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Tom Mulcair's Wife Has Decided to Take Her Husband's Surname For Elxn Campaign
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:25
#1
Tom Mulcair's Wife Has Decided to Take Her Husband's Surname For Elxn Campaign
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:28
#2
When Catherine Pinhas married Thomas Mulcair she decided to keep her maiden name.
She is a woman of with her own accomplishments, and kept her own maiden name throughout Mulcair political career. Even when he became opposition leader, she kept her own name.
Now at the start of this campaign she quietly instructed the media that she wants to be known as Catherine Pinhas-Mulcair.
There has only been one woman who kept her own name, while married to a PM. That is Maureen McTeer who refused repeated calls to take her husbands name.
Laureen Harper, who was known as Laureen Teskey, didn't change her name until Harper became PM.
Even Hillary Clinton back in the 80s was pressured to change her name when Bill Clinton was Govenor of Arkansas. Some of their constituents did not like the fact that she kept her own name. And Bill lost his re-election bid for Governor. Hillary writes in her book that she made a decision, when Bill decided to run for Governor again. Was it more important for her to keep her own name, and alienate voters with her maiden name? Or is it more important for Bill to be Governor and take her married name?
I suspect Catherine Pinhas (now Mulcair) is taking a page from Hillary Clinton. Because both Laureen Harper and Sophie Trudeau have taken their husbands name. I guess she feels she needs to do the same so they are all equal.
Which begs the question, does a spouses surname really make a difference in an election campaign? When that spouse is campaigning with their husband?
For all three ladies listed above, it seems the answer is yes. We have come a long way, but still there is so much more to be done if a spouses surname really makes a difference.
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:36
#3
Yeah but Sophie Trudeau took the Trudeau name.
It is possible Catherine Pinhas did not change her name legally to Mulcair, and is just adding it as a stage name for this election campaign.
If Mulcair becomes PM, we'll have to see if she keeps the Mulcair.
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:38
#4
Where did you hear this?
Since 1981, it's unlawful in Québec to change your surname on marriage, with very strict exceptions, such as:
- The use, for five years or more, of a surname or given name not entered on the act of birth
- A name of foreign origin, too difficult to pronounce or write in its original form
- Serious prejudice or psychological suffering caused by the use of the name
- A name that invites ridicule or that is infamous (marked by disgrace, shame or humiliation)
- The intention to add to the surname of a child under 18 the surname of the father or mother, or a part of it if it is a compound surname
I'd be very surprised if any of those exceptions applied in this case.
So when people get married in Quebec, they don't take the same last name? Why is that?
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:38
#5
alan smithee
Where did you hear this?
Since 1981, it's unlawful in Québec to change your surname on marriage, with very strict exceptions, such as:
- The use, for five years or more, of a surname or given name not entered on the act of birth
- A name of foreign origin, too difficult to pronounce or write in its original form
- Serious prejudice or psychological suffering caused by the use of the name
- A name that invites ridicule or that is infamous (marked by disgrace, shame or humiliation)
- The intention to add to the surname of a child under 18 the surname of the father or mother, or a part of it if it is a compound surname
I'd be very surprised if any of those exceptions applied in this case.
True.
But really,who cares what she wants to call herself?
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:39
#6
Where did you hear this?
Since 1981, it's unlawful in Québec to change your surname on marriage, with very strict exceptions, such as:
- The use, for five years or more, of a surname or given name not entered on the act of birth
- A name of foreign origin, too difficult to pronounce or write in its original form
- Serious prejudice or psychological suffering caused by the use of the name
- A name that invites ridicule or that is infamous (marked by disgrace, shame or humiliation)
- The intention to add to the surname of a child under 18 the surname of the father or mother, or a part of it if it is a compound surname
I'd be very surprised if any of those exceptions applied in this case.
ETA: Unless, of course, she's been using the name "Mulcair" all along as part of her surname (which is not my recollection).
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:39
#7
alan smithee
Where did you hear this?
Since 1981, it's unlawful in Québec to change your surname on marriage, with very strict exceptions, such as:
- The use, for five years or more, of a surname or given name not entered on the act of birth
- A name of foreign origin, too difficult to pronounce or write in its original form
- Serious prejudice or psychological suffering caused by the use of the name
- A name that invites ridicule or that is infamous (marked by disgrace, shame or humiliation)
- The intention to add to the surname of a child under 18 the surname of the father or mother, or a part of it if it is a compound surname
I'd be very surprised if any of those exceptions applied in this case.
