Are there no prisons? Is there no B.C. Liberal kick-back and graft?
Libya IV
Wed, 2011-03-16 17:25
#52
Wed, 2011-03-16 19:06
#53
ov
"Gaddafi as he attempted to drown an inspiring revolt in blood"
Don't you think that is a lttle over the top? All I've seen so far is dinky little craters in the middle of nowhere, and a couple of dozen people standing around a car billowing black smoke; I haven't seen even a single picture of a dead body.
On a related note wrt to "over the top polemics." The other day I got a Care2 request to sign a petition urging haste to implement a no-fly zone over Libya before Gaddafi caused a half million deaths. Yup, they were throwing around numbers that big. I don't know who is behind Care2 but it seems that the only petitions they have are for cute little animals and bs like this. They got unsubscribed but they were back again today and I had to unsubscribe them again.
Wed, 2011-03-16 23:08
#54
Hosni Mubarak didn't attempt to drown an aspiring rebellion in its own blood. Too much effort and not enough backup from the Egyptian people apparently. I think he salted enough of Egypt's national pension plan into his own secret bank accounts to never have to worry about freedom 55. Like Ferdinand Marcos who absconded with billions of dollars in Phlilippinos' national wealth, Wall Street or London bankers will likely welcome Mubarak and his ill-gotten money with open arms similarly.
Thu, 2011-03-17 00:00
#55
Bec.De.Corbin
"Gaddafi as he attempted to drown an inspiring revolt in blood"
Don't you think that is a lttle over the top? All I've seen so far is dinky little craters in the middle of nowhere, and a couple of dozen people standing around a car billowing black smoke; I haven't seen even a single picture of a dead body.
Yeah, I know, they are just shooting spitballs at each other out there... search the internet for pictures, you'll find them. I have but I'm not keen on posting pictures of dead bodies. I seen enough of that in GW1. There are even pictures out there of a Libyan SU23 Flogger the rebels shot down.
(Hurray they got one!)
I don't support the no fly zone or any "invasion", that's not to say I wouldn't mind seeing Gadaffi go or the rebels get some help weapons wise.
Thu, 2011-03-17 00:00
#56
Gaddafi is a war criminal, and he is a monster in my eyes, regardless of western intervention or not.
Thu, 2011-03-17 00:27
#57
M. Spector
The United States shifted gears on Libya on Wednesday as it joined Britain and France in calling for swift action on a bid at the United Nations to establish a no-fly zone over the strife-torn African nation.As the UN Security Council debated the issue in New York, U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton suggested the United States may now back the no-fly measure amid broader sanctions against the oil-rich North African country.
- PostMedia News
Thu, 2011-03-17 00:30
#58
I don't support the no fly zone or any "invasion", that's not to say I wouldn't mind seeing Gadaffi go or the rebels get some help weapons wise.
Oh they already have. The world police force wants Saudi Arabia to supply aerial support for the rebs. And they've asked Saudis and Gulf states to supply weapons to the rebs targeting oil ports and oil refineries in Libya. You see, it really is about oil. Global speculators of food and oil prices are making big money on oil and hunger. It's what they do.
Thu, 2011-03-17 02:26
#59
'Libya Killings Crime Against Humanity'
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/170333.html
"UN Secretary General Ban Ki Moon has called for an end to the violence in Libya as clashes intensify between government forces and revolutionaries. 'Killing Libyan people unarmed who are asking for freedom is completely unacceptable, and is a crime against humanity,' AFP quoted Ban as saying on Wednesday. The UN Chief had earlier urged all sides in Libya to accept an immediate ceasefire, in an effort aimed at preventing the increasing casualties in a full-scale assault by Gaddafi loyalists on Libyan revolutionaries.
Meanwhile, the UN Security Council has agreed on the text of a draft resolution about a new round of sanctions aainst Libya and plans to put the package to a vote on Thursday. Muammar Gaddafi, the Arab world's longest serving ruler, described the revolution in Libya as a conspiracy conducted by the US, France and Britain and vowed to defeat them all..."
