This is an anti-psychiatry thread for people who have been hurt by the mainstream system to voice their concerns and to seek out alternative solutions to help them improve their health. Treatment options like nutrition, and vitamins, yoga, meditation, etc. are welcome to be discussed.
How to Reform Psychiatry - Explore New Ideas for treating people with mental issues.
Mon, 2013-01-28 23:42
#1
How to Reform Psychiatry - Explore New Ideas for treating people with mental issues.
Tue, 2013-01-29 10:19
#2
One of the arguments for defending psychiatry as it is practiced is their reliance on empirical evidence to support their actions.
Well, for many years, the only studies on incest claimed that the incidence of it was one in one million families. Therefore, if a woman went to a psychiatrist to get treated for the emotional traumas of childhood sexual abuse within the family, she was often met with scorn, since the empirical evidence proved otherwise. To make matters worse, these psychiatrists who refused to believe her word could be used as expert testimony in courts of law where some of these women tried to get claims of abuse addressed against members of their family.
Despite the fact that these doctors knew very little to nothing about the subject, and they did not have to learn anything about it in their curriculums, they were still regarded as experts, and they wielded considerable power as such with disasterous consequenses to women who were trying to get help and justice. They even accepted that status as being experts.
As a society, we need to have the right to examine their curriculums and be able to assert how much training constitutes expertise so that these abuses of power never happen again.
Michelle Landsberg, in her book, Woman and Children First, stated to the effect that "psychiatrists, in all their years of training, have only 1 1/2 pages in their textbooks devoted to womens issues." How can we call that expertise? For instance, a commerce degree in university can encompass one of many specialties: economics, administration, accounting, finance, human resources, marketing, finance, business law, etc. We know that if someone who took marketing started giving a lecture about accounting principles, that marketing major would be laughed off the stage because marketing is not accounting, even though the marketing student took more training in accounting than a psyciatrist took in womens issues.
It seems that when we deal with doctors and psychiatrists, we tend to lower the bar on what we classify as expertise.
Tue, 2013-01-29 10:35
#3
I went to a surgeon for a follow up appointment who did surgery on my hip. I tried to talk to him about the benefits of taking niacinimide to try to ward off arthritis. He responded, "what is niacinimide. I have never heard of that before."
For those who do not know, niacinimide is a form of vitamin B3 and was discovered in the 1940s to have powerful therapeutic benefit for arthritis.
However, if I were to ask this surgeon if he was an expert on vitamins, he would likely say yes. They have one hour of training in their curriculums on vitamins, minerals, amino acids, and nutrition. The findingss they read about in their literature about vitamins is all negative despite the tremendous successes that some doctors have had with vitamin treatments in their many years of practice.
How can we call one hour of training to be expertise?
Tue, 2013-01-29 12:50
#4
Unfortunately the ones who need to read this thread won't because you don't have the word "quack" in your thread title.
Tue, 2013-01-29 12:51
#5
One of the arguments for defending psychiatry as it is practiced is their reliance on empirical evidence to support their actions.
Well, for many years, the only studies on incest claimed that the incidence of it was one in one million families. Therefore, if a woman went to a psychiatrist to get treated for the emotional traumas of childhood sexual abuse within the family, she was often met with scorn, since the empirical evidence proved otherwise. To make matters worse, these psychiatrists who refused to believe her word could be used as expert testimony in courts of law where some of these women tried to get claims of abuse addressed against members of their family.
Interesting, Goggles. Hadn't seen this.
From your link:
In 1975, an authoritative text proclaimed that the incidence of father-daughter incest in the United States was 1 in a million families 1.
That source?
1. Henderson D. Incest. In: Freedman A, Kaplan H, Sadock B, eds. Comprehensive Textbook of Psychiatry. 2nd ed. Baltimore: Williams & Wilkins; 1975:1530-1539.
Tue, 2013-01-29 13:12
#6
Do we want them here? Remember what happened last time? The longer they clue in, the more we get to talk about constructive issues which are harming people.
Tue, 2013-01-29 13:12
#7
I have arthritis and I am not sure what B3's potentially easing the symptoms of one type of arthritis has to do with exploring new ideas for treating people with mental issues. There are 183 different types of arthritis and they produce very diverse health problems. I have one of the more common varieties and I have had various alternative treatments suggested to me in clinics with nurses and other health care professionals. I suspect that since the B3 study seems to have been a one off study that it would be malpractice to suggest it to people to take on their own given the known toxicity issues with B3 at high doses. I was given many sheets that highlighted a diet that included the foods listed below and staved off the worst effects for nearly a decade by following the advice on nutrition and proper exercise for someone with deteriorating cartilage.
I was looking forward to a debate on the thread title so maybe you could change it to reflect the actuality of this being a thread about the pros and cons of vitamin therapy on various health issues.