So when people get married in Quebec, they don't take the same last name? Why is that?
It's Québec law.
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:40
#8
True.
But really,who cares what she wants to call herself?
Because does it really make a difference to voters if a spouse takes their husbands name?
Its seems for a PM or President there has been NO spouse who didn't take their husbands name
Except Maurren McTeer and look how that turned out.
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:40
#9
Thanks, but why is it a law? What is the reason?
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:42
#10
So when people get married in Quebec, they don't take the same last name? Why is that?
It was the result of demands by women's organizations, part of throwing off the legacy of Church-driven patriarchy. Women's equality was one of the prime aims of the Quiet Revolution. And people never took the "same last name" - they always took the husband's last name.
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:45
#11
Thank you Unionist. I never knew it was a law, just a common place activity.
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:50
#12
It's too bad. But while it may have something to do with traditional values regarding surnames in marriage, I think it also has to do with simple marketing in our soundbite culture. To establish that Mulcair has a loving and talented wife, and to utilize the goodwill this creates, it's easier to just create the one brand of "Mulcair" rather than have to create the additional brand of "Pinhas" and then associate "Pinhas" with "Mulcair".
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:52
#13
I'd be very surprised if Sophie Grégoire is actually Sophie Trudeau. She'd have to go through a complicated change of name process. They were married in Québec - at Ste-Madeleine church in Outremont (better know for its great bazaars where one can score quality clothing and other merch) so even though they are now domiciled in Ottawa I doubt she could change her name retroactively there. In the press here, I've always heard her referred to as Sophie Grégoire (a family as "prominent" as the Trudeaus or Sinclairs). Gilles Duceppe's wife is well-known as Yolande Brunelle.
I'm surprised that anyone would wonder why we wanted to eliminate that patriarchal custom. And remember that we are one of the world's champions of non-marriage, and (stable) unmarried couples.
Thu, 2015-07-23 09:52
#14
big deal- whatever the 'facts' are
Thu, 2015-07-23 10:03
#15
life is full of ironies. she could not get the French state to call her Pinhas.... even when she ran for MP [for an overseas seat]. Her Franch passport would be in the name of Catherine Mulcair.
The other practical effect of instructing the media that way is that otherwise she is virtually always written up as Catherine Pinhas, wife of Tom Mulcair. As a visceral thing, i can see each incidence of "wife of" being irritating, while what name she is written up with is not.
Thu, 2015-07-23 10:04
#16
The companion of Alexandre Boulerice has a more "difficult" name: Lisa Djevahirdjian. I don't know whether their children have a double-barrelled name.
I guess gay and lesbian married couples in France are exempt from the name change stuff.
Thu, 2015-07-23 10:28
#17
I recall reading that since 2005, women in France are no longer required to change their names on marriage. I think their laws were way more patriarchal than Canada's. Does anyone know?
Anyway, I'm still waiting for terrytowel to reveal the source and/or reliability of his rumour.
Thu, 2015-07-23 10:33
#18
I'd be very surprised if Sophie Grégoire is actually Sophie Trudeau. She'd have to go through a complicated change of name process.
Yeah, I was a bit shocked when I saw that the Liberal Party inner elite has decided to re-brand Mme Grégoire:
[url=https://www.liberal.ca/meet-sophie/]Sophie Grégoire-Trudeau[/url]
So I guess the NDP had no choice but to do likewise. After all, how do you recognize a woman if you don't even know whom she's married to??
Thu, 2015-07-23 10:39
#19
alan smithee
True.
But really,who cares what she wants to call herself?
Because does it really make a difference to voters if a spouse takes their husbands name?
Its seems for a PM or President there has been NO spouse who didn't take their husbands name
Except Maurren McTeer and look how that turned out.
I highly doubt that at election time,a leader's spouse's name is going to make a difference. People will be looking to vote for a new government. They're not going to give a flying fuck about maiden names.
Thu, 2015-07-23 10:48
#20
I sure wish our fellow babbler Lou Arab-Notley would weigh in here!
Thu, 2015-07-23 11:10
#21
Really who cares, what last name she has. She isn't the person being elected to control the country, let's focus on policies and politics.