Benghazi Residents Hold Anti-Gov't Rally
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/170158.html
"People in the Libyan city of Benghazi have held a fresh anti-government rally as forces loyal to Libya's ruler Muammar Gaddafi step up their attacks against revolutionaries in the east of the country. Gaddafi loyalists carried out air strikes in the north-eastern city of Ajdabiya, the gateway to Benghazi on Tuesday and tanks entering the city shelled homes and shops. French Ambassador to the UN Gerard Araud has warned against the fast movement of Gaddafi's forces towards the east of Libya and criticized the UNSC for remaining inactive to the crisis in the North African country."
Thu, 2011-03-17 04:44
#60
Libya: Popular Uprising, Civil War or Military Attack?
http://www.michelcollon.info/Libya-popular-uprising-civilian.html?lang=fr
Mohammed Hassan replies to questions put by Investig'Action
Thu, 2011-03-17 05:54
#61
To conclude, the Libyan people deserve better than this opposition movement that is plunging the country into chaos. They need a real democratic movement to replace the Gaddafi regime and bring about social justice. In any case, the Libyans do not deserve military aggression. The retreating imperialist forces seem nevertheless to be preparing a counter-revolutionary offensive in the Arab World. Attacking Libya is their emergency solution. But they will be shooting themselves in the feet.
I'm not real high on Gadhafi. He was or perhaps still is an anticommunist. But what are the (realistic) alternatives?
Thu, 2011-03-17 10:24
#62
Moammar Gadhafi's air force bombed the airport in the Libyan opposition's main stronghold on Thursday after the rebels used seized planes and helicopters to launch attacks on the government's advancing troops, witnesses and rebel officials said.
Two planes bombed Benina airport just outside the city of Benghazi, one witness told The Associated Press. The extent of the damage was not immediately clear.
The rebels were using three of their own planes and some helicopters to attack Gadhafi's troops outside the city of Ajdabiya, the gateway to Benghazi and surrounding opposition-held territory, said Mustafa Gheriani, an opposition spokesman in Benghazi.
Witnesses and rebels said Gadhafi's forces had surrounded Ajdabiya, seizing positions on all sides of the rebels, who are hoping for help from the U.N. Security Council before government troops move in.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/story/2011/03/17/libya-red-cross031711.html
Thu, 2011-03-17 12:46
#63
Gaddafi Troops Heavy Shell Ajdabiyah
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/170422.html
"There is currently a heavy battle going on in the centre of Adjabiya city, with strong bombardment and residential areas are being destroyed,' opposition commander Hanni al Hassi said..."
'Foreigners Plotted Libya Revolution'
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/170204.html
"Libya's embattled ruler Muammar Gaddafi has once again claimed that revolutionary forces in his country are acting under foreign influence. Gaddafi also denied reports saying over a thousand people have been killed by his forces.."
Thu, 2011-03-17 14:14
#64
The issue therefore is not Western military intervention or not. The issue is the consequence of Qaddafi’s attempt to suppress all opposition in the most brutal fashion for the second Arab revolt. Libya is in turmoil because of the successful uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt. And if there is any conspiracy, it is one between Qaddafi and the West to slow down, even quash, the Arab revolt. To the extent that Qaddafi succeeds, he sends a message to all the other threatened despots of the region that harsh repression rather than concessions is the way to go.
This is what the left in the rest of the world sees, if some left governments in Latin America do not. As Samir Amin points out in his analysis of the Egyptian uprising, there were four distinct components among the protestors – the youth, the radical left, middle-class democrats, and Islamists. The radical left is composed of suppressed left parties and revitalized trade-union movements. There is no doubt a much, much smaller radical left in Libya, and a much weaker army (because of Qaddafi’s deliberate policy). The outcome there is therefore very uncertain.
The assembled leaders of the Arab League may condemn Qaddafi publicly, but many, even most, may be applauding him privately – and copying from him.
Gaddafi isn't a leftist; while he may once have been a minor irritant to the Western imperialists, he has been in their pocket for the last decade. We have no reason to support him or make excuses for him.
Thu, 2011-03-17 16:00
#65
Here Comes the Imperial Cavalry...
Libya Crisis: Military Action Against Gaddafi 'Within Hours'
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/17/libya-no-fly-zone-united-nat...
"Britain, France and the US, along with several Arab countries are to join forces to throw a protective ring around the Libyan rebel stronghold of Benghazi as soon as a UN Security Council vote on military action is authorised..A source at UN headquarters in New York said military forces could be deployed 'within hours' of a new security council resolution calling for states to protect civilians by halting attacks by Muammar Gaddafi's forces by air, land and sea..