Osteoarthritis
One preliminary study suggested that niacinamide may improve arthritis symptoms, including increasing joint mobility and reducing the amount of nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs (NSAIDs) needed. More research is needed.
Dietary Sources:
The best food sources of vitamin B3 are found in beets, brewer's yeast, beef liver, beef kidney, fish, salmon, swordfish, tuna, sunflower seeds, and peanuts. Bread and cereals are usually fortified with niacin. In addition, foods that contain tryptophan, an amino acid the body coverts into niacin, include poultry, red meat, eggs, and dairy products.
Precautions:
Because of the potential for side effects and interactions with medications, you should take dietary supplements only under the supervision of a knowledgeable health care provider.
High doses (50 mg or more) of niacin can cause side effects. The most common side effect is called "niacin flush," which is a burning, tingling sensation in the face and chest, and red or flushed skin. Taking an aspirin 30 minutes prior to the niacin may help reduce this symptom.
At the very high doses used to lower cholesterol and treat other conditions, liver damage and stomach ulcers can occur. Your health care provider will regularly check your liver function through a blood test.
People with a history of liver disease, kidney disease, or stomach ulcers should not take niacin supplements. Those with diabetes or gallbladder disease should do so only under the close supervision of their doctor.
Stop taking niacin or niacinamide at least two weeks before a scheduled surgery.
Niacin and niacinamide may make allergies worse by increasing histamine.
People with low blood pressure should not take niacin or niacinamide because they may cause a dangerous drop in blood pressure. Don' t take niacin if you have a history of gout.
People with coronary artery disease or unstable angina should not take niacin without their doctor' s supervision, as large doses can raise the risk of heart rhythm problems.
Taking any one of the B vitamins for a long period of time can result in an imbalance of other important B vitamins. For this reason, you may want to take a B complex vitamin, which includes all the B vitamins.
Possible Interactions:
If you are currently taking any of the following medications, you should not use niacin without first talking to your health care provider.
Antibiotics, Tetracycline -- Niacin should not be taken at the same time as the antibiotic tetracycline because it interferes with the absorption and effectiveness of this medication. All vitamin B complex supplements act in this way and should be taken at different times from tetracycline.
Aspirin -- Taking aspirin before taking niacin may reduce flushing from niacin, but take it only under your doctor's supervision.
Anti-seizure Medications -- Phenytoin (Dilantin) and valproic acid (Depakote) may cause niacin deficiency in some people. Taking niacin with carbamazepine (Tegretol) or mysoline (Primidone) may increase levels of these medications in the body.
Anticoagulants (blood thinners) -- Niacin may make the effects of these medications stronger, increasing the risk of bleeding.
Blood Pressure Medications, Alpha-blockers -- Niacin can make the effects of medications taken to lower blood pressure stronger, leading to the risk of low blood pressure.
Cholesterol-lowering Medications -- Niacin binds the cholesterol lowering medications known as bile-acid sequestrants and may make them less effective. For this reason, niacin and these medications should be taken at different times of the day. Bile-acid sequestrants include colestipol (Colestid), colesevelam (Welchol), and cholestyramine (Questran).
Statins -- Some scientific evidence suggests that taking niacin with simvastatin (Zocor) appears to slow down the progression of heart disease. However, the combination may also increase the likelihood for serious side effects, such as muscle inflammation or liver damage.
Diabetes Medications -- Niacin may increase blood sugar levels. People taking insulin, metformin (Glucophage), glyburide (Dibeta, Micronase), glipizide (Glucotrol), or other medications used to treat high blood glucose levels should monitor their blood sugar levels closely when taking niacin supplements.
Isoniazid (INH) -- INH, a medication used to treat tuberculosis, may cause a niacin deficiency.
Nicotine Patches -- Using nicotine patches with niacin may worsen or increase the risk of flushing associated with niacin.
These medications may lower levels of niacin in the body:
- Azathioprine (Imuran)
- Chloramphenicol (Chloromycetin)
- Cycloserine (Seromycin)
- Fluorouracil
- Levodopa and carbidopa
- Mercaptopurine (Purinethol)
Tue, 2013-01-29 13:15
#8
From your link:
In 1975, an authoritative text proclaimed that the incidence of father-daughter incest in the United States was 1 in a million families 1.
That source?
1. Henderson D. Incest. In: Freedman A, Kaplan H, Sadock B, eds. Comprehensive Textbook of Psychiatry. 2nd ed. Baltimore: Williams & Wilkins; 1975:1530-1539.
Yes, that's the quote. I tried to extract it by simply copying and pasting, and it wouldn't do it, and I had to leave, so thank you for doing that.
Tue, 2013-01-29 13:27
#9
How can we call one hour of training to be expertise?
That's right, any quack who graduated in the bottom half of his/her class is still referred to as what? Did someone say, doctor?
