Site upgrade today -- temporary downtime

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Mon, 2012-07-23 14:50

Catchfire

Site upgrade today -- temporary downtime

Hi everyone!

The site will be given a small upgrade today, which will mean the whole website will be down for a couple of hours. Most of the upgrade is for other parts of the site, but you will notice a few changes on babble and in your user profile. Rebecca and I hope that these will be positive changes, but we'll have to see once the upgrade hits. Mostly, if you're wondering why the site is down, if you read this, you'll know why.

Here's what our resident tech guy has to say about the upgrade and the brief down period:

Quote:
Hello rabble.ca people,

Early next week rabble.ca is upgrading the software the site is built on.
The primary purpose of the upgrade is to move to a more current version
of the back-end so that we can take advantage of new features and make
rabble.ca run smoother.
For most users, we've kept things relatively the same for now, but some
aspects have had to change and you will notice some slight differences.

... and yes, there may in fact be some broken items.
You may have noticed that rabble.ca is a fairly big site, and once
running live, new errors may surface.
Please help us discover and address these quickly by reporting them on
this form (http://rabble.ca/contact/bug%20report).

The small FAQ to start you off.
- the rabble tech team

UPGRADE FAQ

WHERE IS MY MENU?
Perhaps the biggest item most users will see right away is the
disappearance of the My Menu bar on the right. Everything that was here
has now moved to the menu at the top right of the page. Clicking on
'Content' will bring you to your workspace where you can create new
content and see all of your past posts.

MY USER PAGE HAS CHANGED, WHY?
It hasn't changed much.
Content has now been separated into two blocks to show you clearly what
posts of yours have had recent activity, and to keep track of your most
recent comments.

BUT WHAT ABOUT THE STATUS BOX?
It was a nice little feature that was fun for a few users. We may bring
it back, but it is a prime example of a piece of the software that when
upgraded, it had significantly expanded it's feature set well beyond our
needs and caused us concern with site performance.

THE CONTENT CREATION FORM LOOKS DIFFERENT!
Yup. Though very little is actually different here, we did try and clean
it up some.
You'll notice that some of the broken features in the WYSIWIG now work.
For example, formatting an image's alignment and padding.

PAGE X IS DISPLAYING WEIRDLY IN MY BROWSER. WHY?
Great! Please let us know asap via http://rabble.ca/contact/bug%20report
and we'll put it in our list of things to fix.

THIS THING I WANT TO DO DOESN'T WORK THE WAY I WANT IT TOO. WELL TO BE
HONEST IT NEVER DID. WHY?
It's true, somethings didn't work the way everyone wanted them too on
the past site, and this is part of the motivation for the upgrade.
See the references to the contact form above and let us know. We'll put
it into our support queue, and hopefully this is something we can
address now.

Mon, 2012-07-23 14:53

Caissa

What are the babble upgrades?

Mon, 2012-07-23 15:17

Catchfire

Well, you'll hopefully see tomorrow, but they're quite minor from what I've seen. The major thing you'll notice is more info on the Active Topics page (including a post preview) and that the "my menu" you now see on the right side of your screen will be gone and most of those options moved to the top right of your page. Also, our statuses have been removed as part of a new progressive tax scheme under austerity measures.

But like I said, most of the changes are for other parts of the site. Not a whole lot has changed here.

Mon, 2012-07-23 21:02

Unionist

"Up"grade? Really?

Mon, 2012-07-23 21:04

Unionist

Where does one begin when it comes to flagging bugs, or simply degradation of features? There are too many. Can you offer a bounty to make it worthwhile?

Mon, 2012-07-23 21:45

onlinediscountanvils

Here you go, U.

Mon, 2012-07-23 21:56

Jacob Two-Two

Ooh. Don't like that active topics page much. Hopefully it's just a "who moved my cheese" moment, and I'll get used to it, but I feel like it's harder to get a quick overview of the site's activity with this display.

