After Osama Bin Laden's Death

102 posts / 0 new

Topic locked

Last post

Tue, 2011-05-03 01:08

NDPP

After Osama Bin Laden's Death

OBL Post Mortem - Continued from here:

http://rabble.ca/babble/international-news-and-politics/obama-announce-d...

and to start this off just in case you missed it:

Layton Hopes Bin Laden's Death a 'Turning Point'

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/05/02/layton-hopes-bin-ladens-death-a-tur...

"NDP Leader Jack Layton thanked the men and women in uniform shortly after US President Barack Obama announced that Osama Bin Laden was killed in a US raid...

Layton touted 'Canada's role in the international community as a leading contributor to the world's peace, security and prosperity.

I offer our deep appreciaton to the women and men in uniform who work hard and sacrifice to make the world a safer place,' he said."

Really?

Tue, 2011-05-03 01:17

M. Spector M. Spector's picture

Get used to it.

By the next election you won't be able to tell the difference between the NDP of 2015 and the Liberals of 2011.

Tue, 2011-05-03 01:37

NDPP

US Team's Mission Was To Kill Bin Laden

http://links.visibli.com/share/41ccdc

"The US special forces team that hunted down Osama Bin Laden was under orders to kill the Al Qaeda mastermind, not capture him, a US national security official told Reuters. 'This was a kill operation,' the official said, making clear there was no desire to capture bin Laden alive in Pakistan.."

Tue, 2011-05-03 03:46

Fidel

[url=http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=24595]PREDICTED IN MARCH 2010: Staging bin Laden's 'Death'[/url]

Quote:
Staging bin Laden's death will be seen as a fitting end to this genocidal war for the control of energy resources. Of course it will have to be done so that visual identification is not possible.

We suspect that when bin Laden is "killed," we'll just have to trust the folks that lied us into war to confirm they got him.

And they predicted correctly - they have staged his death. Elvis bin Laden was dead years ago and probably died of either wonky kidneys or by assassin Omar Saeed Sheikh, al-MI6'da operative and 9/11 paymaster.

Tue, 2011-05-03 07:48

NDPP

Obama Watched Bin Laden Die On Live Video (and vid)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1382859/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-pho...

assassins watching

Tue, 2011-05-03 08:09

NDPP

What Were They Thinking? - by Dave Lindorff

http://www.thiscantbehappening.net/node/588

Osama Bin Laden's Second Death - by Paul Craig Roberts

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article28009.htm

Tue, 2011-05-03 11:32

Bec.De.Corbin Bec.De.Corbin's picture

After Osama Bin Laden's Death?

Endless conspiracy theories...

Tue, 2011-05-03 13:39

Buddy Kat

Basically no one believes the US..or trusts the US to deliver any semblance of truth nowadays...so when is your next civil war?....word has it the country is about to explode.

Tue, 2011-05-03 18:30

Fidel

NDPP wrote:

Obama Watched Bin Laden Die On Live Video (and vid)

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1382859/Osama-bin-Laden-dead-pho...

assassins watching

They've got diagrams of "the compound" and everything. lol! That reminds of us of their previous diagramatic depictions of the "massive concrete bunkers" at Tora Bora which no one has ever verified existed. Well at least they won't be trying to pawn-off anymore faked video tapes on us.

I can see it all now. It will be an Elvis bin Laden marketing extravaganza with buttons and T-shirts and plastic models of OBL's lair of evol.

[url=http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=24601]Announcement of Osama's Death Fuels the Osama bin Laden Mythology[/url]

Quote:
Public confusion over body ID

The body was then allegedly recovered by the U.S. military and kept in its possession until it was dumped at sea. Here is where the story gets a bit dicey. Both ABC News and the Associated Press have reported that the body has been identified by DNA testing using tissue and blood samples taken from his sister who died of brain cancer previously. However, Reuters reports that DNA test results will not actually be available for days still, and that his body was identified using facial recognition techniques.

Adding to the confusion surrounding evidence of bin Laden's death, US military officials are said to have immediately disposed of the body in the Arabian Sea, supposedly adhering to "Muslim burial customs". Washington insists that they have photos and video of the body, but have yet to release them to the public.

So we're back to relying on doctored photos and faked video tape evidence, and that's not certain either.

Tue, 2011-05-03 18:46

#10

Sven

Fidel wrote:

And they predicted correctly - they have staged his death.

That's sounds like a "deather" (the flip side of those crazy "birthers" down here demanding a copy of BHO's birth certificate)...