My mother had a bad case of hypercactive thyroid in the 1950's. A GP asked her is she had a nervous predisposition or something. He asked her if her husband was mean with her and all sorts of irrelevant questions. And that was in the good old days before medicare. My father was laid off at the plant right on time just before Christmas, and so there was no Blue Cross coverage. Ducktor told ma to go home and try to get better on her own. Doctors were asshole-duluxes in those days.
Tue, 2013-01-29 13:31
#10
Michelle Landsberg, in her book, Woman and Children First, stated to the effect that "psychiatrists, in all their years of training, have only 1 1/2 pages in their textbooks devoted to womens issues."
I find that intriguing, and I'd like to see some more context please, without having to go out and buy the book. What were her exact words, and what "textbooks" was she referring to?
Tue, 2013-01-29 13:32
#11
I was looking forward to a debate on the thread title so maybe you could change it to reflect the actuality of this being a thread about the pros and cons of vitamin therapy on various health issues.
It can be done, and arthritis is welcome to be discussed. This is a continuation of the anti-psychiatry thread in body, mind, and soul.
Dr. Abram Hoffer was a psychiatrist and the Director of Psychiatrictric Research at the University of Saskatchewan who performed the first controlled studies ever in psychiatry. He used these studies to find a cure for schizophrenia and addictions in Saskatchewan in the 1950s. He found that using very high doses of vitamin B3 and Vitamin C cured some forms of schizophrenia. Over the years, he perfected his techniques, and found that a change in diet, removing bad foods, and foods which make people sick, plus the implimentation of vitamins, minerals, amino acids, and essential fatty acids, he was able to reverse most forms of mental illness.
However, his ideas have been attacked by mainstream medicine ever since. He found that if people came to his office for mental health issues, and they followed his practices, as they recovered mentally, some of their other health issues improved as well. Arthritis is one of those illnesses which responds very well to what he calls "orthomolecular medicine". He wrote in his book Orthomolecular Medicine for Physicians that both osteoarthritis and Rheumatoid arthritis both respond favourably.
In this thread you will run across many arguments about the toxicities of vitamins. Dr. Hoffer used very high doses of vitamin B3 for over 50 years of practice without any toxic side effects.
Tue, 2013-01-29 13:38
#12
@ k
I interviewed a fellow back in the 80s who had been told by doctors that he should prepare himself for life in a wheelchair because of his arthritis. He decided to do some research and find his own way. The biggest change he made was to cut acidic foods, orange juice and wine out of his diet, and to develop mechanical aids to help him function. I should add that when I met him he walked and used his hands as well as I did.
On the mental health front, I can't claim to know much, but I did find this:
http://ebmh.bmj.com/content/6/2/41.full
Tue, 2013-01-29 14:09
#13
I went to a surgeon for a follow up appointment who did surgery on my hip. I tried to talk to him about the benefits of taking niacinimide to try to ward off arthritis. He responded, "what is niacinimide. I have never heard of that before."
For those who do not know, niacinimide is a form of vitamin B3 and was discovered in the 1940s to have powerful therapeutic benefit for arthritis.
However, if I were to ask this surgeon if he was an expert on vitamins, he would likely say yes. They have one hour of training in their curriculums on vitamins, minerals, amino acids, and nutrition. The findingss they read about in their literature about vitamins is all negative despite the tremendous successes that some doctors have had with vitamin treatments in their many years of practice.
How can we call one hour of training to be expertise?
This is the thrust of Dr. Ray Strand's argument in his book "What your Doctor doesnt know about Nutrition May Be Killing You.
He does not list any recommends companies for his vitamins or push any products on anyone. On his website he does, but its not in any of his books. And if you look over his website the only reason why he now has brands is that so many people wrote in and asked where to find stuff. And even then he doesnt recommend a brand for every vitamin listed. I would also recommend highly Dean Mindell's Vitamin Bible which is huge in scope and helpful in telling you how to take vitamins (like calcium should be taken at night) and telling you exactly what they do and what the complement (like Vitamin K helps transport calcium throughout the body)
Tue, 2013-01-29 14:21
#14
Bacchus,
I am going to look into this. I find it so hard to run across credible sources of good vitamin literature. I once went into a healthfood store and walked out with a vitamin encyclopedia written by a natruopathic doctor. Regarding calcium, he told people to not take calcium because it binds with lead so people who take calcium can get lead toxicities.
I then read what Dr. Hoffer had to say about calcium, and he wrote that people who take calcium supplimentation of 1000 mg a day after three months have lower levels of lead in their system ppm than people who do not take calcium supplimentation.
I find that I like the inputs from different sources, but when they start putting out alarming facts, it is sometimes nice to have the information from qualified medical doctors who have used these nutrients as a regular part of their practice for many years.
