And so a new era begins in Canadian politics.......

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Sean in Ottawa

quizzical wrote:

i agree Sean. i believe if there was investigation done on the student population in control of the this body who did this silly shit they would find them to be 'christians'.

That would make sense. I hope we hear more on this becuase it is a really strange position. I will ask my daughter (a 4th year student there) if she has heard what this is about. She is a really great critical thinker so no doubt she would have some thoughts.

Cody87

Regarding the "Yoga" story which I have been on the warpath about since I heard of it on the 21st. Sources say there were no complaints at U of Ottawa. The student body just decided to take up this cause on it's own.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/11/23/university...

In a French-language interview with Radio Canada, student federation president Roméo Ahimakin said there were no direct complaints about the class. Instead, it was ended as part of a review of all programs “to make them more interesting, accessible, inclusive and responsive to the needs of students,” as the CBC noted.

That being said, the same article above notes that apparently India is taking an interest in the status of Yoga:

“As the multi-billion dollar yoga industry continues to grow with studios becoming as prevalent as Starbucks and $120 yoga pants, the mass commercialization of this ancient practice, rooted in Hindu thought, has become concerning,” according to the Web site of the Hindu American Foundation, an advocacy group based in Washington, D.C., with an initiative called “Take Back Yoga.” “With proliferation of new forms of ‘yoga,’ the underlying meaning, philosophy, and purpose of yoga are being lost,” reads a Web page for the initiative.

Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi has been trying to take yoga back for almost a year now. His nation even has a yoga minister.

“There is little doubt about yoga being an Indian art form,” Shripad Yesso Naik said in December. “We’re trying to establish to the world that it’s ours.”

So if the student federation is looking for a somewhat convincing excuse, I guess that gives them one.

 

swallow swallow's picture

Cody, did you use the term "on the warpath" deliberately? ;) 

Quote:

He said they're doing consultations on the idea of bringing a free yoga class back and could get a more accessible version of it as soon as the next semester starts in January.

On Monday the University of Ottawa tweeted out a notice that it's organizing free yoga sessions Dec. 1, 8 and 15 at its University Centre. One yoga teacher at the school emailed CBC News to say the university does that during exams and through the summer so there are other yoga options on campus.

[url=http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/university-ottawa-yoga-cultural-sen... class cancelled....[/url]

Unionist

quizzical wrote:

i agree Sean. i believe if there was investigation done on the student population in control of the this body who did this silly shit they would find them to be 'christians'.

Jump to conclusions much?

Interesting how people pick up snippets from some scandalmongering MSM reports which have gone all over the world and then make up their minds without hearing all sides of the story.

That's how wars and genocides get started.

And federal elections.

ETA: Sorry, I should have addressed that comment to Sean as well.

 

swallow swallow's picture

Further to "yoga-gate" (which maybe shuld have its own thread, but this one seems pretty jumbled already): 

Quote:
The recent wave of media coverage of the cancellation of a yoga class at the University of Ottawa is a perfect illustration of everything that is wrong with mainstream media....

To say that the incident has been blown out of proportion is only the beginning. All the headlines say things like “University Of Ottawa’s Free Yoga Class Scrapped“, which is completely factually incorrect. The action was taken by a service of the student union, which is a separate organization from the university (actually, the university still has its own free yoga class, which it was happy to point out on twitter today). Some of the headlines say that yoga has been banned, which is also wrong. Staff of the CSD have also stressed that they have only cancelled the class for this semester (which is only about two or three more weeks), and they’re reviewing it for next semester – so “scrapped” is also quite a stretch....

If you’re not a disabled student, you don’t get to decide whether the CSD is using it’s funding appropriately. And if you’re not a south asian person, you don’t get to decide whether yoga is offensive or not. We need to be willing to be engaged about this. I’m actually appalled at how often this has to be said — not just to the right wing folks who are right now harassing the CSD’s staff, but to left wing activists I know who still read Sun News. We need to see past the media’s sensationalism and have an actual calm and nuanced conversation.

[url=http://murkygreenwaters.com/2015/11/24/the-yoga-controversy-a-disabled-p... reading the whole post[/url]

JKR

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

quizzical wrote:

i agree Sean. i believe if there was investigation done on the student population in control of the this body who did this silly shit they would find them to be 'christians'.