Tue, 2011-05-03 19:21

#11

Slumberjack

It's somewhat different Sven. Birthers are merely piling yet another excuse onto an existing racial overcurrent having to do about people with foreign sounding names that shouldn't have any entitlement to rights, such as those provided for through their own birth, hence the 'take back our country' sentiments. "Deathers" on the other hand would be in possession of quite a number of well founded reasons for questioning everything that passes from the mouths of those born liars down there masquerading as the people's representatives.

Wed, 2011-05-04 04:33

#12

Fidel

Sven wrote:

Fidel wrote:

And they predicted correctly - they have staged his death.

That's sounds like a "deather" (the flip side of those crazy "birthers" down here demanding a copy of BHO's birth certificate)...

The difference is that those types drew their own conclusions years ago and will not be convinced of anything else no matter what proof the plutocracy produces or conveniently neglects to. For instance in this case, an actual body and eye witnesses, perhaps even one of the Bush Family acquaintances and business partners among the bin Ladens confirming identity of the body. In fact, there is no body. This burial at sea business is another fantastic lie for which they never intended on producing for the public record. Their dubious and highly suspect 9/11 narrative is preserved in this way.

Truthers, OTOH, are always open to examining new evidence. So far, though, there is nothing but circumstantial evidence, heresay and conjecture as the case has been since "nurse Nayirah" fairy tales in 1991 through to "WMD" claims in 2003. Some Americans and Canadians are easily fooled. This is part of the same politically expedient truth which central planners in the war planning department consider when plotting out years of worth phony war in advance.

We haven't seen anything but more photos and wild claims, and yet another diagramatic depiction of Dr Evol's lair similar to the massively fictitious claims for concrete bunker complexes manned by Qaeda Generals and the invisible army of darkness bent on America's destruction as Donald Rumsfeld and Lord Haha himself, Bill O'Reilly claimed was true on Fox Newz in the 2000s. Apparently they knew that only some of the people require fooling. Some people insist on only the most outrageous lies before ignoring the blood for oil. neoMackinderian reality of a vicious empire running out of time. It's as if they willingly pull the wool over their own eyes and plug their own ears and spew the most ridiculous things sooner than consider government lies in a rational and logical way. Survivors of the Nazi regime describe similar behaviours among their countrymen in the 1930s.

The plutocracy in America isn't even claiming that they will produce any hard physical evidence of OBL's death. But their loyal and obedient flock of followers continue clinging to their every word and utterance and have hastily accepted this newz item hand-delivered from war planners and parroted by cosmetic leaders as fact and not the leap of faith that it is. Non-truthers continue to be bred and led. Their's is not to question why only to trust and obey.

[url=http://globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=24599]Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda: A Critical Analysis[/url] Selected Articles

[url=http://www.euronews.net/2011/05/02/dead-bin-laden-photo-is-a-fake/][colo... bin Laden photo ‘is a fake'[/color][/url]

Wed, 2011-05-04 13:05

#13

Sven

Alright, Fidel, then, very simply: What evidence do you have that (1) OBL is still alive or (2) OBL was killed a long time ago?

Wed, 2011-05-04 13:39

#14

George Victor

M. Spector wrote:

Get used to it.

By the next election you won't be able to tell the difference between the NDP of 2015 and the Liberals of 2011.

Ah well, perhaps Jack together with the committed newcomers from Quebec will have been able to save public medicine and given we old farts a new reason for hope by the time 2015 rolls around. Can't possibly meet your celestial standards, of course, but maybe save a few lives here and there in this country. That'll be something, I suppose.

Wed, 2011-05-04 13:43

#15

pwr_2_da_ppl

If you believe that OBL was killed the other night in this "raid" on his "compound" and then had his body dumped in the ocean, then I've got a few bridges to sell ya for a song!

Seriously, have you guys seen the death photos? Come on...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/02/osama-bin-laden-photo-fake

there is absolutely no evidence that this actually happened, other than Obama saying so. Would you believe him if he said Gaddafi has WMD and we need to invade ? Did you believe that the video of OBL that was released days before the 2004 presidential elections was a real video? If no, then why do you believe this story?

this is master manipulation on a large scale. Joseph Goebbels could have learned a thing or two from these guys!

Wed, 2011-05-04 13:51

#16

contrarianna

Don't "Truthers" have their own tinfoil-secured website?

Wed, 2011-05-04 13:57

#17

Slumberjack

Yeah, but they don't have matching hats. Everything gets through.

Wed, 2011-05-04 13:58

#18

pwr_2_da_ppl

contrarianna: Sorry, I guess I should be celebrating the (irrelevant) death of a single person in Pakistan?