That is good information, and I am going to look into this.
Tue, 2013-01-29 14:31
#15
So what else are vitamins good for?
I for one have never thought that if you wanted to get information about nutrition you should ask a doctor. I also don't believe that doctors have the godlike powers of omnipotence and omniscience.
Q: What's the difference between god and a doctor.
A: God doesn't think she is a doctor.
However while I will joke about them I am very lucky to have a super GP and she has referred me to any kind of alternate health practitioners that we have thought might be helpful. Like a good lawyer she knows what her expertise is and when a problem is outside of her area of practice she is open and refers me to the proper health care provider.
Tue, 2013-01-29 14:40
#16
Well the vitamin makes good bathroom reading as its huge and detailed. His latest updated one has the more recent studies quoted for all the entries but the older one was easier to navigate through.
Krop, My GP is excellent that way too and she really listens to me and lets me try various treatments if I have done the research and she feels she can agree or at least be open to it
Tue, 2013-01-29 14:41
#17
Freaking DP
Tue, 2013-01-29 14:51
#18
However while I will joke about them I am very lucky to have a super GP and she has referred me to any kind of alternate health practitioners that we have thought might be helpful. Like a good lawyer she knows what her expertise is and when a problem is outside of her area of practice she is open and refers me to the proper health care provider.
Likewise.
One recent time when my partner went to thedoctor she said "I'd prescribe you the antibiotics except I know you wouldn't take them." She took the prescription which, no, she did not fill.
Like any professional who is in the end working for you, it is nice when they know the bounds of respect. I wish our current tax consultant understood that.
Tue, 2013-01-29 14:54
#19
Vitamins can be useful. Since I had eside-effects to bone builders, I now take Vitamin D, Magnesium and Calcium to address my osteoporosis.
Tue, 2013-01-29 15:20
#20
So what else are vitamins good for?
I witnessed a young boy recover from quadraparalysis simply by taking vitamins. He was paranoid schizophrenic and starved himself to the point where his nervous system shut down. The neurologists said that there was nothing that could be done for him, and I found his mother crying in the cafeteria. I told her that there was a lot she could do, and to sneak vitamins in. 6 weeks later, his nervous system shot back. He is back at home living with his mother.
There are many neurological conditions which respond, autoimmune diseases, huntington's disease, parkinson's disease, etc.
Tue, 2013-01-29 15:49
#21
There's no doubt that physical and mental health are linked.
When visiting a relative in a mental health care facility, I couldn't help but notice the food was crap (maybe nutritionally valuable to some extent, but looked disgusting and, according to my niece, inedible) and there were no activities that promoted healthy physical activity. Plus, the environment was horribly depressing. Drab, little colour or decorative detail. Imagine how a clinically depressed person would feel spending day after day in such an environment?
I'd also like to mention that one time, when I was leaving the ward after a visit, the people at the nursing station thought they'd get a bit of entertainment at my expense. The door to the locked ward is controlled by the nursing station at LPH (London Psychiatric Hospital, aka Larry's Pool Hall, the Highbury Hilton). You have to be buzzed in and buzzed out. When I was leaving, I buzzed out, and got no response. Buzzed again. No response. Buzzed again, I got nuthin'. I turned around to see why I wasn't getting out and the staff at the nursing station was snickering, passing glances at me and at each other, while they pretended to be otherwise occupied. It was pretty obvious they thought freaking out a single woman visitor would be a source of hilarity. When they finally decided to relent and let me out, I turned around, looked through the window of the locked door, and they were laughing their asses off.
Who are the sick ones in the system?
Tue, 2013-01-29 16:07
#22
Apparently, back in the 1940s three of my father's siblings worked as orderlies at a psychiatric ward in Alberta. Anyhow, my mother was totally flabberghasted to hear them laughing a joking about the cruel tricks they played on the patients in the hospital. There was a licorice tasting substance that was used as a laxative back then, and if someone acted up, the orderlies used to give them way too much so that they would get sick.
I am ashamed of what they did, but how common was that or is that going on?
Tue, 2013-01-29 16:27
#23
Who are the sick ones in the system?
I knew a psych nurse who played a trick like that on me once, She had moved something of mine to a very difficult to see spot, and when I asked about it, denied any knowledge. She later bragged to a friend "If he can't figure it out, why should I tell him?"
She also tried fucking with her partner's mind by claiming she thought she had a debilitating disease, but was too scared to check it out. SHe was fine.
Not that I assume that is the norm when it comes to medical professionals, but I have heard and read a number articles about stress, addiction, and abusive behaviour in their ranks. It does beg the question of how much of this springs fromt he individual, and how much is systemic.
Tue, 2013-01-29 16:29
#24
I find that intriguing, and I'd like to see some more context please, without having to go out and buy the book. What were her exact words, and what "textbooks" was she referring to?
