Please give it a break
The nonsense that has been spewed out here denying the Russia / Trump connection is total mind-boggling rubbish and Fake News at its best
https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/16/politics/mueller-indictments-special-counsel/index.html
KremlinGate
Sat, 2018-02-17 02:00
#852
Sat, 2018-02-17 03:33
#853
Sat, 2018-02-17 03:35
#854
Sat, 2018-02-17 10:03
#855
Indictment of Russian Nationals Used To Campaign For Censorship and War
http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2018/02/17/russ-f17.html
"...As Philip Alston, the UN special rapporteur on extreme poverty and human rights said after a visit to the US last year, 'There is no other developed country where so many voters are disenfranchised...and where ordinary voters ultimately have so little impact on political outcomes.'
The Democratic Party, in alliance with dominant factions of the military-intelligence apparatus, has focused its opposition to the Trump administration not on its reactionary domestic policy or war-mongering, but on its supposed collusion with Russia.
The indictment alleges that Russian agents aimed to 'support Bernie Sanders,' and encourage Americans to 'vote for a third-party US Presidential candidate."
US Justice Dept Indicts 13 Russians Over Alleged 'Meddling'
"13 against the billion-dollar budgets of the intelligence Agencies? Absurd? Yes..."
Sat, 2018-02-17 10:46
#856
US Indicts 13 Russians For 2016 Election Meddling, But 'No Allegations' They Influenced Outcome
13 Russians Indictment Reveals Odd 'Meddling' Efforts
'Absurd' Meddling Claims & Indictment of Russians Show New US Policy - Russian FM Spokesperson
"The entities and individuals were indicted by a US Federal grand jury on Friday of 'supporting the presidential campaign of then-candidate Donald J Trump...and disparaging Hillary Clinton.' However, there are 'no allegations' that the suspected activities of the Russian nationals somehow affected the polls, according to US Deputy AG Rod Rosenstein.
On Friday, Russian FM Sergey Lavrov said that supporting Donald Trump has never been an official Russian policy, even if some Russians did expres their backing of the new US leader. The Minister has expressed his discontent with the apparently continuing nosedive in US-Russia relations. 'It's a pity that under Donald Trump, for more than a year of his presidency, our relations have not improved compared to the period of the Democratic administration. Even worsened to a certain extent,' Lavrov told Euronews."
#13 Russians: Underwhelmed Netizens React To US Indictment Over Election Meddling
"The overdramatisation of Russian interference in this election cannot be overstated..."
LOL. First it was no interference. Now it’s, well they interfered but it had no effect (which is an unknown),
Sat, 2018-02-17 11:47
#857
NR You can post 1000 of these articles. But if the russians warped my mind to believe that I want world peace, deal with the gross wealth inequality, and I want homeless to be housed. You want to know what, give more of that of russian kool-aid, I am parched here:).
Thing is, you have to ask why they are talking up these causes.
I'm not making a direct comparison here (really, I am not) but there are some who still remember Hitler's contribution to the cause of Indian independence, even though it was primarily an anti-British foil.
Every global power plays this game - Russia, the U.S., everyone. They promote social justice in one country while at the same time backing fascists and anti-immigrant sentiment in another country. The main purpose of course is destabilization.
In the Mueller indictment it was revealed the same trolls were backing two competing rallies in the same city at the same time. Go figure.
Sat, 2018-02-17 11:37
#858
After the election.
Sat, 2018-02-17 11:48
#859
Sure. It's not over.
Sat, 2018-02-17 12:56
#860
NR You can post 1000 of these articles. But if the russians warped my mind to believe that I want world peace, deal with the gross wealth inequality, and I want homeless to be housed. You want to know what, give more of that of russian kool-aid, I am parched here:).
Thing is, you have to ask why they are talking up these causes.
I'm not making a direct comparison here (really, I am not) but there are some who still remember Hitler's contribution to the cause of Indian independence, even though it was primarily an anti-British foil.
Every global power plays this game - Russia, the U.S., everyone. They promote social justice in one country while at the same time backing fascists and anti-immigrant sentiment in another country. The main purpose of course is destabilization.
In the Mueller indictment it was revealed the same trolls were backing two competing rallies in the same city at the same time. Go figure.
I take your point. But somehow to think that Russia was responsible for "chaos" it is rather simple answer to something that would take a small book to answer. 1. If look into numbers I think heard it minimal investment of to accomplish something so grand. Honestly I the big corps spend more money on advertising to change a 2% marketshare on toilet paper brand your using. 2.And more importantly, this did not start with nothing. We have fundamental problems that tri our society. If the media did its job we have had a situation what ever influence Russia had on the election would be pointless because the media would be talking about homeless, war, inequality,etc.
