This Should Be the NDP's Moment to Shine

Ken Burch wrote:

NDPP wrote:

Dreaded words from politicians - 'let me be perfectly clear'

https://cfjctoday.com/2021/08/30/rothenburger-dreaded-words-from-politic...

"NDP leader Jagmeet Singh was making himself perfectly clear the other day when a reporter asked him whether he'd stop construction of the Trans Mountain pipeline expansion should he and his party form government.

It was a question that requires only a yes-or-no answer. But Singh waffled, obfuscated and, with perfect clarity, avoided answering..."

NDP=No Difference Party

So who should people vote FOR?  Election boycotts never achieve anything, anywhere.  

And if you think the NDP is a "no difference" party- I'm not going to say you're wrong, overall- what are you trying to build as an alternative?

Have you done any work on trying to  help create a genuine independent socialist society?

I find your questioning of my views, as expressed by NDPP, to be paternalistic and demeaning. Who are you to demand to know what I have done to arrive at the conclusion that the NDP are no different and not worth voting for in this election? What test do you think I have to pass to express that opinion. Is fifty years of paying attention to Canadian politics not enough or do I need to post a list of all the things I do besides sit behind a keyboard. And if these days I don't do much because I am 70 does that mean I should just shut the fuck up?

I personally find the question obnoxious but since you  seem to like this kind of discourse tell me how are you doing to help create a genuine independent socialist society. And if it is merely voting for the NDP then I guess you have little commitment. Have you been to a land defenders blockade or an anti pipeline rally or is keyboard warrior your main role in the battle for a socialist society.

kropotkin1951 wrote:

Ken Burch wrote:

NDPP wrote:

Dreaded words from politicians - 'let me be perfectly clear'

https://cfjctoday.com/2021/08/30/rothenburger-dreaded-words-from-politic...

"NDP leader Jagmeet Singh was making himself perfectly clear the other day when a reporter asked him whether he'd stop construction of the Trans Mountain pipeline expansion should he and his party form government.

It was a question that requires only a yes-or-no answer. But Singh waffled, obfuscated and, with perfect clarity, avoided answering..."

NDP=No Difference Party

So who should people vote FOR?  Election boycotts never achieve anything, anywhere.  

And if you think the NDP is a "no difference" party- I'm not going to say you're wrong, overall- what are you trying to build as an alternative?

Have you done any work on trying to  help create a genuine independent socialist society?

I find your questioning of my views, as expressed by NDPP, to be paternalistic and demeaning. Who are you to demand to know what I have done to arrive at the conclusion that the NDP are no different and not worth voting for in this election? What test do you think I have to pass to express that opinion. Is fifty years of paying attention to Canadian politics not enough or do I need to post a list of all the things I do besides sit behind a keyboard. And if these days I don't do much because I am 70 does that mean I should just shut the fuck up?

I personally find the question obnoxious but since you  seem to like this kind of discourse tell me how are you doing to help create a genuine independent socialist society. And if it is merely voting for the NDP then I guess you have little commitment. Have you been to a land defenders blockade or an anti pipeline rally or is keyboard warrior your main role in the battle for a socialist society.

Kropotkin, I wasn't saying anything about you there at all.  I'm sorry if it came across as if I was, and I had no  idea you regarded NDPP as in any way speaking for you.

And I've been quite critical of the NDP myself, as I have been of the needlessly vindictive and antidemocratic swing to the far right the current British Labour Party's discredited leader, Keir Starmer, has imposed on his party.

Also, I wasn't in any universe saying that people SHOULDN'T try to persuade others not to vote NDP in the federal election.

All I was commenting on was what struck me as that other poster's purely hostile, purely negative tactic of denouncing the NDP while not calling for a positive alternative course of action.

JUST saying "don't vote NDP", without calling for any alternative course of action, is not a way forward towards anything.

I've worked in various groups working for change throughout my life, for the record- some within electoral politics, some outside of it- never presented or saw myself as a leader or an exemplar, just another human trying to help in my way.

It's just that I haven't appointed myself the official arbiter of whether anything anybody else is doing can be considered valid, or set myself up as entitled to seemingly dismiss everybody else's methods of working for change as a pointless, hopelessly-compromised waste of time.

Is there something wrong in saying "if you're going to call out one approach as useless, you need to offer another that wouldn't be"?  That some positive possibility needs to be offered along with critique?  

That's all I've been saying on this.

None of it was aimed at you personally, Kropotkin, because you don't work in the way I'm discussing here.

Finally!

A political party is actually going to complement the work done by the Father of Canada's Medicare, Tommy Douglas, and bring dental care coverage into Canada's  medicare system, for those households with an income of less than $90,000, to be paid for by Canada's ultrarich. Sweet!

NDP's Singh promises dental care coverage for families earning less than $90,000

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/federal-election-2021/ndp-s-singh-promis...

Former Green candidates supporting Avi Lewis

https://youtu.be/e_qn9WtZgyI

A parachute candidate from a privilaged background. In his riding not quite a third of the population is of European descent, all those settlers too must be able to relate to indegenous issues?. The Conservatives are normally the competition in Burnaby as they were last electon. They are running a business motivational speaker who looks as swarmy as it gets, of course looks might be decieving.