That is a good question. Her book was written in 1983. I do not live in a large centre with a large library. Our library does not carry the book anymore, and I have ordered a second hand book, which has not arrived yet, but it is on the way. When I get that, I will update you on what you requested.
However, I went on Michele Landsberg wiki, and it says in there:
"Landsberg is an outspoken critic of the False Memory Syndrome Foundation and is known for challenging the credentials of foundation advisors, saying that they "are people who really do have powerful motivation to deny the truth".[8]8. Stanton, Mike (Jul/Aug 1997). "U-turn on memory lane". Columbia Journalism Review (36): pp. 44–49.
The textbooks she referred to which had little to no reference to womens' issues were the textbooks used by psychiaty students as a part of their regular curriculum in their courses of training in psychiatry.
Tue, 2013-01-29 17:30
#25
THE SCIENTIFIC VALIDITY OF MAJOR TRANQUILIZERS QUESTIONED...
Accoring to Dr. Bonnie Burstow in her book, Radical Feminist Therapy,
"The answer to the doctors' problems was further medicalization. Further medicalization was made possible by an alliance with the drug companies. The inital inroads were made by a French pharmaceutical company named Rhone, Poulenc and its American marketer, Smith, Kline, and French. The company had spent 10 years developing what had become known as chlorpromazine. Chlorpromazine was not invented to "cure schizophrenia as is now generally believed. The documentation by Smith, Kline, and French was quoted by Scull (1977) proves that chlorpromazine was intended as a cure for nausea and itching and as a general anaesthetic. It became clear in 1953 that the company might sustain a great loss because there was no market for chlorpromazine. Smith, Kline, and French responded by hiring 50 salesmen to convince psychiatrists and others with power that chlorpromazine would cure mental illness.
The psychiatrists "bought the line." They bought it, I would suggest, because
A) chlorpromazine "sedated" patients and made them easier to manage,
B) giving drugs made the treatments medical and themselves bona fide doctors, and
C) it secured their turf.
The drug companies bombarded state legislatures and hospitals with propoganda, convincing authorities that "mental patients" had medical problems and were in dire need of drugs--something that only doctors could prescribe. En masse, psychiatrists began chemically altering their "patients" despite the lack of identifiable physical illness or chemical imbalance..." pg 27.
This is mainstream medicines' empirical evidence? This is sound science?
The motive according to Burstow in the same book and earlier on says,
"Freud himself both furthered and threatened this medicalization. He furthered it by creating new ailments himself and by essentially pathologizing everyday life. Just as significantly, he threatened it by creating the "talking cure" and by suggesting that non-medical people could also do "psychotherapy."
Within a few decades the threat became formidable indeed--so formidable that the future of psychiatry was in jeopardy. Many varieties of psychotherapy were created. They were popular, and most of the practitioners were non-medical. The success of psychotherapy endangered the credibility of the medical explanation, and the success of the nonmedical therapists posed a special problem. Although psychiatrists practiced psychotherapy, overall they were simply not as good at it as the psychologists and social workers." pg. 27.
Tue, 2013-01-29 18:12
#26
Michelle Landsberg, in her book, Woman and Children First, stated to the effect that "psychiatrists, in all their years of training, have only 1 1/2 pages in their textbooks devoted to womens issues."
I find that intriguing, and I'd like to see some more context please, without having to go out and buy the book. What were her exact words, and what "textbooks" was she referring to?
I think any runofthemill GP is considered qualified to give psychiatric advice to their patients but don't quote me. The quacks actually look down on psychiatry as not being a real area of medical science. And they tend to prefer proclamation over scientific investigation themselves.
Tue, 2013-01-29 18:26
#27
with all the empirical evidence showing 'stress' as having a strong relationship with ill health, it seems all efforts towards the removal of it(stress)would do alot towards improving any patient outcomes. Disempowerment in the traditional treatment roles, medication side effects, cultural perception and its negative valuations are major stressors and there's been an awareness of all of it for decades.
Tue, 2013-01-29 20:04
#28
Exactly.
Dr. Hoffer did the first and only scientific investigation of the cause of schizophrenia ever, and nothing has ever been done since. He showed the chemical changes in the body as it deals with stress with the adrenal glands, and found the exact chemical reaction. That was in 1952. The toxic drugs came on the market in 1953, and the mainstream medical community has been trying to discredit him and his evidence ever since.
It is stress.
Tue, 2013-01-29 22:03
#29
,I have arthritis and I am not sure what B3's potentially easing the symptoms of one type of arthritis has to do with exploring new ideas for treating people with mental issues. There are 183 different types of arthritis and they produce very diverse health problems. I have one of the more common varieties and I have had various alternative treatments suggested to me in clinics with nurses and other health care professionals. I suspect that since the B3 study seems to have been a one off study that it would be malpractice to suggest it to people to take on their own given the known toxicity issues with B3 at high doses. I was given many sheets that highlighted a diet that included the foods listed below and staved off the worst effects for nearly a decade by following the advice on nutrition and proper exercise for someone with deteriorating cartilage.