Don't sadistic sheeple have their own rationality-secured website? I think it's called the NY times, you'll likely find it soothing and un-challenging to your opinions.

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:00

#19

George Victor

Not allowed to come in here with the obvious one about gray matter under the hats...

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:03

#20

Caissa

President Barack Obama has decided not to release a photo of Osama bin Laden's body as evidence of his death, an administration official briefed by the White House told CNN Wednesday.

The decision follows discussions among U.S. officials about whether to release a photo.

CIA Director Leon Panetta said Tuesday that he believed a photo would be released at some point. "I just think it's important -- they know we have it, to release it," Panetta said.

But White House spokesman Jay Carney noted Tuesday that there were also "sensitivities here in terms of the appropriateness of releasing photographs of Osama bin Laden in the aftermath" of the killing.

http://edition.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/04/bin.laden.main/index.htm...

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:19

#21

contrarianna

pwr_2_da_ppl wrote:

If you believe that OBL was killed the other night in this "raid" on his "compound" and then had his body dumped in the ocean, then I've got a few bridges to sell ya for a song!

Seriously, have you guys seen the death photos? Come on...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/02/osama-bin-laden-photo-fake

there is absolutely no evidence that this actually happened, other than Obama saying so. Would you believe him if he said Gaddafi has WMD and we need to invade ? Did you believe that the video of OBL that was released days before the 2004 presidential elections was a real video? If no, then why do you believe this story?

this is master manipulation on a large scale. Joseph Goebbels could have learned a thing or two from these guys!

Lets see, the US government circulated a well known 2-year old photshopped fake picture of bin Laden's death through a Pakistani newspaper in order to....?

Now, let's at least get a little creative here in our conpiracy theory and not just say that THEY thought: "no one will notice" or, "someone might notice, but spending a few hundred dollars on doing a new one is just too much for the Pentagon".

Hmmm, let's see. How about "Let's circulate an obviously fake photo that will obviously be spotted then people will think:
a) bin Laden is still alive and is a serious threat that must be met with more wars
or
b) "Truthers" will spot it and it will distract them, thereby allowing us a free hand with more controlled demolitions and energy beams from space.

Feel free to add your own

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:24

#22

pwr_2_da_ppl

President Obama has refused to release evidence of his claim to have allegedly killed OBL. So just "trust us". We got him. "Trust us". Why would we lie to you all? It's not like we have anything to hide, right? It's not like the US Gov has lied in the past, right?

This is exactly the kind of public acquiescence to the official narrative that allowed the invasion of Afghanistan, and the invasion of Iraq, not to mention the entire "war on terror" and our dramatic plunge towards a police-state. I have no problem believing that OBL is dead, but what is going on right now is nothing short of public hysteria. People foaming at the mouth and cheering in the streets and in writing for the death of another person, a human being.Any why? Because Big Brother told us to.

What does this say about our society? In Canada the death penalty is illegal, and yet our media and politicians cheer the alleged murder of this man without shame? Our citizens cheer his death as a victory of some kind. It makes me sick, and IMO raises legitimate questions about the level of civility in this society.

The OBL mythos has been a running narrative over the past 10 years, perhaps longer, and at every step of the way there are serious questions about the authenticity of this narrative. And now, it seems all it forgotten because "we won", "we got him", "he died like a coward behind a woman".

And some here would attack my opinion and call me a "conspiracy theorist" right on cue! Lol, what a joke.

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:33

#23

pwr_2_da_ppl

contrarianna: how about releasing a real photo? How about releasing actual evidence and facts? I guess you have no need for any of that. More kool-aid, anyone?

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:39

#24

contrarianna

You've got me there. My masters in the CIA tell me I can't release my photos yet, good photoshopping takes time, as noted in post #20

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:43

#25

pwr_2_da_ppl

ah, intentional misunderstanding, the last refuge of the loser!

Clearly I was speaking about the Obama admin. but hey, you've got no other leg to stand on so you might as well attempt to obfuscate my points about you lacking the intellectual ability to decern fact from fiction.

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:48

#26

Lachine Scot

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/985401--bin-laden-killing-was-...

Bin Laden killing was self defence: U.S. Attorney General

In case we thought the Obama administration was less crazy than the Bush one.

And I'm saying this as someone sympathetic to Obama. Sheesh.

Wed, 2011-05-04 14:56

#27

contrarianna

Cold-blooded murderer murdered by cold-blooded (lying) murderers:

The obvious lies by Obama in his fantasy speech of the "brave firefight" and all the rest of the Manichean mythology of battling Evil is becoming evident.

Quote:
OSAMA bin Laden was unarmed and with members of his family - including his 12-year-old daughter - when he was shot dead by US special forces on Monday, according to new details that emerged yesterday.