That would make sense. I hope we hear more on this becuase it is a really strange position. I will ask my daughter (a 4th year student there) if she has heard what this is about. She is a really great critical thinker so no doubt she would have some thoughts.

http://www.hafsite.org/media/pr/takeyogaback

http://www.hafsite.org/media/pr/yoga-hindu-origins

Unionist

Thanks swallow and JKR for broadening the discussion a bit, before we all go off at ridiculing "political correctness" and "student radicals" and "crushing freedom of speech" and, well, you know the spiel.

It's simply incredible how easy it is to get us on that kind of bandwagon. And I mean all of us. Like, "je suis Charlie". And you can imagine a million other examples.

NorthReport

So Trudeau's first election promise failure was that Canada was going to bring in 25,000 Syrian refugees by Dec 31. 

quizzical

Unionist wrote:
Thanks swallow and JKR for broadening the discussion a bit, before we all go off at ridiculing "political correctness" and "student radicals" and "crushing freedom of speech" and, well, you know the spiel.

It's simply incredible how easy it is to get us on that kind of bandwagon. And I mean all of us. Like, "je suis Charlie". And you can imagine a million other examples.

i was simply indicating the fight going on here and elsewhere in BC by fundamentalist christians to stop hatha yoga in secular settings and as you well know their network of action is across Canada. it's the same people who are anti-choice.

 

Sean in Ottawa

Unionist wrote:

quizzical wrote:

i agree Sean. i believe if there was investigation done on the student population in control of the this body who did this silly shit they would find them to be 'christians'.

Jump to conclusions much?

Interesting how people pick up snippets from some scandalmongering MSM reports which have gone all over the world and then make up their minds without hearing all sides of the story.

That's how wars and genocides get started.

And federal elections.

ETA: Sorry, I should have addressed that comment to Sean as well.

 

??? I only said this would make sense and I hoped we would hear more. Hardly a conclusive statement. Quizzical also only speculated and did not make it conclusive either.

Pondering

NorthReport wrote:

So Trudeau's first election promise failure was that Canada was going to bring in 25,000 Syrian refugees by Dec 31. 

Do you think the 2 month delay is important?

I'm disappointed that they were wrong about the amount of time it would take. They were too ambitious. On the other hand I don't have a problem with taking an extra 2 months to achieve the target so I still consider it a promise kept.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

I think other than when it comes to the CF18s in Syria, and Vets Offices in Canada, there aren't any other broken promises. I get the dislike for Junior, but let's keep our perspective. As I said before, he's my PM, but he's not my leader.

NorthReport

Fossil fuel companies risk wasting $2tn of investors' money, study says

Paris climate deal could render oil, gas and coal projects worthless with US, Canada, China and Australia most vulnerable to losing billions

An oil rig in Culver City, California, US.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/nov/25/fossil-fuel-companies-risk-wasting-2tn-paris-climate-deal

NorthReport

Liberal dudes now allied with Toronto Sun. Go figure, eh!

Hurrah for Trudeau's first broken election promise

http://www.torontosun.com/2015/11/24/hurrah-for-trudeaus-first-broken-el...

Sean in Ottawa

Pondering wrote:

NorthReport wrote:

So Trudeau's first election promise failure was that Canada was going to bring in 25,000 Syrian refugees by Dec 31. 

Do you think the 2 month delay is important?

I'm disappointed that they were wrong about the amount of time it would take. They were too ambitious. On the other hand I don't have a problem with taking an extra 2 months to achieve the target so I still consider it a promise kept.

No I don't think the extra time is that significant but it is more than two months BTW.

The original promise was 25000 government sponsored refugees. We don't know what the current number is as the present plan is 25000 ALL refugees inlcuding private by February and then to continue through the year until the government refugee number is 25000. The delay in part is to overcome resistance that would otherwise affect the refugees negatively so I do not find this to be unexpected or unreasonable.

That said I think the number is significant for a country that is volunteering (as opposed to people flooding across the border). The initiative is reasonable so long as the timeline to get to the full 25k does not go too much past February and the Federal government makes sure that the provinces are well-funded to integrate. I suspect this will be the case. As well, once the 25000 government sponsored refugees are reached then Canada should examine its total in light of the scale of the need and see if it can do more.