The increase in military preparations came as Gaddafi announced that his forces would invade Benghazi tonight and would show no mercy.."
nor will theirs..
Thu, 2011-03-17 16:58
#66
Bec.De.Corbin
Here Comes the Imperial Cavalry...
Libya Crisis: Military Action Against Gaddafi 'Within Hours'
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/mar/17/libya-no-fly-zone-united-nat...
"Britain, France and the US, along with several Arab countries are to join forces to throw a protective ring around the Libyan rebel stronghold of Benghazi as soon as a UN Security Council vote on military action is authorised..A source at UN headquarters in New York said military forces could be deployed 'within hours' of a new security council resolution calling for states to protect civilians by halting attacks by Muammar Gaddafi's forces by air, land and sea..
The increase in military preparations came as Gaddafi announced that his forces would invade Benghazi tonight and would show no mercy.."
nor will theirs..
Fuck... and it's still cold up in Washington DC...
IF the UN does pass a resolution to put up a "no fly zone" (more like a free fire zone) before Benghazi falls then, yeah, NDPP is correct, the pro Gadaffi guys in their tanks, APCs and their heavy artillery are going to be sitting ducks out in the dessert for whatever aircraft are used. Same with their supply trucks that have to run the highways to keep them resupplied. You'll see allot of abandoned equipment left behind as they flee back to Tripoli in their cars and pick-up trucks.
Thu, 2011-03-17 18:02
#67
[url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-12770467]British Petroleum mercenaries could be in action by Friday[/url] God save the Queen and BP
Thu, 2011-03-17 18:21
#68
welder
To conclude, the Libyan people deserve better than this opposition movement that is plunging the country into chaos. They need a real democratic movement to replace the Gaddafi regime and bring about social justice. In any case, the Libyans do not deserve military aggression. The retreating imperialist forces seem nevertheless to be preparing a counter-revolutionary offensive in the Arab World. Attacking Libya is their emergency solution. But they will be shooting themselves in the feet.I'm not real high on Gadhafi. He was or perhaps still is an anticommunist. But what are the (realistic) alternatives?
Khaddaffi is a self styled Ba'Athist...A follower (to an extent) of Nasser...
Fidel,I can tell you what the sorry options are if something is'nt done to stop this bloodthirsty nationalist from turning Eastern Libya into a killing field..
Since the West has to this point,essentially thrown these people under Khaddaffi's bus,their only option will be the even more bloodthirsty Islamofascist's (I'm not impugning the faith of Islam,just a coterrie of very dispicable people within it) for help.
This is in no one's best interest,most importantly,the average Libyan...
Thu, 2011-03-17 18:33
#69
I don't believe half of what the MSM is telling us about massacres, genocides, killing fields, etc. We heard the same bullshit when NATO bombed Serbia. It was a lie then, and I'll bet its a lie now.
The west has as much concern for the Libyan people as they do for the Bahraini people; that is, none. They want the oil concessions, they want people in charge with whom they can do business.
Quadaffi's big crime in the eyes of France, Britain, and the US is that he didn't bribe the right people. He thought he bought Sarkozy, but he should have known better than to make deals with fascists.
Thu, 2011-03-17 18:45
#70
welder
I don't believe half of what the MSM is telling us about massacres, genocides, killing fields, etc. We heard the same bullshit when NATO bombed Serbia. It was a lie then, and I'll bet its a lie now.
The west has as much concern for the Libyan people as they do for the Bahraini people; that is, none. They want the oil concessions, they want people in charge with whom they can do business.
Quadaffi's big crime in the eyes of France, Britain, and the US is that he didn't bribe the right people. He thought he bought Sarkozy, but he should have known better than to make deals with fascists.
I tend not to give in to tinfoil hat conspiracy theories...
Although,you may be partly correct,their is stil the undeniable fact that Khaddaffi will kill anyone who opposes him,and who knows how many he's killed of his own in the last two weeks.We definately know that he has run one of the most repressive regimes on this planet this side of Kim Jong Il.
Are you saying,because of your antipathy to Big Oil.Which I have,as well,that you are prepared to allow Mr.Khaddaffi to kill as many people as he can?
Is your position that that real suffering is to be put aside because of your personal geopolitical theories??
