NDP Furious @ Trudeau - NDP Did All The Work In HOC & Trudeau Is Getting The Reward | Page 2

Wed, 2015-10-28 20:04

JKR

KarlL wrote:

JKR wrote:

I think the higher-ups in the NDP thought they could get many voters to strategically vote for the NDP by telling people that the NDP was the government-in-waiting since the NDP had 100 seats and the Liberals only had 35. But the NDP was obviously in third place and the voters weren't fooled.

That argument was always hopeless. It came out in extremis, the first time, I think, in that video from Brad Lavigne.

What surprised me is that both Peggy Nash and Tom Mulcair deployed it themselves. It might have had some small resonance if it had been used earlier, despite the speciousness of the argument. Trotted out as late as it was, it looked ridiculous.

I think it would have made sense to use it at the beginning of the election when the NDP was in first place. Using it at the end of the election when the NDP was clearly in third place probably sent votes to the Liberals as voters were aware of which party was in a better position to evict the Conservatives from office.

Wed, 2015-10-28 20:12

#53

Debater

The NDP was temporarily in the lead in the polls early in the Summer, yes, but that was as a result of the Notley Alberta Wave.

To quote Massachussetts progressive Senator Elizabeth Warren, "You didn't build that!"

Mulcair forgot that it was Notley that built that lead for him. He didn't build it himself.

Wed, 2015-10-28 20:22

#54

quizzical

wage zombie wrote:
alan smithee wrote:
Before people call the Liberals liars,keep in mind that the Conservative Senate will be a huge obstacle in getting things done,including amending C-51. It's an obstacle that would handcuff the NDP as well.

Harper might be gone but his cronies in the senate remain with power.

I think Trudeau will be able to take care of that problem lickety split. "What if we have too many empty senate seats?" will be viewed as an opportunity as opposed to a problem.

maybe Harper left so many Senate seats open so Trudeau could fill them with Liberals?

Wed, 2015-10-28 20:39

#55

JKR

Debater wrote:

The NDP was temporarily in the lead in the polls early in the Summer, yes, but that was as a result of the Notley Alberta Wave.

To quote Massachussetts progressive Senator Elizabeth Warren, "You didn't build that!"

Mulcair forgot that it was Notley that built that lead for him. He didn't build it himself.

I think Mulcair and the NDP could still have built on the lead the NDP was fortunate to have by having a good campaign. For example, the NDP could have run on using modest deficits to grow the economy like the Liberals did. I think that's what the NDP's base is supporting right now. That's the way Notley's government in Alberta is moving in the budget they just presented. The budgets in Alberta are actually much more than modest but with today's low interest rates they make sense if they have a strong multiplier effect.

Wed, 2015-10-28 20:51

#56

Debater

As for interest rates, I think Justin Trudeau & his economic team have already said what you did:

Because of low interest rates, now is the time to invest & grow the economy.

Harper didn't want to do it, but the Liberals & NDP are more open to the idea.

Wed, 2015-10-28 21:36

#57

KarlL

KarlL wrote:

quizzical wrote:

maybe Harper left so many Senate seats open so Trudeau could fill them with Liberals?

I have been curious about that as it seems so out of keeping with Harper. Any significant level of electoral reform will hurt the Conservatives badly but in all cases, it will need to get through the Senate. So why would Harper leave those 22 seats unfilled?

I have a pet theory. Despite all this 'nobody wins four terms' horseshit from Kory Teneycke, Harper thought he was going to win the campaign and was planning a wave of appointments to utterly demoralize his opponents as it would have resulted in a 70%/30% split and climbing. In short, Laurentian Elites, you are now in toto something like the NDP has long been - a voice of conscience on the issues but understand that effective resistance is futile.

The only alternative seems to be that he wanted to empower Trudeau with a Senate majority to match his House majority and that seems completely counter-intuitive.

Wed, 2015-10-28 21:36

#58

KarlL

dp

Wed, 2015-10-28 21:45

#59

Debater

If Harper had appointed a whole slew of Senators going into the Election, it would have further damaged his credibility.

He kept those seats vacant because:

1) The Senate had become so toxic that appointing any more Senators in the middle of the Duffy Trial would have been terrible optics

2) Harper still thought he had a chance of winning another election

(and he did come close for a while -- the Conservative numbers got a big bump in mid-Septemeber when Harper brought up the right-wing policies about refugees, immigration, citizenship & niqabs).