I do not expect the refugees to be a broken promise at this point. However, I do think the federal government will need to do a longer term assessment on the costs this will have on the provinces including healthcare and education. The healthcare costs of people living in these conditions are obvious. The education costs perhaps less so but they exist an this goes beyond job training when it comes to the children who speak no English at this point.

When it comes to children without English, the younger ages will not be a problem at all given how easy it is for very young people to aquire another language. However later elementary and early high school kids will need support for several years as ESL students. Their success would be expected to be very high but the investment is important and costly when you have significant volumes. That said you have an exonomy of scale when you have significant numbers of children in the same place, at the same level and coming from the same language background.

The support for higher education is important. To not help these refugees attain higher education, given that soem may not be that far off and their parents may have little ability to support them in this is also important. Of course other Canadians cannot be left behind as well. The only answer is to increase the level of support for higher education so that all students who have the ability and desire can attend no matter their background or economic circumstances.

We should also recognznize the long term benefits to the economy of this significant group of children who will grow and become part of our system during a time of population aging. Any investments in these people will be money very well spent. It is just important that this be handled well as delays in investing in children create huge human and financial costs over time. And the returns of such investment return rapidly

All that said there is no reason to assume the Liberals do not understand this (the budget hole previously spoken of, we can assume to be about accounting rather than intention). Second of all we have to recognize the value of Provincial-Federal communication at a level we have not seen in almost a decade.

I think the decision to delay the arrival of the refugees will be taken for the most part as responding to circumstances and public opinion. It takes the wind out of the sails of the anti-refugee voices by removing any sense that the process is ill-considered or arbitrary.  All in all I don't have a significant problem with the handling of this file so far.

NorthReport

Global emissions nearly stall after a decade of rapid growth, report shows

Slowdown in 2014 is attributed to lack of growth in Chinese coal use and signals new period of slower rises in world emissions, say experts

 

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/nov/25/global-emissions-near...

NorthReport

Dear Media, Stop Freaking Out About Donald Trump’s Polls

 

http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/dear-media-stop-freaking-out-about-d...

NorthReport

Rubio's charged but nuanced rhetoric on national security excites GOP voters

Foreign policy experience takes on new significance for Iowa conservatives after the Paris attacks, as the Republican presidential candidate emphasizes his vitriol on the ‘clash of civilizations’ is directed at Isis, not Muslims

 

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/nov/25/marco-rubio-national-secu...

NorthReport

How an angry comic who had a coke habit became the Barbara Walters of podcasts

https://www.washingtonpost.com/entertainment/how-an-angry-comic-with-a-c...

NorthReport

Shades of the Harper regime. Ugh!  Frown

Standoff over government climate study provokes national uproar by scientists

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/federal-eye/wp/2015/11/24/standoff-o...

NorthReport

Now the federal government is suing UBC

Federal government sues UBC, former associate dean over misused funds for First Nations dental program

http://www.cknw.com/2015/11/25/feds-sue-ubc-former-associate-dean-over-m...

NorthReport

From gas plants to gold mines, heavy emitters of greenhouse gases aren’t just in Alberta

Five things to know about the first ministers’ meeting on climate change ahead of Paris talks

 

NorthReport

Oil industry’s future might depend on joining fight against global warming:

Alberta's plan to take on climate change is an opportunity for the oilsands industry to rebrand.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/11/25/oil-industrys-future-might...

NorthReport

Cigarette-style warning labels about climate change may soon appear at gas stations around Vancouver

http://www.straight.com/news/584011/cigarette-style-warning-labels-about...

NorthReport

Will Smith says he may enter politics 'in the near future'

Actor says he has been ‘incensed to a level that I can’t sleep’ over the year’s events, and he is considering channeling that dissatisfaction into politics

 

http://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/nov/25/will-smith-may-enter-politic...

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

Well, no actually! Trudeau lies about Syria and CF commitment:

http://linkis.com/www.cbc.ca/news/poli/NAtKC 

We're still in the fight. He lied!

Pondering

Arthur Cramer wrote:

Well, no actually! Trudeau lies about Syria and CF commitment:

http://linkis.com/www.cbc.ca/news/poli/NAtKC 

We're still in the fight. He lied!

