The Very Real Possibility of President Elizabeth Warren

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melovesproles

Warren is a lot better on most issues than Clinton was but she does suck on foreign policy and that is usually a major red flag on how progressive a candidate really is.  

She's definitely more articulate than Sanders and she certainly is intelligent and has some great ideas about how to 'fix' things. I just can't believe the media narrative that another wonky 'smart' Liberal who is a real 'expert' is a better match-up to Trump than Sanders with his economic populism and his no bullshit consistency. The Democrats just don't understand their own country. But who knows maybe the US has suddenly shed its anti-intellectualism. Let's all forget Gore, Kerry and Clinton all won their debates..  It's bceoming obvious Liberals are allergic to class politics and Sanders scares them more than another Trump term.

Michael Moriarity Michael Moriarity's picture

melovesproles wrote:

Warren is a lot better on most issues than Clinton was but she does suck on foreign policy and that is usually a major red flag on how progressive a candidate really is.  

She's definitely more articulate than Sanders and she certainly is intelligent and has some great ideas about how to 'fix' things. I just can't believe the media narrative that another wonky 'smart' Liberal who is a real 'expert' is a better match-up to Trump than Sanders with his economic populism and his no bullshit consistency. The Democrats just don't understand their own country. But who knows maybe the US has suddenly shed its anti-intellectualism. Let's all forget Gore, Kerry and Clinton all won their debates..  It's bceoming obvious Liberals are allergic to class politics and Sanders scares them more than another Trump term.

Couldn't have said it better myself. The one quibble is that I think Sanders is plenty articulate, just more plain-spoken.

NorthReport

I like Sanders but I don't think he can defeat Trump.

Of course if Trump does get impeached, all bets are off, and it may give Biden's campaign a boost depending how it shakes out.

5 reasons why Elizabeth Warren has the best chance to beat Donald Trump

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/09/25/5-reasons-warren-best-chance-beat-trump-column/2419281001/

NDPP

Elizabeth Warren and the Military Industrial Complex

https://t.co/ETtsAb2D68

"Elizabeth Warren is a mixed bag when it comes to foreign policy..."

Aristotleded24

JKR wrote:

NorthReport wrote:

JKR

You are correct about that anti-Hillary, now anti-Warren, although I'm not sure it quite ever stopped.

Yeah, Anti-Hillaryism seems to still be going strong here on Babble even 3 years after Hillary’s lost election even though she won 3 million more votes than Trump.

I think Warren is likely going to win the Democratic nomination and that will likely lead to the ugliest presidential election in memory if Trump is still president for the election which unfortunately he probably will be.

I don't know if Warren is a shoe-in for the Democratic nomination, but I agree that she is a stronger candidate than Clinton. Clinton was very clearly establishment, and when she tried to present something different, she came off as fake, so it was clear that she was not a progressive. Warren, because of her history on the financial regulation file, is perceived by many to be far more progressive than she actually is, which may win over enough progressives to put her over the top.

Aristotleded24

Michael Moriarity wrote:

melovesproles wrote:

Warren is a lot better on most issues than Clinton was but she does suck on foreign policy and that is usually a major red flag on how progressive a candidate really is.  

She's definitely more articulate than Sanders and she certainly is intelligent and has some great ideas about how to 'fix' things. I just can't believe the media narrative that another wonky 'smart' Liberal who is a real 'expert' is a better match-up to Trump than Sanders with his economic populism and his no bullshit consistency. The Democrats just don't understand their own country. But who knows maybe the US has suddenly shed its anti-intellectualism. Let's all forget Gore, Kerry and Clinton all won their debates..  It's bceoming obvious Liberals are allergic to class politics and Sanders scares them more than another Trump term.

Couldn't have said it better myself. The one quibble is that I think Sanders is plenty articulate, just more plain-spoken.

I think even if he's not perfectly articulate that this gives him an aura of authenticity that people are craving in an era of phoniness. Nobody is perfect, and someone who is can easily give the impression that they are overly rehearsed and doing more of a sales job than actually representing anything real.