Mon, 2012-07-23 21:56

Boom Boom

I'm on dialup, and babble is just an awful mess now - can't get a decent TAT, for one. *sigh*

Mon, 2012-07-23 22:07

Boom Boom

I'm logging off and hopefully this will all be fixed by tomorrow.

Mon, 2012-07-23 22:41

#10

Catchfire

There are some "performance issues" say our tech team. That message has been confirmed by Professor Obvious.

I rather like the new Active Topics -- it's almost up to pre-2008 performance levels! But, as always, YMMV. (Also: "Who moved my cheese" is my new favourite troubleshooting phrase. Much obliged, JTT).

@Unionist When I saw that our tech team decided to ask for bug feedback from babblers, I thought, "do they know what they're asking for?" I'm afraid the only answer I can give is that rabble is a big site with a lot of needs which depend on a limited pool of funds. Website design and programming costs a lot of money, time and labour. We've got a few things new on babble, but bigger changes to functionality et al. will just have to wait. I'm as impatient as all y'all, believe.

Mon, 2012-07-23 23:37

#11

Sven

Boom Boom wrote:

I'm on dialup, and babble is just an awful mess now - can't get a decent TAT, for one. *sigh*

Indeed. At the moment, of the 29 listings on TAT, 9 of them are "Site upgrade today -- temporary downtime". Rather than listing the most recent threads, TAT is listing the most recent posts (even if they are from the same thread).

Mon, 2012-07-23 23:59

#12

RevolutionPlease RevolutionPlease's picture

Forest for the trees.

Tue, 2012-07-24 00:06

#13

bagkitty

I see the most recently commented on items are now being promoted on the rabble main page. Damn, does this mean we have to watch our language when creating thread titles?

I am already pretty sure there are going to be problems with the active topics page showing the most recent comments themselves, as opposed to the most recently commented on threads -- very active threads are going to push everything else into oblivion.

Tue, 2012-07-24 13:49

#14

Catchfire

So our intrepid tech dudes are working madly to fix the performance issues which already seem much better. Perhaps better than anonymous bug reports would be to list fixes you'd like to see here and Rebecca West and I will compile a report for the tech team.

Tue, 2012-07-24 13:59

#15

Caissa

Test

Dislike the new active threads format.

Tue, 2012-07-24 14:21

#16

Boom Boom

Ditto. The previous format was much better. I don't see anything in the new upgrade whatsoever to rejoice about. But I'm an old cranky curmudgeon anyway.

Tue, 2012-07-24 14:23

#17

Unionist

Catchfire wrote:
So our intrepid tech dudes are working madly to fix the performance issues which already seem much better. Perhaps better than anonymous bug reports would be to list fixes you'd like to see here and Rebecca West and I will compile a report for the tech team.

1. TAT is bad. Go back to showing topics, not posts.

2. Wasn't able to post for a long while (kept sending me captcha tests and falsely accusing me of failing them all), but seems better now.

3. "Recent activity" in user profiles isn't showing the latest recent activity.

4. Everything else.

Tue, 2012-07-24 14:23

#18

Boom Boom

I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm on dialup, and this upgrade is positively the shits. Why not go back to the way it was?

Tue, 2012-07-24 14:29

#19

Caissa

What Unionist and Boom Boom said.

Tue, 2012-07-24 14:41

#20

laine lowe laine lowe's picture

I find the TAT page confusing.

Tue, 2012-07-24 15:33

#21

Catchfire

Thanks for the suggestions -- I've alerted the tech team and made some suggestions on how to make the TAT easier to read. I like the comment teaser and find it much easier to scan threads I'm interested in. babble used to have exactly that, and I always missed it after the initial upgrade. Can people tell me what it is exactly they don't like? Or maybe guesses if they're not sure? Is it simply too much information?

I think glitches 2 & 3 from Unionist's post and Boom Boom's comment about the speed of the site are just temporary growing pains. As our tech dude tells us, "the sad truth is that we don't have the resources to be able to do full testing on a site like this in a live production environment, and so instead of delaying it even more, we decided to just do trial by fire testing/debugging."