Thu, 2015-07-23 11:21
#22
In Quebec you keep the last name you were born with as far as officialdom is concerned - regardless of who you marry - unless you go through an elaborate name change process. But of course in everyday life people call themselves whatever they want. In Quebec you often have a couple who are known socially as "Monsieur and Madame Sauve" but when Madame Sauve gets mail from the Quebec government its made out to her as Madame Morin (her so-called maiden name).
This law was changed in the early 80s. I still remember that my grandmother who lived in Montreal at the time was shocked when she suddenly got a piece of mail from Revenue Quebec in 1982 addressed to her with her maiden name - a name she had not used since 1934!
Thu, 2015-07-23 11:22
#23
I don't think any of us cares what a candidate's spouse calls herself.
But there's a rumour above that a candidate's spouse has asked the media to make sure they include her spouse's surname in referring to her.
That, surely, is worthy of discussion, if it's true - and it has nothing to do with policies or politics or whom to vote for, but rather, the place of women in our society.
Which is why I wondered aloud whether Lou Arab was planning to adopt his partner's surname. You know, like, to avoid always having to be referred to as "husband of Rachel Notley":
The other practical effect of instructing the media that way is that otherwise she is virtually always written up as Catherine Pinhas, wife of Tom Mulcair. As a visceral thing, i can see each incidence of "wife of" being irritating, while what name she is written up with is not.
Anyone ever hear of a man taking his more famous wife's surname? Ever? No? Correct.
Thu, 2015-07-23 11:35
#24
Unfortunately, some people have come to care about that, in an aping of US politics. This is not only the case in Canada. Chancellor Merkel's husband Dr Joachim Sauer, doesn't get it much though. The name "Merkel" was that of her first husband.
I don't care about Ms Grégoire; she'll do fine even if they divorce, with her background. But I do care about the steps we have taken here in Québec towards equality for women.
http://www.lapresse.ca/debats/chroniques/nathalie-petrowski/201304/22/01...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sophie_Gr%C3%A9goire Most of the other fluff also calls her Sophie Grégoire, but some Grégoire-Trudeaus have crept in of late, especially in English.
Thu, 2015-07-23 11:37
#25
CBC is kicking things off by referring to Mrs. Mulcair by her new name
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/ndp-leader-tom-mulcair-makes-his-pitch-i...
Really who cares, what last name she has. She isn't the person being elected to control the country, let's focus on policies and politics.
Not an issue for me, I don't care.
But as people had said above, it is for branding, soundbites and marketing the Mulcairs as one entity.
I'm sure both Sophie Trudeau and Catherine Pinhas-Mulcair are just stage names.
But starting today every news item will refer to Mrs. Mulcair as Catherine Pinhas-Mulcair
Which is why I wondered aloud whether Lou Arab was planning to adopt his partner's surname. You know, like, to avoid always having to be referred to as "husband of Rachel Notley":
But I have heard of some marriages having tension because the man was tired of being referred to by the wife's maiden name. Like "Hello Mr. Notley", when his surname is Arab (just as an example)
btw I'm not ignoring or avoiding anyone. I'm offline today, as I'm doing research at the reference library. So I won't be able to respond untol tonight.
Cheers!
Thu, 2015-07-23 11:45
#26
Most of the other fluff also calls her Sophie Grégoire, but some Grégoire-Trudeaus have crept in of late, especially in English.
Lagatta - see my post above? She has been officially re-branded as [url=https://www.liberal.ca/fr/rencontrer-sophie/]Sophie Grégoire Trudeau[/url], by the Liberal Party website - in French. And from terrytowel's CBC link, it seems that Catherine Pinhas is undergoing the same makeover.
Thu, 2015-07-23 12:01
#27
Well if both partners in the relationships are happy with the "rebranding" or "makeover" of their names why should the general public care?
Thu, 2015-07-23 12:12
#28
alan smithee
Well if both partners in the relationships are happy with the "rebranding" or "makeover" of their names why should the general public care?
The general public doesn't care. Only someone making a desperate and pathetic issue out of nothing does.
Thu, 2015-07-23 12:22
#29
Well if both partners in the relationships are happy with the "rebranding" or "makeover" of their names why should the general public care?
No, of course an individual's decision to rebrand their name is not of concern to the public.
