steadily badmouthed Pantalone while Cueball has not only actively defended him, but actively supported his campaign. For example.
And yes, I know Stockholm has made a to-do about throwing a few bucks to Joe, enduring a number of campaign phone calls and even (!) voting for the guy.
Edited to add: I've objected to some of Cueball's overgeneralizations (hint hint: I am a member of the NDP), however this is waaaaaaay over the top, unconstructive rhetoric in its own right:
And you are not, as you see yourself, engaged in constructive criticism. You are engaged in all-out attack. You are turning into a foaming-at-the-mouth hatemonger, to whom truth means nothing - so long as your target is damaged by the salvo.
Fri, 2010-10-22 02:23
#21
Cueball
Yes, I see that the NDP is perfectly capable of running non-white candidates in ridings where it is advantageous to do some times, in order to exploit the ethnic charachter of the community. What I do not see is the NDP running non-white candidates in wards and ridings where the strength of the NDP organization can act to support that person, when the riding or ward is not overwhellmingly of a specific ethnic charachter. There might be a few tokens out there in unwiinable ridings, where the NDP is weak, but in ridings where the NDP is strong, no such luck.
The Karen Sun example is perfect. Tam Gossen being bounced from ward 20 in 2006 another example. Nepotism in the first case, patronage in the second.
The NDP could do with losing a few just to show that it has some commitment to the ideals it professess. Indeed, lose a few today, and win more tomorrow because it proves its credentials, build links in communities and acts to empower the disenfranchised as opposed to diminishing them.
I really have no interest in being an ally of the NDP. Why should I be? It's mostly pretty disgusting overall. I have no reason to do anything but criticize it when its progressive pretensions, seem to be little more than pretensions.
Fri, 2010-10-22 02:34
#22
writer
The simple fact is that, until the NDP comes somewhere close to 50% representation for women and at least 10 - 15 - 20% people of colour, what Cueball has written above has legs.
Perhaps an uncomfortable truth, but one borne out by the results.
Sure, a lot of energy can be spent rationalizing and defending. It would be more interesting, challenging and hopeful if the party actually *did* something that resulted in *tangible results* ... soon.
Fri, 2010-10-22 03:24
#23
RevolutionPlease
Hear, hear, writer.
Fri, 2010-10-22 07:03
#24
I don't live in Toronto or even Canada any more, but once did, hence live in a weird space-time warp of knowing the Toronto civic scene in great detail for long-age epochs -- Mayor Denison's decline, the upsurge of Phil Givens, the radical Sowell and Jaffery vs the developers, David Crombie's slick pamphlets and campaign .... then the 1980s came, I left town and since then can barely match the subsequent mayors and their decades
However, reading this Globe "endorsement"" editorial, it has to be very bad in TO, as the Globe set a new world record for lukewarm political endorsements, in this case for Smitherman:
Mr. Ford and Mr. Smitherman have similarly unpersuasive and unsatisfactory platforms. In the end, Mr. Smitherman's ability to get things done makes him the better candidate; Torontonians may have to live in hope that he tries to do the right things, and that he comes to see the city's financial predicament as the fight of his life. The electors of Toronto should guardedly opt for George Smitherman.
Fri, 2010-10-22 09:15
#25
Yes, I see that the NDP is perfectly capable of running non-white candidates in ridings where it is advantageous to do some times, in order to exploit the ethnic charachter of the community. What I do not see is the NDP running non-white candidates in wards and ridings where the strength of the NDP organization can act to support that person, when the riding or ward is not overwhellmingly of a specific ethnic charachter. There might be a few tokens out there in unwiinable ridings, where the NDP is weak, but in ridings where the NDP is strong, no such luck.
The Karen Sun example is perfect. Tam Gossen being bounced from ward 20 in 2006 another example. Nepotism in the first case, patronage in the second.
I guess you don't talk about Olivia Chow because she totally flies in the face of your theory. Or let me get this straight - if the NDP runs a candidate from a minority group that is a major part of the demographic makeup of a riding (ie: running an Indo-Canadian in Surrey North) - it doesn't count. If the NDP runs a candidate from a minority group in a riding where the party traditionallly does not win - it doesn't count. and if the NDP runs a minority candidate in a very winnable riding where there are actually not that many voters from the group that the candidate is from in the riding (ie: Olivia Chow, Kevin Chief, Goprdon Earle etc...) it also doesn't count because (I suppose) its just tokenism. There is no winning with you. Since you seem to think the Liberal party is so welcoming of minorities - maybe you should join the Liberal party and pratice your "entryism" there and see if you can stage a "hostile takeover" and turn it into a Trostskyist party??