NorthReport

My hunch is that greed is the number one factor that is keeping the rich rich and the poor poor and Warren wants to help address that which seems very progressive to me

And Warren is running to be President of the USA not of babble 

melovesproles

I like Sanders but I don't think he can defeat Trump.

Of course if Trump does get impeached, all bets are off, and it may give Biden's campaign a boost depending how it shakes out.

5 reasons why Elizabeth Warren has the best chance to beat Donald Trump

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2019/09/25/5-reasons-warren-best-chance-beat-trump-column/2419281001/

I can see why you think that if you are uncritically reading articles like that.

From the article:

Warren not only inspires white working-class voters, she inspires people of all sorts, particularly young people

That is not actually what polls show at all. Warren's supporters skew wealthier, older and more educated.  Although the whiter part is certainly true. 

"Sanders supporters are 16% more likely to be under $50,000 voters."

"Warren supporter's are 16% more likely to be $100,000 + voters"

https://www.politico.com/2020-election/democratic-presidential-candidates/polls/

Sanders also stacks up better against Trump in polls than Warren does.  But media pundits tend not to care about under $50,000 voters or have much interaction with them so they ignore them.  Maybe the wealthy white Liberal voter base will somehow be large enough to beat the Republicans this time..

The one quibble is that I think Sanders is plenty articulate, just more plain-spoken.

I think even if he's not perfectly articulate that this gives him an aura of authenticity that people are craving in an era of phoniness. Nobody is perfect, and someone who is can easily give the impression that they are overly rehearsed and doing more of a sales job than actually representing anything real.

I do agree with both of you. I like the way Sanders speaks and I think it does play well with working class voters. I think if one was selecting a Debate Club leader, Warren would be the pick though. That seems to be what the chattering classes think wins elections.  

voice of the damned

 I think if one was selecting a Debate Club leader, Warren would be the pick though. That seems to be what the chattering classes think wins elections.  

Well, in fairness to the chattering classes, Obama basically ran as a debate-club intellectual, and managed to win back-to-back majorities in the popular vote, something no one had done since Ronald Reagan in the early 1980s. So I wouldn't neccessarily assume that a bookish personality is going to alienate voters.

melovesproles

Well, in fairness to the chattering classes, Obama basically ran as a debate-club intellectual, and managed to win back-to-back majorities in the popular vote, something no one had done since Ronald Reagan in the early 1980s. So I wouldn't neccessarily assume that a bookish personality is going to alienate voters.

Oh for sure. Obama was the time it worked but that is an informative example as well. He ran as a transofrmational candidate with an incredible grassroots organization, and then once in government ditched OFA in favour of corpratism. Obama is one of the reasons why so many activists are skeptical of Warren.    

Warren like Obama wants people to trust the technocrats to fix the leaks that are springing up in the Capitalist ship whereas Sanders is promising to work with movements and unions to build a new boat. Trump is making gut level economic arguments which are racist and deceitful but have been effective because Democrats have ceded the economic populist ground and championed neoliberal projects like TPP. Warren seems to have a better understanding of this than Clinton and Obama but the most enthusiasm for her is from the professional class whereas Sanders has broader working class support. What support do you think would be more important in a general vs Trump?

And yeah the Democrats will most likely win the popular vote regardless of who they have as leader but that hardly matters anymore in US elections. It has the same relationship to winning as shots on goal in a hockey game.

NDPP

'Reasons NOT To Vote For Warren'

https://twitter.com/anh8705/status/1176896300463415297

"Okay, Tweeters. Let's start a thread. What are tangible reasons (not based on good or bad feelings alone) NOT to vote for Elizabeth Warren? You don't have to convince me, I already know I'm not supporting her. This is for the lurkers..."

NorthReport

Wall Street Democratic donors warn the party: We’ll sit out, or back Trump, if you nominate Elizabeth Warren

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/26/wall-street-democratic-donors-may-back-trump-if-warren-is-nominated.html

NorthReport

Warren gets ‘dramatic shift’ in support from black voters

After struggling to win over African Americans in the early stages of the primary season, polls show the Massachusetts senator is gaining traction with a pivotal constituency.