But, if women routinely take their husbands' names for political branding purposes (Hillary, Sophie, Loreen, Catherine, etc.) - but men never take their wives' names in the same circumstances - then progressive people have a right to wonder whether this reflects inequality in the society. Or whether it's just one of those gosh darn coincidences.
So do you think it's a coincidence - or that it says something about our society?
Thu, 2015-07-23 12:33
#30
it's a symbol of a shit ton that's wrong with society.
A power imbalance based on income inequality, political representation, and legal status.
But don't confuse the symbol with the thing itself.
Thu, 2015-07-23 12:34
#31
It is still a personal choice between the partners, regards if you are progressive, liberal and conservative. My sister in-law's husband took her last name, what is the big deal?
In these cases, the couples have decided that it better for them to have the same last name. They understand doing so will result in large personal victories during/after the election. Is it a coincidence, nope. Both the people and the parties they represent are going after a large victory.
Why does society need to stick their noses into the individual's personal activity?
Thu, 2015-07-23 13:34
#32
It is still a personal choice between the partners, regards if you are progressive, liberal and conservative. My sister in-law's husband took her last name, what is the big deal?
In these cases, the couples have decided that it better for them to have the same last name. They understand doing so will result in large personal victories during/after the election. Is it a coincidence, nope. Both the people and the parties they represent are going after a large victory.
Why does society need to stick their noses into the individual's personal activity?
If they are doing it for public effect then it isn't just "personal activity". You can't have it both ways.
Double standards still exist. Queen Elizabeth could not have a King. Hilary Clinton must downplay Bill to assert her candidacy. The reverse does not exist. A man running for office is only strengthened by having a strong woman by his side.
Thu, 2015-07-23 13:52
#33
So what you are really saying thier there is no private/public area in which society doesn't have the right to invade and question over thier choices.
Thu, 2015-07-23 14:17
#34
Because they're public figures. Personally I don't think voters give a rat's ass what name a politician's spouse chooses to use. For me, the whole notion of a maiden name is antiquated and ridiculous - a symbol of how little we have strayed from the patriarchal model.It is still a personal choice between the partners, regards if you are progressive, liberal and conservative. My sister in-law's husband took her last name, what is the big deal?
In these cases, the couples have decided that it better for them to have the same last name. They understand doing so will result in large personal victories during/after the election. Is it a coincidence, nope. Both the people and the parties they represent are going after a large victory.
Why does society need to stick their noses into the individual's personal activity?
I was born with a perfectly good name and had no reason whatsoever to change it when I got married.
Thu, 2015-07-23 14:54
#35
my father abandoned me and i would love to take on my husband's name if i ever get married.
Thu, 2015-07-23 15:01
#36
Misfit
You don't have to get married to change your name. If you do not like your name now, you can make it anything you like such as your mother's maiden name if that is something you feel more comfortable with. And, your mother's maiden name is just a suggestion. You are free to change it to anything you want.
Thu, 2015-07-23 15:02
#37
Misfit
If there is an expectation for Catherine to hyphenate her name then there should be he very same expectation for Tom to hyphenate his name as well. And TT knows full well that Joe Clark did not lose the election because of his wife's last name. He lost the election because the airline lost his luggage! ;-)
Thu, 2015-07-23 15:06
#38
When you get married, you don’t have to legally change your last name (surname). You have 3 options if you would like to change your name. You can: • change your last name to your spouse’s last name • combine both of your last names with a space in-between • combine both of your last names with a hyphen Fun fact in Ontario!
Thu, 2015-07-23 15:10
#39
Hi just thought I'd take a break from my research at the reference library and check in. Great comments, this is a good discussion about this topic.
Two things. If Jack was still around, 100% sure Olivia Chow would never take the Layton name. She is too independent for that, and she has never been the typical political spouse. She is more out there in terms of talking about policy and politics.
To the point of "Why doesn't the man take the woman's name". Some men have. For same-sex couples. some couples combine their name into one, and then legally change it. For instance I know a couple who had the surnames Burrowes & Stone. So they combined it to one name Stoneburrowes, and both of them legally changed their name.
But not just same-sex couples do that. I know many straight couples as well.
The opera diva Measha Bruggergosman is not her orignal name. She was born Measha Gosman, but when she married Mr. Brugger they decided to combine their names, and legally change it. So now they are both known as Bruggergosman.