Trudeau never said we were withdrawing from the coalition. Just the opposite. He assured everyone that Canada would remain a part of the coalition. His reason for withdrawing the CF-18s was that we can contribute better in other ways. He has never said that bombing is wrong or that we shouldn't help in the fight against ISIL/Daesh. Condemn him for that not some fake claim about a commitment he never made.

Arthur Cramer Arthur Cramer's picture

No Pondering, everyone who voted for him believed he meant the Canadians were coming home. Your problem is that you'd sooner defend anything Trudeau says rather than face up to the fact he needlessly puts Canadian Service men and women at risk. That's cirmminal. So says this 20 plus year CF Vet. Junior, has never served a day in uniform in his life but he's just another typial POLIITICIAN who is quite content to send the children of others off to die for nothing. Change?  In a pig's eye!

brookmere

Arthur Cramer wrote:
No Pondering, everyone who voted for him believed he meant the Canadians were coming home.

OK, so you're not actually saying JT lied, rather that everyone who voted Liberal believed that JT was lying when he said he would retain Canadian troops in training roles.

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

Sean in Ottawa

Arthur Cramer wrote:

No Pondering, everyone who voted for him believed he meant the Canadians were coming home. Your problem is that you'd sooner defend anything Trudeau says rather than face up to the fact he needlessly puts Canadian Service men and women at risk. That's cirmminal. So says this 20 plus year CF Vet. Junior, has never served a day in uniform in his life but he's just another typial POLIITICIAN who is quite content to send the children of others off to die for nothing. Change?  In a pig's eye!

Sorry Art I do not agree with this. I never understood from Trudeau and the Liberals that they were doing anything other than bringing back the CF-18s and replacing them with what would be riskier for Canadains but perhaps less risky for civilians but very much a part of the engagement. Disengagement was not a Liberal position that I can recall. I do not agree with the Liebral position but I do not think it is a lie, broken promise, surprise etc.

The part that I find disapointing is the lack of a connection between wider mental health support and security domestically. This is important in part becuase while we know that suicidal people who are homicidal get all the news, especially if they adopt the cause of terror, the majority of deaths from mental illness are suicides and they can be reduced by better care. The headline grabbing "terror attacks" would also be reduced by this but the greater problem of suicide could be helped at the same time with the same approach. Greater public support for mental health would also improve the lives of many other people who are not a threat to others or suicidal. This is a huge priority now and it was before we got obsessed with the much smaller, albeit more dramatic "terror" threat. There are more than 3700 suicides in Canada a year. Almost 800 under age 30 with the greatest number between 40 and 60. If even 10% of these died in terror attacks Canada would talk of little else. Many more are not labeled suicide when the intention of the person was not clear.

Pondering

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

The part that I find disapointing is the lack of a connection between wider mental health support and security domestically. This is important in part becuase while we know that suicidal people who are homicidal get all the news, especially if they adopt the cause of terror, the majority of deaths from mental illness are suicides and they can be reduced by better care. The headline grabbing "terror attacks" would also be reduced by this but the greater problem of suicide could be helped at the same time with the same approach.

I'm disappointed that so far the Liberals have not highlighted the need for better mental health care. Trudeau himself sought counselling to deal with his mother's illness which was diagnosed as bi-polar.

I also can't help but make a connection between the lack of mental health care and some lone wolf attacks but statistically people with mental health care issues are more likely to be the victims of crime than commit them.

Emphasizing any connection between mental health care and criminality encourages stigmatization.

I get really really tired of hearing the phrase “mental illness” thrown around as a way to avoid saying other terms like “toxic masculinity,” “white supremacy,” “misogyny” or “racism.”

We barely know anything about the suspect in the Charleston, South Carolina, atrocity. We certainly don’t have testimony from a mental health professional responsible for his care that he suffered from any specific mental illness, or that he suffered from a mental illness at all.

We do have statistics showing that the vast majority of people who commit acts of violence do not have a diagnosis of mental illness and, conversely, people who have mental illness are far more likely to be the victims of violence than the perpetrators.

We know that the stigma of people who suffer from mental illness as scary, dangerous potential murderers hurts people every single day — it costs people relationships and jobs, it scares people away from seeking help who need it, it brings shame and fear down on the heads of people who already have it bad enough.

