Saganash and Singh are doing suprisingly well in my view. Dewar is incredibly stiff. Topp and Nash are definitely the winners in my view so far. Both seem natural. Topp tops Nash where language is concerned. Mulcair.. oy, the constant self-boasting is a bit tiring, as was that little stunt he pulled where he spoke English in the French debate. Nice opportunity to show his "lighter" side.
NDP leadership debate: December 4
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:22
#52
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:24
#53
dacckon
Chisholm should drop, its unacceptable. Topp speaks the best. Nash,Mulcair, and Saganash have also done incredibly well.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:25
#54
I wonder if Topp cranked up Dewar as a tactic to keep Mulcair out of the picture as much as possible?
And this is for Unionist: Romeo Saganesh has the best hair.
Next to Singh, perhaps.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:25
#55
Boom Boom
There's a young guy yawning behind Chisholm! 
Now he looks like he fell asleep, and woke up with a start - he's listening to Chisholm and wondering "what the hell?"
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:29
#56
I hadn't realized Saganash was so much more confident in French than in English. The difference is striking.
Chisholm really doesn't deserve to be there if he can't even make an effort in French. It's an insult.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:29
#57
Is Topp trying to show he's "tough" enough to go against Harper? Your first introduction with all the candidates and you're looking like a snarky pitbull. Not coming across well. You could even see it in the audience.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:29
#58
My new French ranking: Saganash=Mulcair>Topp>Nash>Ashton>Cullen>Singh>Dewar
Chisholm is neither taking nor answering questions in French.
In terms of who could "grow" in to the job linguistically, I would draw the line at Cullen. He is on the edge of being able to pull it off. Singh needs a few more years of French or some French immersion. His foundation is solid but part of the structure is missing.
Topp is very close to Mulcair and Saganash in terms of French ability. Nash and Ashton both have strong French. Cullen's accent and measured pace saves his bacon but he needs more vocab, better grammar.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:30
#59
I missed the beginning, but here are my impressions.
First, too many candidates. Candidates don't have the time to differentiate each other because they first establish their support of the NDP's values, but then they run out of time to define their own particular positions. Some candidates need to bow out for the good of the race.
I'm thinking that Saganash and Ashton don't currently have the experience for the job. Niki Ashton is young, she'll have more chances if she keeps at it, she may be a rising star, but she hasn't reached the level needed currently. She might have been good if the NDP wasn't in position to become a government in waiting. Saganash is particularly nervous and inexperienced with the political scene. Chisholm and Singh have a lot of trouble in French, that is currently unacceptable for the NDP if it wants to keep its support in Québec. I'd finally say that Gewar also is a bit nervous and not ready either.
Second, Thomas Mulcair and Nathan Cullen are doing the best job in this format. They seem most at ease. Brian Topp seems to know what he is talking about, but he is not as at ease. Currently, I wouldn't vote for him, but he has potential. Peggy Nash is okay, she makes me think of Pelosi a bit also.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:31
#60
There were no opening statements in French (i.e. in the French section). I suspect that is why Mulcair opened in French.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:32
#61
absolutely agree with Unionist above - Cullen is a very nice surprise in this French debate. He has an ease and confidence that is shocking, even with all his mistakes.
Interesting - I never would have put Peggy as the winner of English language part.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:33
#62
Saganash seems to be much stronger in French than in English, probably a function of being based in Quebec. Paul Dewar's French is just awful, and I'm disappointed that Chisholm has not progressed to the point where he can participate in the debate.
Among the candidates, Nash and Ashton have moved up on my radar, while Saganash has dropped somewhat. Cullen has interesting things to say, and would be in contention if he hadn't screwed up with the idea of running joint slates.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:33
#63
Stupid question: "Who's your second choice?" I would have asked: "Who's your third choce?"
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:34
#64
Actually, now that I think of it, I asked one of the candidates the same question. So call me stupid! Anyway, some good answers - so I guess it confirms that there are no stupid questions.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:36
#65
Boom Boom
Saganash really comes alive in the French language debate. He looks wonderful - much more than in the first debate.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:38
#66
To the candidates: "Who is your second choice?"