Sat, 2018-02-17 16:10
#861
Not solely, but there are enough examples of them exploiting an already tense situation, for example the false story about assaults by immigrants in Berlin.
And this:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/16/us/russian-bots-florida-shooting-intl/ind...
The point is the motive is not social justice, because those same agents turn around and push the opposite message at the same time.
Sat, 2018-02-17 16:22
#862
Trump and the Russians deserve one another. They’re both lying scum.
Sat, 2018-02-17 17:37
#863
Not solely, but there are enough examples of them exploiting an already tense situation, for example the false story about assaults by immigrants in Berlin.
And this:
https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/16/us/russian-bots-florida-shooting-intl/ind...
The point is the motive is not social justice, because those same agents turn around and push the opposite message at the same time.
I think we a disagreement here I think that strikes at the heart of what society we want to live in. I think that people should be able listen to all points of thought involved in politics and decide what is fake news or not. And critically make up their own minds as to what actions to take. This also governed by a constitution and courts that will enforce limits on said actions from those exposed to "fake news" as people put it. I want the maximum allowed within the constitution.
As to fall out from fake news I believe we a society that flexible and strong can take the BS.
As well I remember a time American officials would go around tell the world follow our example we have open society it is our strength. Now allegedly the Russians spend what 10 million on propaganda effort they change the political dynamics of US society. This just shows how weak and divided the Americans are, that this riles up Washington is amazing. I hope when the Russians come to Canada we can address the weak of points of our society rather like the US bury them.
Sat, 2018-02-17 17:52
#864
Maybe we disagree, and maybe we don't.
I didn't say anything about not being able to listen to different voices, even crap media. But a lot of this gets into election law and media standards. And ultimately I am concerned about transparency.
We want to know who owns and influences our big media? Well we should also be aware of who is doing what with other media and for what reason. Or infiltrating and subverting a demonstration. And if someone is broadcasting something it should be held to verifiable standards. They are a lot more lax in the U.S., but RT and PressTV have been sanctioned by advertising and broadcast regulators in the UK for this very reason.
Or a string of cases in Germany where false reports on social media of attacks by immigrants made their way into the regular press (even though Bild is about on par with the Daily Mail).
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/16/world/europe/bild-fake-story.html
Sat, 2018-02-17 18:53
#865
I would love that you bring up transparency and the media. Six major corps control what 90 what the population hears in the US. Here something from business insider not a radical sheet.
http://www.businessinsider.com/these-6-corporations-control-90-of-the-me...
And that is 2012.
----------------------------------------
http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-yemen-us-arms-2017-story.html
Thats the context above.
I was watching a very powerful American news network, their Yemen reporter spent 3 minutes on the food crisis and general destruction of the country. Then the reporter was asked what was the US doing about this, the response was that US was providing humanitarian aid to yemen. That was it. It took me 30 seconds find the hyperlink above. And this news organization has thousands of employees so I think that they are aware that the is US selling weapons to Saudi Arabia then they drop on the Yemen population. But little troubling though was not mentioned in the interview. So I want transparency all day long maybe I could ask the yemen interview and why this happens and fact of 2012 of the media controlled by six corporations to extent of 90%.
Sun, 2018-02-18 03:30
#866
I hope this works technically.
This is the strawberry arrangement on the ice cream cake of reality I had been building up in my past posts.
Truly a masterpiece. I encourage you to watch the whole 5:30 for fun. But punch line starts at 4:35.
Sun, 2018-02-18 03:50
#867
Here we go again quoting Fox News the King of Fake News
—————
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2018/02/muellers-message-to-america/553658/
Sun, 2018-02-18 03:54
#868
Sun, 2018-02-18 03:55
#869
dp
Sun, 2018-02-18 03:58
#870
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:02
#871
NR
This is a series piece of reporting. Then no need to bury it in your endless stream of articles post that basically say the same thing. Let the people watch and decide. Your doing a disservice to rabble posters and readers.
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:01
#872
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:01
#873
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:05
#874
Fake News and their supporters have been in overdrive
https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/02/devin-nunes-california-republican-fake-news-site
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:07
#875
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:15
#876
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:16
#877
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:17
#878
NR I will assume best of you. But in your search for the truth you are destroying the said truth. There is no need for endless spamming your not making any contributions to the truth your in effect censorings the truth.