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/10/02/elizabeth-warren-black-voters-support-2020-016649

NDPP

"Elizabeth Warren signed a 2016 Senate letter asking Barack Obama to veto any UN resolution that condemned Israel's illegal settlement enterprise. Not sure if they organized the letter, but it's featured on AIPAC's website. (Obama abstained).

https://twitter.com/ZaidJilani/status/1179020242967760901

 

Elizabeth Warren: The Surprising Israel Hawk on Hillary Clinton's Shortlist

https://t.co/YDpK4aTXoG

"You'll never guess who's the Israel hawk on Hillary Clinton's US presidential shortlist...?"

NDPP

The White Supremacy of Elizabeth Warren

https://twitter.com/MikePrysner/status/1178352289523761152

"Criticizing Warren for lying about being Cherokee for personal gain is not a rightwing talking point. It's a Cherokee talking point. They've investigated & exposed her since 2012 (and were also called 'rightwing' by Warren's campaign when they tried to meet."

josh

NDPP wrote:

The White Supremacy of Elizabeth Warren

https://twitter.com/MikePrysner/status/1178352289523761152

"Criticizing Warren for lying about being Cherokee for personal gain is not a rightwing talking point. It's a Cherokee talking point. They've investigated & exposed her since 2012 (and were also called 'rightwing' by Warren's campaign when they tried to meet."

She didn't lie.  She may have exploited it, and if you think that's a big deal in the overall scheme of things, so be it. 

NorthReport

The reality is the financial backers of the Democrats have ruled Warren out. I’m sure it’s the same for Sanders. Trump knows this and it is his reason for trying to damage Biden the probable Democratic candidate

Debater

Well one thing is for sure, Sanders is done.

It was unreasonable for him to run again.  He deserves credit for pushing the Democratic Party to the left and championing the issue of health care.

But after having a heart attack at age 78, the Democratic Primary voters will realize they need someone else to be the nominee.

Aristotleded24

Debater wrote:
Well one thing is for sure, Sanders is done.

It was unreasonable for him to run again.  He deserves credit for pushing the Democratic Party to the left and championing the issue of health care.

But after having a heart attack at age 78, the Democratic Primary voters will realize they need someone else to be the nominee.

Sanders did not have a heart attack. He had an operation to repair blocked arteries, and by all accounts will be back in the game in the next few days.

As for pushing the party left? Of course everyone else will pretend that they are left-wing in order to get the votes of the Democratic base. Unfortunately for Warren, when she loses to Trump, that will be taken by the Democratic Establishment as proof that going too far to the left is a losing strategy, and that will kill the chance of progressive government in the US for a long time.

Sean in Ottawa

Absolutely terrifying.

The democrats greatest nightmare is impeachment.

Impeachment offers the Tea Party (AKA the GOP) a chance to personalize their problems in Trump, get a new face and come back to keep up the war on the poor. the Tea Party (AKA the GOP) must be forced to wear Trump and what he (and they) stand for in an election. Having the damage of Trump followed by a new leader who does not have responsibility for Trump, means that Warren could be President for a month and then lose to a new member of the Tea Party.

Nobody should wish for this.

Yes, it is possible that the GOP could protect Trump in the Senate and the Democrats could out them for that and defeat them to take control of the chamber, but the risk is real that by the time Impeachment proceedings gets there the GOP will dump Trump and run a new face to win.

People have to stop personalizing the horror the Tea Party in Trump and recognize what this really is. He is an incompetent figurehead but what he stands for is the Tea Party and all that represents. Lose sight of that fact and we get the Tea Party ruling the most powerful country on earth for 8 more years. The loss of US power and prestige by the end of that will not be worth the damage to the entire world.

Sean in Ottawa

Debater wrote:

Well one thing is for sure, Sanders is done.

