Hey, were you the guy running against Fantino? I saw that on RogersTV. Nice job but if it was you, have fun while you're here.
Centrist Party of Canada
Fri, 2011-02-18 23:57
#52
RevolutionPlease
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:02
#53
I helped with the campaign but I quit the party. I am not Dorian Baxter but I was challenging the person in the party at the time so it was either me or Dorian to run against Fantino but they picked Dorian Baxter since he was a teacher and had name recognition.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:08
#54
I finally found Radiorahim's quote in the closed thread as one is more than enough:
Relax trippie this is a party of one.
I'd like to recommend it to the Babble Hall of Fame - how does that work?
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:09
#55
so, you want a conservative party pretending to be centrist?
We already have one. It's called the NDP.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:16
#56
RevolutionPlease
I finally found Radiorahim's quote in the closed thread as one is more than enough:
Relax trippie this is a party of one.
I'd like to recommend it to the Babble Hall of Fame - how does that work?
Done.
http://rabble.ca/babble/babble-banter/babble-hall-fame-version-x21#comme...
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:20
#57
No I want it to be centrist but really close to the Liberals but since the Liberals are toxic with their name in Western Canada we give a strong centrist moderate alternative to the Conservatives therefore we unite all the parties in those regions against the Conservatives since progressives and conservatives under our party would want that since we are a much kinder, pragmatic option which wants to work for all Canadians and try to restore Canadian democracy. Also we want to increase voter intention. We would be slightly conservative but not far-right conservative so we would not really be pretending to be conservative but we would give a strong alternative to the Conservatives especially in Atlantic Canada and Western Canada.
Two conservative parties means people choose either one or the other and if they fail they move to us seems like a fair proposition and we are more positive and between the two parties and we want to be one nation conservatives which means we would unify progressives and conservatives under one big tent so it is all good.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:22
#58
Talk to people on the facebook page entitled Centrist Part of Canada the person who designed it misspelled it.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:26
#59
alan smithee
Screw Alberta and the Prairies...They are HOPELESSLY conservative...Nut wing conservative.
It's probably time for the provinces to hold all the power...That way progressive provinces can run in a progressive manner and the lost cause conservative provinces can be ruled by The Preston Manning Institute (made of up with rubber walls) and live in their crack pot utopia .
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:27
#60
Fellow babblers, regardless of what you think of this persons ideas or new party can we stop the "what are YOU doing here?" crap and engage in a discussion?
This is why the our ideas here never get anywhere. As soon as someone we don't agree with engages us, we tell them to piss off rather than engage in a substantive discussion of ideas. telling this person "your ideas are not welcome here" sounds very exclusionary and is almost mocking, in my opinion.
Also, the idea of "conservatism" isn't that foreign to the left, and in fact the old style conservatism has much in common with the left. In fact, ask Chomsky. He even compares his ideas to those of early US conservatives, and actually says his views are more reflective of real conservatism than the extremists in washington.
Atta be, milo. Gad Horowitz has done a lot of research and writing on the commonalities between Canadian conservatism and socialism. Then there's old George Grant, and later, post-heart transplant Dalton Camp. Nevertheless, such a position could not be called "centrist."
What about the 'Harper Harpies' shingle on this forum. It appears as an invitation to discuss 'progressive' politics along a spectrum from Layton to Harper.
Ah yes, the political spectrum from J to V.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:28
#61
Would you mind taking your brainless generalisations and shoving them up your CN Tower?
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:29
#62
RevolutionPlease
Since we're going over the EDGE:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G272iYvxW_w&feature=bf_next&list=MLGxdCwV...
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:31
#63
Anyone here remember Joe Clark yes his type of conservatism is what we are after. If you want proof there is no ideology in Canada that has liberal conservatism. Research Centrist Democrat International and you will see the countries and notice Canada has no international organization with that name representing any of the parties. We are seeking the middle ground and notice the ideological trend of all the parties and the direction we are headed by following them.
Check out wikipedia on "Centrist Democrat International", this other term "liberal conservatism", "one nation conservatism", "neoliberalism", "centrism", "right-centrism", "social conservatism", "traditionalist conservatism", "communitarianism", "conservative liberalism" and "social progressivism".