And by the way,a Pan Arabist Ba'Athist is a Fascist.The roots of that ideology start with an adherence to European Fascism.
Thu, 2011-03-17 18:57
#71
Pogo
I could see if a similiar scenario was playing out in Venezuela that there would be serious worries about this being a power grab over oil. However as has been said over and over again both sides in Libya are in the pocket of Big Oil. I think the monied interests are mostly for the war to stop so the oil producing can continue unabated.
Thu, 2011-03-17 18:58
#72
Khaddaffi is a self styled Ba'Athist...A follower (to an extent) of Nasser...
Fidel,I can tell you what the sorry options are if something is'nt done to stop this bloodthirsty nationalist from turning Eastern Libya into a killing field..
Since the West has to this point,essentially thrown these people under Khaddaffi's bus,their only option will be the even more bloodthirsty Islamofascist's (I'm not impugning the faith of Islam,just a coterrie of very dispicable people within it) for help.
This is in no one's best interest,most importantly,the average Libyan...
A no-fly decree and NATO bombing would be worse. British and American pirates and government mercenaries anchored offshore are only after the oil to be sure.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:13
#73
M. Spector
The United Nations Security Council has approved a no-fly zone over Libya to protect civilians and rebels from Libyan government airstrikes.
Thursday's vote was 10 in favor with no votes against. Five countries abstained.
The resolution authorizes UN members to take "all necessary measures" to protect civilians, including a ban on all flights over Libya. The resolution expresses grave concern at the deteriorating situation in Libya, where rebels have been trying to topple long-time leader Moammar Gadhafi.
- VOA
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:13
#74
I believe that Cuba has been recently supplying the Libyans with military aid also.
Plenty of guilty parties involved these useless deaths.
It depends on when it happened:
Was it before or after the blockade of Libya and the presence of U.S. warships in the Mediterranean?
Was it before or after the People's Revolution of Libya?
It depends who received the weapons:
Was it the Gadhafi regime or the Libyan people?
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:16
#75
Boom Boom
CNN reporting the measures will be put into effect in a matter of hours, we may hear news of enforcement actions before midnight EST.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:17
#76
Boom Boom
CNN reporting the US has given its blessing on arms shipments to Libyan rebels through Egypt.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:28
#77
welder
Khaddaffi is a self styled Ba'Athist...A follower (to an extent) of Nasser...
Fidel,I can tell you what the sorry options are if something is'nt done to stop this bloodthirsty nationalist from turning Eastern Libya into a killing field..
Since the West has to this point,essentially thrown these people under Khaddaffi's bus,their only option will be the even more bloodthirsty Islamofascist's (I'm not impugning the faith of Islam,just a coterrie of very dispicable people within it) for help.
This is in no one's best interest,most importantly,the average Libyan...
A no-fly decree and NATO bombing would be worse. British and American pirates and government mercenaries anchored offshore are only after the oil to be sure.
I don't deny the fre(er)flow of oil is part of this,however,that does'nt change the fact that there are people trying to free themselves from Mr.Khaddaffi's murderous and repressive regime.Those people are about to be murdered by Mr.Khaddaffi,and his "friends"...
Alot of them are going to die horribly if nothing is done,that's for certain...
So,I take it your position is that because the European powers,and their oil executive aparatchiks will probably profit from this,that Mr.Khaddaffi should be allowd to murder his own citizens,who he has almost no regard for anyway???
And as I said before,will certainly pave the way for the even worse,and even more bloodthirsty,Islamofascist's....
This is your position,is it not??
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:34
#78
Most will run away and live to fight another day, the tactic works quit well for others, (like the Taliban). No reason for it not to work here as well; he'll probably now have permanent insurgencies to deal with from now on.
Yes! You are absolutely right.
Another thing the people can do right now is hit the Gadhafi force's overstretched supply lines. This could isolate and "starve" them in the cities. The people could then counterattack the weakened government forces and recapture the cities.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:41
#79
The vote was unanimous, with all three nations with a large Muslim population: Nigeria, Bosnia & Herzegovina, and Lebanon, voting in favour of the no-fly zone. There's your international mandate.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:43
#80
M. Spector
So the cruise-missile leftists have achieved their fondest wish — imperialist air attacks on Libya; and those who accused Fidel Castro of hysteria for predicting exactly that are busy wiping egg off their faces.