The daughter has claimed that she watched as her father was captured alive and shot before being dragged to a US military helicopter, Arabic news network al-Arabiya quoted Pakistani officials as saying
....
While [76 year old]bin Laden had offered ''resistance'' to the US commandos, officials revealed he was not armed - fuelling speculation the elite Navy SEAL team was under orders to kill rather than capture him.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/daughter-12-saw-killing-of-unarmed-bin-laden...

Quote:
Story Changes: Osama Was ‘Unarmed,’ Officials Now Admit
Questions Grow Over Why Troops Didn't Capture Him Alive
by Jason Ditz, May 03, 2011

....
Other changes to the story include the “used his wife as a human shield” claim, which was first revised to a claim that he used some other, random woman as a human shield and eventually dropped in favor of the claim that the random, unarmed woman attacked the troops upon entering the room. It remains to be seen if other major changes will be forthcoming.

http://news.antiwar.com/2011/05/03/story-changes-osama-was-unarmed-offic...

Wed, 2011-05-04 15:13

#28

contrarianna

Lachine Scot wrote:

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/985401--bin-laden-killing-was-...

Bin Laden killing was self defence: U.S. Attorney General

In case we thought the Obama administration was less crazy than the Bush one.

And I'm saying this as someone sympathetic to Obama. Sheesh.

Yep.

The weasel words in the actual statement is "national self-defense" which is another way of saying: "although this 76 year old was unarmed and helpless, it was in the US national interest to execute him with 2 bullets in the head in front of his family and 12 year-old daughter."

Wed, 2011-05-04 15:39

#29

Sven

pwr_2_da_ppl wrote:

If you believe that OBL was killed the other night in this "raid" on his "compound" and then had his body dumped in the ocean, then I've got a few bridges to sell ya for a song!

[snip]

there is absolutely no evidence that this actually happened, other than Obama saying so.

People are free to believe or not believe whatever they want (like the faked moon landing in 1969).

Wed, 2011-05-04 15:59

#30

pwr_2_da_ppl

Sven: I guess you're going to attribute all sorts of crazy ideas to me now? How utterly typical.

Wed, 2011-05-04 16:59

#31

al-Qa'bong

I saw French government officials on TV5 last night question the veracity of the reports of Bin Laden's summary execution by US soldiers.

This is a win-win for the US government. They can both take the credit for ridding the world of its evillest dude, and keep the fear of their own private Emmanuel Goldstein alive.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:05

#32

SRB

Thomas Mulcair was careless enough to question the existence of photos of Bin Laden on Power and Politics as well as making some incautious remarks about international law, and now Evan Solomon, Greg Weston and Tasha Kheiriddin are all yucking it up over what a major gaffe from a so-called serious MP this was. Is the NDP really going to take a position questioning US claims?

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:08

#33

pookie

It's amazing how the pundits all descended like sharks...they're positively gleeful!

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:13

#34

SRB

Well, of course, no one dare question America's claims about anything. And it was stupid!

But their laughter was rude. The whole time Ian was talking, Tasha was giggling in the background.

I suppose now the party will have to make a statement about this or take a position. Next time he should leave well enough alone.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:14

#35

pookie

I agree - the outright snorting was quite unprofessional.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:18

#36

knownothing knownothing's picture

Good for Mulcair at least someone speaks the people's mind!

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:21

#37

Sven

On a related subject, I think the decision not to disclose photos of OBL's dead body is the right one. For those who doubt that the USA just killed OBL, a photo is unlikely to convince them otherwise anyway (especially for those dedicated conspiracy theorists who see a conspiracy hiding behind every rock). And, other than for the purpose of providing evidence of OBL's death, I see no other legitimate reason for publicizing such a photo.

In the meantime, I'm just happy OBL is gone.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:28

#38

Boom Boom

There are things I like about Evan Solomon - his speech, for example - but he really took unfair advantage of this misstep by Mulcair. He should have given Mulcair a chance to retract his comment.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:31

#39

SRB

The NDP should take a lesson from this and tread much more carefully. That is exactly what will happen whenever anyone makes a mistake or gaffe -- outright laughter and scorn. And not just the punditry, but all the partisan hacks will flog it to death as well.

ETA: Solomon has now played the clip several times for different guests. He is obviously enjoying flogging this gaffe as much as he can.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:35

#40

knownothing knownothing's picture

Whatever. I think the NDP should establish themselves as an Anti-American party. Let's oppose the Tories not cuddle up to them like the Libs.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:51

#41

Boom Boom

knownothing wrote:

Whatever. I think the NDP should establish themselves as an Anti-American party. Let's oppose the Tories not cuddle up to them like the Libs.