I would like you to check out all the ideologies on wikipedia since that is the direction we are going to go down in terms of a party and you will be pleased how close the party is to the liberals in fact on social policy we are closer to the liberals and on economic policy we are directly between the two parties and on democratic and environmental policy we are close to the greens. i think we achieved the right balance.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:31
#64
RevolutionPlease
Whatever happened to the NDP in Sask. Al'Q?
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:40
#65
I should pair with people in Alberta who want to build a movement in the West since the Liberal name is bad in both Alberta, Saskatchewan and Manitoba and I believe for progressivism to survive in the West it needs a palatible voice it must have a progressive conservative alternative and Centrist or Moderate party fits the bill. It takes all the best ideals from the two parties and remember a communitarian conservative party is what we are after which means the most vulnerable will be protected and we are for a moderate social safety net. Europe has gone down this road for their conservative parties we should too.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:41
#66
They shifted to the right, but since the Alberta Party was already a better representative of the right, they got clobbered.
I suppose I might ask what the frack was that "NDP" government in Ontario. Where's Bob Rae these days?
We'll always have the Regina Manifesto and Tommy Douglas. You have Orangemen.
Sat, 2011-02-19 00:45
#67
anyone want to know what we stand for well email me at [email protected] and get in touch our pdf file containing all party info about where we stand is almost done.
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:05
#68
alan smithee
Who the fuck are you to tell me to fuck MY 'brainless generalizations' with one of your own,al-Q?
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:07
#69
alan smithee
BTW,if it wasn't for Alberta and the Prairies,the Reform Party would have about 15% support instead of 35%
So much for generalisations.
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:12
#70
RevolutionPlease
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:21
#71
Hey there RP, thanks so much for putting things where they belong. Much appreciated.
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:25
#72
Come on I made some good points and you are not even talking about the party.Anyone here remember Joe Clark
yes his type of conservatism is what we are after. If you want proof there is no ideology in Canada that has liberal conservatism.
Research Centrist Democrat International and you will see the countries and notice Canada has no international organization
with that name representing any of the parties. We are seeking the middle ground and notice the ideological trend of all the
parties and the direction we are headed by following them.
Check out wikipedia on "Centrist Democrat International", this other term "liberal conservatism", "one nation conservatism", "
neoliberalism", "centrism", "right-centrism", "social conservatism", "traditionalist conservatism",
"communitarianism", "conservative liberalism" and "social progressivism".
I would like you to check out all the ideologies on wikipedia since that is the direction we are going to go down
in terms of a party and you will be pleased how close the party is to the liberals in fact on social policy we are
closer to the liberals and on economic policy we are directly between the two parties and on democratic and
environmental policy we are close to the greens. i think we achieved the right balance.
This is another important point I brought up above:
I should pair with people in Alberta who want to build a movement in the West since the Liberal name
is bad in both Alberta, Saskatchewan and Manitoba and I believe for progressivism to survive in the West it
needs a palatible voice it must have a progressive conservative alternative and Centrist or Moderate party fits the bill.
It takes all the best ideals from the two parties and remember a communitarian conservative party is what we are
after which means the most vulnerable will be protected and we are for a moderate social safety net.
Europe has gone down this road for their conservative parties we should too.
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:31
#73
anyone want to know what we stand for well email me at [email protected] and get
in touch our pdf file containing all party info about where we stand is almost done.
I look forward to it so people can stop asking questions about where we stand as a party and we can just provide
what is necessary on each of the issues. Remember so it is next week when the pdf document should be done for the party but
it cannot be posted on the site since it does not contain the aspects necessary to download files onto it. i would know i am an expert
html/xhtml programmer.
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:41
#74
alan smithee
It takes all the best ideals from the two parties and remember a communitarian conservative party is what we are
after which means the most vulnerable will be protected and we are for a moderate social safety net.
Europe has gone down this road for their conservative parties we should too.
And there is where you lose me....'Moderate social safety net' sounds to me like double speak for cutting social programs.
Where does this Great alliance of liberal and conservative stand on REAL issues?
Affordable housing,worker's benefits,pensions,prohibition,people who rely on food banks or those who are without a home?
I guess a 'moderate safety net' would be band aid solutions that will keep people living in poverty.
Does this great alliance believe that bosses should be paid to give people the priviledge of working?
Does this great alliance prescribe to the current policy of socialism for the rich and capitalism for the rest of us?
This alliance sounds alot like Libertarianism which is just as greedy,amoral and cold blooded as the staunch capitalist neocon ideologues who currently run the machine.