The Libyan revolt is doomed to ending with the installation of yet another neoliberal toady government that's acceptable to Obomba. It will be armed with western weaponry and left firmly in control before the no-fly zone will be lifted. Any chance of real social change will be put on hold for the foreseeable future.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:44
#81
"A no-fly decree and NATO bombing would be worse. British and American pirates and government mercenaries anchored offshore are only after the oil to be sure."
Yeah..a beaten down people for 40 plus years, looking at Tunisia and Egypt and realizing that things really can be different and then stepping up. The only problem being, you have "freedom fighters" armed with small weapons, against tanks and fighter aircraft. At the very least a no fly will level the playing field. I guess all those Libyans, if the news is to believed, holding up the signs, begging for help are actually in the employ of big oil. I know if I was in that situation I would want help and if I got it, I would remember, and if I didn't, I would remember that as well. Freedom for all. Right?
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:47
#82
There were "rebels" in 1936 Spain. They called for outside backup from the Luftwaffe to attack Spanish government forces and "mercenaries" supporting the government then, too. Hitler and Goring came through for them with flying colours.
You said it Fidel!
Up until 1939 the people of the United Socialist Soviet Republic supported (as did the people who made up the International Brigades) the Libertarias of Spain - until that monster Stalin turned on them.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:48
#83
Northern Shoveler
FMRSD Wow too bad those dumb arabs aren't as smart as you are. Do you think you could contact them somehow to tell them about your brilliant strategy?
A no fly zone enforced by NATO to help one side in a civil war is not going to help the people of Libya anymore than the NATO intervention to destroy Yugosalvia has benefited the people of that region.
Since most reports don't seem to indicate that it is merely air power superiority on the side of the government forces will NATO allow the government forces to overrun all the rebel strongholds with non aerial weapons or will they actively attack Libyan government forces when they continue to win. There is no being a little bit pregnant or a little bit at war.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:53
#84
welder
Most will run away and live to fight another day, the tactic works quit well for others, (like the Taliban). No reason for it not to work here as well; he'll probably now have permanent insurgencies to deal with from now on.
Yes! You are absolutely right.
Another thing the people can do right now is hit the Gadhafi force's overstretched supply lines. This could isolate and "starve" them in the cities. The people could then counterattack the weakened government forces and recapture the cities.
I agree...
Strategically,Col. Khaddaffi played this very well.
He allowed a poorly trained rag tag bunch of rebels take up alot of geographical space very quicly which spread themselves too thin...
He then struck back with full force!
This can be turned on him,however.His supply lines are exceedingly long...
Take out command and control from the air...
Simultaneously,warships in the Gulf of Sidra...And torpedo any gov't warship...
The strategic airstrikes on the roads,slowing down any retreat...
Catch the bastard in his own plan...
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:53
#85
"Gaddafi as he attempted to drown an inspiring revolt in blood"Don't you think that is a lttle over the top? All I've seen so far is dinky little craters in the middle of nowhere, and a couple of dozen people standing around a car billowing black smoke; I haven't seen even a single picture of a dead body.
The International Criminal Court has stated that 10,000 Libyans have been killed by Gaddafi's forces during the conflict, as of the end of February. If you must see someone get killed ...
Those young men who have been taken advantage of - those infidels who are attempting to burn down our country to the ground, we should have no mercy on them. Those are the traitors, used and abused by those infidels from Qatar, unfortunately, Kuwait and other countries. How stupid can you become to be taken advantage of to that extent in Benghazi? Now you're hungry and thirsty - we don't have a natural disaster like the one that happened in Japan recently ... but those infidels and traitors we promise to deal with.
....
All people should surround the traitors, to tell them that there is no way out. They are finished, they are wiped out. From tomorrow you will only find our people. You all go out and cleanse the city of Benghazi.
Thu, 2011-03-17 19:57
#86
welder
"A no-fly decree and NATO bombing would be worse. British and American pirates and government mercenaries anchored offshore are only after the oil to be sure."
Yeah..a beaten down people for 40 plus years, looking at Tunisia and Egypt and realizing that things really can be different and then stepping up. The only problem being, you have "freedom fighters" armed with small weapons, against tanks and fighter aircraft. At the very least a no fly will level the playing field. I guess all those Libyans, if the news is to believed, holding up the signs, begging for help are actually in the employ of big oil. I know if I was in that situation I would want help and if I got it, I would remember, and if I didn't, I would remember that as well. Freedom for all. Right?