It was unreasonable for him to run again.  He deserves credit for pushing the Democratic Party to the left and championing the issue of health care.

But after having a heart attack at age 78, the Democratic Primary voters will realize they need someone else to be the nominee.

It is possible that more than Sanders is done.

He had a routine operation among people of his generation. If he is done so, possibly, are all other candidates who are seniors.

In fairness women's health decline tends to be 5 years behind men so it may not affect the women as much. But it could take out Biden and Trump as well.

 

Aristotleded24

Why Sanders is better than Warren:

Warren voted for Ben Carson to be head of HUD

Sanders wants to completely eliminate medical debt, Warren does not

Sanders wants to eliminate all student loan debt, Warren does not

Warren voted for Trump's military budget (which was bigger than Trump was asking for)

Warren has raised funds from the Military Industrial Complex

Warren has waffled on Medicare for All

Warren will take big money in the general election, after speaking out against big money in politics

Warren endorsed Clinton over Sanders in 2016, even though the policy positions she espoused were closer to what Sanders was advocating

Sanders will take on Democrats who oppose his agenda, Warren will not

Debater

It was confirmed this afternoon that Sanders DID have a heart attack.

His own campaign confirmed it -- here's the New York Times article:

--

Bernie Sanders Had Heart Attack, His Doctors Say, as He Leaves Hospital

Senator Bernie Sanders had a heart attack this week, his presidential campaign said on Friday as he left a Las Vegas hospital, following three days of near silence from the candidate and his advisers about his health.

Mr. Sanders, 78, had entered the hospital on Tuesday night after experiencing chest pain at a campaign event, and doctors had inserted two stents in a blocked artery, a relatively common procedure. But the campaign did not confirm that Mr. Sanders had had a heart attack until Friday, inviting questions about his condition, and his campaign’s transparency, as he remained off the campaign trail this week.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/04/us/politics/bernie-sanders-hospital.html

josh

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Debater wrote:
Well one thing is for sure, Sanders is done.

It was unreasonable for him to run again.  He deserves credit for pushing the Democratic Party to the left and championing the issue of health care.

But after having a heart attack at age 78, the Democratic Primary voters will realize they need someone else to be the nominee.

Sanders did not have a heart attack. He had an operation to repair blocked arteries, and by all accounts will be back in the game in the next few days.

As for pushing the party left? Of course everyone else will pretend that they are left-wing in order to get the votes of the Democratic base. Unfortunately for Warren, when she loses to Trump, that will be taken by the Democratic Establishment as proof that going too far to the left is a losing strategy, and that will kill the chance of progressive government in the US for a long time.

You cannot let Trump get away with the things he’s done without consequence.  The precedent that would set would lead to future presidents not only believing that they were above the law, but that they are the law itself.  The U.S. Constitution did not create the Divine Right of Kings.

NorthReport
Debater

josh wrote:

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Debater wrote:
Well one thing is for sure, Sanders is done.

It was unreasonable for him to run again.  He deserves credit for pushing the Democratic Party to the left and championing the issue of health care.

But after having a heart attack at age 78, the Democratic Primary voters will realize they need someone else to be the nominee.

Sanders did not have a heart attack. He had an operation to repair blocked arteries, and by all accounts will be back in the game in the next few days.

As for pushing the party left? Of course everyone else will pretend that they are left-wing in order to get the votes of the Democratic base. Unfortunately for Warren, when she loses to Trump, that will be taken by the Democratic Establishment as proof that going too far to the left is a losing strategy, and that will kill the chance of progressive government in the US for a long time.

You cannot let Trump get away with the things he’s done without consequence.  The precedent that would set would lead to future presidents not only believing that they were above the law, but that they are the law itself.  The U.S. Constitution did not create the Divine Right of Kings.

Agreed.

The Democrats are doing the right thing by beginning an impeachment inquiry.  And it's not something they rushed into.  They waited until more evidence of Trump's corruption and foreign interference in the election came to light with the Ukraine President's phone call with Trump.