But the media insists on trotting out “mental illness” and blaring out that phrase nonstop in the wake of any mass killing. I had to grit my teeth every time I personally debated someone defaulting to the mindless mantra of “The real issue is mental illness” over the Isla Vista shootings.

“The real issue is mental illness” is a goddamn cop-out. I almost never hear it from actual mental health professionals, or advocates working in the mental health sphere, or anyone who actually has any kind of informed opinion on mental health or serious policy proposals for how to improve our treatment of the mentally ill in this country.

http://www.salon.com/2015/06/18/its_not_about_mental_illness_the_big_lie...

 

 

Sean in Ottawa

Pondering wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

The part that I find disapointing is the lack of a connection between wider mental health support and security domestically. This is important in part becuase while we know that suicidal people who are homicidal get all the news, especially if they adopt the cause of terror, the majority of deaths from mental illness are suicides and they can be reduced by better care. The headline grabbing "terror attacks" would also be reduced by this but the greater problem of suicide could be helped at the same time with the same approach.

I'm disappointed that so far the Liberals have not highlighted the need for better mental health care. Trudeau himself sought counselling to deal with his mother's illness which was diagnosed as bi-polar.

I also can't help but make a connection between the lack of mental health care and some lone wolf attacks but statistically people with mental health care issues are more likely to be the victims of crime than commit them.

I realize you don't read carefully but I already addressed this.

I have been very, very clear that the terror threat is remote far less than the toll of mental illness. However, if an attack caused by an individual's crisis is attracting a response the connection to the problem is reasonable and correct.

I am very well aware of the issues of mental health in Canada and stigmatization. However, the lack of support for mental health does lead to a continuum of suffering from lives spent in unnecessary misery to suicide and to rare cases of homicide on the very rare fringe.

My point is greater access to supports for mental health not only can help reduce risk of occurences such as what we saw a year ago on Parliament Hill, but also the far more common risk of suicide. As well as the suffering of people who may not be in mortal danger but certainly are sufferng. Confusing mental illness with terrorism does more damage than anything I have said.

***

And my disapointment is that the Liberals did not address mental health in any of the mandates. Even if they did not want to reorient resources from going after people's rights to supporting their health, they could have mentionned the need for greater attention to mental health at least somewhere.

We also have to recognize that access to mental health services is also one affected by income level as there are few public supports that are not faced with long waiting lists. People with insurance or money to pay privately have much greater and more timely access.

Now all that said I expressed disapointment but am not condemning them since I do know they are consulting and it is a sector they are likely to listen to.

I not only want a greater attention spent on health, but also specifically more on mental health and health research. In this there are many advocates competing so you have to hope this message makes it through. For example, the Liberals are wanting to bring science and evidence back to decision-making. The trouble is that the area of science that has been most famously ignored is of course the environment. But this is also true of human health science.

But still I disagree with you that we should not recognize certain terrist acts as really extreme and rare cases of mental distress. It is important for the public to know that the vast overwhelming majority of those who suffer from mental illness are of no danger to others but it does not mean we completely ignore the mental health connection in the rare times they are. There is a lot of public education needed. Many people consider mental illness as if it is just one illness rather than many disorders. But there is no shortcut to wider public education on this.

NorthReport

Are Trudeau and his cabinet ministers paying any attention?

Grant Shapps resigns over bullying scandal: 'the buck should stop with me'

Former party chairman stands down after revelations he knew about bullying allegations against aide almost a year ago

 

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/nov/28/grant-shapps-resigns-ove...

montrealer58 montrealer58's picture

Good to see Shapps go down. Nasty piece of work.

JKR

NorthReport wrote:

Are Trudeau and his cabinet ministers paying any attention?

Grant Shapps resigns over bullying scandal: 'the buck should stop with me'

Former party chairman stands down after revelations he knew about bullying allegations against aide almost a year ago

 

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/nov/28/grant-shapps-resigns-ove...

What does this article in the Guardian have to do with Canadian politics?

Pondering

NorthReport wrote:

Are Trudeau and his cabinet ministers paying any attention?