Dewar -Saganash
Cullen- Nash
Nash- Ashton
Saganash -Undecided
Mulcair -didn't answer
Ashton- didn't answer
Chisholm- didn't answer, likely saving choice until the convention
Topp - Ashton
Singh- didn't answer
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:39
#67
Surprisingly, I can most see Cullen going head to head with other party leaders. Mulcair is good but there's something lacking - maybe he seems too detached? Topp is also good though I agree that at times he seems smug. I like his directness and willingness to engage other candidates.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:39
#68
Boom Boom
I have no idea who is winning the French debate, so I rely on your opinions.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:40
#69
Catchfire
I would have asked who's your last choice!
And who said that Niki Ashton's French was poor? Cripes! I wish mine was twice as bad!
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:42
#70
Whoa - good question from Peggy, wrong answer from Martin, about whether he agrees that a strong public pension plan is the best for workers and for small businesses. Sorry... I promised not to talk about substance... Damn!
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:45
#71
Boom Boom
Will anyone drop out after this? I can't see Chisholm going forward.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:48
#72
Oy. I believe Chisholm's attempt to ask Topp a question in French actually resulted in the violent death of several cute kittens.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:48
#73
Chisolm should be dropping out. It's embarrassing. He will make a great minister some day, but the langauge skills are not just there.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:49
#74
dacckon
"The prime ministers Barack Obama's best friend" Oh Chisholm... you are teh weakest link
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:52
#75
Oh, not very classy, Topp mentions that Broadbent is in the hall. Endorsements forever!
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:53
#76
And, yes, Saganash is almost a different candidate in French. Much more commanding.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:53
#77
Will anyone drop out after this? I can't see Chisholm going forward.
Several MPs tried to talk him out of running. He didn't want to listen. But after paying $15,000 to enter, who knows if he will drop out...
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:53
#78
kim elliott
Curious: are there any people here who are seeing some of these leadership candidates perform for the first time? I've been enjoying all of your comments... as I always do.. but other than confirming how poor or good each person's French is... I haven't seen any surprises come out of this first debate. But that said, with the exception of Singh, I'm pretty familiar with all of these people. I'd be very curious to know what people's first impressions are of the candidates.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:55
#79
Wow, Mulcair, good point which should resonate. We won by going way beyond our traditional constituency in Québec. Gotta do it everywhere.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:55
#80
Boom Boom
What did Chisholm just say - it made the youngsters behind him laugh out loud. Something about his ability in French.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:56
#81
English debate. It is hard to score, but here is a stab: Chisholm>Mulcair>Dewar>Topp>Singh>Cullen>Nash>Ashton>Saganash
I'm more confident with my ranking near the lower end than the higher end. Dewar surprised me with his handling of Topp's attack. Dewar didn't addressed the substance of Topp's attack but he found ways to manage the conversation. Chisholm was relaxed at the podium and spoke very clearly. Mulcair was stiff but spoke clearly and played it safe. Topp came across as negative in his attack. It was a good jibe but he needed to avoid interrupting Dewar too much in order to make his point. Singh differentiated himself with interesting policies and solid self-confidence. Cullen was the only candidate that made people laugh, but he repeated himself a lot and did not say much of substance. Nash spoke lethargically. Ashton was platitudinous in the extreme. Saganash seemed very nervous and had trouble communicating.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:56
#82
Curious: are there any people here who are seeing some of these leadership candidates perform for the first time? I've been enjoying all of your comments... as I always do.. but other than confirming how poor or good each person's French is... I haven't seen any surprises come out of this first debate. But that said, with the exception of Singh, I'm pretty familiar with all of these people. I'd be very curious to know what people's first impressions are of the candidates.
They're all my second choice.
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:57
#83
What did Chisholm just say - it made the youngsters behind him laugh out loud. Something about his ability in French.