Spot on!!!
Our friend,Fidel feels that it will be ven worse under some tinfoil hat oil oligarchy....
Worse than a bloodthristy dictator like Khaddaffi??
Worse than the Islamofascist Option B that will surely fall into line because all other democratic options failed because of Western inaction???
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:05
#87
There were "rebels" in 1936 Spain. They called for outside backup from the Luftwaffe to attack Spanish government forces and "mercenaries" supporting the government then, too. Hitler and Goring came through for them with flying colours.
You said it Fidel!
Up until 1939 the people of the United Socialist Soviet Republic supported (as did the people who made up the International Brigades) the Libertarias of Spain - until that monster Stalin turned on them.
I don't think Fidel said it. He is comparing Gadaffi to a legitimate democratic government that had a militarist putsch that initially failed and dragged out into a civil war that acted as the first stage of WW2.
For this analogy to work the rebels would have to be identifiable as reactionary insurgents and in control of parts of the government. This is not an apt analogy and is frankly quite disgusting. Regardless of the international anticipating for another orgy of bombs falling on civilian sites - like the Spanish Civil War - one cannot draw paradigms between the political programs of 2011 Libya and 1930s Spain.
That is some shameful rhetoric. Fidel, you sir, are engaged in mindless shock rhetoric to defend a poor point. Gadaffi may have been some anti-imperialist hero. 40 years of power turns all men into tyrants and crooks.
As for the no-fly zone, well, it is being instituted - let us hope that the collateral damage is not too widespread. What happens now will simply happen. Accusing other leftists of grevious transgressions against The Orthodox Thought is counter-productive and won't move any discussion forward. I can understand why al-Jazeera (that mouth piece of American propoganda) is showing images of the people of Benghazi celebrating this international action - for them it will mean protection and survival in the short term - it means destruction in Libya in the long term.
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:06
#88
Is this a civil war or not? From my keyboard in Canada I can't tell so even if I thought intervention was ever justified (which I don't) I don't think the international debate has moved to the point where it is alright to interfere in civil wars.
Civil wars always have the highest body counts. Just look at the UK or the USA. Their civil wars had body counts that put the Libyans to shame.
Are Libyans waging war against Libyans?
Yes.
Is this war taking place within the sovereign state of Libya?
Yes.
Then it is a civil war. These are the only criteria required.
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:06
#89
At the time German High Command considered it a golden opportunity to test there new weapons and tactics in preparation for the big show.
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:12
#90
M. Spector
[url=http://archive.rabble.ca/babble/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=13&t=0021... the Iraqis[/url] whether things are [url=http://archive.rabble.ca/babble/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic&f=28&t=0015... now[/url] than they were [url=http://archive.rabble.ca/babble/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=13&t=0016... Saddam[/url].
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:16
#91
"Gaddafi as he attempted to drown an inspiring revolt in blood"
Don't you think that is a lttle over the top? All I've seen so far is dinky little craters in the middle of nowhere, and a couple of dozen people standing around a car billowing black smoke; I haven't seen even a single picture of a dead body.
If we get our "information" from the FCM (Fawning Commercial Media), we are going to get a very inaccurate and biased perspective.
The FCM considers it "unseemly" to print or broadcast images of soldier's, the people's (Libertarias') and civilian's bodies - i.e., murdered victims of war.
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:26
#92
I'm not real high on Gadhafi. He was or perhaps still is an anticommunist. But what are the (realistic) alternatives?
The People, my friend, the People!
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:38
#93
Are you saying,because of your antipathy to Big Oil.Which I have,as well,that you are prepared to allow Mr.Khaddaffi to kill as many people as he can?
Is your position that that real suffering is to be put aside because of your personal geopolitical theories??
What goes on in Libya is the affair of Libyans and no one else.
No other country has the right to militarily interfere in the internal affairs of Libya and Libyans.
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:39
#94
40 years of power turns all men into tyrants and crooks.
I know. I'm an Albertan. *rimshot*
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:44
#95
Welcome back, Frmrsldr!