Grant Shapps resigns over bullying scandal: 'the buck should stop with me'

Former party chairman stands down after revelations he knew about bullying allegations against aide almost a year ago

 

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/nov/28/grant-shapps-resigns-ove...

He wrote: “Although neither the party nor I can find any record of written allegations of bullying, sexual abuse or blackmail made to the chairman’s office prior to the election, I cannot help but feel that the steady stream of those who raised smaller, more nuanced objections should have perhaps set alarm bells ringing sooner.

Trudeau didn't need written allegations or an official complaint to deal with abusive MPs. He suspended them pending an investigation. The results of that investigation were not contested by either man. No written official complaints required.

While I know that many NDP supporters think Trudeau was wrong it confirmed to me that I chose the right leader to support. I am delighted that those men are no longer lawmakers.

Maybe Mulcair and his executive should be the ones taking notes along with the CBC on how to deal with workplace bullying.

Sean in Ottawa

I notice that the Liberals under TRudeau do not think that the targets in Paris should be binding.

Think about that for a moment.

Is this a change or just a return to toothless Liberal promises? They always did do better promises than anyone else.

Pondering

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

I notice that the Liberals under TRudeau do not think that the targets in Paris should be binding.

Think about that for a moment.

Is this a change or just a return to toothless Liberal promises? They always did do better promises than anyone else.

No need to think about it. The US should be isolated in its decision to reject binding targets not joined by Canada. We will have to wait and see what actions he takes over the next 4 years.

If the NDP is ahead of the Liberals on climate change it isn't by a significant amount.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/139-countries-could-get-all-of...

The NDP can try for 2019, but realistically Trudeau will most likely take it. That (to me) may be disappointing but it also allows for a genuine rethink of what should be at the top of the agenda for a progressive party.

In the Liberal dissection of the party http://www.liberal.ca/files/2011/11/BuildingaModernLiberalParty.pdf page 19 section 1.9 discusses the challenge in getting activists to support a party.

I'd say one reason is that political parties are not taking a strong enough stand on the two most important issues of the century. Climate change and income inequality. For many progressives today if you aren't serious about those two issues you are irrelevant.

NorthReport

Trudeau's comments on Syria are discouraging,

Corbyn on the other hand is exhibiting some healthy leadership

Too bad John Horgan doesn't get it.

Jeremy Corbyn warns rebels: I'm not going anywhere over Syria

Labour leader makes clear only he will decide whether to whip his MPs to vote against extending airstrikes against Isis

 

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/nov/29/jeremy-corbyn-warns-rebe...

swallow swallow's picture

Pondering wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

I notice that the Liberals under TRudeau do not think that the targets in Paris should be binding.

Think about that for a moment.

Is this a change or just a return to toothless Liberal promises? They always did do better promises than anyone else.

No need to think about it. The US should be isolated in its decision to reject binding targets not joined by Canada. We will have to wait and see what actions he takes over the next 4 years.

If the NDP is ahead of the Liberals on climate change it isn't by a significant amount.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/139-countries-could-get-all-of...

The NDP can try for 2019, but realistically Trudeau will most likely take it. That (to me) may be disappointing but it also allows for a genuine rethink of what should be at the top of the agenda for a progressive party.

In the Liberal dissection of the party http://www.liberal.ca/files/2011/11/BuildingaModernLiberalParty.pdf page 19 section 1.9 discusses the challenge in getting activists to support a party.

I'd say one reason is that political parties are not taking a strong enough stand on the two most important issues of the century. Climate change and income inequality. For many progressives today if you aren't serious about those two issues you are irrelevant.

If Trudeau is rejecting binding targets, and the USA should be isolated in rejecting binding targets, does this mean you are in actual disagreement with a Trudeau policy? 

Sean in Ottawa

Pondering wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

I notice that the Liberals under TRudeau do not think that the targets in Paris should be binding.

Think about that for a moment.

Is this a change or just a return to toothless Liberal promises? They always did do better promises than anyone else.

No need to think about it. The US should be isolated in its decision to reject binding targets not joined by Canada. We will have to wait and see what actions he takes over the next 4 years.

If the NDP is ahead of the Liberals on climate change it isn't by a significant amount.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/139-countries-could-get-all-of...

The NDP can try for 2019, but realistically Trudeau will most likely take it. That (to me) may be disappointing but it also allows for a genuine rethink of what should be at the top of the agenda for a progressive party.