He said he works hard to learn French but "c'est tough"
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:57
#84
kim elliott
BTW, I'm watching the debate at a bar in Toronto with Michelle, Radio Rahim and OldGoat. Comment of the afternoon (so far): "If invoking Jack Layton was a word drinking game, Mulcair would have us all under the table an hour ago."
Sun, 2011-12-04 15:57
#85
And, yes, Saganash is almost a different candidate in French. Much more commanding.
Maybe that's what I've been missing... hearing he's quite impressive but then I listen to him it doesn't match up.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:01
#86
If Chisholm didn't have the self-awareness to stay out of the race, I'm unsure he has the sense of shame now to quit.
I think Dewar's performance should see him drop in the estimation of many. Topp sounded assured, but looked haughty. Mulcair the warmest and most natural. Saganash's lack of confidence in English shows itself to be a huge stumbling block.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:01
#87
Hmmm...first impressions?
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:02
#88
dacckon
Mulcair was calm and detailed
Nash performed the best in the English Debate
Topp did fantastic in French, I felt that he recovered a bit from the pointless attack on Dewar. He should have realized the time limit doesn't allow for back and forth.
Chisholm should drop ASAP
Singh seems like a single issue candidate. He's more of a cabinet minister than a prime minister
Saganash didn't perform as well as I expected. Perhaps he should stay in the race and we can see if he improves.
Dewar lacked in French.
Ashton has potential, she did very well.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:04
#89
Mulcair has helped himself enormously I think. Topp not so much. Ashton will be rising on many people's list I expect. Saganash balanced off a weak english performance with a strong french one, so will likely hold his own. Nash will hold support well, but I don't think will have grown it much- really flubbed the rural/urban divide question. Dewar was way too stiff. Singh was too much of a broken record. Chisholm should drop out.
And Nathan Cullen. Oh Nathan, if it were not be for your stupid, idiotic proposal on joint nominations you might have made yourself the front runner today.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:08
#90
Am I the only one who was bothered by Chisholm's "give me a chance to learn French" plea at the end of the debate?
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:09
#91
Not sure why Topp would be so "forward" with Dewar and Nash. Does he want to put a bad taste in the mouths of their supporters? Someone should remind him this is a preferential ballot.
Someone who liked Topp said they expected a certain camp would bring up Buzz Hargrove and Peggy... guess they had inside knowledge it would be their own? lol
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:10
#92
Boom Boom
I'm seeing Singh and Chisholm for the first time. Not impressed by either of them.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:11
#93
Boom Boom
Goldhawk is analysing the debate on CPAC. Chisholm is getting flak.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:12
#94
nope
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:12
#95
dacckon
Lol'd @ the first call. Knows Cullen personally.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:13
#96
Interesting that more than one person has ranked Dewar's French higher than Cullen's. My impression was the reverse, by far. Granted I am not a first-language francophone, but Cullen's French flows very naturally and Dewar's stutters. Did those with more perceptive ears found Cullen's to be more flawed than I did?
I'm very disappointed with my PVR. While it did allow me to switch the audio track to French on CPAC, what I didn't know was that every time I switched the audio track it hacked up the recording into little bits. And I can't actually switch the audio track when I play back the recording.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:15
#97
Chisholm should absolutely drop out.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:15
#98
dacckon
Yes, Cullen was much better in French.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:16
#99
No, I would put Cullen ahead of Dewar even if his grammar is worse, simply because I think Francophones would find Cullen the more engaging speaker. I don't know Cullen's background, but it would seem that with a bit of targeted training he could become very good indeed. Dewar likely has a cap on how good he can get.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:17
#100
Am I the only one who was bothered by Chisholm's "give me a chance to learn French" plea at the end of the debate?
Won't happen. And it's not just getting there for the next election... you need to be able to engage those who speak French for the three or four before the election.
I like Robert a lot. But if you're not bilingual, don't run. Period.
Sun, 2011-12-04 16:18
#101
I kinda liked Justin Ling's approach.