Now the vultures are circling Libya, and Harper, the great humanitarian, he who sheds tears daily for the suffering people of Libya, Iraq, and Afghanistan, is sending a mercy mission of F-16s.
May their aircraft fall out of the air. May their efforts be crowned with defeat. Obama, Cameron, Sarkozy, Harper, to the dustbin of history. Victory to the Libyan people!
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:46
#96
Al Jazeera's screen crawler is reporting that "CANADA IS SENDING WARPLANES TO HELP ENFORCE THE NO FLY ZONE"
Here's what the Angry Arab News, a very knowledgeable commentator said earlier:
Libyan Opposition:
"The Libyan people have been betrayed. Their revolution against the Libyan tyrant has been hijacked by the US and Saudi Arabia. That lousy henchman for Qhadhafi, Mustafa-Abd-Al-Jalil, is now a Saudi stooge who hijacked the uprising on behalf of a foreign agenda. I mean, what do you expect from a man who until the other day held the position of Minister of Justice in Qadhafi's regime, for potato's sake. And don't you like it when Western media constantly refers to him as 'the respected Libyan minister of Justice'. Respected by who? By Western governments?
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:49
#97
Give the people a chance to decide what the alternative will be and keep the body count down. That is all anybody can do in these situations.
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:49
#98
I don't deny the fre(er)flow of oil is part of this,however,that does'nt change the fact that there are people trying to free themselves from Mr.Khaddaffi's murderous and repressive regime.Those people are about to be murdered by Mr.Khaddaffi,and his "friends"...
Alot of them are going to die horribly if nothing is done,that's for certain...
So,I take it your position is that because the European powers,and their oil executive aparatchiks will probably profit from this,that Mr.Khaddaffi should be allowd to murder his own citizens,who he has almost no regard for anyway???
And as I said before,will certainly pave the way for the even worse,and even more bloodthirsty,Islamofascist's....
Throughout Gadhafi's career, he has been supported by various Western powers at various times.
What is happening now is a product of this.
To interfere with a no-fly zone and bombing and strafing Gadhafi forces on the ground will only put the Libyan people in the debt/grip of the West, should the West succeed in defeating government forces and overthrowing Gadhafi.
Whatever happens, whether the people succeed or fail -
It should be left entirely up to the People.
I know this may sould like "tough love" to some of you,
But it's the best way, if the Libyan People are to be Libertarias (Free or Liberated People.)
They must do it (for) themselves.
Thu, 2011-03-17 20:55
#99
FMRSD Wow too bad those dumb arabs aren't as smart as you are. Do you think you could contact them somehow to tell them about your brilliant strategy?
A no fly zone enforced by NATO to help one side in a civil war is not going to help the people of Libya anymore than the NATO intervention to destroy Yugosalvia has benefited the people of that region.
Since most reports don't seem to indicate that it is merely air power superiority on the side of the government forces will NATO allow the government forces to overrun all the rebel strongholds with non aerial weapons or will they actively attack Libyan government forces when they continue to win. There is no being a little bit pregnant or a little bit at war.
I have never argued in favor of a no-fly zone.
Read my previous posts and the ones posted below.
Well, when I (re)post this, they will be above.
You know what I mean.
Thu, 2011-03-17 21:00
#100
Are you saying,because of your antipathy to Big Oil.Which I have,as well,that you are prepared to allow Mr.Khaddaffi to kill as many people as he can?
Is your position that that real suffering is to be put aside because of your personal geopolitical theories??
What goes on in Libya is the affair of Libyans and no one else.
No other country has the right to militarily interfere in the internal affairs of Libya and Libyans.
Would you say that about Rwanda too?
Thu, 2011-03-17 21:01
#101
I agree...
Strategically,Col. Khaddaffi played this very well.
He allowed a poorly trained rag tag bunch of rebels take up alot of geographical space very quicly which spread themselves too thin...
He then struck back with full force!
This can be turned on him,however.His supply lines are exceedingly long...
Take out command and control from the air...
Simultaneously,warships in the Gulf of Sidra...And torpedo any gov't warship...
The strategic airstrikes on the roads,slowing down any retreat...
Catch the bastard in his own plan...
The precedent for this was the North African theater of war in WW2 where the lines see-sawed back and forth for awhile between the Axis and Allied forces. However that stuff about naval and air attacks is about Western forces. I am opposed to foreign interference.