So for me,thanks but no thanks.
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:49
#75
Have you even researched what liberal conservatism means and what one nation conservatism means those are ideologies where we want to balance progressive and conservative policies. It is something when we had the old PC party of Canada. It is social liberalism but on the conservative side that is what liberal conservatism means.
On the site I even said the party has policies for social housing and we would invest moderately on that. We are a compassionate conservative party.
We would increase the CPP and make a good retirement for all it is on the issues page of the site.
Moderate social safety net means that there would be social programs for those who need it and health care and education would be essential and never be taken away. We would always defend it. We would make the manufacturing sector a buffer to ensure a sector for high paying jobs and concentrate on small business since we believe that is where most of the jobs are.
We also want to link the economy and the environment and have a plan which gets new industries and gets us off of old industries and we have a grid to generate cleaner sources of energy and start the green energy economy. We want to be like the compassionate conservative British Tory party. The real tories are what we stand for.
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:52
#76
OK, let me say it again...
You want to start another bourgeoisie capitalists party...Why come here, most people wantto rid themselves of the bourgeoisie and the exploitative failing Capitalist economic system.
Why would we want to join a party the will be going ou tof it's way to enslave us into separate classes and that causes all the misery we see in the world today?
Why, why, why ,W.H.Y, would we want any more of the crap you are peddling? We already have our fill
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:54
#77
I guess no one reads what I put down and even acknowledges it. Ya very kind no one will even respond to it and give their opinion on what I wrote!
Sat, 2011-02-19 01:57
#78
Been there, done that. Seriously, I've given you a few leads, try some other suckers instead.
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:05
#79
alan smithee
Yes,Canada needs the old PC Party...That's the answer.
In reality we've all been secretly pining for the days of Brian Bologne to come back
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:09
#80
We want to be like the compassionate conservative British Tory party. The real tories are what we stand for.
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:11
#81
margaret thatcher was a libertarian and a neocon and her side hardly gets any voice in the party. it is usually the communitarian side, the compassionate conservative side and the one nation side of the party which is centrist that is dominated which is what i want to create as a party.
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:11
#82
We want to be like the compassionate conservative British Tory party. The real tories are what we stand for.
No thanks. I can't afford to see my tuition fees tripled, and I'm not a fan of massive cuts.
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:12
#83
brian mulroney was a blue tory in the party like harper. joe clark, diefenbaker, stanfield, borden and charest were red tories the true conservatives. got it man! i researched on these guys in case you are wondering.
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:13
#84
i said as a party we favour health and investing in post secondary and the only party you hear talking about investing are the liberals. as a party we want to go down that direction and we want to stand by health care and defend the canada health act and protect it.
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:24
#85
alan smithee
The thing is you keep repeating the word 'moderate' when you refer to social spending.
You also seem to be regurgitating the mantra of the neocon/neo-liberal message of the past 25 years.
Put all our resources (tax moneys) into business and it will create jobs.
We've been doing that for a quarter century and where are the jobs?
And out of the small return of corporate welfare/socialism,the jobs are being created at Wal-Mart,McDonald's and a host of low paying jobs without benefits or a pension.
Meanwhile the owners,the bosses,the CEO's,the Executives are making more money than they ever seen...They pocket stimuluses,creating jobs is not a priority,it's making a buck.
And 99/100 when a corporation or business no matter how big or small,talks about 'losing money',they are actually talking about losing profit.
We made $2 B in 2009 and only $1.6 B in 2010...Hand us a stimulus or we're picking up our ball and going home..Then they get their stimulus and take their ball and leave anyway.
The only cuts to welfare should be on the corporate level...The only 'moderate' spending should be on prisons NOT social housing and/or affordable housing..It's the housing Canadians need,not prisons.
So if everything is market based,then that is not an alternative,it's the same old same old.
And I believe most people have had enough of eating the shit sandwiches our governments have been serving up for the last generation.
Red Tory,blue tory,purple tory,blue liberal,red liberal....same old,same mold.
Sat, 2011-02-19 02:40
#86
@ centeristparty
I don't have to read what you wrote... I read that shit 20 years ago, why should I keep rereading it over and over again.
Maybe you have not clued in on reality, but the capitalist system, that you want to preserve, with your rehashed bourgeois political party ideology, is out dated. Capitalism is in the midst of a globel restructuring, what new ideas have you put on the table?
