China #2

ikosmos wrote:

Mop and Pail wrote:

Then there is the Arctic Ocean, where China has – so far – respected the fishing and continental shelf rights of the five coastal states. But if China rejects the application of the UN Convention on the Law of the Sea in Asia, can any country rely on it respecting those same promises in the Arctic?

bwa ha ha ha. What an example! Russia, for example, supports Canada in protecting what it views as an inland waterway, through Arctic waters. For Canada, it's the NorthWest Passage, for Russia it's the NorthEast Passage, although they call it something else.

Guess what stinking Empire opposes both? BZZZZ! Wrong! Not China. The USA. oh yeah.

Actually this is wrong. China and the US both agree on this.

For China it is hypocritical given how impossible it is to line up the principles between their nine-dash claim and their view that the Arctic is international.

I know that there are a lot of defenders of China here. I have at times been one of them.

However, increasingly China is taking an aggressive imperial view of the world. In  many respects the Chinese are following a US blueprint (which is the reason US complaints about China so often smell of hypocrisy). Both countries had an inward period, a sanctimonious vision and pursuit of their raw interests.

There is nothing right or left about this and the fact that China does this under a socialist banner is meaningless.

The approach to the world from China and the US are full of distinctions without differences.

I recognize that the US remains the more powerful in terms of military and so in this particular cold-war vision China is the underdog. But rather than deliver all sympathy to that underdog, perhaps it is worth considering all the small nations bullied by any empire in history as more deserving.

It is important to see the conflict between the China and its neighbours in the context of US imperialism, but it is not necessary to view China as innocent in terms of its behaviour towards its neighbours. This is one of those many international issues where binary responses are most unhelpful. It is after all not that unusual that one bully bullies another and that both bully everyone else.

NorthReport wrote:

China appears to be setting itself up for trouble of its own making The Chinese just showed up one day off the Philippine Coast and told the Filipinos that they could not fish in their own coastal waters and they have physically enforced that edict The Philippines have just won a court ruling that the Chinese were wrong but the Chinese are now thumbing their nose at that decision Many other countries in the area are feeling bullied by China as well Also you have the North Korean situation so it's no wonder Japan wants to have a military The USA is moving 60% of their Navy into the Pacific and rebuilding bases in Asia, but realistically what alternative does the USA have?

Of course the question is in the present. The US certainly had other alternatives before getting to the point that became the world's self-appointed ruler.

An argument can be made that the US has no business in the area even though the Chinese are wrong. It is not a contradiction to say both empires are wrong and one's reaction to the other is not helpful in the long term.

If I say that the US should not be controlling the area or sailing through it aggressively with armed vessels, that does not mean that I endorse or agree with China's position.

In fact, the US not being there in the way it is certainly removes some of the justification for China's aggression. This is an armed posturing between two big powers after all.

We have a loaded situation and I agree the US cannot just vanish without creating instability. This aggressive posture has to be taken back bit by bit over time with pressure that the otherside do the same. China is a player in the world economy and is not immune to pressure -- there are things it wants. It is not at all clear to me that one kind of force must be presented with the identical kind. The idea that China is overstepping is contradicted in many respects when a country as far as the US is competing in the area.

Again, I see no need to take sides between imperial forces.

The Coming War on China...(and vid)

https://www.rt.com/shows/going-underground/369108-john-pilger-china-film/

"We speak to award winning journalist and film-maker John Pilger about his newest film, The Coming War on China."

Can Russia Stand By As Trump Goes After China?   -   by Rostislav Ishchenko

http://www.fortruss.com/2017/01/can-russia-stand-by-and-trump-goes-after...

"As long as China is on the list of the American administration's military priorities, even if Washington demonstrates friendliness towards Russia, there can be no talk of the US refraining from aggressive policies of global hegemony.

Instead, we are dealing with a transfer of the main blow from the Russian to the Chinese flank. This means we can feel temporary relief only deceptively. This does not reduce the common threat.

Moscow can in no way stand by and watch as Trump tries to destroy its strategic partner in Asia."

Prominent Chinese Economist Warns Country's Debt Becoming Problem

https://on.rt.com/8kqx

"Everyone knows there's a credit problem in China, but I find that people often forget about the scale. It's important in global terms,' Chu said in an interview with the Financial Times.

Chu, who made her name warning of the risks from China's credit binge, has predicted that by the end of the year, the country will accumulate $7.6 trillion worth of so-called 'bad' debt.

The comments came the day after the IMF warned that Chinese debt could be the reason for the next financial crisis as borrowing becomes more unsustainable."

Excellent!

The thoughts of Chairman Xi

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/idt-sh/Thoughts_Chairman_Xi

I also find it disturbing that there's no mention on babble of the largest political party in the world just had their congressional meetings!!!!

As well don't go to a western imperialist news outlet to learn about socialism!

http://www.scmp.com/chinas-leadership-reshuffle-2017

Xi's Road Map to the Chinese Dream   -   by Pepe Escobar

https://www.counterpunch.org/2017/10/25/xis-road-map-to-the-chinese-dream/

"All the milestones for China in the immediate future have been set..."

If we have established that only nationals of countries being spoken about have the authority to post anything of value, I think these threads may get less busy.

I think people of a country have a special perspective but I actually think those of other countries also have a valuable and interesting perspective. In a debate over certain types of facts the authority of a person who is from a place is recognizable, however, I don't think that Canadians here can agree that there is a single set of facts to rely on about Canada. I cannot assume that over a billion Chinese people would have the same opinion as the couple Chinese people who come here. Much of what is stated here are opinions rather than facts.

The best Canadian History teacher I ever had was an immigrant from Pakistan. Her understanding was in part because she looked at this country from a distance.

I do not want to diminish those who claim special knowledge and personal experience. However, I think it is not helpful to claim exclusive insight that trumps any other poster. A person with that special knowledge of a country ought to have data at their disposal that should win argument rather than have to claim some exclusive authority. We can get pro government lectures elsewhere -- here we should be able to debate.

This kind of discussion is not similar to experiences that you have to experience to have authority to speak (e.g. racism). International dialogue about countries will cease if each can only talk to a mirror about their own experience.

It is one thing to have a person of a national culture seek to be an authority of that culture's experience but it is another to suggest that observations of what is happening and the meaning of that can exclusively be the domain of those who live there.

I personally think the US is not very self aware when it comes to many of their issues. More controversially I think that is true of Canada as well. Even more controversially I suspect that is true of many countries and maybe even the Middle Kingdom.  中国

Speculation of other countries (with respect) is an important way to see insights into our own and I would hope that would be encouraged here. Nobody attacked a Chinese poster here saying they did not know what they were talking about. Nobody would dispute that a Chinese poster with intimate knowlege has special value. But to have a person suggest that their Chinese background  makes their personal opinion the only one valuable is disturbing. I think the above posts have reached that point.