quebec election - 04.09.2012
http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/elections/pq-backs-away-from-...
The PQ appears to be blowing chucks this election and it appears to be the salvation of the Liberals and maybe QS too to a lesser degree.
I'm feeling a certain parallel to the past few Ontario elections. McGuinty was never super popular in Ontario, but he kept winning by way of having opponents who were not greatly preferred to him (at least by election day).
I have to admit...The PQ plan for referendums for issues petitioned by 850,000 signatures or more is not only brilliant,it's the ONE lesson we could learn from the US.
Also,the PQ's spending plan would cost HALF of the PLQ plan and 1/3 of the CAQ plan....Without cutting services.
10 days to go and I'm still leaning towards the PQ.
Another part of QS's platform I like.
Yeah, it's good. They're calling for the Québec pension plan to pay up to 60% of the average industrial wage, instead of 25% as at present (same as CPP) - with of course increased contributions by workers and employers. That's the campaign the Canadian Labour Congress has been waging for the last few years, except that the unions call for 50%.
Marois n PQ ignore the Aboriginals. yeah whatever
The Liberal record:
I have to admit...The PQ plan for referendums for issues petitioned by 850,000 signatures or more is not only brilliant,it's the ONE lesson we could learn from the US.
Also,the PQ's spending plan would cost HALF of the PLQ plan and 1/3 of the CAQ plan....Without cutting services.
10 days to go and I'm still leaning towards the PQ.
Except that this is similar to an idea the Canadian Alliance tried to introduce. Rick Mercer rightly pilloried them for it and tried to start a campaign to make Stockwell Day change his first name to Doris.
Also, just look at the US - one of the reasons their political system is so paralysed and inept is because of all these stupid referenda wherein special interest groups tie up the political system by constantly introducing all these stupid citizens initiatives. One of the reasons so many governments are bankrupt down there is not just because they refuse to raise taxes, but are actually prevented from doing so as a result of so-called citizens initiatives.
Dear Babble,
What's up with all the double posts? And what did you do with the reply button? The save button is tres sucky.
Leger poll:
PQ 33
CAQ 28
Lib 27
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/caq-ahead-of-liberals-in-ne...
Liberal red fading in usual strongholds West side story: Some voters feel they’re ignored by party they support
http://www.montrealgazette.com/life/Liberal+fading+usual+strongholds/714...
[quote=josh]Leger poll: PQ 33 CAQ 28 Lib 27
[quote]
with a week to go, the middle-class electorate might start seeing the CAQ as ready for a breakthrough and drop Liberals ... nothing is settled yet
cf. April 2011 and those federal polls no one believed
CBC this morning had the Liberals at 18% in francophone votes, and predicted the Liberals are heading for their worse electoral defeat in Quebec since Confederation. 
http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Québec+solidaire+optimistic/7136684/story.html
Québec solidaire optimistic
http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Québec+solidaire+optimistic/7136684/story.html
Correct, Boom:
the key poll results, among francophone voters:
38 - PQ
31 - CAQ
then:
18 Liberal 
Charest combative as he sinks under the waves:
Le chef libéral se dit confiant que les Québécois entendront les mises en garde qu'il leur répète depuis des jours. Il dépeint ses deux adversaires comme des souverainistes qui plongeront le Québec dans l'incertitude et la turbulence. Il se présente, en opposition, comme le candidat de la stabilité, qui privilégie avant tout le développement économique.
«Dans un cas, Mme Marois nous annonce des référendums et de la turbulence, a-t-il dénoncé. Et lui (François Legault), il nous annonce de la turbulence suivie de référendums. C'est ça le choix qui se présente aux Québécois.»
from the piece above:
GREAT EXPECTATIONS
“If we base our expectations on the trends we have seen in recent weeks, we could expect something between five and 10 seats,” Khadir says when asked just how much of a boost he thinks his party will receive when Quebecers head to the polls on Sept. 4.
Khadir is perhaps being a tad optimistic, but the party does have reason to be hopeful in five ridings in particular on Montreal Island, districts where QS membership has grown by leaps and bounds over the past four years and where its candidates will undoubtedly put up a fight. The campaign managers for those districts — Mercier, Gouin, Hochelaga-Maisonneuve, Laurier-Dorion and Saint-Marie-Saint-Jacques — are now veterans of previous races and have been meeting once a week to compare notes and discuss strategy, says Gouin campaign director Julie Larose.
There is still, she maintains, a lingering sense of momentum within the party’s rank and file coming off last spring’s student uprising.
“I think the spring favoured us because we had hyper-clear positions and we stuck to them until the end,” Larose says.
Holy smokes! If QS actually manage ten seats (or more???) in the National Assembly, that should give the NDP pause. I'm thinking maybe QS can actually replace the Charest Liberals - and that would be awesome.