Pelosi has many years of experience, and she resisted premature calls from "The Squad" to rush into impeaching Trump and used her wisdom of her years in Washington until Trump implicated himself over this past month.

Sean in Ottawa

Debater wrote:

josh wrote:

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Debater wrote:
Well one thing is for sure, Sanders is done.

It was unreasonable for him to run again.  He deserves credit for pushing the Democratic Party to the left and championing the issue of health care.

But after having a heart attack at age 78, the Democratic Primary voters will realize they need someone else to be the nominee.

Sanders did not have a heart attack. He had an operation to repair blocked arteries, and by all accounts will be back in the game in the next few days.

As for pushing the party left? Of course everyone else will pretend that they are left-wing in order to get the votes of the Democratic base. Unfortunately for Warren, when she loses to Trump, that will be taken by the Democratic Establishment as proof that going too far to the left is a losing strategy, and that will kill the chance of progressive government in the US for a long time.

You cannot let Trump get away with the things he’s done without consequence.  The precedent that would set would lead to future presidents not only believing that they were above the law, but that they are the law itself.  The U.S. Constitution did not create the Divine Right of Kings.

Agreed.

The Democrats are doing the right thing by beginning an impeachment inquiry.  And it's not something they rushed into.  They waited until more evidence of Trump's corruption and foreign interference in the election came to light with the Ukraine President's phone call with Trump.

Pelosi has many years of experience, and she resisted premature calls from "The Squad" to rush into impeaching Trump and used her wisdom of her years in Washington until Trump implicated himself over this past month.

They are still falling into the trap of personalizing the Tea Party to Trump allowing them to choose another candidate and win. Not saying they have a lot of choices but it is a trap nonetheless.

cco

"With Trump at the top of the ticket, Democrats are sure to win. Look how unpopular he is." is the trap Democrats fell into in 2016. The idea that any other Republican would be more popular is, as far as I can tell, unsupported. Trump's brought in his own base, and I'm not sure how many of them would rally to the Bush coalition that Pence represents.

Sean in Ottawa

cco wrote:
"With Trump at the top of the ticket, Democrats are sure to win. Look how unpopular he is." is the trap Democrats fell into in 2016. The idea that any other Republican would be more popular is, as far as I can tell, unsupported. Trump's brought in his own base, and I'm not sure how many of them would rally to the Bush coalition that Pence represents.

Trump has run his course and is now a liability. Blaming him for the problems of the Trump presidency is vital for the Tea Party to continue on without a break. Watch them do it if the Democrats do not start fighting the Tea Party instead of just Trump.

Pence does not represent the Bush coalition. He represents the Tea Party that pushed Bush out and went to Trump.

 

NorthReport

So how are you doing Paul Ryan?

Debater

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

cco wrote:
"With Trump at the top of the ticket, Democrats are sure to win. Look how unpopular he is." is the trap Democrats fell into in 2016. The idea that any other Republican would be more popular is, as far as I can tell, unsupported. Trump's brought in his own base, and I'm not sure how many of them would rally to the Bush coalition that Pence represents.

Trump has run his course and is now a liability. Blaming him for the problems of the Trump presidency is vital for the Tea Party to continue on without a break. Watch them do it if the Democrats do not start fighting the Tea Party instead of just Trump.

Pence does not represent the Bush coalition. He represents the Tea Party that pushed Bush out and went to Trump.

 

They can't get rid of Trump -- they're stuck with him.  The GOP base (aka "the deplorables") worship Trump like a God, buy his MAGA hats and go to his rallies.  They will lash out at the GOP if they try to replace Trump with another candidate.

And I don't see Paul Ryan running in 2020 after he just left Congress last year and after the fight he's had with Trump this Fall over the publication of critical comments about Trump in his new book.

NorthReport

Unless there is some kind of significant change things appear to be getting better and better for Elizabeth Warren. Sander’s heart attack and Biden’s lack of significant response to Trump’s attacks, will push her into front runner status. If big money blocks her candidacy progressive voters could do serious damage to the Democrat’s election campaign. Who is in 4th place?