Great. Give the Cons more ammunition. Apparently this is 'gaffe' week for the NDP.

Wed, 2011-05-04 18:59

#42

knownothing knownothing's picture

We have to fight the Cons, not roll over and play footsie with them. We have to oppose them!

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:07

#43

Boom Boom

I was referring to this comment by you: "I think the NDP should establish themselves as an Anti-American party". That's about the dumbest thing the NDP could do.

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:20

#44

knownothing knownothing's picture

Maybe...maybe not. Donald Trump is allowed to speculate about the non-existence of Obama's birth certificate and Mulcair can't speculate about the non-existence of Osama's death photo?

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:26

#45

Boom Boom

I think he'll be known as 'Doubting Thomas' soon.

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:33

#46

Wat Tyler

pookie wrote:

It's amazing how the pundits all descended like sharks...they're positively gleeful!

Just remember, they used to do the same to Reform, the Alliance and Stephen Harper -- our opposites on the ideological spectrum. And looked where they ended up.

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:35

#47

Snert

Quote:
Donald Trump is allowed to speculate about the non-existence of Obama's birth certificate and Mulcair can't speculate about the non-existence of Osama's death photo?

And [i]nobody[/i] laughed at that, or the other 'Birthers'?

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:42

#48

Slumberjack

It's still considered a heresy within the usual centers of sycophancy, the CBC, the National Post, the mind of Greg Weston, etc, to question any utterance from the born liars of the US corporate administration. He may as well have torn pages from the Bible on air and set them on fire with a bic lighter.

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:46

#49

SRB

Slumberjack wrote:

It's still considered a heresy within the usual centers of sycophancy, the CBC, the National Post, the mind of Greg Weston, etc, to question any utterance from the born liars of the US corporate administration. He may as well have torn pages from the Bible on air and set them on fire with a bic lighter.

Which is why it was stupid. Sometimes the NDP will want to take principled positions which will cause them to be shouted at in the Media. But surely not over an issue like this, because who really cares? There are more important things on which to take a controversial (to the MSM) position. And Mulcair is an experienced (supposedly) MP!

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:47

#50

Fidel

Sven wrote:

Alright, Fidel, then, very simply: What evidence do you have that (1) OBL is still alive or (2) OBL was killed a long time ago?

I have no evidence of OBL's status, but neither have you been provided with any at the same time.

The [url=http://foreign.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Tora_Bora_Report.pdf]US Senate(pdf)[/url] said thatOBL was "within the grasp" of the U.S. militaryin December 2001. Apparently then-secretary of defense Donald Rumsfeld refused to provide enough soldiers to capture or kill him.

[url=http://classic-web.archive.org/web/20060217051331/http://www.msnbc.msn.c... field commander[/url] for Afghanistan then admitted the same thing.

[url=http://www.juancole.com/2008/11/afghan-article-says-us-bin-ladin-hunt.ht... soldiers[/url] said much the same thing, and that they could have easily captured or killed OBL. They said US Military officers stopped them.

Next up, [url=http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,304306,00.html]this retired US Military officer[/url] and Fox News military analyst said that the U.S. Military could have killed Bin Laden in 2007, but chose not to.

I'm just scratching the surface here in order to lead you to draw your own conclusions. These aren't all foreign news services - most are US and quoting US Government officials, CIA, and retired US Military officers who were involved in the hunt for OBL.

Sven the source of these "conspiracy theories" are US nationals and government people themselves not me or any other lefties up here north o' the border. Your country has real issues, and there are whistleblowers trying to tell you certain things about what's wrong with things in general. Are you listening? These are Americans and even patriotic ones at that. They care about America and their fellow Americans. Those kinds of Americans are serious about such noble ideas as freedom and democracy and owing a certain duty to their country. Are you a patriotic American, Sven?

Wed, 2011-05-04 19:49

#51

ghoris

This story is now the headline on CBC: "NDP deputy leader doubts bin Laden photos exist".

Edited to add: Paul Dewar has issued a clarifying statement.

Quote:

"We have no reason to doubt the veracity of President Obama's statement," Dewar wrote in an emailed statement.

"I understand that the U.S. government has photos, but decided not to release them as they do not want them used as trophies. This is a legitimate concern. We agree these types of photos shouldn't be used as propaganda tools.

"As in all cases, the public's right to know must be balanced with public safety concerns."

The "Clampetts" narrative that seems to be developing in the media is eerily reminiscent of Ontario in 1990.

Pages

Topic locked