Let me tell you. You have put no new idea on the table. You are just rehashing some old ideas that the bourgeoisie of Canada killed off already, because they were not working.
You want me to tell you how it works??? People only buy into ideas if those ideas advance humanity. Like computers, like the internet, like sliced bread, like automobiles, like airplanes, like assemble lines, like HDTV, like 3D movies, like credit cards, like iphones, like ipads, like mp3 players. like Facebook, like working class revolutions.....
Do I sound condescending ??? Good. wake up.
Sat, 2011-02-19 11:53
#87
I don't know. Starting from ideological paradigms without being able to substantively nail down how you will do this by policy smacks of Don Quixote tilting at the wind mills. It would be like me making mention of a variety of ideologies and then praying and hoping that I could gather these really cool ideas and put them into a cohesive policy. You're trying to make a centre-right party, that will be moderate on the fiscally conservative side and socially indifferent with a play to Canadian identity. How are you going to lay the necessary groundwork to break the Conservatives or Liberals in ridings you feel are potentially winnable? Have you identified key players that could make good candidates? Do you have the organizational capacity to get an executive together and hold a party meeting to solidify yourself prior to an election? What sort of fundraising infrastructure are you building? What sort of advice are you able to get from potential international partners?
Most importantly, how can you prove that you won't fall into irrelevancy in the sea of Canadian minor right wing parties?
Sat, 2011-02-19 12:10
#88
Who the fuck are you to tell me to fuck MY 'brainless generalizations' with one of your own,al-Q?
Ya see what it's like?
Sat, 2011-02-19 17:57
#89
as far as i'm concerned, more centre right parties can only be a good thing if only to split the vote from the conservative party, like what happens with the liberal/ndp/bloc/green.
also, many people who consider themselves "conservative" vote for harper, who is anything but conservative--he's an extremist of sorts. giving them an option that is less extremist can only be a good thing, seeing as most people who vote conservative hold views that are essentially in line with most of the left, except they're swayed by relentless propaganda to support policies that clash with their actual views. Again the chomsky comparison that the majority of american opinion agrees with him at the same time they think he's nuts.
do the ideas mesh with what i believe? no. but we're not going to get rid of hyper capitalism overnight, the only way it is realistically going to happen is a slow progression to more progressive politics that lead to even better policies and perhaps eventually some semblance of democracy, and things seem to be going in the opposite direction at the moment.
compare that to real democracies like bolivia, where they elected a peasant leader with real popular support. why can't we organize and do that here? maybe cause we're too busy complaining about how fucked our country is instead of doing something about it, typical western spoon fed babies.
just like the famous clash song said:
Black people gotta lot a problems
But they don't mind throwing a brick
White people go to school
Where they teach you how to be thick
An' everybody's doing
Just what they're told to
An' nobody wants
To go to jail!
All the power's in the hands
Of people rich enough to buy it
While we walk the street
Too chicken to even try it
Everybody's doing
Just what they're told to
Nobody wants
To go to jail!
Are you taking over
or are you taking orders?
Are you going backwards
Or are you going forwards?
Sat, 2011-02-19 18:59
#90
Who the fuck are you to tell me to fuck MY 'brainless generalizations' with one of your own,al-Q?
I'm always pleased to see the word 'fuck' used as both a verb and adjective. There are few words so flexible. Shame.
Anyway, I'm glad to see that this thread has developed into a discussion with energy. Keep up the good work!
Sun, 2011-02-20 02:35
#91
Anyone here remember Joe Clark
I do. My favorite memory of Joe Clark is when OCAP came to Parliament Hill, and Clark came out to speak to them. He got knocked around by members of the media while they were jockeying for position with their cameras, microphones, and recorders; and the media spin became 'Joe Clark attacked by OCAP'. Good times.
Sun, 2011-02-20 09:16
#92
Anyone here remember Joe Clark yes his type of conservatism is what we are after.
A conservatism that can't count! Sorry, had to. I'm still not sure how far this is from where the Liberal Party is today with the exception that Clark had a more decentralist view of federalism.
If you want proof there is no ideology in Canada that has liberal conservatism. Research Centrist Democrat International and you will see the countries and notice Canada has no international organization with that name representing any of the parties.
There's a reason for that - we've never had a Christian Democratic party in Canada (and we're unlikely to get one now). Back when one might have made sense in Canada it would have been trying to set up on ground already occupied by the CCF and Social Credit.