Thanks for bearing with us!

Tue, 2012-07-24 15:50

#22

Boom Boom

I don't understand why I get this before I see any posts after I click on TAT:

browse by issue
- Afghanistan
- Anti-Racism
- Arts & Culture
- Civil Liberties
- Coalition
- Economy
- Education
- Elections
- Environment
- Feminism
- G8/G20
- Gaza
- Haiti
- Healthcare USA
- Indigenous
- Labour
- LGBTI
- Maker Culture
- Media Matters
- NDP
- Occupy
- Olympics
- Politics in Canada
- Technology
- Who Are U?

Tue, 2012-07-24 15:51

#23

Boom Boom

And then at the bottom of the page I get this:

Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
Images can be added to this post.
Allowed HTML tags: <a> <blockquote> <center> <cite> <code> <dd> <dl> <dt> <img> <li> <ol> <strike> <ul>
Allowed Style properties: border, float, margin, margin-bottom, margin-left, margin-right, margin-top, padding, text-align
You can use BBCode tags in the text. URLs will automatically be converted to links.
You may quote other posts using [quote] tags.
Freelinking helps you easily create HTML links. Links take the form of [[indicator:target|Title]]. By default (no indicator): Link to a local node by title

Tue, 2012-07-24 15:52

#24

Boom Boom

It's just an ugly mess. What benefits were supposed to come with this so-called "upgrade"?

Tue, 2012-07-24 16:03

#25

Boom Boom

Rabble.ca is also a complete disaster. Hope this is all fixed soon.

Tue, 2012-07-24 16:03

#26

onlinediscountanvils

Boom Boom wrote:

What benefits were supposed to come with this so-called "upgrade"?

We can see who's online and who's offline.

Tue, 2012-07-24 16:10

#27

Boom Boom

Am I the only one not getting the HTML bar for bolding, italics, smilie icons, hotlinking, and other stuff?

At least the "Forum Topics" page escaped the upgrades.

Tue, 2012-07-24 16:22

#28

Unionist

Catchfire wrote:

I like the comment teaser and find it much easier to scan threads I'm interested in. babble used to have exactly that, and I always missed it after the initial upgrade. Can people tell me what it is exactly they don't like? Or maybe guesses if they're not sure? Is it simply too much information?

I totally agree - but it was showing multiple posts from the same thread. Change it to show one teaser per most-recently accessed threads, as per the old babble, and I will hail at least this aspect as an upgrade!

And thanks for the quick repairs. I understand about shoot first and fix problems later. I'm in the union movement.

Tue, 2012-07-24 16:33

#29

Boom Boom

On this particlular page TAT and Forum Topics are in the middle of the page instead of at the top in the previous edition. Awkward!

Tue, 2012-07-24 18:57

#30

onlinediscountanvils

Not a bug, but a question...

If I close the window am I marked as "offline", or does that require me to be logged-out?

Tue, 2012-07-24 19:10

#31

Aristotleded24

I can't find my private messages?

Tue, 2012-07-24 19:58

#32

Boom Boom

Hey! It's getting better. This page loads normally - but I still don't have the HTML bar (bold, italics, hotlinking, smilies, etc..).

Tue, 2012-07-24 20:07

#33

Boom Boom

The HTML bar is back - someone is listening!!!!

While you're at it - could you fix the "search function"???

I typed in "tar sands" and did not get even one babble thread result, whereas before I would get 20 - 30 pages of results.

Tue, 2012-07-24 20:40

#34

Boom Boom

Rabble.ca is back and looks good. Good job, techies - but was all this worth having the site down for 30 hours?

Tue, 2012-07-24 21:21

#35

kropotkin1951

When I click on my name it used to give me the activity in the threads listing the most recent and how many responses there were after mine. Now I get some ridiculous thing that has threads from years ago at the top and there seems to be no way to tell the activity in the threads one has posted in recently. I find the short blurbs annoying and not helpful at all. I guess one has to start thinking in tweets so that the message you are trying to convey doesn't get lost in an introduction which becomes the main focus when anyone else is looking at those little summary blurbs.