In the Liberal dissection of the party http://www.liberal.ca/files/2011/11/BuildingaModernLiberalParty.pdf page 19 section 1.9 discusses the challenge in getting activists to support a party.

I'd say one reason is that political parties are not taking a strong enough stand on the two most important issues of the century. Climate change and income inequality. For many progressives today if you aren't serious about those two issues you are irrelevant.

I find I agree with you in most of this.

I did understand that the NDP was in favour of binding targets -- does anyone have references on this?

I think the NDP could put up a real fight in 2019 but not with Mulcair. And if they do not in 2019 the wave of Layton will be too distant to even try to take advantage of.

NorthReport

Trudeau trips up again. Trudeau needs to learn it is not always about him. 

Queen responds to Trudeau’s toast in Malta: ‘Thank you, Mr. Prime Minister of Canada, for making me feel so old!’

http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/queen-responds-to-trudeaus-toas...

quizzical

he didn't write the speech or do any of the research. whoever did the speech should be fired.

Sean in Ottawa

quizzical wrote:

he didn't write the speech or do any of the research. whoever did the speech should be fired.

Interesting -- I did not take it that she was offended. I thought it was the Queen with a sense of humour. I thought she could have said that no matter what Trudeau said.

I am not sure but that was how I took it.

NorthReport

The Queen probably was not offended - she has more class than that.

 

mark_alfred

It was a very good toast from Justin Trudeau to the Queen, I felt.

Geoff

Who said, "Her Majesty's a pretty nice girl, but she doesn't have a lot to say"? I thought what she had to say was very clever. She probably appreciated the opportunity to get a few laughs from the audience.

Pondering

swallow wrote:

If Trudeau is rejecting binding targets, and the USA should be isolated in rejecting binding targets, does this mean you are in actual disagreement with a Trudeau policy? 

Yes, I am in disagreement on several policies. I am against CETA and TPP and C-51. I also have a problem with P3s. There may be some individual situations in which it benefits us but I've never heard of one. I have no doubt that I am in disagreement with many more policies

Whether or not the NDP wants binding targets doesn't matter to me. We cannot allow expotential development of the oil sands. I acknowledge that realistically we aren't going to shut them down but at the very least they can't exceed the pace they are now extracting at.

Energy East is an environmental no go not only because it would increase production in the oil sands but also because it's path threatens too many important water sources that our major cities depend on and it uses old pipes that are not financially feasible to replace.I haven't heard anything about the life-span of the pipes nor who will pay to remove the pipes when they are no longer required.

The federal government needs to come up with a plan in concert with the province to transform its economy.

There is a company, I think in Ontario, that is paying people to let them put solar panels on the roof of their home. The electric company buys the excess which the company shares with the homeowners.

If it is possible for a private company to be making money that way then it is Hydro who should be installing the solar panels and reaping the profits.

It is the job of our government to see as far as they can into the future and plan for whatever is coming. It should be acknowledged that plans that happen over decades are tentative but we know that sooner or later Alberta will have to transition. We should be planning for that as well as the climate change fallout that cannot be avoided even if we stopped burning fuel overnight. We need to put in some plans for farmers who will have to switch to other crops. It is extending our growing belt so we should be looking at areas that are likely to become arable to see where agriculture might expand so we can set aside future farmland.

Basically I think our governments, provincial and federal, are failing to look out for our long-term well-being and they are the only entities we have to perform that function.

quizzical

Sean in Ottawa wrote:
quizzical wrote:
he didn't write the speech or do any of the research. whoever did the speech should be fired.

Interesting -- I did not take it that she was offended. I thought it was the Queen with a sense of humour. I thought she could have said that no matter what Trudeau said.

I am not sure but that was how I took it.

i don't give a shit if he offended "the queen".

he didn't speak on behalf of Canadians and our future. he spoke about himself, his dad and blah blah blah. he didn't even speak about the Commonwealth countries.

Pondering

quizzical wrote:

i don't give a shit if he offended "the queen".

he didn't speak on behalf of Canadians and our future. he spoke about himself, his dad and blah blah blah. he didn't even speak about the Commonwealth countries.

He was assigned the task of toasting the Queen.

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