I was looking forward to a debate on the thread title so maybe you could change it to reflect the actuality of this being a thread about the pros and cons of vitamin therapy on various health issues.
According to Dr. Hoffer, in his book Orthomolecular Medicine for Physicians, he writes:
"In 1943, Dr. William Kaufman published a little book, The Common Form of Niacin Amide Deficiency Disease...'In persons suffering from aniacinamidosis there occurs a progressive clinical pattern which, in its final stages, is disgnosed arthritis.'...The improvements he observed using dosages less than 1,000 mg per day of niacin was remarkable. But patients had to continue taking niacinamide continuously or the arthritis would return. This little book was ignored almost completely.'
In 1949, Dr. Kaufman published his second book on arthritis, The Common Form of Joint Dysfunction., 'But the arthritis was still prevalent, except that much larger quantities of the vitamin were required - up to 4 grams per day in three or four divided doses. Then the responses were equally good...For reasons unknown, these people have extra requirements of Vitamin B3. Dr. Kaufman had discovered that a major portion of all patients suffering from arthritis were vitamin B3 dependent...Both of these classic books on arthritis and vitamin B3 are still available from the author, Dr. William Kaufman, 395A Ottawa Lane, Stratford, CT 06497.
Dr. Kaufman based the conclusions in his second book on 455 patients ranging from 4 to 78 years of age, treated betweeen March 1945 and February 1947." pp, 128-9.
Wed, 2013-01-30 11:58
#30
What makes me ANGRY about psychiatry is that THEY HAVE NO INTEREST IN FINDING A CURE for mental illness. They tell you that your problems are for life and you will be dependent on them and on their drugs for life. What a horrible way to establish a guaranteed market for your sub-standard products. All they do is drug you with toxic drugs with dangerous side effects. If you try to leave them, they will institionalize you.
Nutrition based doctors, simply by using vitamins in their proper doses along with changes in eating habits have been able to properly reverse most cases of severe mental illness. Dr. Hoffer discovered the cause of the schizophrenia and he found that vitamins can counteract these negative chemical changes taking place in the body.
We don't know about this because the medical community does not want people to know. Too many people are making too much money.
Dr. Humphrey Osmond, one of the pioneering doctors in these studies said in the video, Feed Your Head, "that we were not in this to find ways to make large sums of money for ourselves. We simply wanted to find ways to make people well."
Now today, doctors are putting hyperactive children on ritalin and are ruining their brains. When will the corporate greed and insanity stop?
Wed, 2013-01-30 12:07
#31
So indeed this is one very small study over a short two year time frame. My disease began in my late 30's and was held in check until my late forties and then deteriorated slowly throughout my fifties. A study that followed patients for two years seems to me to be inadequate to tell me anything about the progression that would occur if these same patients had been followed for three or four decades. I know that I increased my daily amount by diet decades ago and I believe that it slowed the rate of deterioration of my joints from my arthritis. However I still have had two Full Knee replacements before the recommended age for surgery because of genetics and basketball. I doubt if B3 is a cure for arthritis although it is almost certainly a factor in controlling the disease and might limit or at least slow down the damage.
I also believe from my own experience that natural sources of vitamins and other essential nutrients are healthier and have better outcomes for me than taking manufactured supplements. But of course that is merely my anecdotal evidence. I have yet to see any movement to do studies that compare outcomes based on adding specific foods like brewers yeast into ones diet compared to popping a vitamin pill.
Wed, 2013-01-30 12:17
#32
Now today, doctors are putting hyperactive children on ritalin and are ruining their brains. When will the corporate greed and insanity stop?
I look back at my school history and am sure that I would have been chosen as a good candidate for Ritalin. Lucky for me I went to elementary school in the 50's and early 60's. For instance after I had done the math problems in 3 to 5 minutes that the teacher had assigned to the class for a 20 minute period with undone questions as homework then the teachers would get on my case for being disruptive. Many kids like me are now drugged for no reason except control of the classroom. Instead of being drugged into a stupor I was allowed to function in my own way and get the best marks in most subjects. Every school report card has the same comment, "He's a good student but asks too many questions." Every single elementary teacher I had made that comment. LOL I guess things have not changed much since I still question everything.