It looks like a down grade to me and I give it an F.

Wed, 2012-07-25 00:42

#36

Left Turn

Ok, I've got the following issues with the "upgrade":

1. The "keep me logged in" has dissapeared from the log-in page. Could we plase get it back, I don't like having to log-in every time I want to post here.

2. The performance is fine when I'm logged out, but when I'm logged in it takes longer than usual for the site to load.

3. Could we get the red thread titles back on the TAT please, they look better in red than in black.

Wed, 2012-07-25 07:55

#37

Maysie

I like the TAT look of every other thread in a different grey scale, much more readable.

Wed, 2012-07-25 08:06

#38

Boom Boom

I still don't understand the point of this so-called "upgrade". 30 hours of downtime for what benefits, exactly?

Wed, 2012-07-25 09:23

#39

onlinediscountanvils

Boom Boom wrote:

I still don't understand the point of this so-called "upgrade". 30 hours of downtime for what benefits, exactly?

It was meant to give us a glimpse into what life would be like in Bedford Falls without babble.

Wed, 2012-07-25 10:32

#40

Boom Boom

It would be a wonderful life, I suppose.

Wed, 2012-07-25 10:54

#41

Caissa

That sort of rings a bell.

Wed, 2012-07-25 11:24

#42

Boom Boom

The babble 'search function' looks to be degraded by the babble upgrade - it's slower than ever, and the results are sometimes bizarre. Do a search for "Canadian mining companies" and "tar sands" and you'll see what I mean.

ETA: For me, on dialup, babble overall is much slower than before the upgrade.

Wed, 2012-07-25 11:28

#43

mark_alfred

I'll echo Boom Boom on that. The site is super slow since the upgrade, and not just the search function. The entire site is slower.

Wed, 2012-07-25 11:56

#44

Boom Boom

To sum up: The "upgrade" resulted in babble being down for 30 hours, and the board is now slower than ever, for no real benefit that I can see. Is that about right?

Wed, 2012-07-25 12:12

#45

Catchfire

The site is slow just for the time being and should pick up shortly. The site relies on a lot of caching, and it needs to catch up after the upgrade. That's why the search function is working right now. But once it caches the archives, the site will speed up and the search function will come back to its former glory.

I think, Left Turn, that's why yoiu keep needing to log-in--the site has been re-loaded a few times which logs you out. Once it settles, you will stay logged in like before. I also agree with you about the red titles -- I've already asked the tech team to implement this. Hopefully it will come in time!

Thanks everyone for your patience. And for the Wonderful Life references. Keep 'em coming!

Wed, 2012-07-25 12:19

#46

Boom Boom

Thank you for that explanation, Catchfire - that makes sense. Now, what are the benefits from the upgrade?

Wed, 2012-07-25 12:35

#47

contrarianna

For those a little confused, here are the definitions of TAT as used here:

Theoretical Arrival Time
Time for Average Turnaround
Testing and Training
Tired All the Time
Tourism Authority of Thailand
Thematic Apperception Test
Trans-America Trail
Transgenic Arthropod Team

and, most important:

"Tips for Threading - Many times guys forget to remove the Thread Alignment Tool (TAT) after they get 4 or so threads started. They then bottom out the TAT on the barrel face and rip the threads out of the TAT, Die or both. Also don't just crank the die on there, it will break. Remember to break the chips (back off) after 1/6 to 1/4 of a turn so you don't load up the die. Be sure to use cutting fluid."

http://www.dinzagarms.com/tools/tkp.html

Wed, 2012-07-25 13:58

#48

Unionist

Babble no longer alerts you when you have new unread PMs. That needs to be fixed.

Wed, 2012-07-25 14:32

#49

Caissa

That's to keep us from organizing dissent.

Wed, 2012-07-25 14:55

#50

oldgoat