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:30
#879
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:31
#880
Sun, 2018-02-18 04:34
#881
Sun, 2018-02-18 05:26
#882
A co-worker awhile back told me she had a second job working as a writer for the National Inquirer I asked her what she wrote about and she replied that she was instructed to write about whatever came to mind for her as long as it was sexual in nature. In other words her column had zero amount of truth in it. It was pure fantasy. Her comments remind me of a few people who constantly post messages here of support for Trump and/or the Kremlin concerning the US election but post under the guise of attempted credibility by quoting organizations such as Fox News and other such Fake News organizations. How sad!
Sun, 2018-02-18 05:44
#883
NR
This is a series piece of reporting. Then no need to bury it in your endless stream of articles post that basically say the same thing. Let the people watch and decide. Your doing a disservice to rabble posters and readers.
I think NR's articles are much more reputable than the vacuous Fox News video you posted. Laura Ingraham is a right-wing pro-Republican pundit, not a journalist.
Sun, 2018-02-18 09:21
#884
The Former Director of CIA admitting that the US the is meddling in elections of other countries in recent times is vacuous. Is not relevant to the issue at hand. No transcript yet.
Sun, 2018-02-18 11:25
#885
The Former Director of CIA admitting that the US the is meddling in elections of other countries in recent times is vacuous. Is not relevant to the issue at hand. No transcript yet.
I don't think anyone who has been paying attention doubts that the U.S. has been the world's worst offender when it comes to interfering in other countries' elections. Similarly, they are also the masters of using more direct means, such as bribery, covert ops, assassinatons, and military coups to engineer their desired regime changes.
That was never at issue. The question is whether the Russians have managed to give the Americans a good taste of their own medicine. In my opinion, the answer is clearly yes. I am more amused than outraged by this fact, but it does appear to be a fact.
Sun, 2018-02-18 11:51
#886
Fox and RT once again working in tandem.
https://mobile.twitter.com/jaketapper/status/965236882505388032
Sun, 2018-02-18 12:32
#887
Well said.
The Former Director of CIA admitting that the US the is meddling in elections of other countries in recent times is vacuous. Is not relevant to the issue at hand. No transcript yet.
I don't think anyone who has been paying attention doubts that the U.S. has been the world's worst offender when it comes to interfering in other countries' elections. Similarly, they are also the masters of using more direct means, such as bribery, covert ops, assassinatons, and military coups to engineer their desired regime changes.
That was never at issue. The question is whether the Russians have managed to give the Americans a good taste of their own medicine. In my opinion, the answer is clearly yes. I am more amused than outraged by this fact, but it does appear to be a fact.
Sun, 2018-02-18 12:33
#888
Insane Anti-Trumpists Call For Even More Escalations Against A Nuclear Superpower
https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/insane-anti-trumpists-call-for-even-m...
"Do you see what is happening here? There is never, ever going to be any proof of Trump-Russia collusion, because that has never been what this is about. We've talked about this before: America's unelected power establishment doesn't care about impeaching Trump, it cares about hobbling Russia in order to prevent the rise of a potential rival superpower in its ally China. All this lunacy makes perfect sense when you realize this.
We are already at an extremely dangerous point in the ongoing trend of continous escalations with a country that is armed with thousands of nuclear warheads. And these deranged lunatics want more..."
Mueller Indictment - The 'Russian Influence' Is A Commercial Marketing Scheme
"...The panic of the US establishment over the loss of their preferred candidate created an artificial storm over 'Russian influence' and assumed 'collusion' with the Trump campaign. (Certain Democrats though, like Adam Schiff, profit from creating a new Cold War through their sponsoring armament companies.) The Mueller investigation found no 'collusion' between anything Russian and the Trump campaign. The indictment does not mention any. The whole 'Russian influence' storm is based on a misunderstanding of commercial activities of a Russian marketing company in US social networks..."
Sun, 2018-02-18 12:56
#889
Those must come straight from the Internet Research Agency.
The indictment did not say there was no Russian-Trump collusion. That was not the subject of the indictment as Mueller continues his investigation. By the increasing hysteria of Trump, the Russians and their allies, he must be getting closer.
Sun, 2018-02-18 13:07
#890
That was never at issue. The question is whether the Russians have managed to give the Americans a good taste of their own medicine. In my opinion, the answer is clearly yes. I am more amused than outraged by this fact, but it does appear to be a fact.
No surprise; they are good at it, and they always have been. They have had to be, not having the same military might as some of their opponents. If they didn't invent it (that prize might go to the French Republicans) they certainly started one of the oldest running ones with the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.
Plus they have had the advantage of being able to piggyback on more progressive causes like disarmament and social justice, and until recently they have also been able to use causes that question authority.
With the rise of the modern conspiracist radical right (which they have also exploited) there is a wider pool of dupes to work with.