Sean in Ottawa

Debater wrote:

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

cco wrote:
"With Trump at the top of the ticket, Democrats are sure to win. Look how unpopular he is." is the trap Democrats fell into in 2016. The idea that any other Republican would be more popular is, as far as I can tell, unsupported. Trump's brought in his own base, and I'm not sure how many of them would rally to the Bush coalition that Pence represents.

Trump has run his course and is now a liability. Blaming him for the problems of the Trump presidency is vital for the Tea Party to continue on without a break. Watch them do it if the Democrats do not start fighting the Tea Party instead of just Trump.

Pence does not represent the Bush coalition. He represents the Tea Party that pushed Bush out and went to Trump.

 

They can't get rid of Trump -- they're stuck with him.  The GOP base (aka "the deplorables") worship Trump like a God, buy his MAGA hats and go to his rallies.  They will lash out at the GOP if they try to replace Trump with another candidate.

And I don't see Paul Ryan running in 2020 after he just left Congress last year and after the fight he's had with Trump this Fall over the publication of critical comments about Trump in his new book.

This is not the way things are. Memories are short. Propaganda is high. Even with Trump the GOP is not far behind. A new person can close the gap. The US is polarized and the group making the decision in the middle is very small. The Dems must be careful not to ascribe the problem just to Trump or they will face a replacement just as bad who can win.

NDPP

"One of my favorite Bernie Sanders anti-endorsements is from Haim Saban, a guy who openly admits to using money to buy political influence and has donated to Elizabeth Warren..."

https://twitter.com/trekkerteach12/status/1179812234186244096

Zio billionaire and pro-Israel lobbyist.

NorthReport
cco

Sean in Ottawa wrote:

Pence does not represent the Bush coalition. He represents the Tea Party that pushed Bush out and went to Trump.

His Christian Dominionism is vintage Bush (W., not Jeb).

Sean in Ottawa

cco wrote:
Sean in Ottawa wrote:

Pence does not represent the Bush coalition. He represents the Tea Party that pushed Bush out and went to Trump.

His Christian Dominionism is vintage Bush (W., not Jeb).

His apporach is more extreme and Bush was already pandering to Tea Party as it was beginning. This is what Tea Party led to -- not just one man.

NorthReport

But regardless of the Trump insanity, this election is not a shoe-in for the Democrats

 

What’s Behind Warren’s Rise In The Polls?

Four possible explanations for her upward trajectory.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/whats-behind-warrens-rise-in-the-polls/

NorthReport
NDPP

'Here's Elizabeth Warren's Foreign Policy'

https://twitter.com/shawna_burley/status/1181899521976086528

"George HW Bush was an American patriot who lived his life and served our country with dignity. From joining the Navy during WWII to the presidency, his devotion to public service was unmatched. Bruce and I send our heartfelt condolences to his family."

Sure sounds 'Presidential' to me...

bekayne

NDPP wrote:

'Here's Elizabeth Warren's Foreign Policy'

https://twitter.com/shawna_burley/status/1181899521976086528

"George HW Bush was an American patriot who lived his life and served our country with dignity. From joining the Navy during WWII to the presidency, his devotion to public service was unmatched. Bruce and I send our heartfelt condolences to his family."

Sure sounds 'Presidential' to me...

So she should piss in his casket?

NDPP

Read Elizabeth Warren's Defense of Corporations...

https://t.co/A5oc9zeIXc

Appearance by Elizabeth Warren at a conservative Manhattan think-tank event at the NYC Harvard Club, March 18, 1999.

NorthReport
Aristotleded24

josh wrote:

Aristotleded24 wrote:

Debater wrote:
Well one thing is for sure, Sanders is done.

It was unreasonable for him to run again.  He deserves credit for pushing the Democratic Party to the left and championing the issue of health care.

But after having a heart attack at age 78, the Democratic Primary voters will realize they need someone else to be the nominee.