Wed, 2013-01-30 13:22
#33
The Catholic school I attended as a child used raw leather straps to sort out dysfunction within the student body. We were quick to discover ways to avoid the harshest strokes by feigning extreme pain whenever the blows would find their way across our exposed skin, as opposed to earning even harder swipes for any ill-conceived stoicism we might have thought to display. Most of us were of the rough and tumble sort from our outdoor lives as kids, and had absorbed more scrapes and bruises than the school could ever legally mete out, even by early 70's Catholic elementary school standards. But come punishment time in the Principal's office, passers by might have suspected he was in there skinning us alive. They weren't satisfied until they got their pound of tears, which were unsparingly given up at the earliest opportunity. Such advice was freely shared with anyone who had previously managed to avoid such attention, but whose name was ominously being summoned over the PA system to account for some infraction or another. Nowadays of course, the drug companies have taken over from where the Catholics left off. I recall we were a little put out over the fact that girls were never punished in that way, nor were the kids from better off families who stuffed envelopes into the collection plates on Sunday.
Wed, 2013-01-30 13:37
#34
Then you never had Sister Claudia. She was attuned to that game and if you faked it poorly you got a double dose. Of course the really brave tried for the pull back of the hand timed to make her hit herself. You paid dearly for that but the few who did were legendary. So the trick for us was to appear to be stoically resisting while visibly wincing and whimpering despite ones best efforts at being brave. The nuns scared me but my Dad had a strap at home that scared me more and for him the worst crime of all was disobeying a nun.
Wed, 2013-01-30 14:13
#35
Our tormenter and principal was a sadistic stump of a layperson, who eventually learned from bitter experience himself not to send kids home from school looking too worst for wear to their fathers and uncles. Usually they counted on the belief of parents in the infallibility of the Church, and by extension the school, in order to get away with their abuses.
Sat, 2013-02-02 00:38
#36
RevolutionPlease
How do they continually assault us? Easy. We let them.
Do I let them fail me again? Hell no!
Do we fight back? Yes! We do!
No more drugging me. No more silencing me. No more making me invisible.
Where do we go from there?
Speak out, resist, I'm open to suggestions.
Sat, 2013-02-02 01:14
#37
RevolutionPlease
I hope noone ever gives in to the diagnosis.
I've done good. They'll always try to change you.
Sat, 2013-02-02 01:17
#38
RevolutionPlease
Sat, 2013-02-02 13:40
#39
Here is a rabble podcast video about a psychiatrist saying outright that our current medical system is "SICK". He is telling you outright that our psychiatric system has to completely reform itself. Here is the video...
Tue, 2013-02-05 00:15
#40
I believe that it does benefit the patients, and it is because it does NOT benefit the pharmaceutical industry that the idea was scrapped despite its numerous successes. Dr. Hoffer treated over 10,000 patients, and with fantastic results. Dr. Hoffer said that doctors should get paid not simply for treating people, but for getting positive results. That is going to be the only thing which forces doctors to notice other treatment options.
Vitamins are NOT the same as patented drugs. They are synthetic versions of nutrients found in food that has the same molecular structure to nutrients found in regular foods. There are oodles of companies producing the same vitamins at much lower profit margins. That is because vitamins cannot be patented.
Tue, 2013-02-05 01:48
#41
$19 billion dollars a year in advertising to U.S. doctors. We can see that the switch to a strictly biomedical view of mental illness (to which, I recognize, orthomolecular medicine also subscribes) is certainly benefiting the pharmaceutical industry. Is it benefiting patients? This article suggests "not so much."
Tue, 2013-02-05 12:31
#42
Tho the quality can vary greatly cuz theres no regulation really
Tue, 2013-02-05 19:32
#43
I don't know what you mean by the quality. If the molecular structure is off, then it is not that vitamin and they can be sued. The molecular structure has to be bang on for it to be classified as the vitamin. If the dosage levels have variations in them, then that becomes an issue, but here is the REAL issue...
Say, you purchase a cheap no name vitamin C and it says it has 500 mg in it. You assume it has 500 mg in it. However, say, one tablet on testing has 483 mg, and another has 461 mg, and another 491, and so on. Say that the cheap no name vitamin is 60% the price of a big name brand vitamin C bottle, but the differentiation is much less on the more expensive bottle, I would still take the cheaper bottle even though the big name brand has better quality control. For 40 percent less, and at 461 mg in one tablet, I am still getting 461 mg of vitamin C that I wasn't getting before. That 461 mg is still 92% of the required dosage. 461/500 equals 92%. I can forgive these discrepancies for cheaper value. 8 % less tablet is not worth the 40 % higher cost for a bigger name label.
Vitamins are NOT toxic like drugs are. This means that these discrepancies are not to cause worry like pharmaceutical drug quality control issues would.
Tue, 2013-02-05 19:37
#44
If you are implying that no regulations means that there are safety concerns with purchasing vitamins, then I can reassure you that people are not harmed by taking vitamins...