Plus people expect the western imperialists to do it, yet for some inexplicable reason just assume that other powers are acting in good faith.
Sun, 2018-02-18 13:07
#891
The Former Director of CIA admitting that the US the is meddling in elections of other countries in recent times is vacuous. Is not relevant to the issue at hand. No transcript yet.
I don't think anyone who has been paying attention doubts that the U.S. has been the world's worst offender when it comes to interfering in other countries' elections. Similarly, they are also the masters of using more direct means, such as bribery, covert ops, assassinatons, and military coups to engineer their desired regime changes.
That was never at issue. The question is whether the Russians have managed to give the Americans a good taste of their own medicine. In my opinion, the answer is clearly yes. I am more amused than outraged by this fact, but it does appear to be a fact.
I always suspected this, but never heard officer of us government go on tv even a former official go on tv admit it. But your post MM is an excellent summary of the issue at hand.
Sun, 2018-02-18 13:17
#892
That was never at issue. The question is whether the Russians have managed to give the Americans a good taste of their own medicine. In my opinion, the answer is clearly yes. I am more amused than outraged by this fact, but it does appear to be a fact.
No surprise; they are good at it, and they always have been. They have had to be, not having the same military might as some of their opponents. If they didn't invent it (that prize might go to the French Republicans) they certainly started one of the oldest running ones with the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.
Plus they have had the advantage of being able to piggyback on more progressive causes like disarmament and social justice, and until recently they have also been able to use causes that question authority.
With the rise of the modern conspiracist radical right (which they have also exploited) there is a wider pool of dupes to work with.
Plus people expect the western imperialists to do it, yet for some inexplicable reason just assume that other powers are acting in good faith.
The reason I engaged on this thread this threat a to left, the media was playing the connections to sanders and stein was that leftist, progressives, etc were a bunch fools voted as they did. If this happens in Canada the NDP will be a target as a third party.
Sun, 2018-02-18 13:20
#893
Insane Anti-Trumpists Call For Even More Escalations Against A Nuclear Superpower
https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/insane-anti-trumpists-call-for-even-m...
"Do you see what is happening here? There is never, ever going to be any proof of Trump-Russia collusion, because that has never been what this is about. We've talked about this before: America's unelected power establishment doesn't care about impeaching Trump, it cares about hobbling Russia in order to prevent the rise of a potential rival superpower in its ally China. All this lunacy makes perfect sense when you realize this.
We are already at an extremely dangerous point in the ongoing trend of continous escalations with a country that is armed with thousands of nuclear warheads. And these deranged lunatics want more..."
From the comments:
Sun, 2018-02-18 13:48
#894
"How many lies are there in the Guardian (Observer) editorial on Mueller indictment? We count them..."
https://twitter.com/OffGuardian0/status/965263732472451073
"Thirteen Russians doing viral marketing is not 'rigging', or 'collusion' or 'hacking'...This is the biggest fish available and it's not worth the bait."
Sun, 2018-02-18 17:20
#895
Agreed.
Those must come straight from the Internet Research Agency.
The indictment did not say there was no Russian-Trump collusion. That was not the subject of the indictment as Mueller continues his investigation. By the increasing hysteria of Trump, the Russians and their allies, he must be getting closer.
Sun, 2018-02-18 18:22
#896
Nuff said,
Trump attacks everyone except Russia
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/18/trump-twitter-mueller-fbi-russ...
Sun, 2018-02-18 18:56
#897
Doesn't look good Mr President!
Top Secret US/NATO intelligence shows the Kremlin was planning to back Trump 4 POTUS years before 2016.
Sun, 2018-02-18 18:59
#898
Trump gets caught in his own web of lies
http://observer.com/2018/02/kremlin-officials-began-planning-donald-trum...
Sun, 2018-02-18 19:03
#899
Sun, 2018-02-18 20:00
#900
Nuff said,
Trump attacks everyone except Russia
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/18/trump-twitter-mueller-fbi-russ...
"The Twitter broadsides attracted bipartisan pushback as Republicans and Democrats expressed frustration that Trump is not taking the Russian threat seriously."
[quote=NDPP]
This is the whole point of the exercise. It is the US threat that is the only real one of course, not Russia, but no surprise to see the usual msm-led chumps and cheerleaders, just as they did with Libya, Syria, Ukraine etc, taking up their usual role as 'progressive' shock troops for this dangerous American agenda of global domination and hegemony. As we have also seen, their Russophobia requires no real proof of any kind and is impervious to actual fact or reason.
Mon, 2018-02-19 11:47
#901
Trump, panicking, reveals the depths of his awfulness
https://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/right-turn/wp/2018/02/19/trump-pani...