Sanders did not have a heart attack. He had an operation to repair blocked arteries, and by all accounts will be back in the game in the next few days.

As for pushing the party left? Of course everyone else will pretend that they are left-wing in order to get the votes of the Democratic base. Unfortunately for Warren, when she loses to Trump, that will be taken by the Democratic Establishment as proof that going too far to the left is a losing strategy, and that will kill the chance of progressive government in the US for a long time.

You cannot let Trump get away with the things he’s done without consequence.  The precedent that would set would lead to future presidents not only believing that they were above the law, but that they are the law itself.  The U.S. Constitution did not create the Divine Right of Kings.

That's the same kind of Trump Derangement Syndrome that is too common on the left. The fact is, US Presidents have been pushing the boundaries of the law for decades, and nobody has done anything. Obama himself is in large part at fault because he didn't prosecute the crimes of the former Bush Administration. The problem with too many on the left is that they are so blinded by hatred of Trump that they cannot try and see things objectively. Why else were there screams to impeach Trump before he was even innagurated? As for the reason given for impeachment? Impeaching him for what he did to Biden is one of the worst possible reasons for going after him. As unorthodox as Trump's methods were, there is a grain of truth to the idea that Biden and his family benefitted from deals in Ukraine, and Biden is already unpopular. Average Americans are not going to take the time to read through all the details of what is going on. Maybe they should, but they won't. Also, with the Republicans in control of the Senate, what do you think the chances are that Trump will be removed by the 2/3 majority vote that is required for such a thing? The last President to face a trial in the Senate was Bill Clinton, and his popularity went up after that. Speaking of Trump, while he is unpopular, the media pretends that everyone hates him. That is not true. Trump has a support base, he has been very adept at using this support base to enact his agenda, and any attacks on him, he will turn around and make his support base feel like they personally are being attacked, and they will rush to his defense.

Aristotleded24

Debater wrote:
It was confirmed this afternoon that Sanders DID have a heart attack.

His own campaign confirmed it -- here's the New York Times article:

--

Bernie Sanders Had Heart Attack, His Doctors Say, as He Leaves Hospital

Senator Bernie Sanders had a heart attack this week, his presidential campaign said on Friday as he left a Las Vegas hospital, following three days of near silence from the candidate and his advisers about his health.

Mr. Sanders, 78, had entered the hospital on Tuesday night after experiencing chest pain at a campaign event, and doctors had inserted two stents in a blocked artery, a relatively common procedure. But the campaign did not confirm that Mr. Sanders had had a heart attack until Friday, inviting questions about his condition, and his campaign’s transparency, as he remained off the campaign trail this week.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/04/us/politics/bernie-sanders-hospital.html

That's just a trash piece from the same media outlets that have been trying to bury Sander's candidacy since he announced the first time. The public policy agenda that Sanders proposes is a threat to those who own these big media outlets. That is why they have done what they can to stop his rise to power. He has been held to standards that no other candidate has. Did you know that Biden has had surgery for brain aneyurisms? Politics aside, I'm far more concerned about the health of someone who has had that kind of surgery rather than a heart attack. Why is nobody questioning Biden's medical fitness for office?

It's been predicted before that Sander's candidacy is over, only for Sanders to bounce back. He will bounce back after this little setback as well.

josh

So you don't believe Sanders had a heart attack?

Aristotleded24

josh wrote:
So you don't believe Sanders had a heart attack?

Minor heart attack. Doctors have come out and said that this is a routine procedure, and that he has a good chance of bouncing back from that.

If John McCain and Ed Kennedy can serve in the Senate to the very end, and peope have served as Senators well into their 90s, if Ronald Raegan can serve a second term when his Alzheimers was starting to become evident, why can't Sanders serve as President in his late 70s?

josh

I don't have a problem with it.  Other presidents and vice-presidents have had heart attacks before and during their term in office.

NDPP

The Jimmy Dore Show

https://youtu.be/EJzzfl3BRJc

"Harry Reid: Elizabeth Warren More Corruptible Than Bernie."

NDPP

dp

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