I'm hoping for a minority but my concern is who will Legault link up with if he gets a minority?
if the Liberals are actually decimated -- and 18 per cent francophone support indicates that -- there might be right-leaning MNAs looking for a new home, and willing to look at CAQ ministerial and other inducements ...
All the more reason to completely destroy the Liberals.
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Progressives of all stripes in Quebec need to get behind Quebec Solidaire now by giving them money, time, and their vote to ensure they are well represented in the next National Assembly
Still waiting to hear how QS did in today's Leger poll!!!
http://tvanouvelles.ca/lcn/infos/national/elections2012/archives/2012/08...
with a week to go, the middle-class electorate might start seeing the CAQ as ready for a breakthrough and drop Liberals ... nothing is settled yet
cf. April 2011 and those federal polls no one believed
And no mention of QS in article despite rising since previous poll
PQS platform in English
http://www.quebecsolidaire.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/QS-Plateforme-...
Holy smokes! If QS actually manage ten seats (or more???) in the National Assembly, that should give the NDP pause. I'm thinking maybe QS can actually replace the Charest Liberals - and that would be awesome.
That would be difficult as the Liberals have around 18 or 19 ultra safe seats
Yeah, I completely forgot about those. 
Probably not much chance they would go NDP if this new party proposal ever gets off the ground?
It's looking like a PQ minority....
The CAQ and PLQ may form a coalition...bad news
Remember the orange wave - look at this!!! Lot's of time left - 10 days to go.
Un rassemblement de QS attire plus de 1000 personnes
Les coporte-parole de la formation politique, Amir Khadir et Françoise David.
PHOTO: MARCO CAMPANOZZI, LA PRESSE
http://www.lapresse.ca/actualites/elections-quebec-2012/201208/25/01-456...
It's looking like a PQ minority....
The CAQ and PLQ may form a coalition...bad news
You are getting way ahead of yourself: a week is an eternity in politics
... but the CAQ has more momentum than expected, and with both the PQ and CAQ in the 30s among francophone voters, nothing is settled at all, minority, majority, who with whom.... nothing.
anyway,
once again Jacques Parizeau shows superb timing and a willingness to score into his own net:
[...] Mr. Parizeau stopped short of backing Option Nationale outright, a party spokesperson said. But his endorsement of Mr. Aussant’s candidacy reinforces the skepticism some sovereignists hold regarding Ms. Marois’s true desire to achieve political independence.
Ms. Marois responded by appealing to all sovereignist and progressive forces to support the PQ if they wanted to rid Quebec of Jean Charest’s Liberals.
“If we want to move forwards with our project of achieving a country we need a PQ majority government,” Ms. Marois insisted. “I have a great deal of respect for Mr. Parizeau… But we are the only true alternative to the Liberals.”
Mr. Parizeau’s comments could harm the PQ efforts of winning a majority government, especially if sovereignists hesitate to support Ms. Marois. A public opinion poll released today indicated that support for the PQ remained idle while the Coalition Avenir Québec was slowly attracting a greater number of francophone voters.
really weird how this election is shaping up.
the pq is bungling this campaign in every conceivable way. as with many on rabble here, i'm a pretty high information voter and it takes a lot to move me from one day to the next. but as one who, at the outset, hoped for a pq government as the least bad and even potentially good option, some of their policies have actually managed to alienate me to the point of near apathy. partly this is charest and legault forcing marois into making it a base turnout election (she could win a majority with 33% of the vote, which is nuts), but partly it's straight-up poor electioning and party it's marois' surprisingly weak hold on the pq leadership, and party it's that the pq has only become more radical, as many of those for whom independence is not the dominant en jeu have moved to solidaire and caq.
i feel like if the pq ends up second to legault, marois will probably be ousted immediately, irrespective of seats distribution in the assembly, allowing legault to run quebec at least until the liberals (if there are any left) and pq have new leaders. it would be pretty shocking if in five years, quebec's assembly was ndp-caq with pq-plq-on as marginal parties. a month ago, i'd have scoffed at the possibility, squished the thought and then ridiculed myself for even considering it. but you know, if that were to come to pass, this is exactly the way it would look at exactly this point in time.
really weird how this election is shaping up.
Marois should have spent all her time in this election focusing on the party's plans for the economy,programs and immediate issues instead of appeasing hard liners who,apparently,are a growing minority....
What scares me is the possibility of a CAQ government...CAQ = Harpercons.
[url=http://www.cjad.com/CJADLocalNews/entry.aspx?BlogEntryID=10419583]Big pro-independence rally for Quebec Solidaire[/url]
Anyone who siphons votes from Marois, in this election, is fine with me.
Not a cool way of phrasing it, autoworker. What matters is making a decent life for all...not what flag flies over that life.
Not a cool way of phrasing it, autoworker. What matters is making a decent life for all...not what flag flies over that life.
It's funny how 'mon pays' is "cool", yet 'my country' is not.