Tue, 2013-02-05 19:57
#45
I have included an excerpt from an Introduction to the book, Finding Care for Depression pp. xviii-xix. The intro was written by Dr. Abram Hoffer, and it explains how toxicity levels are obtained in vitamins, and niacin is recognized as a VERY TOXIC VITAMIN by most medical "experts"...
"I was not very worried about side effects of niacin since I knew that water soluble vitamins were extraordinarily safe. Toxicity tests in dogs showed that 5 grams of niacin per kilogram of body weight would kill half of them. A test dog weighing 20 kg would get 100 grams of niacin. The dose that kills 50% of the test animals is called the LD 50. That dose would be equivalent to giving a 30 kg child 150 grams of niacin and a 60 kg adult 300 grams (more than one half a pound) every day. Anyone who swallowed that much niacin would probably vomit it promptly back up. Our treatments typically use 3 to 6 gram doses of niacin. This is nowhere near the LD dose. One of my female patients took, as a suicide gesture, two hundred 1/2 gram (=500 mg) tablets of vitamin B-3. Before she began to take vitamin B-3 as directed – at the rate of 2 tablets, 3 times a day – she became angry at her mother and swallowed the whole bottleful. For the next three days, she complained of stomach ache but then had no further complaints. She eventually recovered from her schizophrenia."
Tue, 2013-02-05 20:33
#46
Vitamins were first discovered and isolated within the last 100 years. Vitamin A, I believe, in 1912, and then other vitamins from then on. Doctors, from the very beginning, questioned the role nutrients and their deficiencies had on health. As far back as the 1700s, the British Navy discovered the role limes had in preventing scurvy. It has been long known that nutritients and nutrition play a key role in health, and with just a few years from the discovery or isolation of vitamins to the major patenting of drugs, there never was any time to properly discover the role nutrition had on disease formation and prognosis.
This new shift has made the doctors and drug companies a lot of money, but for all the billions of dollars in research, their results in curing people has been dismal at best.
The few doctors who do examine the role vitamins and nutrition play on peoples' health do see positive results when their patients take vitamins and change their diets, so why is there such a reluctance for others to change?
Tue, 2013-02-05 23:11
#47
I don't know what you mean by the quality. If the molecular structure is off, then it is not that vitamin and they can be sued. The molecular structure has to be bang on for it to be classified as the vitamin. If the dosage levels have variations in them, then that becomes an issue, but here is the REAL issue...
Say, you purchase a cheap no name vitamin C and it says it has 500 mg in it. You assume it has 500 mg in it. However, say, one tablet on testing has 483 mg, and another has 461 mg, and another 491, and so on. Say that the cheap no name vitamin is 60% the price of a big name brand vitamin C bottle, but the differentiation is much less on the more expensive bottle, I would still take the cheaper bottle even though the big name brand has better quality control. For 40 percent less, and at 461 mg in one tablet, I am still getting 461 mg of vitamin C that I wasn't getting before. That 461 mg is still 92% of the required dosage. 461/500 equals 92%. I can forgive these discrepancies for cheaper value. 8 % less tablet is not worth the 40 % higher cost for a bigger name label.
Vitamins are NOT toxic like drugs are. This means that these discrepancies are not to cause worry like pharmaceutical drug quality control issues would.
You can sue but theres not government regulations athat would allow prosecution.. I was howvever, refering to the quality rather than the toxicity. And if you are using a vitamin regimen with "you need at least x amount of vitamin x" then the amounts being as stated on the bottle really matter, especially since some vitamins are toxic in larger than allowable amounts or can cause all sorts of problems. According to Ray strand and dean mindell that is tho Ive seen other studies quoted in the news too
Wed, 2013-02-06 08:19
#48
Did he really do toxicity tests on dogs to see at what dosage half of them die? WTF is that about?
Wed, 2013-02-06 10:20
#49
Timebandit
He did LSD experiments on student nurses back in the 1960s as well.
Wed, 2013-02-06 10:50
#50
Did he really do toxicity tests on dogs to see at what dosage half of them die? WTF is that about?
LD50 is a standard for measuring toxicity. Not the quack standard - the scientific standard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Median_lethal_dose
They have figured that out for prettty much every substance under the sun (including water. check out the table). Because of course you have to figure stuff like that out. Yay science!
So nevermind poisoning dogs. It would have been really fun to be there for the waterboarding rat experiments.
Wed, 2013-02-06 10:51
#51
He did LSD experiments on student nurses back in the 1960s as well.
Yes, he started LSD experiments in the 1950s, and the US CIA set up headquarters in Weyburn under MK ULTRA, which was a secret CIA program designed to find out everything they could about LSD because they were worried that the KGB had a mind erasing drug for espionage purposes, and thought the LSD had those qualities.
He used LSD on alcoholics, drug addicts, and schizophrenics for therapeutic purposes. They all said that it helped. He used LSD on Bill W, the founder of AA in the US as well.