Recent Protests in Greece

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Sat, 2011-07-02 11:47

Uncle John

@Sven - The Germans have made out like bandits with the Euro. They have a guaranteed market for their exports all over Europe, and they have defacto control of the money supply out of the European Central Bank in (Guess Where?) Germany."Fourth Reich" hegemony over Europe has made it extremely difficult for countries on the periphery to compete, because they have to deal in a currency they have no control over. Germany is quite happy to send its BMWs and Mercedes Benzes to those countries for good money, but when the shoe drops and these countries need help (primarily because of economic imbalances caused by German domination) the Germans turn their back? This is not good enough. If you are going to have Imperial dominion over a whole continent, you have to take responsibility for all people on that continent, whether they are in your country or not.

Going back to my example of Canadian equalization, Albertans bitch all the time about money flowing to Quebec, but that doesn't seem to stop the system. At the same time, they are quite happy to sell their tar sands sludge to the Americans, while forcing up the Canadian dollar and screwing up the economy for everyone else.

Sat, 2011-07-02 12:34

#103

Roscoe

Tommy_Paine wrote:

Whatever pretext one uses to default-- and I like the notion of "odius" debt-- it still doesn't change the reality of the question that is really being put to the Greeks, that has already been put to the Icelanders and Irish.

That question is would you rather be poor and enslaved to other nations for generations, or would you rather be poor for a few decades, soveriegn and independant?

Not only are nations facing this question, but many individuals all over Europe and North America.

Iceland is different. Icelandic banks had failed, wiping out the savings of Dutch and English investors. The governments of those investors repaid their respective investors and then attempted to force the Icelandic government to reimburse the Netherlands and Britain via the usual IMF/WB/ECB thuggery.

When the Icelandic government approved this coersion, the PM vetoed it -forcing a referendum where the people voted it down. It was the people, not the poltroons they elected who saw the banksters off.

In the case of Greece, the elected poltroons have approved at the urging of the PM. If Greece doesn't have a mechanism to give the people a vote, the people will either have to force such a vote or allow their government to sell them into EU slavery.

Sat, 2011-07-02 13:01

#104

Roscoe

Uncle John wrote:

Going back to my example of Canadian equalization, Albertans bitch all the time about money flowing to Quebec, but that doesn't seem to stop the system. At the same time, they are quite happy to sell their tar sands sludge to the Americans, while forcing up the Canadian dollar and screwing up the economy for everyone else.

It is a terrible situation is it not? The natural order is uncompetitive eastern manufacturing economies forcing the Loonie down so they can coast on its coattails rather than creating a competitive economy. The fact that they "screw up the economy for everyone else" is never considered.

Albertans (also BC and Sask) are too busy working and enjoying life to worry about equalisation largesse. We don't begrudge the money, just the attitudes that a small minority of easterners send back as thanks.

Not just "Alberta" but BC and Saskatchewan industry is searching world wide for skilled labour. Many workers come from the east and either move or commute on paid travel to their homes. Eastern companies manufacture many of the components and parts for new facilities and still, much of the work is outsourced to Asia.

Western Canada's booming economy based on energy and resources is changing the political and economic landscape permanently. Get used to it. Canada needs the resource revenue to pay for its services and entitlements. The Conference Board of Canada states that Canada is still falling in productivity. Without the work ethic and drive of the west, Canada can easily become like Greece.

Sat, 2011-07-02 13:16

#105

Roscoe

Uncle John wrote:

@Sven - The Germans have made out like bandits with the Euro. They have a guaranteed market for their exports all over Europe, and they have defacto control of the money supply out of the European Central Bank in (Guess Where?) Germany."Fourth Reich" hegemony over Europe has made it extremely difficult for countries on the periphery to compete, because they have to deal in a currency they have no control over. Germany is quite happy to send its BMWs and Mercedes Benzes to those countries for good money, but when the shoe drops and these countries need help (primarily because of economic imbalances caused by German domination) the Germans turn their back? This is not good enough. If you are going to have Imperial dominion over a whole continent, you have to take responsibility for all people on that continent, whether they are in your country or not.

An uninformed simplistic solution for a complex issue. Try understanding the lack of real wage growth and/or savings in Germany. Inform yourself on the sacrifices the German people are making to ensure their competitiveness. ( Then compare that effort with Canadian lack of effort) Without doubt, it is the German people who stand against a bailout of Greece, just like it is the Greek people who stand against the costs of said bailout.

Merkel's government is well aware that the German people will not tolerate ECB/IMF chicanery to save the banksters.

Sat, 2011-07-02 14:01

#106

MegB

Continued here.

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