Fri, 2010-10-22 09:37
#26
Cueball
Why don't you go there rather than bringing your Reform Party "entryism" here on this "progressive" board and in parties that are supposed to hava a "social democratic" focus?
I only found out about the term "entryism" just the other day, but I know what trolling and red-baiting and provoacateur bullshit is. As for a hostile takeover, what precisly is there to take over? I have been looking for some kind of NDP organization in Trinity Spadina for about a month now, and I have seen nary a soul.
My time would be better spent trying to organize in a Tim Horton's. At least there would be people in it.
Fri, 2010-10-22 10:03
#27
If that's the case - why don't you run as a Socialist Workers/Anti-Zionist party candidate in Trinity-Spadina in the next election? If the NDP is really so non-existent - it should be a simple task to win the seat with the army of people to the left of the NDP that you apparently have access to.
Fri, 2010-10-22 10:13
#28
Cueball
You really think that Barry Weislader's critque of Pantalone candidacy was so effective that it got the NDP to stand down on his campaign?
Fri, 2010-10-22 10:21
#29
Yes, I see that the NDP is perfectly capable of running non-white candidates in ridings where it is advantageous to do some times, in order to exploit the ethnic charachter of the community. What I do not see is the NDP running non-white candidates in wards and ridings where the strength of the NDP organization can act to support that person, when the riding or ward is not overwhellmingly of a specific ethnic charachter. There might be a few tokens out there in unwiinable ridings, where the NDP is weak, but in ridings where the NDP is strong, no such luck.
The Karen Sun example is perfect. Tam Gossen being bounced from ward 20 in 2006 another example. Nepotism in the first case, patronage in the second.
Yes, but Helen Kennedy *lost* despite having the backing of the NDP machine because Adam Vaughan was a more formidable candidate and was able to assemble a more effective team behind him (and because many of Goosen's supporters either did not work during the election or joined Vaughan's team. The votes haven't been counted and we may end up with a surprise but at the moment it looks like Sun, for all her community credentials, hasn't been able to attract a large enough campaign victory to give her victory (or possibly even put her in the top two if signs are any indication). I rode on the Ossington bus again yesterday from the top to the bottom ofthe ward and I only saw two Karen Sun signs - she's being outsigned not only by Layton but by two other candidates. Layton is being helped by the NDP machine, obviously, but as we saw in Kennedy's case, that isn't automatically enough in a downtown ward if there is an opponent who is better able to mobilise progressive community support.
If Sun loses it's not Layton's fault for not letting her win but just a matter of having a weaker campaign and if her campaign is that weak then without Layton in the race who is to say a strong Liberal candidate couldn't have beaten Sun in his place?
Fri, 2010-10-22 10:31
#30
Cueball
Whose to say what? My point is that building linkages that would embed the party more deeply into different social and ethnic groupings, as opposed to just looking at the shiney but ephemeral prize of winning electoral offices that often have very little real impact in society, might even pay off in the long run.
For example, a whole new set of voters might be found. Indeed the recent result in Calgary seems to show that the winners campaign largely depended on bringin new voters to the fold. I suspect, but do not know that many of those are voters who are new Canadians, who up until now felt isolated from the process.
Sure, Sun may not have been able to beat her Liberal competitors, but is that all really what matters? No doubt she would have done much better, and indeed Kennedy despite having certain liabilities did very well against Vaughan who had extreme advantages of notoriety resulting from his roll as a popular media personality, and indeed because of his key roll in bringing to light major scandals at city hall at the begining of the decade.
Had Kennedy no NDP support, she probably would not have topped a few hundred votes.
What we do know is that Sun would have done a lot better with the support of the NDP, and in terms of building organizational depth, that might have paid off far more in the long run, than winning a seat on council, which may have very little substantive positive impact anyway.
Fri, 2010-10-22 10:37
#31
I'm not aware of Karen Sun ever having made the slightest effort to get the NDP to support her in the first place. In fact her strategy from the start has been to claim to be an "independent" and to brag about never having supported the NDP.
If you think that winning a seat on council is so unimportant - then why are we even bothing to discuss city council races at all. Why not just dismiss all elections as "petty bourgeois parlour game" and start building barricaces instead?
Fri, 2010-10-22 10:46
#32
Cueball
You mean to say Mike had to beg to get the NDP to endorse him?
Fri, 2010-10-22 10:53
#33
First of all, I don't there is any "official" endorsement of anyone by the NDP - since in municipal politics in Ontario parties are not supposed to exist. But to the extent that there was an "informal" endorsement - it was something he won by acclamation since no one else apperently wanted NDP support.