Ok back to the books! Cheers!
Thu, 2015-07-23 16:14
#40
A male friend of mine always uses his mum's last name as dad was a deadbeat who deserted them (they were legally married).
I do think name changes should be easier, as long as it isn't for devious purposes. But that has nothing to do with marriage.
Thu, 2015-07-23 16:57
#41
In BC when you get married you can assume the last name of your spouse without any paperwork but not any hyphenated or other kinds of names. If you assume the last name of your spouse you can stop doing so anytime you want. The law is specifically designed to be non-gender specific.
3 A spouse by marriage may
(a) use the surname he or she had immediately before the marriage,
(b) use the surname he or she had at birth or by adoption, or
(c) use the surname of his or her spouse by marriage.
Thu, 2015-07-23 17:51
#42
OK back again between researching at the Library
Two tidbits, John Tory wife has kept her surname (Barbara Hackett) when he was both PC Opposition Leader in Ontario and currently as the Mayor Wife.
Another story from Hillary Clinton biography. She writes in 1992 as they were gearing up for the campaign, she ordered new stationary that read at the top "Hillary Rodham Clinton". She passed off the order to someone on Bill Clinton staff. When the new stationary arrived it said at the top "Hillary Clinton", her surname was removed by one of Bill Clinton staff.
Thu, 2015-07-23 19:16
#43
well i like to take my husband's name and its my right to do that. i want to be his.
Thu, 2015-07-23 19:19
#44
So what you are really saying thier there is no private/public area in which society doesn't have the right to invade and question over thier choices.
No, I'm saying if you make a choice about anything based on the impact it will have on a political campaign you can't demand people have only positive reactions to it. The name changes were for political not personal reasons.
I don't fault the two women for doing this because like it or not wives matter to political careers but if someone presented the argument that it is harmful for women I would listen.
Thu, 2015-07-23 19:21
#45
maybe it is for personal reason, how do you know ? are you Tom Mulcair's wife?
Thu, 2015-07-23 20:20
#46
maybe it is for personal reason, how do you know ? are you Tom Mulcair's wife?
Well, the title says it's for the election, I don't think either Catherine or Sophie changed their names legally. I think it would be quite the coincidence if both Trudeau's and Mulcair's wives, who have always been known by their "maiden" names, decided to add their husband's surnames just as they decided to run for the office of Prime Minister.
Sophie has had 3 children without changing her name and Catherine kept her name at a time when it was unusual to do so. In both cases the timing is very odd if it has nothing to do with their husband's aspirations.
Thu, 2015-07-23 20:36
#47
maybe she believes it is more convenient for her to take on her husband's name . It's her choice on she would like to be addressed. But do go on. I am sure you will.
Thu, 2015-07-23 20:45
#48
Changing your name to your husband's name is like covering your whole face with a burqa. You can say you're an adult who knows what she's doing and is making a conscious choice, but the government knows better.
Thu, 2015-07-23 21:03
#49
Maybe Catherine taking on the Mulcair name is because Catherine was born in France, and as Tom has already been attacked for having duel Canadian & French citizenship in some quarters, it might help to diffuse rather than add more fuel to the stupid flames created by that political nonsense. Rather unfortunate.
I do appreciate Mulcair's comments in Joanna Smith's Toronto Star article today about some things he learned from Jack.
Thu, 2015-07-23 21:11
#50
Unionist was wondering whether men ever take their wife's surname.... well c'mon Babblers, its time for all us pseudo progressives to join the 21st century:
Men taking their wife's name, double-barrelled surnames and even meshed versions are all the rage as traditional marriages go out of fashion
- Increasing number of husbands taking their wives names when they marry
- Often men with 'embarrassing' names don't want to pass it on to children
- 'Meshing' - creating a new surname by combing both names - also popular
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3122546/Men-taking-wife-s-double-barrelled-surnames-MESHED-versions-rage-traditional-marriages-fashion.html#ixzz3glbRvVqO
Fri, 2015-07-24 01:59
#51
Of course it is better for a woman to keep her fathers name rather than taking her husbands when she gets married. Unless it is two women marrying then they get to choose either of their father's names. 
I think children should have their mothers surname because at birth the thing that is almost always known is the mother's name.