The Green candidate is who I would vote for no matter what the party problems are. I love tree huggers.

Maureen Curran (she/her) moved to Victoria to do her MSc in nuclear physics and fell in love with B.C. She has taught science and math in Coquitlam for 22 years, and works with the Simon Fraser University teacher training program, building sustainable and socially diverse learning communities.

Maureen has been an active community member while raising her two boys in New West and Burnaby. From coaching little league to participating on local cycling advocacy committees, fundraising for an accessible playground or running clubs at her school, Maureen has always worked to make a difference.

A coordinator with Protect the Planet Stop TMX, Maureen is a peaceful land defender. She’s spent days and nights in a tent suspended above the Brunette River, defending the urban forest that is slated to be destroyed to make way for a tar sands expansion pipeline. As a scientist, Maureen understands the planetary emergency is so dangerous that we must do everything we can to prevent it.

Maureen is a candidate you can trust to give her all in helping make a better Canada: one that puts the needs of all families at the forefront and that takes fully to heart the responsibilities of reconciliation and stewardship.

https://www.maureencurran.ca/

https://likkylavji.com/

Shining? Like a dead herring in the moonlight maybe...it shines but it stinks.

Why won't any party challenge Canadian foreign policy?

https://yvesengler.com/2021/09/12/why-wont-any-party-challenge-canadian-...

"...If they refuse to criticize the military's role in Afghanistan, there's no reason to expect a political party to challenge the militarists' push to devote huge sums to strengthening the Canadian Forces capacity to wage war.

The NDP election platform supports spending $100 billion - $300 billion over their lifecycle - on new naval vessels and fighter jets, which will enable the military to fight another Afghanistan or Libya type war.

For peace and socialist-minded internationalists this election confirms the importance of building grassroots antiwar and solidarity groups, as well as media outlets, willing to challenge Canadian imperialism and the servile support from supposedly left wing parties for the status quo."

NDP = No Difference Party!

Ripe for the pickin'

One year later: Canadian billionaire wealth up by $78 billion

https://www.policynote.ca/the-rich-and-the-rest-of-us/

NorthReport wrote:

Seems like Jagmeet and Bernie are on the same page.

Democrats seek corporate, wealthy tax hikes for $3.5T plan

 

 

https://www.nationalnewswatch.com/2021/09/13/manchin-nixes-bidens-3-5t-b...

I actually think Bernie is well to the left of Singh. He campaigned on reducing military spending. The NDP platform on the other hand wants to entangle the Canadian working class more deeply with the military industrial complex:

In contracting for new military equipment, including ships and fighter jets, New Democrats will ensure maximum industrial benefits and jobs.

Sanders also ran on attacking corporate subsidies and baliouts and ending socialism for the rich. Taxes are a big part of that but not being able to also describe what rightwing spending you would end, makes you look like you haven't thought very hard about being in government.

Crazy that a US Democrat is well to the left of the NDP but Canada's political class is pretty listless in 2021.

NDP and Conservative Party Foreign Policy:

Prime Minister Singh?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/12/jagmeet-singh-the-ex-lawye...

Re: 'Seems like Jagmeet & Bernie are on the same page.'

https://rabble.ca/comment/5697654#comment-5697654

At last NR. We agree.

Because there are a lot of xenophobes in Canada who like blaming China for our problems? I think most Canadians and Canadian politicians wish we never got caught up being used by the US in arresting Meng Wanzhou but now we have to make the best of a bad situation. We're a middle power that has to maintain a balanced often contradictory wimpy approach.

JKR wrote:

We're a middle power that has to maintain a balanced often contradictory wimpy approach.

Sure, like Chretien publicly opposing the Iraq war while Canadian diplomats expressed regret to the US that domestic politics made backing the war untenable but could we possibly demonstrate our support for the invasion in other ways..

That's still lightyears ahead of where we are now where public opinion is just taken completely out of the equation and all of the political parties trot out the exact same line (and not exactly a wimpy balanced one but actually quite belligerent and globally destabilizing). Twenty years ago the poltical elites had to consider the repercussions of going against popular opinion and now they just make sure there are always just five flavours of vanilla.

melovesproles wrote:

That's still lightyears ahead of where we are now where public opinion is just taken completely out of the equation and all of the political parties trot out the exact same line (and not exactly a wimpy balanced one but actually quite belligerent and globally destabilizing). Twenty years ago the poltical elites had to consider the repercussions of going against popular opinion and now they just make sure there are always just five flavours of vanilla.

What is public opinion regarding foreign policy? I think Canadians generally don't care about foreign policy because we benefit from global inequality and the solutions to global inequality are not appealing to most Canadians.

Swinging for the fences, Singh's ndp tries to outbid Trudeau

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/jagmeet-singh-ndp-trudeau-election-1.61...

"...But the NDP is also running into questions about the credibility of its platform.

The Institute of Fiscal Studies and Democracy, which assesses parties' fiscal plans for transparency, responsibility and realism, gave the NDP the lowest score of the three major parties..."