Apparently Sun was planning to run before she even knew if Pantalone was going to run again or not and she fully intended to attack him if he had been her opponent.
Fri, 2010-10-22 11:00
#34
Cueball
Oh, I see, so the NDP could have "informally" endorsed the otherwise "indpendent" Karn Sun by simply not running The Leader's of the Federal NDP's son against her in a heavily left wing riding, and instead might have contributed tacit support of the kind he now enjoys?
Fri, 2010-10-22 11:02
#35
Cueball
Anyway, this is a stupid conversation, it is obvious you will shill for and defend the NDP and all its people without reservation all the time, except of course Joe Panatlone, who for some reason doesn't deserve any such fulsome and uncritical endorsement from you. It doesn't matter that Mike Layton looks like an animated stick drawing in his youtube video, whereas you opinions about Pantalone's deficit of public presence must be outlined at each and every oppotunity.
Fri, 2010-10-22 12:07
#36
It is now between Pam McConnell and Howard Bortenstein in Ward 28. Given how Howard Bortenstein was Rob Ford's colleague in the Toronto Party, I fear my vote is decided. The other candidates have thrown in the towel to support Howard. Much as I might detest the status quo...a Rob Ford Change would be a big step backwards.
I read an interesting article in the latest Socialist Worker (Canada Edition) that perfectly describes the Ford phenomena. While, we might all have issues with IS, on this issue they were bang on.
The beast arises from the politics of anger and hate, as I said earlier on, developing an effective/affective politics that counters those destructive tendencies has to be our task. In Central America, it was easy, for we had the support of parts of the Catholic Church, in Canada - we have no similar broad mass movement. It need not be religious or secular, is the conculusion we reached but a umbrella to keep out the early rains before we build more permanent shelters against the onslaught of the storm.
Again, it means also changing the language, as I mentioned in my posting of fascism. These words do have power but not a live memory attached to them anymore. The forms of dictatorship are much more descreet and hidden these days but are none the less real. How to translate the experiences of today's generation of surveilance and supression of dissent seems to be the way forward.
Again, I ask, what are you doing after election day? People complained that cog job of working 9-5 pays for life...not true and increasingly not true. Seeing the relationship with the downward pressures on wages and lack of seeing shelter ie housing as a right has transformed our thinking. Giving everyone a stake means giving everyone property which more than just adjusting taxes but creating real opportunities. It might be capitalism but certainly a different sort of capitalism, if done right... The historical record calls these opportunities revolutions.
I would be foolish to say that we ignore the election and only focus on revolution.
Fri, 2010-10-22 12:18
#37
writer
In Toronto, many of "today's generation" has first-hand knowledge of what an unabashed dictatorship looks like.
Fri, 2010-10-22 15:04
#38
Just saw this in the news:
Trustees sued for conflict-of-interest
Just days before the municipal election, three high-profile, long-serving Toronto public trustees who are running to stick around the boardroom are being sued for a conflict of interest, the Sun has learned.Sheila Cary-Meagher, Stephnie Payne and Irene Atkinson are each facing a conflict of interest lawsuit brought by Leroy St. Germaine.
Leroy St. Germaine publishes "Ward 31 News" and "Ward 32 News" which are anti-union, anti-progressive, red-baiting vehicles to try and dethrone Sandra Bussin, Janet Davis and Paula Fletcher.
The three trustees all have relatives who work for the board...Cary-Meagher said she hasn't had a chance to go through the documents yet. "What I do know is that three people were served, all women, all NDPers and three other people were not served who are male and not NDPers, it's quite interesting,"..
While Atkinson said she still has to go through the documentation she was served with Friday morning, she questioned who St. Germaine is and who is funding the legal case against her.
"I would also like to know who is behind this (St. Germaine) person," she said.
Word has it that it's a disgruntled former east end city councillor.
This is another "thin edge of the wedge" attack.
Fri, 2010-10-22 15:26
#39
Lou Arab
Yes, I see that the NDP is perfectly capable of running non-white candidates in ridings where it is advantageous to do some times, in order to exploit the ethnic charachter of the community. What I do not see is the NDP running non-white candidates in wards and ridings where the strength of the NDP organization can act to support that person, when the riding or ward is not overwhellmingly of a specific ethnic charachter. There might be a few tokens out there in unwiinable ridings, where the NDP is weak, but in ridings where the NDP is strong, no such luck.