Wed, 2011-02-23 17:47
#93
The main reason that Canada never had a Christian Democratic party is that the CIA was never quite as paranoid about the possibility of Canada going "Red" at the ballot box as it was that post-World War II "Western Europe" might do so. The "Christian Democratic" parties were basically "unite the center-right" groupings that the CIA(with the possible collusion of the Catholic Church) invented for the sole purpose of preventing left-wing electoral victories in places like Italy, "West" Germany and some other counrties, mainly small Catholic countries like Belgium, Luxembourg, and such. Prior to 1945, there was no such thing as a Christian Democratic Party anywhere.
Thu, 2011-02-24 01:47
#94
Now that we have the discussion of the Centrist Party of Canada dealt with I want to inform those who think my party
could create a better moderate conservative option for Canadians one that is compassionate conservative and wants to govern
in the tradition of the old Progressive Consevative party I would encourage those who like thoughtful discussion to comment about
what I wrote. Also since me and the members of the party have completed the document outlining where we stand on all the issues
those who are interested may ask for one and I will send you a copy just make sure you reach me at
[email protected] or you may comment on this thread if you wish to ask for one here.
Also you can read also similar information like what is shown in the pdf document we created about where the party
stands on all the issues at this site: http://centristparty.piczo.com/issues?cr=5 Thank you and I agree
with the comments that were made about the fact there cannot be a Christian Democrat party in Canada simply because
Canadians are not like the Europeans and will not accept something that is like they do and we have different traditions.
Anyways, Christian Democracy was developed in Europe and thus would make it hard for it to catch on here. Anyways,
to read about the party again check out http://centristparty.piczo.com/issues?cr=5 or email me at
[email protected] if you wish to receive a copy of where we stand on all the issues.
Thank you and always hope for something better in our democracy then the two major parties which is what I long for.
Thu, 2011-02-24 10:40
#95
alan smithee
In don't see the point of pitching an idea or a 'new' political wing that will never resonate with progressives..Or socialists like myself.
You're kinda beating a dead horse,mate.
Thu, 2011-02-24 16:37
#96
And, if you've ever wondered, here's what it LOOKS like when someone beats a dead horse:
Thu, 2011-02-24 22:06
#97
Lard Tunderin Jeezus
so, you want a conservative party pretending to be centrist?
We already have one. It's called the NDP.
Actually, by european standards, 'third way' social democrats are the new centre. And in terms of fighting rear-guard battles to maintain traditional Canadian standards and institutions (such as public healthcare), the NDP are certainly the most small-c conservative of the parties in Parliament.
As an added bonus, our friend named 'centristparty' seems to love Jack Layton, so his path should be clear: he needs to join the NDP.
Fri, 2011-02-25 16:59
#98
Conservatives were elected in 2006 to clean up corruption and Canadians are about to find out Conservatives are no different from Liberals we need a party committed to essential programs like health care and education always being protected, making sure foreign policy and law and order are balanced and this party between the two parties would want to ensure that the economy is closer to being balanced which means tax cuts are targeted and studied to show what the affects really are and we need a manufacturing sector which is invested in and helps as a buffer for the middle class. We also need to have a balanced environmental program which does not get its ideas from Washington but is studied and works to lower carbon emissions.
That is how you build a strong moderate conservative party one that is for balancing fiscal responsibility, taxes and social progress. This is also a way to ensure we get a hold on our debt and deficit.
Check out our issues page to find out where we stand: http://centristparty.piczo.com/issues?cr=5 or email us which is on the main page: http://centristparty.piczo.com/?g=1&cr=5 at the bottom of the page.
Fri, 2011-02-25 17:09
#99
Lard Tunderin Jeezus
Linking once is fine. Linking twice is repetitive. Beyond that, it's spam.
If you need to advertize, buy a banner.
Fri, 2011-02-25 17:34
#100
@Lard Tunderin Jeezus - I put one link for the issues page and one for the main page of the site so people could contact me on the email which is on the bottom of the main page.
Fri, 2011-02-25 18:34
#101
alan smithee
This is becoming an Abbott and Costello sketch of Who's on first and What's on second..
You come to a community for progressives,those involved in unions and social programs etc...Trying to convince everyone that a resurrection of the old PC Party will lead us all to the promised land.
You know,you can dress up a pig and it's still a pig.