In Quebec, "my country"(said in English)is a reactionary concept, as are most types of patriotism(my country's form being a particular example). Patriotism in the ROC nowadays largely means Harper-worship.
It's not realistic to expect the Quebecois to actually repudiate sovereigntism
Insisting they do or that soverereigntism be crushed in some way is as noxious as it would have been for the British trade union movement in the early 20th Century to insist that Irish workers sing "God Save The King".
...what's more important is to find ground to work with them on social justice and workers' rights issues. The life people life is what important, not the flags. It really doesn't matter which flag is waving, since flags themselves are mainly just a symbol used to get workers to kill other workers.
yeah, i doubt if the pq has translated the website, but if you can read french, you ought to take a look at their platform. if it weren't for the french language and independence stuff, i think most people on here would be debating how we can trust them actually to go through with the stuff, the way we do mulcair. certainly, solidaire's unambiguously progressive positions align almost completely with my own on virtually every issue (except independence, which i'm "heart no, brain yes" on), but i realize that i'm way left of the mainstream, and that for a mainstream party, the pq is about where the ndp is.
I don't think Dublin (1916) is at all analagous to Montreal (2012), There's nothing to compare with 'Bloody Sunday', and nobody is forced to sing the praises of Her Majesty, nowadays. As for flags, banners and colours; I've seen myriad semiphores in the streets of late. What do they signify? Each has its own deconstructed meaning, it seems-- depending on the semiotician.
[url=http://www.lapresse.ca/actualites/elections-quebec-2012/201208/26/01-456... shuts the door to conservative sovereignists[/url]
PQ leader Pauline Marois says conservative sovereignists should vote either for the Liberal Party or the CAQ.[...]She said that the issue in this election "is surely, first and foremost, a choice between progressives and conservatives", and after that, a choice "between sovereignists and federalists".
A journalist asked her, not once but twice, what "suggestion" she had for "conservative sovereignists". Far from inviting them to vote PQ, she replied: "Let them choose. They have two conservative parties to choose from."
My rough translation.
They sound afraid of Québec solidaire.
But very often, the PQ has "campaigned left", and then "governed right".
They sound afraid of Québec solidaire.
But very often, the PQ has "campaigned left", and then "governed right".
That's my take, exactly. The PQ hasn't had much luck with the "we are the only real sovereignists" and "don't split the sovereignist vote" line - especially after QS's 1000-strong pro-sovereignty celebration yesterday! - so now it'll be, "don't split the progressive vote either".
Having said that, I prefer to hear the PQ claiming to be progressive, than to have a growing social consensus that all the "major" parties are neoliberal mouthpieces. The PQ is a pretty vast coalition, and we don't need the post-Lucien Bouchard types running the show.
looks like CAQ going wins in minority just similar last spring NDP surplus in opinion polls.
Hahahaha - Marois [url=http://www.montrealgazette.com/news/Marois+gunning+majority/7147085/stor... another flop[/url]:
Later Marois met with reporters again to say she did not understand the question, asked in French, and thought the reporter was asking her what conservative federalist should do. “I really did not hear the question,” she said.
As for conservative sovereignists, Marois indicated they should vote PQ because, “I will run a government that is responsible.”
Ah well. I thought I had spotted something positive. Didn't last too long.
Ok, I'm off to vote QS in the advance poll. Wish me luck.
ETA: And [url=http://www.lapresse.ca/actualites/elections-quebec-2012/201208/26/01-456... she is again[/url], correcting her "error" and insisting to "conservative sovereignists" how really really fiscally responsible the PQ's election promises are, etc. etc.
Sébastien Robert, QS candidate in Vachon, makes a pitch for independence, targeting the [url=http://youtu.be/7Kn69q2uhjA]very young vote[/url].
looks like CAQ going [to] win in minority, just similar last spring NDP surplus in opinion polls.
I am holding back from predictions, but there seem to be 2 overwhelming decisions made by the Quebec electorate to date:
- the need for a change of govt., so no chance given Charest/PLQ from outset;
- openness to other parties/views, and even a bandwagon effect possible.
I guess Marois has forgotten that one the great SAINTS of the PQ Lucien Bouchard was a Conservative cabinet minister and close confidante of Brian Mulroney and ran a very rightwing PQ government. How conveninet of her to try to simply press the "delete" button on that history.
[url=http://www.lapresse.ca/actualites/elections-quebec-2012/201208/26/01-456... shuts the door to conservative sovereignists[/url]
PQ leader Pauline Marois says conservative sovereignists should vote either for the Liberal Party or the CAQ.[...]She said that the issue in this election "is surely, first and foremost, a choice between progressives and conservatives", and after that, a choice "between sovereignists and federalists".
A journalist asked her, not once but twice, what "suggestion" she had for "conservative sovereignists". Far from inviting them to vote PQ, she replied: "Let them choose. They have two conservative parties to choose from."
My rough translation.