You 'do not see it' because you do not look:
Raj Pannu was elected in Edmonton Strathcona for the NDP between 1997-2008 - there are very few non-white voters in this riding.
Moe Sihota was elected in suburban Victoria (again, few non-white voters) three times.
Harry Lali was elected in a very white interior BC riding several times.
Percy Paris was elected in rural Nova Scotia in the last provincial election.
Does the ethnic make up of NDP candidate slates reflect Canada's ethnic make up? No.
Is there a lot of room for improvement? Yes.
The NDP is neither perfect nor all bad on these issues. The best way to improve the record of the NDP is to get behind some minority candidates for nomination (and general election) with time, effort and money. Lecturing (without looking at all the facts) on a message board isn't likely to accomplish much.
Fri, 2010-10-22 21:41
#40
Sign-watch part X: Wong-Tam body-slams everyone else on Church, and Dick's sign-team has been busy to the south and east of there. I'm going to give 27 to KWT, but her winning percentage could be in the low-to-mid 20s. If the winner gets into the teens, then the ward should have a do-over. No-one should win with less than 20% of the vote. Pam McConnell will mop the floor with Bortenstein in 28.
Sat, 2010-10-23 00:11
#41
Even with Daniel Murton going over to the Bortenstein/Ford camp? I can only hope that Pam might learn something in opposition, as much as she has been helpful with the fire victims...as with every crisis there is the thought that you ought to be doing more. However, talk about the Trojan strategy that the Right has been using almost consistantly in this campaign.
I think, it might, be the similar strategy that we are going to see in the upcoming Provincial election...for even the Conservatives are running on the ticket of we ain't Dalton...and the Liberals look like they will dump Dalton anyhow just to win again...in the meantime, Prue brings up many issues but is unavoidably silenced by not have any traction with the larger audience. So run a bunch phoney issues, hide behind deficit hysteria and build in such a way that the Conservatives waltz back in.
Dictatorship? Writer most young people have not suffered under a dictatorship...please do not confuse the limited Democracy with Dictatorship. Canada is far from being a dictatorship even though it has suffered with majoritarian tendencies that stiffle dissent. The behavior of the Police during the G20 summit was deplorable but still if this were a dictatorship, as I have witnessed...mothers and fathers would be arrested with grandparents submitting lists of the Disappeared.
Sat, 2010-10-23 00:50
#42
Cueball
I think she was talking about large sectors of the immigrant community. For example, most new Pakistani immigrants have lived under one dictatroship or another. Same goes for the Afghan refugees, survivors of the Vietnam war. Many persons from China... Iranians... and so on.
Sat, 2010-10-23 00:56
#43
Any bet that *any* de facto Team Ford council candidate is headed for an upset coattails victory? Ron Singer replacing Moscoe? Anyone?
Sat, 2010-10-23 01:20
#44
Don't think Rob Ford will have any coattails.
Sat, 2010-10-23 01:28
#45
writer
Cueball, yes, that was my point.
Sat, 2010-10-23 01:56
#46
Any bet that *any* de facto Team Ford council candidate is headed for an upset coattails victory? Ron Singer replacing Moscoe? Anyone?
[url=http://www.frumtoronto.com/Blogger.asp?BlogCategoryID=44&ShowEntryID=441... for Rob and Rob[/url]
Sat, 2010-10-23 09:27
#47
Even with Daniel Murton going over to the Bortenstein/Ford camp?
Frankly, yes. I have seen plenty of McConnell signs and an ad in the local freesheet, whereas this thread is the first time I've even heard of any challengers. I've even seen a sign for Catholic School Board Trustee, but no-one else for council. Do her challengers even have signs? If McConnell's even remotely threatened, I'd be surprised.
Sat, 2010-10-23 09:29
#48
Don't think Rob Ford will have any coattails.
Only liberal elitististas have coattails.
Sat, 2010-10-23 10:05
#49
writer
[url=http://www.nowtoronto.com/daily/story.cfm?content=177447]A typical article about Rob Ford[/url]
Nice.
Sat, 2010-10-23 11:34
#50
If I had a nickel for every distortion, lie, fabrication, exaggeration and falsehood that Ford has been peddling, I'd have enough to supply the entire city with nice new sticky labels.
Sat, 2010-10-23 12:44
#51
There may be lies and distortions (on both sides). The one constant is that Ford ran a great campaign his mantra repeated over and over again won over many voters that don't like the Miller gang.
Walking around in Willowdale I did not see any signs except for some Ford signs.
Now we may have to deal with the public image of Ford speaking for Torontonians world wide. The city councilors gave us the finger far too long.